AnimeSuki Forums

imaginari · 2010-01-10, 20:34

I just thought of something, just a guess, not much basis for it, but interesting enough. I don't know if it belongs here or in the Epitaph thread. My theory:

The mechanism for the hidden passage leading to the Kuwadorian is connected to that of the mansion clock and can only be opened from 10 to 12 o'clock.

My evidence:

Eva entered the tunnel at 10:00 AM in EP3.
Rosa also entered at just close enough of a time to bump into Eva despite the tiny odds of this.
Battler and Erika found the gold at 10:00 PM in EP5.
The family was shown the gold at 10:47 PM.
George and Shannon (and Gaap)'s mysterious meetings always occur between 10 PM and midnight.
The gameboard always ends just after the mansion clock strikes twelve, and seemingly never before.
The "explosion theory" would be simpler if something in the tunnel was already to be triggered at midnight and the explosives were hooked up to that. There would be no need to purchase a separate timer.

What do you guys think?

Ronove · 2010-01-10, 21:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by imaginari

I just thought of something, just a guess, not much basis for it, but interesting enough. I don't know if it belongs here or in the Epitaph thread. My theory:

The mechanism for the hidden passage leading to the Kuwadorian is connected to that of the mansion clock and can only be opened from 10 to 12 o'clock.

My evidence:

Eva entered the tunnel at 10:00 AM in EP3.
Rosa also entered at just close enough of a time to bump into Eva despite the tiny odds of this.
Battler and Erika found the gold at 10:00 PM in EP5.
The family was shown the gold at 10:47 PM.
George and Shannon (and Gaap)'s mysterious meetings always occur between 10 PM and midnight.
The gameboard always ends just after the mansion clock strikes twelve, and seemingly never before.
The "explosion theory" would be simpler if something in the tunnel was already to be triggered at midnight and the explosives were hooked up to that. There would be no need to purchase a separate timer.

What do you guys think?

Well, I don't know about this but it's plausible, however Knox's Commandments might cancel it.

Interesting idea though, with the clocks and time.

Btw, referring to GeorgexGaap + JessicaxRonove, does this mean George was fighting Nanjo and Jessica was fighting Genji? This would mean Nanjo took Krauss' boxing skills.

tehjoker · 2010-01-10, 21:58

Shannon is Gaap.
That's why George didn't lay a single kick on her.

Judoh · 2010-01-10, 23:18

Hi I just signed up! I just read episode 5 and I'm rereading episodes 1-5 again because I want to figure out the mystery before the epsiode 6 translation comes out.

While I was reading I realized something fascinating about the location of Rokkenjima island. I thought if I learned more about it's location I would learn more about why he chose this place for his story.

The Izu archipelego ( where Rokkenjima island is) is located in the Devil's sea, which is also right in the middle of the “Dragon's triangle”. Similar to the Bermuda triangle all sorts of weird phenomena happen there. Boats have been reported to disappear there during storms. There are reports of “UFO phenomena” there. Radio communications can stop working during storms as well. In the Bermuda triangle there are even stories of planes flying through portals and traveling back in time

The Dragon's triangle really is the perfect place to put Rokkenjima island if you want strange phenomena to occur. It wouldn't be out of the ordinary to even suggest that the storm caused an electromagnetic disturbance at the island that caused everyone to go crazy. Of course I don't think Ryukishi07 would actually use that in his story after what happened in Higurashi, but I think it's interesting that he chose this place for his story specifically because of what happens there.

It doesn't help us figure out who the culprit is, but it could explain why they can't even use the radio to call the police. And it might be able to explain the time loops and the supernatural experiences.

http://www.unexplainedstuff.com/Plac...-Triangle.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devil%27s_Sea

I'm also wondering if maybe the pictures of Rokkenjima island in the openings were maybe some kind of clue to help us figure this out.

Smeckledorf · 2010-01-10, 23:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronove

Well, I don't know about this but it's plausible, however Knox's Commandments might cancel it.

Interesting idea though, with the clocks and time.

Btw, referring to GeorgexGaap + JessicaxRonove, does this mean George was fighting Nanjo and Jessica was fighting Genji? This would mean Nanjo took Krauss' boxing skills.

I would like this explained to me because this is the first time I have heard of this, why does Gaap=Nanjo?

TTR · 2010-01-11, 00:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by MeoTwister5

You guys would be surprised. Infants and neonates have surprisingly high regenerative capabilities. They can in fact survive certain kinds of physical injury better than adults so you can't exactly say that a 1 year old child would fare worse in similar situations than fully grown people.

This came off to me as "You know, if you drop a baby off a 3+ story house, don't be surprised if it's still alive."

Also, about that "servant being seriously injured and quitting" thing, that was most likely a euphemism for death. I mean, in EP1, it said basically that the family loaned lost of money to its members. I thought that was just a euphemism for "everyone's actually really REALLY broke"

Renall · 2010-01-11, 01:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smeckledorf

I would like this explained to me because this is the first time I have heard of this, why does Gaap=Nanjo?

There are several arguments. Basically:

The demons appear not to represent family members based on the patterns of ep1-6. We know at least that Ronove's "vessel" is Genji and Virgilia's is Kumasawa.
Gaap claims to be a "friend" and a "guest," not a servant herself. Nanjo is the only person on the island who is not an Ushiromiya or a servant of the family. He is Kinzo's friend and a guest.
Gaap makes people "disappear" in ep4 and 5. If Nanjo drugged people you could argue he did this in 4, and in 5, his false diagnosis of death would've allowed the "victims" to sneak away once everyone was gone.
Someone compared Gaap's stiletto heels to a needle. If anyone has one of those, it's the doctor.
This is ep6, but Zepar/Furfur appear to be representative of Kanon/Shannon, which would eliminate almost all the non-family candidates for the role except Nanjo and Gohda. Granted, that could simply be coincidence.
Many people suspect Shannon of being Beatrice. If Shannon is indeed Beatrice, she isn't Gaap at the same time. Gaap being her "friend" could refer to Nanjo being in on some plot with Shannon.

Of course, none of this is really proof of anything, but that's why some people think Gaap = Nanjo.

Smeckledorf · 2010-01-11, 02:48

That sure is interesting. But I would not be so quick to say the family couldn't be represented by witches, demons, and the like. I mean Maria thinks she is a witch.

Key Board · 2010-01-11, 04:44

Do you know how Beatrice once said that furnitures are scary and have at times become witches themselves.

That's most likely a flag for episode 7 or 8

Kanon or Shanon or perhaps both (assuming they are the one and the same) are Beatrice

Smeckledorf · 2010-01-11, 04:58

I don't know about Kannon being Beatrice but he does seem to be one of her more useful/favorite tools.

Derlev · 2010-01-11, 08:18

Hello, i tried to work out some pattern to the twilight murders and i wanted to know what others think about it.

Spoiler for The pattern:

Now i'll try to apply the pattern to Episodes 1-3:

Spoiler for Episode 1:

Spoiler for Episode 2:

Spoiler for Episode 3:

I wrote this because i read somewhere that you can guess the following twilights according to the victims of the 1st one. When i searched the web for something similar to this i didn't find anything so if there is a better idea for the victim's order could you please link it.

personally thought i have some problems with that pattern. It's a bit of a problem to guess who is the next victim when it depends where and with whom Battler is. Also, the 2 exception rules (Rule 2 and the skipping Kinzo if his corpse isn't found) need some more work imo. If those rules really do apply there need to be some hints that Kinzo's corpse is going to appear in the Episode and who is under rule 2 in order to guess the victim order.

What do you think? is it the really the pattern for the twilights or is it just some nonesense i made up?
With enough "exception rules" i guess people can make any kind of pattern for the twilights.

Koi · 2010-01-11, 10:03

the gold is in underground...
Probably near chapel...
where it is can be described with word game. A very hard one.
The chances it uses English word is high, but I think it involves kanji too.

oh, BTW... family tree kinda reminds me of the family rank. Can that be used?
Maybe people with family crest... 1+4+4+3= 12

Marion · 2010-01-11, 13:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renall

[*] Many people suspect Shannon of being Beatrice. If Shannon is indeed Beatrice, she isn't Gaap at the same time. Gaap being her "friend" could refer to Nanjo being in on some plot with Shannon.[/LIST]Of course, none of this is really proof of anything, but that's why some people think Gaap = Nanjo.

I would think that point works better for Jessica, who Shannon considers to be her best friend. The fact that in EP 4 Gaap killed George and Jessica knew George died only adds onto that.

And if Gaap isn't a servant, like Virgilia and Ronove are, then why can't she be a member of the family? The pattern shouldn't apply to her.

rogerpepitone · 2010-01-11, 13:34

Gaap, Sakutarou and the Siestas do not wear the one-winged eagle.
Beatrice, Goldsmith, the stakes, the goats, and Ronove do.
Virgilia wears something similar to the one-winged eagle.

Mirrored · 2010-01-11, 15:48

I think that Gaap and Ronove are Nanjo and Kyrie.

At the very least, I imagine that both Nanjo and Kyrie are accomplices. The evidence for this is evidence from the future,

On the day before both leave, a letter is sent with their names as the sender and a return address listed. What this means to me is that they opted to serve as accomplices, with the promise of money that would arrive after or be left to their children.

Thus, Nanjo is leaving the money to his son (or it is simply a security deposit for his cooperation). Kyrie is leaving the money to Ange (or it is simply a security deposit for her cooperation).

Alternatively, I like the theory that Kyrie is an accomplice, and her daughter is being held hostage during the time. However, older Ange does not remember being held hostage, so I think the "leaving money behind" idea is much better.

Smeckledorf · 2010-01-11, 15:57

I believe the letter was for Rudolph. Personally, I think that money was sent as hush money to all the people that KNEW Kinzo was dead.
Also, Ange inherited the Ushiromiya family. I think Kyrie would have left behind almost nothing compared to that.
This actually brings me back to the number Nanjo received, Nanjo did not paint that number on the door but someone who gave it to him did. This would most likely be Krauss or Natsuhi. I don't see the relevance of doing such to help out the remaining survivors or instill fear into them. My guess is this was meant to frame someone after the police came. Either that or we have two different parties killing people.

Midnight Bliss · 2010-01-11, 16:03

Spoiler for theories:

I personally think Nanjo is the true culprit. This is just a theory of mine, though. xD;; Reasons why if you'd ask:

1. Nanjo usually doesn't have a solid alibi in reality. He's always sleeping or playing chess with "Kinzo", who we know, before the start of the game, is already dead. So what could he possibly be doing at the time?

2. He knows about Kudaworian. He could easily kill, fake his death to remove suspicion, and go hide in Kudaworian. If you ask how he knows, refer to ep 4 where Kinzo asks him " you don't remember, old friend?" and Nanjo replies with "Could it possibly be, Kudaworian?" and Kinzo replies with a "yes, you walked down years ago along this same basement" or something along the lines.

3. Since phones and everything is disconnected because of the typhoon, Nanjo as a doctor and the murders going around, his word is the only one that could be taken for. He could lie about his autopsies and other things as well, as he has little to no suspicion as a doctor.

4. He doesn't really have anything to lose, he's old, and he never has had a close relationship with any of the cousins, siblings, or servants. Since Kinzo has already died, he could as well want to have the inheritance to himself.

5. In ep 3, Battler chases after Eva, and Nanjo helps the now blinded Jessica who can't see. Since she couldn't see, he could've faked his death at this point, and Jessica wouldn't know anything, blind. At this moment, he could have killed her, and then next Battler. As he would try and kill Battler, maybe Battler tried to fight back and managed to kill Nanjo as he would be killed, Eva the only one left and running away until the police came, because Nanjo, the true culprit, was killed.

6. We barely know about him and he gets little screen time, so we don't really know what he's up to most of the time.

7. All that, or to some people's theories, he could be Gaap, I guess reducing the number of people on the island before Erika came along and arrived to 16.

As for Shannon being Beatrice, I think it's likely.

1. In ep 2, Beato was shown with the one winged eagle on her leg, just like Shannon does. I'm not sure if this only pertains to the anime and not the vn, though.

2. Battler's "first love" was probably Shannon, as he said he used to have a crush on her 6 years ago. Beatrice wants him to remember his sin of 6 years ago, probably a promise that he made and he could not keep. he could've forgotten a promise he made to Shannon and that would be his sin.

3. So why would Shannon go out with George while in love with Battler? It could be an attempt for jealousy for Battler, and realizing that it didn't work, she might as well disguise herself as the rumored Beatrice and appear before Battler as her and try to see if it works.

4. Sayo, as said a couple of times before, means 34, as well as Lambdadelta. Theories about Lambdadelta's true piece being Shannon could be likely, and maybe it all has to do with her and Lambdadelta making a contract or something of the sort.

...This is just me though. xD;;

Smeckledorf · 2010-01-11, 16:13

Spoiler for response to said theories:

Midnight Bliss · 2010-01-11, 16:18

Spoiler for spoiler:

Judoh · 2010-01-11, 16:35

Spoiler for response to nanjo theory:

Spoiler for more about Kyrie:

2010-01-10, 20:34	Link #5261
imaginari Purupurupiko-Man Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: My beloved hometown, the mackerel river running through it	I just thought of something, just a guess, not much basis for it, but interesting enough. I don't know if it belongs here or in the Epitaph thread. My theory: The mechanism for the hidden passage leading to the Kuwadorian is connected to that of the mansion clock and can only be opened from 10 to 12 o'clock. My evidence: Eva entered the tunnel at 10:00 AM in EP3. Rosa also entered at just close enough of a time to bump into Eva despite the tiny odds of this. Battler and Erika found the gold at 10:00 PM in EP5. The family was shown the gold at 10:47 PM. George and Shannon (and Gaap)'s mysterious meetings always occur between 10 PM and midnight. The gameboard always ends just after the mansion clock strikes twelve, and seemingly never before. The "explosion theory" would be simpler if something in the tunnel was already to be triggered at midnight and the explosives were hooked up to that. There would be no need to purchase a separate timer. What do you guys think?

2010-01-11, 08:18	Link #5271
Derlev Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2010	Hello, i tried to work out some pattern to the twilight murders and i wanted to know what others think about it. Spoiler for The pattern: -This is the pattern for the twilights(as according to the staking). It doesn't nessecarily means the victim is really dead nor that it applies to murders after the twilights. -The order is based only on Episodes 1-3 since only those Episodes have a complete list for the twilights. -The 1st twilight victims are randomly picked. The basic killing order: Rosa, Maria, Rudolf, Hideyoshi, Kyrie, Natsuhi, Krauss, Eva, Jessica, Kinzo, Kannon, Shannon, Gohda, George, Genji, Nanjo, Kumasawa and Battler. The BDP rule (or rule 1) : Any person that is with Battler can't be picked as the victim of the twilight. I'll call it for now "Battler's Divine Protection" or BDP. For example Nartsuhi in episode 1 was under BDP all the time from the moment they discovered the 1st twilight victims until they found the 6th-8th twilight victims so she didn't die during that time. -Rule 2:For some reason i still can't figure that out. The pattern seems to work with the exception of one person in each Episode. I'll then assume another rule: one "random" (until i figure out something else) person can't be picked as a twilight victim. If it weren't for Maria at EP 1 i would have guessed that the person under Rule 2 is maybe the culprit. -If Kinzo's corpse isn't found in the episode we just skip him and go for the next one in the order Now i'll try to apply the pattern to Episodes 1-3: Spoiler for Episode 1: The survivors list is written according to the supposed killing order meaning that if the person is the 1st one on the list and he isn't under "BDP" or "Rule 2" he is the next victim. survivors after the 1st twilight:Maria, Hideyoshi, Natsuhi, Eva, Jessica, Kinzo, Kannon,George, Genji, Nanjo, Kumasawa and Battler. People under BDP during the 2nd twilight:Maria, Jessica, George and Natsuhi. -Eva and Hideyoshi as the victims fit the pattern. survivors after the 2nd twilight:Maria, Natsuhi, Jessica, Kinzo, Kannon,George, Genji, Nanjo, Kumasawa and Battler. People under BDP during the 4th-5th twilights:Everyone besides Kannon, Kinzo and Kumasawa if i'm not mistaken. -the death of Kinzo and Kannon fits the pattern. B]survivors after the 5th twilight:[/B]Maria, Natsuhi, Jessica, George, Genji, Nanjo, Kumasawa and Battler. People under BDP during the 6th-8th twilight:Jessica, George and Natsuhi. -here we apply "Rule 2" for Maria. survivors after the 8th twilight:Maria, Natsuhi, Jessica, George and Battler. Spoiler for Episode 2: survivors after the 1st twilight: Rosa, Maria, Jessica, Kinzo, Kannon, Shannon, Gohda, George, Genji, Nanjo, Kumasawa and Battler. People under BDP during the 2nd twilight: Rosa, Maria, Gohda, George and Nanjo. -Jessica and Kannon as the victims fits the pattern. Rosa was with Battler until Gohda came back and (supposdly) the 2nd twilight occurs. Kinzo's corpse is never found in this episode so he is skipped on the order list. survivors after the 2nd twilight: Rosa, Maria, Kinzo, Shannon, Gohda, George, Genji, Nanjo, Kumasawa and Battler. People under BDP during the 4th-8th twilights: Rosa and Maria. -here we apply "Rule 2" on Genji. survivors after the 8th twilight: Rosa, Maria, Kinzo, Genji and Battler. Spoiler for Episode 3: survivors after the 1st twilight: Rosa, Maria, Rudolf, Hideyoshi, Kyrie, Natsuhi, Krauss, Eva, Jessica, George, Nanjo and Battler. People under BDP during the 2nd twilight:George and Jessica. -Rosa and Maria as the victims fits the pattern. survivors after the 2nd twilight: Rudolf, Hideyoshi, Kyrie, Natsuhi, Krauss, Eva, Jessica, George, Nanjo and Battler. People under BDP during the 4th-6th twilights: Jessica and George. survivors after the 6th twilight: Natsuhi, Krauss, Eva, Jessica, George, Nanjo and Battler. People under BDP during the 7th-8th twilights: Jessica. survivors after the 8th twilight: Eva, Jessica, George, Nanjo and Battler. I wrote this because i read somewhere that you can guess the following twilights according to the victims of the 1st one. When i searched the web for something similar to this i didn't find anything so if there is a better idea for the victim's order could you please link it. personally thought i have some problems with that pattern. It's a bit of a problem to guess who is the next victim when it depends where and with whom Battler is. Also, the 2 exception rules (Rule 2 and the skipping Kinzo if his corpse isn't found) need some more work imo. If those rules really do apply there need to be some hints that Kinzo's corpse is going to appear in the Episode and who is under rule 2 in order to guess the victim order. What do you think? is it the really the pattern for the twilights or is it just some nonesense i made up? With enough "exception rules" i guess people can make any kind of pattern for the twilights. Last edited by Derlev; 2010-01-11 at 08:29.

2010-01-11, 16:03	Link #5277
Midnight Bliss Radiant as the sun; Graphic Designer Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Golden Land	Spoiler for theories: I personally think Nanjo is the true culprit. This is just a theory of mine, though. xD;; Reasons why if you'd ask: 1. Nanjo usually doesn't have a solid alibi in reality. He's always sleeping or playing chess with "Kinzo", who we know, before the start of the game, is already dead. So what could he possibly be doing at the time? 2. He knows about Kudaworian. He could easily kill, fake his death to remove suspicion, and go hide in Kudaworian. If you ask how he knows, refer to ep 4 where Kinzo asks him " you don't remember, old friend?" and Nanjo replies with "Could it possibly be, Kudaworian?" and Kinzo replies with a "yes, you walked down years ago along this same basement" or something along the lines. 3. Since phones and everything is disconnected because of the typhoon, Nanjo as a doctor and the murders going around, his word is the only one that could be taken for. He could lie about his autopsies and other things as well, as he has little to no suspicion as a doctor. 4. He doesn't really have anything to lose, he's old, and he never has had a close relationship with any of the cousins, siblings, or servants. Since Kinzo has already died, he could as well want to have the inheritance to himself. 5. In ep 3, Battler chases after Eva, and Nanjo helps the now blinded Jessica who can't see. Since she couldn't see, he could've faked his death at this point, and Jessica wouldn't know anything, blind. At this moment, he could have killed her, and then next Battler. As he would try and kill Battler, maybe Battler tried to fight back and managed to kill Nanjo as he would be killed, Eva the only one left and running away until the police came, because Nanjo, the true culprit, was killed. 6. We barely know about him and he gets little screen time, so we don't really know what he's up to most of the time. 7. All that, or to some people's theories, he could be Gaap, I guess reducing the number of people on the island before Erika came along and arrived to 16. As for Shannon being Beatrice, I think it's likely. 1. In ep 2, Beato was shown with the one winged eagle on her leg, just like Shannon does. I'm not sure if this only pertains to the anime and not the vn, though. 2. Battler's "first love" was probably Shannon, as he said he used to have a crush on her 6 years ago. Beatrice wants him to remember his sin of 6 years ago, probably a promise that he made and he could not keep. he could've forgotten a promise he made to Shannon and that would be his sin. 3. So why would Shannon go out with George while in love with Battler? It could be an attempt for jealousy for Battler, and realizing that it didn't work, she might as well disguise herself as the rumored Beatrice and appear before Battler as her and try to see if it works. 4. Sayo, as said a couple of times before, means 34, as well as Lambdadelta. Theories about Lambdadelta's true piece being Shannon could be likely, and maybe it all has to do with her and Lambdadelta making a contract or something of the sort. ...This is just me though. xD;; __________________ Jessica: The Love Counselor - fanfic by tjfarmer and me <3 g r a p h i c s

2010-01-11, 16:13	Link #5278
Smeckledorf Intellectual Rapist Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: 3 12151805142615	Spoiler for response to said theories: Gaap representing Nanjo would not change the number of people on the island. Beatrice stated someone else killed him pointblank. Anyways, why would Nanjo be killing over a promise to Shanon? Or any other sin Battler could have commited?

2010-01-11, 16:18	Link #5279
Midnight Bliss Radiant as the sun; Graphic Designer Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Golden Land	Spoiler for spoiler: Well, I never said Nanjo would be killing over Shannon, or Battler for the matter. The Nanjo and Shannon theories i posted above are different from each other and not really related. The Shannon theory i'm not really sure about, because on who Beatrice is, is kind of vague. I'm more onto my Nanjo is the Cuplrit theory. xD; Why he would do so, i'm not sure, my guess just basically having to do with the inheritance, but it'd have to be alot deeper to kill everyone off. Just a theory though, there's plenty of loopholes and such to fill in. __________________ Jessica: The Love Counselor - fanfic by tjfarmer and me <3 g r a p h i c s

2010-01-10, 21:58	Link #5263
tehjoker It's all useless. Join Date: Sep 2008	Shannon is Gaap. That's why George didn't lay a single kick on her.

2010-01-10, 23:18	Link #5264
Judoh Mystery buff Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Gone Fishin!	Hi I just signed up! I just read episode 5 and I'm rereading episodes 1-5 again because I want to figure out the mystery before the epsiode 6 translation comes out. While I was reading I realized something fascinating about the location of Rokkenjima island. I thought if I learned more about it's location I would learn more about why he chose this place for his story. The Izu archipelego ( where Rokkenjima island is) is located in the Devil's sea, which is also right in the middle of the “Dragon's triangle”. Similar to the Bermuda triangle all sorts of weird phenomena happen there. Boats have been reported to disappear there during storms. There are reports of “UFO phenomena” there. Radio communications can stop working during storms as well. In the Bermuda triangle there are even stories of planes flying through portals and traveling back in time The Dragon's triangle really is the perfect place to put Rokkenjima island if you want strange phenomena to occur. It wouldn't be out of the ordinary to even suggest that the storm caused an electromagnetic disturbance at the island that caused everyone to go crazy. Of course I don't think Ryukishi07 would actually use that in his story after what happened in Higurashi, but I think it's interesting that he chose this place for his story specifically because of what happens there. It doesn't help us figure out who the culprit is, but it could explain why they can't even use the radio to call the police. And it might be able to explain the time loops and the supernatural experiences. http://www.unexplainedstuff.com/Plac...-Triangle.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devil%27s_Sea I'm also wondering if maybe the pictures of Rokkenjima island in the openings were maybe some kind of clue to help us figure this out.

2010-01-11, 02:48	Link #5268
Smeckledorf Intellectual Rapist Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: 3 12151805142615	That sure is interesting. But I would not be so quick to say the family couldn't be represented by witches, demons, and the like. I mean Maria thinks she is a witch.

2010-01-11, 04:44	Link #5269
Key Board Carbon Join Date: Nov 2003	Do you know how Beatrice once said that furnitures are scary and have at times become witches themselves. That's most likely a flag for episode 7 or 8 Kanon or Shanon or perhaps both (assuming they are the one and the same) are Beatrice

2010-01-11, 04:58	Link #5270
Smeckledorf Intellectual Rapist Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: 3 12151805142615	I don't know about Kannon being Beatrice but he does seem to be one of her more useful/favorite tools.

2010-01-11, 10:03	Link #5272
Koi Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Indonesia	the gold is in underground... Probably near chapel... where it is can be described with word game. A very hard one. The chances it uses English word is high, but I think it involves kanji too. oh, BTW... family tree kinda reminds me of the family rank. Can that be used? Maybe people with family crest... 1+4+4+3= 12

2010-01-11, 13:34	Link #5274
rogerpepitone Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008	Gaap, Sakutarou and the Siestas do not wear the one-winged eagle. Beatrice, Goldsmith, the stakes, the goats, and Ronove do. Virgilia wears something similar to the one-winged eagle.

2010-01-11, 15:48	Link #5275
Mirrored Member Join Date: Dec 2009	I think that Gaap and Ronove are Nanjo and Kyrie. At the very least, I imagine that both Nanjo and Kyrie are accomplices. The evidence for this is evidence from the future, On the day before both leave, a letter is sent with their names as the sender and a return address listed. What this means to me is that they opted to serve as accomplices, with the promise of money that would arrive after or be left to their children. Thus, Nanjo is leaving the money to his son (or it is simply a security deposit for his cooperation). Kyrie is leaving the money to Ange (or it is simply a security deposit for her cooperation). Alternatively, I like the theory that Kyrie is an accomplice, and her daughter is being held hostage during the time. However, older Ange does not remember being held hostage, so I think the "leaving money behind" idea is much better.

2010-01-11, 15:57	Link #5276
Smeckledorf Intellectual Rapist Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: 3 12151805142615	I believe the letter was for Rudolph. Personally, I think that money was sent as hush money to all the people that KNEW Kinzo was dead. Also, Ange inherited the Ushiromiya family. I think Kyrie would have left behind almost nothing compared to that. This actually brings me back to the number Nanjo received, Nanjo did not paint that number on the door but someone who gave it to him did. This would most likely be Krauss or Natsuhi. I don't see the relevance of doing such to help out the remaining survivors or instill fear into them. My guess is this was meant to frame someone after the police came. Either that or we have two different parties killing people.

2010-01-11, 16:35	Link #5280
Judoh Mystery buff Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Gone Fishin!	Spoiler for response to nanjo theory: Wasn't it said in red that "Nanjo is not a murderer"? Personally I like the Taiwan theory becuase the bomb at the end explains why only Maria's jaw was found after 1986 and why none of the other bodies were found. A Bomb could cause fires, mud slides, and all kinds of things that could kill everyone. It could also explain why they were running from the Kuwadorian. My theory is Kyrie already knew where the Kuwadorian was from her "friends from Tokyo" (episode 5) she led everyone to the Kuwadorian in episode 4 and had the other characters like Nanjo and Genji give the cousins their tests. The tests were a distraction they put up while they were trying to find out how much the gold at the Kuwadorian was worth. Kyrie started the bomb, everybody freaked and they went to warn everyone. After that Kyrie killed them for knowing too much and fed Battler the disinfo about magic. Nanjo on the other hand doesn't spread disinfo about the witch being the culprit so even if he doesn't have an alibi he's not suspicious to me. Spoiler for more about Kyrie: Kyrie is the first person to say they should open the letter from Beatrice in episode 1 She gives people hints about the epitaph in episode 3 and 5, which could be foreshadowing that she might already know the answer to the epitaph. In Episode 5 she says she has "friends from Tokyo" when talking about Krauss's money troubles Some people have theorized that Erika was hired by Kyrie I also think the culprit should be someone who would want to send a message to Battler and that would be either Jessica, Kyrie, or Shannon, but I don't think it's only possible for them it might also be possible for Rosa to be the culprit. She tells Battler to beleive in magic and demons in episode 4. In episode 5 she helps deceive the detective Erika to come to the "Natsuhi culprit theory conclusion". oh and Ange was born 6 years ago and that's when Battlers sin is, coincidence? Last edited by Judoh; 2010-01-11 at 16:57.