2010-08-21, 13:08 | Link #4021 |
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Join Date: Apr 2009
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there are so many different sources about angels it's not even funny...Metatron doesn't even exist in many doctrines, Roman Catholic included...
from the looks of it, it seems Kamachi is using the eastern orthodox hierarchy, at least as far as the 4 archangels are concerned Michael is generally considered as the strongest angel, from a military point of view, as the chief of the heavenly host and the one who cast satan down from heaven... |
2010-08-21, 13:46 | Link #4022 |
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: In my room
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I'm a roman catholic but haven't heard metatron. To be honest the first time I heard about that is when kabalah was mention in 666 satan manga. Though their is another angel aside from metatron that's been mentioned.... I think it's sandephon though not sure about the name. Then after that manga I heard it in persona games
eastern orthodox hierarchy? first time hearing it too. I really don't have knowledge concerning that. But if I derived my hypothesis from the 4 god's right hand. Representing the 4 corners of the earth and four elements and also 4 angels that would bring destruction to earth..... Their are only 4 so far and one is already been shown in physical state even though it's in terribly weaken state. |
2010-08-21, 14:54 | Link #4025 | |
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True, some Archangels can appear in multiple Choirs/Orders. Makes it difficult to place some of them definitively into the hierarchy. And yes, there are a lot sources describing angels. Michael's descriptions according to the five versus that mention him in the Bible make him seem pretty important, but in most sources I've come across, with exceptions like Michael, Archangels tend to be put fairly low on the rung, as angels who directly communicate with humans. Michael is "one of the chief princes," implying there are others, and he is generally considered (though I don't think it's explicitly stated) to be the field commander of God's army. I don't believe he was the one who cast Satan out of Heaven the first time. That is still yet to come, according to the books of Revelation and Daniel which describe the event as prophecy for the end days. Vento of the Front mentions Lucifer's rebellion in Heaven in past tense, so I'm assuming Satan was cast out already by some other means and then will be defeated by Michael's superior forces in the second war (not necessarily that Michael is stronger on an individual basis). Of course, if one of the novels mentions somewhere that Michael cast out Satan already, there's not much to do except use that as canon regardless of Biblical verse. EDIT: then again, maybe an angel's ranking in the orders, at least among the lower orders excluding Cherubim and Seraphim, doesn't indicate strength from a military perspective, but describes things more from an administrative view. Last edited by oldmanpoo; 2010-08-21 at 15:14. |
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2010-08-21, 14:55 | Link #4026 |
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: In my room
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Then I wouldn't be surprised if Accelerator start deciphering it. He starts to understand angelic language thanks to goat skin and also thanks to that he manage to fend off AIM based attack of Hyoka though Telesma based attack of Gabriel still damage him.
With his own knowledge of science and some knowledge of angels the artificial angel of academy city wouldn't win against him. Though the real deal angels still are different. |
2010-08-21, 15:01 | Link #4027 |
Honos628
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Mexico
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You know what would be funny and unfunny and god I hope I am wrong here that each of the 3 protagonist is a personification of the holy trinity.
For example Accelerator seems to be of the age of horus acording to Aiwass God Father Touma lack luck but it always helping people even if is following his own belives Jesus Mr I have all the luck of the world but I am useless otherwise Holy spirit |
2010-08-21, 15:40 | Link #4028 | |
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Join Date: Apr 2009
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also, am i the only one who thinks esper powers developed by AC are nothing more than magic from the book of the law? |
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2010-08-21, 16:21 | Link #4029 |
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Valdosta, GA
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Seems possible, actually, unless I'm missing something (which is easily possible). Aleister in real life practiced some weird amalgamation of pseudo-science cosmology and religion he dubbed Thelema, using, as he claimed, the scientific method to record spiritual experiences. Not only that, but technically, even the magic in this series must operate on some sort of scientific principle, perhaps just with a different method of attaining it (granted through God or through a connection to Heaven).
When Vento mentioned angels as being tools/machines with no free will (which isn't really the case in scripture, but for the sake of this series...) it seems to indicate that perhaps the "magic" side (magicians, angels) is also utilizing principles controlled by science and mechanics, just a different kind or from a different source. I'd be interested in knowing on a physical level how a flame created by a pyrokinetic (such as the one in episode one of Railgun) is any different than Stiyl's. Spoiler for Crowley/Aiwass:
According to that (taken from Wikipedia), Aiwass was only a messenger. Can someone tell me where it was stated Aiwass was above Archangels? |
2010-08-21, 18:51 | Link #4030 | ||
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But I wouldn't call it 'magic' though as it clearly has different properties from 'normal' magic. But like 'magic' and Telesma, it's a form of energy/matter in the Universe that isn't fully explain by Science yet... God knows we have alot of them.
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2010-08-21, 20:09 | Link #4032 |
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As I recall, he just said that he is an Angel, but not like the Christian Angels, which I interpret now as 'Not made from the same Stuff'. And that Aiwass is a natural Angel made from AIM, which would then explain how he can teach Aleister about it.
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2010-08-21, 20:34 | Link #4033 | |
Banned
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Age: 34
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2010-08-21, 21:44 | Link #4036 | |
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Age: 30
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Just so happens I found this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magick Quote:
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2010-08-21, 22:49 | Link #4038 |
(`・⊝・´)/\(`・⊝・´)
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Age: 30
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^ Yep, that's exactly what I thought as well. If Aiwass is the true master of the secrets of magicks then could that mean, rather than being some form of angel, it's actually the ultimate esper that transcended human boundaries?
EDIT: Some Chapter 6 (i.e. chapter 2) info from vol 21. Credit to Observer from OM: Spoiler for Vol 21 chapter 6 (chapter 2 of the volume):
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Last edited by Suzuku; 2010-08-21 at 23:25. |
2010-08-21, 23:42 | Link #4039 | ||
Kino fanboy
Join Date: Dec 2004
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action, dengeki bunko, fantasy, light novels, science fiction, shounen |
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