Hayate no Gotoku manga (raw discussion only)

[GlassesLady]

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

I think that's his grandmother from the movie, I recalled her trying to pay off Hayate's debt... Or something...

Pay off Hayate's dent? She didn't even try to do that. She just kidnapped Nagi and tried to wipe her from everyone's memory.

[JPblueser]

Originally Posted by GlassesLady

Pay off Hayate's dent? She didn't even try to do that. She just kidnapped Nagi and tried to wipe her from everyone's memory.

Well, that's true, but...

Spoiler for Movie plot:

She also did give Hayate a jewel or something which was worth enough to pay the debt. In the end, he returned it and said the following:

"I'm sorry to say this, Ojou-sama, but I decided I really want to pay off my debt by myself."

In other words:

Spoiler for Conclusions:

1. The debt still exists.
2. Hayate doesn't want anyone to pay the debt for him.

So, yeah...
Just goes to show all those flashforwards were not a really good idea...

[Shadow5YA]

Originally Posted by evil|plushie

Nagi really sort of rubbed me the wrong way this chapter. I'm not sure what right she has to demand Ruka give up on Hayate. Over-possessive much?

The same right Ruka has to demand Hayate herself. They both want him.

[evil|plushie]

Ruka's bet wasn't to demand Hayate from Nagi. It was to let her pay off his debt. There's a difference between 'let me help you' and 'bugger off, don't get near him'

[Shadow5YA]

Originally Posted by evil|plushie

Ruka's bet wasn't to demand Hayate from Nagi. It was to let her pay off his debt. There's a difference between 'let me help you' and 'bugger off, don't get near him'

What? It wasn't anything close to "let me help you". The message was "give him to me". She asked to take on all of Hayate's debt, meaning she wants ownership over Hayate so that he is no longer required to serve Nagi.

[Used Can]

Originally Posted by Shadow5YA

The message was "give him to me".

I don't really think that was the idea. Remember she was originally going to ask Nagi to forgive Hayate's debt if she won, but then she said that was too much to ask, and then asked the debt to be transferred to her if she won.

So, I wouldn't know if she was thinking of buying Hayate off from Nagi.
That said, I don't think she was thinking about the possibility of Hayate not liking her back when she made that bet. I really don't think she's that altruistic.

Anyhow, I'd like it if Hata made CTMEOY non-canon. In my opinion, knowing that nothing will really change after this arc makes it a little too anti-climatic and very predictable. Not to mention that HnG is close to reach its 400th chapter, and so far, we haven't had any real development in the romantic area, and the plot development is all over the place. So, once they go back to the mansion, we'll be left with a story which is pretty much back to where it started, but with some character development for some characters which doesn't really justify 400 chapters, many plot points that aren't even close to be solved, many characters that are just there and many others that were simply forgotten. That, and this is purely my opinion, despite some funny moments here and there, I think the comedy in this manga is pretty much stale.

[Shadow5YA]

Originally Posted by Used Can

I don't really think that was the idea. Remember she was originally going to ask Nagi to forgive Hayate's debt if she won, but then she said that was too much to ask, and then asked the debt to be transferred to her if she won.

So, I wouldn't know if she was thinking of buying Hayate off from Nagi.
That said, I don't think she was thinking about the possibility of Hayate not liking her back when she made that bet. I really don't think she's that altruistic.

Her assumption is that Hayate doesn't want a relationship because he's obligated to serve Nagi. That's the entire reason why Ruka confronted Nagi: she wants to remove that obligation in hopes that Hayate will reconsider going out with her.

The point was that if Nagi won't let Hayate go, Ruka will take him from her. I don't understand why people are getting so defensive about this as if Ruka was doing something bad. She is just being proactive and doing everything she can to achieve her goals like she always has.

Likewise, Nagi has every right to refuse, because legally, she owns Hayate and has no reason to give him up if she does not want to give him up.

[madmac]

What? It wasn't anything close to "let me help you". The message was "give him to me". She asked to take on all of Hayate's debt, meaning she wants ownership over Hayate so that he is no longer required to serve Nagi.

Precisely.

Even if Ruka was hoping to pay off Hayate's debt for purely altruistic reasons (WHICH SHE ISN'T) she still wouldn't be helping him, because Hayate's proven enough times by now he doesn't give a flip about the debt except to the point that it represents a personal obligation to Nagi. Handing him a check at this point just means putting him on the spot and forcing him to stammer out an excuse as to why he can't take it.

Heck, he hasn't even done anything to indicate that he's interested in dating Ruka.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by madmac

Heck, he hasn't even done anything to indicate that he's interested in dating Ruka.

Except for the only reason him giving for rejecting her was because he couldn't leave Nagi's side due to the debt he owes her. But yeah, other than that.

[madmac]

Except for the only reason him giving for rejecting her was because he couldn't leave Nagi's side due to the debt he owes her. But yeah, other than that

From Ruka's perspective, sure. That's the only excuse he would give her. I just mean from a readers standpoint it's obvious that Hayate has given the idea zero consideration and is honestly acting like he just kinda wants to sweep the whole confession thing under the rug and pretend it didn't happen.

[Shadow5YA]

Originally Posted by GDB

Except for the only reason him giving for rejecting her was because he couldn't leave Nagi's side due to the debt he owes her. But yeah, other than that.

He went back to that because he didn't have a good reason to refuse Ruka even when she demanded for a good reason.

His first reason was the "I'm only interested in 2D girls" excuse he gave to Ayumu. It's not hard to believe that Hayate didn't think about relationships since he's too busy trying to make ends meet everyday.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Shadow5YA

He went back to that because he didn't have a good reason to refuse Ruka even when she demanded for a good reason.

Okay? I don't care why he had to "resort" to it. If he had zero interest in her, he could say that. The fact that he didn't shows he's at least mildly interested.

[NK141]

Originally Posted by Shadow5YA

He went back to that because he didn't have a good reason to refuse Ruka even when she demanded for a good reason.

His first reason was the "I'm only interested in 2D girls" excuse he gave to Ayumu. It's not hard to believe that Hayate didn't think about relationships since he's too busy trying to make ends meet everyday.

Don't forget though earlier on when he told Hinagiku and the others why he couldn't go out with Ayumu . The reason that Athena herself burned into him"That he did not have the right to date anyone cause he doesn't have the money to support a girl, that he should have the financial standing to be able to support her forever" could also be the reason.

[madmac]

Honestly, I don't think Hayate even knows what his reason is. He just knows that he's rejected every confession that comes his way and every explanation he's offered feels like an after-the-fact rationalization. Your example with Athena for example was at least the third excuse he'd given for not dating Hamster.

Okay? I don't care why he had to "resort" to it. If he had zero interest in her, he could say that. The fact that he didn't shows he's at least mildly interested.

...Seriously what? I don't mind Ruka pressing for a real answer, but Hayate being dodgy doesn't indicate interest in any way.

[NK141]

Originally Posted by madmac

Honestly, I don't think Hayate even knows what his reason is. He just knows that he's rejected every confession that comes his way and every explanation he's offered feels like an after-the-fact rationalization. Your example with Athena for example was at least the third excuse he'd given for not dating Hamster.

This is very true. He has given many excuses. It could be a case of him not knowing what he wants exactly.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by madmac

...Seriously what? I don't mind Ruka pressing for a real answer, but Hayate being dodgy doesn't indicate interest in any way.

It doesn't indicate a lack of interest either. Thus, combined with how he blushed and reacted to her body shows he doesn't have zero interest.

[Used Can]

Originally Posted by Shadow5YA

The point was that if Nagi won't let Hayate go, Ruka will take him from her. I don't understand why people are getting so defensive about this as if Ruka was doing something bad. She is just being proactive and doing everything she can to achieve her goals like she always has.

I'm not getting defensive, though. I simply don't get the impression that she's trying to buy him off. Certainly, she wants him to have no duty toward Nagi, because as far as she knows, Hayate cannot go out with her if he's indebted to Nagi. But I don't think Ruka wants Hayate to be with her now out of duty.

Like I said before, I don't think she's an altruist to take on Hayate's debt simply so that he's free of it, but I don't think she's that inconsiderate that she'll buy his debt so that he owes her and has to be with her. I don't think she's been shown as being that type of person.

Originally Posted by GDB

Okay? I don't care why he had to "resort" to it. If he had zero interest in her, he could say that. The fact that he didn't shows he's at least mildly interested.

You forget a problem he has that has been mentioned many times and was even brought up in the latest chapter. Hayate is too much of a nice guy.

[evil|plushie]

Ruka isn't trying to buy Hayate off. She's simply being what the manga has described her as. A very earnest and straightforward girl. "Hayate can't date because he has to concentrate on paying back his debt? No problem, I will help him pay off the debt with all my might" It's not because she thinks this will automatically win her Hayate.

Plus we all know Hayate rejected every girl so he can be with Athena in the end ;p

[Shadow5YA]

Originally Posted by evil|plushie

Ruka isn't trying to buy Hayate off. She's simply being what the manga has described her as. A very earnest and straightforward girl. "Hayate can't date because he has to concentrate on paying back his debt? No problem, I will help him pay off the debt with all my might" It's not because she thinks this will automatically win her Hayate.

But she doesn't want Nagi's help. Yes, she is a very honest and straightforward girl, but it doesn't change the fact that she is butting into Hayate's business by attempting to manage his debt with her own hands.

There is nothing inherently wrong with it, but it's not some privilege or right that she's allowed to do either.


The same can be said for Nagi. There is nothing wrong with her refusing Ruka claim over Hayate's debt, because 1)she is the one Hayate is indebted to, and 2) she sees the debt as the only thing keeping Hayate together with her.

You act as if Nagi is doing something wrong while Ruka gets a free pass. That's where I disagree: technically, Nagi does have the right to Hayate, but that's not the point. Romantically, these are just two girls not willing to give up on the man they love. Neither one of them is more "right" or "wrong" than the other, even if one of them is more likable.

[evil|plushie]

Of course she doesn't want Nagi's help. Thanks to Hayate, she thinks Nagi and his debt to her is the reason he can't date her. What do you expect her to do? Ask Nagi to force Hayate to date her? Wait for Hayate to finish paying 150million in yen to Nagi? If you're so smart and so much better, then you tell me what is the best solution in that situation and we'll see if it can't be nitpicked at all.

Note that Ruka doesn't even need to bet with Nagi about the debt. She can just give Hayate the money and ask him to use it to pay back Nagi, which she sort of implied she would do when she asked Hayate what if he didn't have the debt and he didn't give any answer to her.

And Nagi isn't refusing Ruka's claim over Hayate's debt. She basically told Ruka to give up on her feelings for Hayate. Let me make that clearer; she told Ruka; a person which owes her nothing and has no debt to her, to give up on her own personal feelings for Hayate; someone who is indebted to her. It's got nothing to do with Hayate's debt at this point.

The only way this would be even comparable is if Ruka's bet was 'you give up on Hayate' to Nagi