Claymore Chapter 79

[Cyclone]

Originally Posted by chibamonster

@Cyclone: does claymore have to spread into the outer world? Or will the outer world come to them? Now that we have seen these dragon descendants someone is going to have to meet them at some point. Yagi went to the work for character design which means they will show up (just like I think we will see Clare's awakened form... There are some elements we have already been exposed too but I'll post that somewhere else). The organization is definitively evil at this point but they are only the research and development branch of a larger group it seems. Without knowing more about their structure of the true organization who is to stop them from doing it again?

Personally, I think the outer world will come to them - sort of.
If they're goal is to take down the organization, then it's a given that the Organizations youma (and possibly claymore) fascilities must be destroyed. Thus we will find out the process by which youmas and claymores are created.

Now if you'll indulge my hypothesis for a bit, I think it's likely that DoD flesh is one of the essential ingredients in making youma and/or Claymores. That probably means that one or more of them are locked up somewhere in the fascilites so that they can be used for parts.

In the process of destroying the place, the cells holding any DoDs are almost certain to be openned - either by the ghosts or by the Organization. Then, depending on mental state of the DoDs - or perhaps the organization taking a DoDs child hostage for example - a fight between a DoD and our heros would be relatively easy to construct.

Even if the DoDs are not directly involved in the process of creating youma/claymore, then there's probably a dozen other reasons one (or more) could be at Org HQ. For all we know, the MiBs are DoDs...

Something I just thought off: Nothing in the claymores world can dent their swords that we have seen. Their symbols are engraved into the swords and that could not be done on the island. Even Claymores cannot damage other Claymores. The symbols were engraved before the organization gets the swords. A claymores symbol might have much more meaning in the future. We do not even know WHY claymores have symbols yet. It identifies them but it is not like they need an ID check much. What do the symbols actually mean to the experiment in awakened beings?

Interesting thought - I like it. I don't know. We'll have to wait and see.

[Fenrir_valindri]

An interesting thought just crossed my mind.

Why the hell wouldn't you make armor out of the stuff that their swords are made of? That would certainly make someone hard to kill.

[hell88]

Probably because the org doesn't care if there warriors live or not. They just want them to be able to kill, so thats what the sword is for.

[Awakened]

Originally Posted by Fenrir_valindri

An interesting thought just crossed my mind.

Why the hell wouldn't you make armor out of the stuff that their swords are made of? That would certainly make someone hard to kill.

What if the Org have a armor sute made of the same stuff as the sword?

[Goofus Maximus]

I thought the armor was made out of the same stuff, but then I thought of all the times the armor gets punched through or chopped off, while the swords suffer nary a dent or ding, and I think you have a valid point. Of course the armor doesn't protect much in any case. Why protect the hips and shoulders, while leaving the vulnerable abdomen relatively uncovered? Aside from fashion, that is!

Also, I was thinking back on the Slashers arc, and remembered that the MiB told Galatea that that Awakened Being was special. Now I wonder, was this AB one of those ABs they loosed on the old Continent, and they shipped him (being still nominally "loyal") to the testing grounds as a "cleanup" for failed experiments?

[Fenrir_valindri]

I ment they could develop suits of Full-Plate made from that stuff, and a normal soldier would become impervious to most attacks.

Now if they get extremely Loyal Hybrids (Or the human form Alicia/Beth) they would basically be invincible to Awakened Beings.

----------

As for that Male AB in the Slashers Arc, I was thinking something along those lines as well. He was a more "loyal" Awakened Being that the Organization used for clean-up duty, and it is possible they have some loyal ABs and Claymores at the mainland.

[derelict88]

Hello all, I think everyone should know about this. The Moderator was kind enough to private mail me. I think I want to share this in an open forums because it make sense in the end. I guess ultimately there are different kind of help and posting translation for a copyrighted work isnt deem helpful. There ya go. Hope there is a lesson learn here.

Originally Posted by xris

derelict88,

Please do not post translations of licensed manga here at AnimeSuki, doing so will only get yourself a ban. Please read our forum rules.

xris
Admin
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BTW Moderator I reread the rule (as quoted below) I dont see any rules stating no TRANSLATION allowed. Please direct me to the rules that states it. Next question is does translation fall under the category known as media because from what I know about media translation falls far from it. Thanks.

Originally Posted by NoSanninWa

Welcome to the monthly discussion thread for Claymore, Chapter 79. It has been a long hard two months to wait since chapter 78 so I'm anticipating this chapter even more than usual... as I suspect you are also.

The thread was created before the chapter was published. Usually false spoilers start to appear early so (naturally) people always need a place to discuss them.

Thread Guidelines

• Raw requests and offers are not permitted anywhere on this forum.
• The Claymore manga is licensed by Viz so questions about scanlations or answers about scanlation are not allowed. Remember that AnimeSuki does not enable downloading of any licensed anime or manga.
• Discuss your expectations of the chapter if it has not been published yet.
• Be polite to your fellow forum members.
• Please try to keep the discussion on topic.
• Spoilers will not be policed in this thread, so if you haven't read the chapter yet, just stay out if you don't want to read spoilers.

Chapter 80 will probably be released on June 4th, a month from now. That's the usual release date, so I''ll create the new chapter 80 thread a few days before that... as usual.

[chibamonster]

I actually PM'ed Xris about that same issue this morning. I understand the not having links to scans or raws or even mentioning groups in the forums (that is where PM's are necessary) but avoiding translation issues from popping up seems neigh impossible because we are talking about a Japanese manga on an English forum. Even the Viz english translation is full of things that I would translate differently (for instance Flora loses much of her delicate personality through their translation).

It seems very strange to me that chapter summaries would be fine but translations would not be. For instance Ergon went through himself and corrected some of the translation errors that many of us were reading giving much more solid ground about what the characters actually meant. The translation from the chinese raw was certainly different than the one we have now anyway. Some people are translating lyrics from songs on the OST, how is that any different? I think translations should be allowed, especially if we are doing them ourselves.

[mosmos]

Maybe someone posted before...I noticed a plot hole to Miria's theory.

She mentioned that yoma is created within the organization.
Then those claymore girls can sense yomas even from a far.
Surely ppl like Galeatia can easily sense yomas withinin the organization. right ?

Unless, of course the organization manufacture those claymores in an separate place far far away.. Sorry, then there is no plothole then.. my bad..

[NoSanninWa]

Originally Posted by derelict88

BTW Moderator I reread the rule (as quoted below) I dont see any rules stating no TRANSLATION allowed. Please direct me to the rules that states it. Next question is does translation fall under the category known as media because from what I know about media translation falls far from it. Thanks.

Sorry, but we follow international copyright law on this one. It is a rare subset of rule 1.1.

Originally Posted by chibamonster

I actually PM'ed Xris about that same issue this morning. I understand the not having links to scans or raws or even mentioning groups in the forums (that is where PM's are necessary) but avoiding translation issues from popping up seems neigh impossible because we are talking about a Japanese manga on an English forum.

There is no problem with a few lines being translated or a question about the translation of a sentence. The problem is when page after page is translated. In this particular case a full translation of the entire chapter was posted in this thread. That is more than the mere unavoidable translation isses that are bound to appear in our forum.

Originally Posted by chibamonster

It seems very strange to me that chapter summaries would be fine but translations would not be. For instance Ergon went through himself and corrected some of the translation errors that many of us were reading giving much more solid ground about what the characters actually meant. The translation from the chinese raw was certainly different than the one we have now anyway. Some people are translating lyrics from songs on the OST, how is that any different? I think translations should be allowed, especially if we are doing them ourselves.

According to international copyright law, all translations of a work (other than small sections suitable for reviews, discussion, or certain other purposes) are also owned by the copyright holder. Summaries are not owned by them. That's why we don't allow long sections of licensed manga to be posted on our forum, regardless of the language that they are in. It's also why we don't allow whole pages of licensed manga to be posted here.

Now you know WHY we have such a rule.

[Gooral]

Originally Posted by derelict88

(...) BTW Moderator I reread the rule (as quoted below) I dont see any rules stating no TRANSLATION allowed. Please direct me to the rules that states it. (...)

They're overcautious sometimes. I've got a warning some time ago from NoSanninWa for writing "Finally, the RAW is out" (nothing more), although I've seen many doing this (even in this thread) and their posts weren't deleted.

[kayos]

Originally Posted by mosmos

She mentioned that yoma is created within the organization.
Then those claymore girls can sense yomas even from a far.
Surely ppl like Galeatia can easily sense yomas withinin the organization. right ?

Take into consideration that Claymore's are half yoma themselves, so it would be hard to find the needle in the haystack.

[chibamonster]

I agree with Gooral. Sometimes the mods do come down very hard on us in odd ways. We have had pages of posts deleted before and had to ask for them to be brought back because they were not violating any rules of any kind and the members were enjoying it. I have also received warnings for things that did not break any rules. Fortunately NSW does listen to reason when something like that happens for which I am glad.

I am not posting any full translations although I have been very glad when people did. I just think the mods will have a very hard time enforcing what seems like a very gray area especially with how many new members join the discussion and do not know the policies and given the very nature of what we are discussing on the forum. Even reading the rules it did not seem that translations were strictly forbidden. It says they are allowed but gives little guidelines about it. A case by case basis seems rather difficult to accommodate especially with the sheer amount that is posted on the forums. A mixed guideline is no guideline at all. I am not sure if the license holders are breathing down their necks or what but it seems rather sudden as translation like posts being against the rules has never been brought up before. It feels to me like it is something that has to be said before we get back to doing what we are doing.

[Gooral]

Originally Posted by Fenrir_valindri

An interesting thought just crossed my mind.

Why the hell wouldn't you make armor out of the stuff that their swords are made of? That would certainly make someone hard to kill.

Why Japanese didn't make armors the same way they did their swords? Maybe it's not malleable enough and it's too much trouble to make armor. After all a straight piece of metal is much easier to make than an armor. Also if their primary objective was to make powerful monsters which didn't need armor or swords, why bother?

[NoSanninWa]

Originally Posted by chibamonster

A case by case basis seems rather difficult to accommodate especially with the sheer amount that is posted on the forums. A mixed guideline is no guideline at all. I am not sure if the license holders are breathing down their necks or what but it seems rather sudden as translation like posts being against the rules has never been brought up before. It feels to me like it is something that has to be said before we get back to doing what we are doing.

It's not so difficult really. This happens very rarely, so it can't be something worth getting very worked up about. On the few times when it does, we usually have someone report the post so that we can do something about it. Yes, amazingly, that post was reported to us.

[chibamonster]

@NSW: It just seems kind of a funny policy in comparison to what I have seen in the bleach or naruto thread. Best of luck though .

@Fenrir: I can see why the organization would not put the claymores in the special armor. Not like they want them to live anyway. Although the armor they do have seems very useless. It might be a very rare metal for the claymores, but we still might see alicia with a suit of it. Even AB's cannot break the swords so it is harder than them; claymore's just do not have the strength to get through some bodies like Duff's or Rifuls. But if the organization has achieved their goal why not give the AB's they control specialized weapons that are unbreakable?

[Cyclone]

Originally Posted by NoSanninWa

Sorry, but we follow international copyright law on this one. It is a rare subset of rule 1.1.

According to international copyright law, all translations of a work (other than small sections suitable for reviews, discussion, or certain other purposes) are also owned by the copyright holder. Summaries are not owned by them. That's why we don't allow long sections of licensed manga to be posted on our forum, regardless of the language that they are in. It's also why we don't allow whole pages of licensed manga to be posted here.

I'm looking at Rule 1.1 and I don't see anything that applies, to tell you the truth.
Isn't it maybe time to start thinking about shutting down animesuki, if we start respecting weird clauses of international copyright law to the extent that our own members cannot even re-translate by themselves a portion of a really botched translation (talking about ergon's post - not derelict's).

I mean very few of us speak or read chinese/japanese, and so a translation is all many people have to go by. Even now, look at how many people are STILL using terms like "dragon kin" instead of "Descendants of Dragons", and making countless other mistakes based on the faulty translation which the initial scanlator used verbatim. Not being allowed to correct the record with a non-parody translation, makes discussing the chapter intelligently very difficult. There seems to be very little point in having a japanese manga or current chapter thread at all in that case.

The difference between the posts I made with corrections (which seemed to have been deemed ok as they were not deleted) and the big one ergon made (not ok) are not that diffierent in my opinion [except he's better at Japanese so he could translate it better, faster, and more of it (he didn't do all of it either)].

I think a self made translation containing all original work (like ergon's) is MUCH more ethical and respectful of that holy international copyright law than... oh... say a full episode of anime with a rather unobtrusive full translation in soft subs tacked onto the bottom, wouldn't you agree?

[mosmos]

Originally Posted by Fenrir_valindri

An interesting thought just crossed my mind.

Why the hell wouldn't you make armor out of the stuff that their swords are made of? That would certainly make someone hard to kill.

Hey this is a good point! Another story plot hole....

but what if the armour is made of the strong material and is cut by the claymore. Which will break first?

[Cyclone]

Originally Posted by irvinethearcher

I hope the zemas aren't alicia and beth because this would probably mean that the org only recruited one pair of twins and could make warriors as strong as they want and can produce as many theresas as they want when they want. But it bothers me that no other twin claymores apeared, only alicia and beth. Perhaps the org choose the best under all the twins and killed the others, because they didn't want that anyone notice their soul - link experiments. The soul link experiments were made in another location so that the other claymores didn't notice them? Who knows...

It took the organization about 20 years to make the Zema's twins. They are not exactly something that can go into mass production. Furthermore, it seems that while the soul link is a success, it looks far from safe - I'd estimate that each use has at least a 25% of CATASTROPHIC failure. Not a weapon you want to use often.

As to mass producing Teresas - I see no evidence that they could even if they wanted to. Looks like Teresa and Pricilla were just annomalies.

[Cyclone]

Originally Posted by mosmos

but what if the armour is made of the strong material and is cut by the claymore. Which will break first?

They'd bounce off?