Code Geass R2 - Episode 14 Discussion / Poll

[Lolipopo]

Originally Posted by MonkeyDude

Well the episode will air in less than 24 hours from now...let's see how things went...

One day and One Night before having some answers...Let's be brave

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by MonkeyDude

Correct me if I'm wrong, but "Lelouch" is still at the academy living a normal life. Every and all intelligence points to that simple fact, yet Suzaku trusts his gut and truly believes that Zero is in fact Lelouch (much as I don't like the guy, he is right). The bait is still there...albeit someone that performs much better than original...but "he's" still there

In that case, if "Lulu" was brought in for questioning concerning Shirely's suicide, Suzaku would have found out more than he ever needed to know compared to the meaningless act of drugging Kallen.

Few things infuriate me more than morally questionable acts which were performed without purpose. Suzaku is wasting everybody's time.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

Using Lulu as bait for CC might seem well and good, but it would be rather pointless if the bait has gone missing.

How "missing" he is depends on what Rolo's reporting. Though even if he's saying "Lelouch's with me. He's a moral wreck, and doesn't want anyone to see him, so we're holed up in the slum with a good supply of alcohol.", I agree Suzaku should just answer "Great. Bring him in." Suzaku would even have an excuse in case Lelouch's still under his dad's geass. "We're friends, and I'm worried about you. Shirley wouldn't want you to destroy yourself like that."

And if Rolo's gone AWOL too... Then yeah. Suzaku's totally wasting everyone's time.

[FrostWolf]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

In that case, if "Lulu" was brought in for questioning concerning Shirely's suicide, Suzaku would have found out more than he ever needed to know compared to the meaningless act of drugging Kallen.

Few things infuriate me more than morally questionable acts which were performed without purpose. Suzaku is wasting everybody's time.

Indeed apart from acting like a hypcrite he still needs solid evidence on which to base it considering the coroner and all witness testimony would counter-act Kallen's confession

[animeboy12]

Hey, war turns people into beasts(play mgs4 or read All Quiet on the Western Front).After the what Shirley said in the last episode and lulu not even comming to he funeral I'd be a little suspicious too. Anyway, I just want her to get drug because 1) I want the suzaku to find out zero is lulu 2) I tired of all the Deus ex machinas 3) I wanna know more about Kallen

[Tokkan]

Originally Posted by animeboy12

2) I tired of all the Deus ex machinas

Kallen being saved is not a deus ex machina, since it's all within reasonable probability that someone would walk in on them.

Deus ex machina is where an improbable scenario occurs to resolve a seemingly dire situation. Emphasis on the word "improbable".

Originally Posted by animeboy12

3) I wanna know more about Kallen

Considering that Kallen and Nunnally were about to have a conversation about their brothers before Suzaku just had to come on and butt in, we do have other methods of learning more about her.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by animeboy12

Hey, war turns people into beasts(play mgs4 or read All Quiet on the Western Front).After the what Shirley said in the last episode and lulu not even comming to he funeral I'd be a little suspicious too. Anyway, I just want her to get drug because 1) I want the suzaku to find out zero is lulu 2) I tired of all the Deus ex machinas 3) I wanna know more about Kallen

You say you're tired of Deus Ex Machina, and yet Suzaku getting anything useful out of Refrain usage would be a big one, right there.

[bladeofdarkness]

Deus ex machina is where an improbable scenario occurs to resolve a seemingly dire situation. Emphasis on the word "improbable".

actually the best way to descraibe deus ex machina is in its name
the gods come down from the heavens to solve the problems
not something improbable
but a solution that is not derived from the plot of the story so far
but other then that i agree
someone walking in is likely
but it would
a)suck since it means sunrise cheated us out of something more interesting
b)would still make suzaku an asshole since he was still going to inject her and just got interupted

[iBeast]

What will the drug do to Kallen? Suzaku is a little beach if he drugs her regardless of the results...wow even to this episode, Suzaku remains the most hated character and even more so now...damn how can anyone like the guy.

[Tolle Erik Koenig]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

True. In fact, he doesn't even need to explain that much. "Because I say so and I'm a KoR" is all the explanation low level grunts need.

But, while he can ignore what laws there are, he can't ignore the will of the emperor. That's one of the sticking points, though, since there's a Zero out there and all, and CC doesn't seem interested in contacting Lelouch, dangling him as bait may not be that important any more. Certainly, detaining him a few days won't hurt anything.

There may also be another problem: what Euphemia would have wanted. Rather than trigger of return of "Evil Lelouch", wouldn't she have preferred him to live a peaceful student life? Suzaku may be hesitant to interfere with that for nothing.

Originally Posted by Uchiha_Hai

What will the drug do to Kallen? Suzaku is a little beach if he drugs her regardless of the results...wow even to this episode, Suzaku remains the most hated character and even more so now...damn how can anyone like the guy.

Because in Soviet Russia Britannian Japan, anything goes if you're a KoR.

[Tokkan]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

actually the best way to descraibe deus ex machina is in its name
the gods come down from the heavens to solve the problems
not something improbable
but a solution that is not derived from the plot of the story so far

Thank you for going back and telling me it's not "improbable" but it is in fact "improbable based on the fact we have no evidence". Because that's what I get from "solution that is not derived from the plot".

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

but other then that i agree
someone walking in is likely
but it would
a)suck since it means sunrise cheated us out of something more interesting
b)would still make suzaku an asshole since he was still going to inject her and just got interupted

Okay, if Nunnally were to suddenly come in, it'd well and truly show her that Suzaku is untrustworthy. Which she already had suspicions of since Turn 6. A rift being formed between those two would certainly be more interesting to me than Kallen getting high on refrain.

[Tolle Erik Koenig]

Originally Posted by Tokkan

Okay, if Nunnally were to suddenly come in, it'd well and truly show her that Suzaku is untrustworthy. Which she already had suspicions of since Turn 6. A rift being formed between those two would certainly be more interesting to me than Kallen getting high on refrain.

I would rather see that too.

Nunnally for the win!

[bladeofdarkness]

Originally Posted by Tokkan

Thank you for going back and telling me it's not "improbable" but it is in fact "improbable based on the fact we have no evidence". Because that's what I get from "solution that is not derived from the plot".



Okay, if Nunnally were to suddenly come in, it'd well and truly show her that Suzaku is untrustworthy. Which she already had suspicions of since Turn 6. A rift being formed between those two would certainly be more interesting to me than Kallen getting high on refrain.

its a xanatos gambit on suzakus part
read my post in the spoiler page for my theory about it
page 351
post 7006

[Aquaman OS]

Originally Posted by MonkeyDude

Correct me if I'm wrong, but "Lelouch" is still at the academy living a normal life. Every and all intelligence points to that simple fact, yet Suzaku trusts his gut and truly believes that Zero is in fact Lelouch (much as I don't like the guy, he is right). The bait is still there...albeit someone that performs much better than original...but "he's" still there

Actually I don't think Lelouch is there anymore. He took Rolo and Sayako with him to China which suggests he's done pretending at Ashford (other wise I don't see what the point of bringing Sayako was since she didn't do anything in the last mission) They might have all disappeared thus making Suzaku even more suspect. But he can't bring Lelouch in if he doesn't know where he is.

We don't know if he's only drugging her to get her to only talk about Zero's identity. She assumed so but he never really said what he wanted to know. He might be hoping Kallen knows where Lelouch might have gone and will tell him. A shot in the dark but time is money and every minute he doesn't have Zero is a minute Rivalz or Milly or someone else might be killed by him.

[bladeofdarkness]

Originally Posted by Aquaman OS

Actually I don't think Lelouch is there anymore. He took Rolo and Sayako with him to China which suggests he's done pretending at Ashford (other wise I don't see what the point of bringing Sayako was since she didn't do anything in the last mission) They might have all disappeared thus making Suzaku even more suspect. But he can't bring Lelouch in if he doesn't know where he is.

We don't know if he's only drugging her to get her to only talk about Zero's identity. She assumed so but he never really said what he wanted to know. He might be hoping Kallen knows where Lelouch might have gone and will tell him. A shot in the dark but time is money and every minute he doesn't have Zero is a minute Rivalz or Milly or someone else might be killed by him.

except shes been in jail since the china arc ended so she wouldnt know if he went somewhere other then their base in china
and as far as where zero's base is
the chinese gov gave the black knights that island so its clear where they would be

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

It has been shown again and again that Britannia operates under the "Private Law" system. Law as we know it, "common law", where the same law applies to everyone equally, simply do not exist.

There is a law for Numbers, a law for Peasants, a Law for Nobles, and a law for Royalty. Suzaku, being a KotR, is positioned between that of a Royal and a Noble due to his direct association with the Emperor.

Suzaku can order Lulu arrested for questioning, and he could rightfully have any police officer who refused to follow his order executed as a traitor.

People should stop trying to use current real-life legal systems to argue here; there is nothing a judge can say or do that can affect a KotR. Just-Cause is not necessary.

And the fact that Lulu is now missing is all the more reason to set up a dragnet right now, instead of having fun drugging someone for no good reason.

If Suzaku really had all the power you suggest, he wouldn't be drugging Kallen. He's drugging her because he suspects Lelouch but can't prove it, and since he can't prove it no good would come from arresting him. He would be forced to release him. Suzaku may have more authority than your average soldier or cop, but he still has to work within the system. Drugging someone isn't part of that, but he's in private and figures he can get away with it.

[SoldierOfDarkness]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

If Suzaku really had all the power you suggest, he wouldn't be drugging Kallen. He's drugging her because he suspects Lelouch but can't prove it, and since he can't prove it no good would come from arresting him. He would be forced to release him. Suzaku may have more authority than your average soldier or cop, but he still has to work within the system. Drugging someone isn't part of that, but he's in private and figures he can get away with it.

Well if we look back.

Suzaku had suspected that Zero was in fact Lelouch but refused to believe it. When it came to the mexican show-down he regretted for not acting upon it.

So I suppose VCV is right in a sense. If Suzaku wishes to avoid the same fates he should've arrested Lelouch in the first place since his gut is telling him so rather than drugging Kallen.

Ideally the correct measure would be to order the Intelligence Agency to provide him with the layout of Lelouch's recent activities and find any discrepencies within it.

On the other hand two top members of that secret agency are missing I mean that should be obvious enough. It's that or he wants 100% confirmation this time.

[Crontica]

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

Well if we look back.

Suzaku had suspected that Zero was in fact Lelouch but refused to believe it. When it came to the mexican show-down he regretted for not acting upon it.

So I suppose VCV is right in a sense. If Suzaku wishes to avoid the same fates he should've arrested Lelouch in the first place since his gut is telling him so rather than drugging Kallen.

Ideally the correct measure would be to order the Intelligence Agency to provide him with the layout of Lelouch's recent activities and find any discrepencies within it.

On the other hand two top members of that secret agency are missing I mean that should be obvious enough. It's that or he wants 100% confirmation this time.

Bolded Parts:

If Suzaku barged into the now corrupted intelligence agency and viewed lelouches recent activities suzaku would noticed that he keeps going to the "library" suzaku goes and check out the place. cue lelouch coming out of the hidden bookshelf at the wrong moment, and everything would have moved on long ago

[morbosfist]

If only Suzaku were that smart. He could have acted on it in the first season, but what good would it have done? He would never have proven anything. Since the Intelligence Agency is giving the all clear, he figures this is his only method of getting proof. He sure isn't getting it anywhere else.

[Crontica]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

If only Suzaku were that smart. He could have acted on it in the first season, but what good would it have done? He would never have proven anything. Since the Intelligence Agency is giving the all clear, he figures this is his only method of getting proof. He sure isn't getting it anywhere else.

then is he trying to drug kallen untill she becomes numb drag her out into the street go to a nearby tv station broadcast kallen with a gun to her head to try and bait zero out? because the others in this thread have deduced that his current method is just down right stupid