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SaintessHeart · 2012-12-02, 09:09

I finally have a first taste of a UEFI mobo today. It has a nice interface, but it doesn't detect partitions, extra HDDs or any network card on it until the driver is manually installed.

Can someone provide an insight into what exactly is this, and why is it constantly touted as bigger and better than BIOS?

Jinto · 2012-12-03, 16:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by SaintessHeart

I finally have a first taste of a UEFI mobo today. It has a nice interface, but it doesn't detect partitions, extra HDDs or any network card on it until the driver is manually installed.

Can someone provide an insight into what exactly is this, and why is it constantly touted as bigger and better than BIOS?

Its more generic... and as is often with stuff that is more generic... it is more complex. Which directly translates into: harder to get right.

Its basically bananaware a perpetual beta. The software ripens or rather matures at the customer site. Thats you Saintess. Now be a nice beta tester and report all those minor issues.

(Sorry, I don't mean to be mean. Its just another way to say. Oh no, why would you buy immature technology... but if it makes you feel better... look at it this way: its basically Loli-tech ~ way too young

)

Dr. Casey · 2012-12-04, 23:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jinto

its basically Loli-tech ~ way too young

)

kawaiiiiiiii

I wonder if Saintess refuses to buy USB sticks and keeps using floppies instead. Floppy disks store a smaller amount of data, 1.44 megabytes versus gigabytes upon gigabyes, therefore they are loli and more moe.

SaintessHeart · 2012-12-05, 06:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jinto

Its more generic... and as is often with stuff that is more generic... it is more complex. Which directly translates into: harder to get right.

Its basically bananaware a perpetual beta. The software ripens or rather matures at the customer site. Thats you Saintess. Now be a nice beta tester and report all those minor issues.

(Sorry, I don't mean to be mean. Its just another way to say. Oh no, why would you buy immature technology... but if it makes you feel better... look at it this way: its basically Loli-tech ~ way too young

)

Nah that is not mean. I find it quite funny actually.

I was building a PC for my friend on the fly (requisitioning parts on the spot and doing all the math based on budget) and was using a new Gigabyte board, but I didn't realise that Gigabyte switched all their new boards to UEFI.

UEFI has been around since the mid-2000s, though from what I have read, it has only just been commercialised. Is anyone here using an UEFI board, and can tell me the practical cans and cannots of it?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Casey

kawaiiiiiiii

I wonder if Saintess refuses to buy USB sticks and keeps using floppies instead. Floppy disks store a smaller amount of data, 1.44 megabytes versus gigabytes upon gigabyes, therefore they are loli and more moe.

But their tight spots don't seem as enjoyable You dirty lolicon! Get your mind out of the gutter!

chikorita157 · 2012-12-05, 17:42

UEFI is a new standard made by Intel. I think it's first widely used in Macs when Apple transitioned to Intel processors in 2006. Basically, it has more advantages over BIOS as it supports drives over 2 TB (with the new GUID partition table), is CPU dependent, CPU dependent drivers, and also supports Secure Boot along with other things. However, it's only has native support with Windows Vista or higher, Recent versions of Linux and BSD (excluding Mac OS X as you can't install that on non-apple machines without some kind of hack). So essentially, it's supposed to be better than BIOS as it's becoming outdated and BIOS doesn't support drives over 2TB natively.

SeijiSensei · 2012-12-05, 19:44

Ubuntu and RedHat ended up licensing Microsoft's UEFI signing key just so people could continue to install Linux distros on UEFI machines. From everything I've read, the added "security" UEFI provides is minimal at best, but it did erect yet another barrier to all of Microsoft's competitors. I'm especially concerned about whether UEFI will restrict the use of bootable CDs which give people the opportunity to try Linux without altering their machines. We'll see what happens.

Saintess, does that motherboard come with a physical switch to disable UEFI? At one time I recall that hardware manufacturers were strongly encouraged to offer this option on their motherboards. Any evidence for that in your case?

SaintessHeart · 2012-12-05, 20:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

Ubuntu and RedHat ended up licensing Microsoft's UEFI signing key just so people could continue to install Linux distros on UEFI machines. From everything I've read, the added "security" UEFI provides is minimal at best, but it did erect yet another barrier to all of Microsoft's competitors. I'm especially concerned about whether UEFI will restrict the use of bootable CDs which give people the opportunity to try Linux without altering their machines. We'll see what happens.

Saintess, does that motherboard come with a physical switch to disable UEFI? At one time I recall that hardware manufacturers were strongly encouraged to offer this option on their motherboards. Any evidence for that in your case?

Not that I know of. The board is Gigabyte's new Series 7 LGA 1155 board running on an i3 CPU. I made a mistake of not loading Win7 using the command prompt.

So far, I read through forums about long-term problems and my friend has yet to call me for a bricked boot. Though there seems to be a workaround that can permanently disable UEFI on the firmware side.

sa547 · 2012-12-05, 21:47

Damn, after more than a decade of working with PCs, looks like this is too cutting-edge tech that I'll have to study about.

Wandering_Youth · 2012-12-06, 07:25

Straight from Wikipedia.

Pros of UFEI:
- Ability to boot from large disks (over 2 TiB) with a GUID Partition Table, GPT.[12][13]
- CPU-independent architecture[12]
- CPU-independent drivers[12]
- Flexible pre-OS environment, including network capability
- Modular design

I don't know too much about a motherboard's BIOS other than how to overclock them, but UFEI just looks more fancy and streamlined giving sensor, status and component info on a silver platter. I feel like they're trying to make the BIOs more user friendly to people who don't know much about computers so that they can learn.

A few other things I have heard though sound interesting regarding UFEI. Overall because of it's improved basic I/O on the software side it makes POST functions faster so it usually cuts down on boot/POST up times compared to BIOS boards. It also is supposedly more diagnostic friendly so problems on a broken board can be quickly isolated and repaired as there seems to be more sensors and status feedback. But as Jinto has said it is relativity new to consumer market boards so the GUI and functions are less straight forward than BIOs.

I recently bought a Gigabyte Z77-UD5H motherboard LGA 1155 for my new gaming rig which I hope it last me for a good 5+ years. I'm loving this my new computer so far.

SaintessHeart · 2012-12-06, 10:28

The only thing I have found useful is that UEFI boards read 3+TB HDDs. It is not like these things can run an OS without bricking anyway.

SeijiSensei · 2012-12-06, 10:51

Plus you know that companies like HP will use up all four primary partitions no matter what size the drive and stick the large Windows partition in the middle so it cannot be easily resized if you want to add another operating system.

Is it not possible to boot a 2+ TB drive using a standard BIOS if it is partitioned to include a small initial partition with the boot loader installed there on in the Master Boot Record?

TJR · 2012-12-06, 12:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by SaintessHeart

The only thing I have found useful is that UEFI boards read 3+TB HDDs. It is not like these things can run an OS without bricking anyway.

FWIW, the tweaking/overclocking community favours UEFI a lot. Something about greater flexibility, more information, and faster POST speed (because of the modular design). They gave Gigabyte much grief for sticking with Award's legacy BIOS when the competition (ASUS, ASRock, MSI) had already moved on.

Enthusiasts make up a tiny segment of the market though, so most users probably don't see much benefit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

Is it not possible to boot a 2+ TB drive using a standard BIOS if it is partitioned to include a small initial partition with the boot loader installed there on in the Master Boot Record?

Yes, Gigabyte previously offered a custom bootloader as a stopgap.

2012-12-02, 09:09	Link #1
SaintessHeart NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~ Join Date: Nov 2007 Age: 35	UEFI vs BIOS I finally have a first taste of a UEFI mobo today. It has a nice interface, but it doesn't detect partitions, extra HDDs or any network card on it until the driver is manually installed. Can someone provide an insight into what exactly is this, and why is it constantly touted as bigger and better than BIOS? __________________ When three puppygirls named after pastries are on top of each other, it is called Eclair a'la menthe et Biscotti aux fraises avec beaucoup de Ricotta sur le dessus. Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.

2012-12-05, 17:42	Link #5
chikorita157 ひきこもりアイドル IT Support Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Pennsylvania , United States Age: 34	UEFI is a new standard made by Intel. I think it's first widely used in Macs when Apple transitioned to Intel processors in 2006. Basically, it has more advantages over BIOS as it supports drives over 2 TB (with the new GUID partition table), is CPU dependent, CPU dependent drivers, and also supports Secure Boot along with other things. However, it's only has native support with Windows Vista or higher, Recent versions of Linux and BSD (excluding Mac OS X as you can't install that on non-apple machines without some kind of hack). So essentially, it's supposed to be better than BIOS as it's becoming outdated and BIOS doesn't support drives over 2TB natively. __________________ Chikorita157's Anime Blog \| Atelier Shiori (Personal Sideblog) \| Tumblr \| Twitter

2012-12-05, 19:44	Link #6
SeijiSensei AS Oji-kun Join Date: Nov 2006 Age: 74	Ubuntu and RedHat ended up licensing Microsoft's UEFI signing key just so people could continue to install Linux distros on UEFI machines. From everything I've read, the added "security" UEFI provides is minimal at best, but it did erect yet another barrier to all of Microsoft's competitors. I'm especially concerned about whether UEFI will restrict the use of bootable CDs which give people the opportunity to try Linux without altering their machines. We'll see what happens. Saintess, does that motherboard come with a physical switch to disable UEFI? At one time I recall that hardware manufacturers were strongly encouraged to offer this option on their motherboards. Any evidence for that in your case? __________________ Taking Anime Seriously - Politics by the Numbers - Sports by the Numbers - MAL List - Avatars - Images

2012-12-05, 21:47	Link #8
sa547 Senior Member Author Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Philippines Age: 47	Damn, after more than a decade of working with PCs, looks like this is too cutting-edge tech that I'll have to study about. __________________

2012-12-06, 07:25	Link #9
Wandering_Youth lost in wonder forever... Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: edge of my dream in the land of twilight...ZzzZzZ	Straight from Wikipedia. Pros of UFEI: - Ability to boot from large disks (over 2 TiB) with a GUID Partition Table, GPT.[12][13] - CPU-independent architecture[12] - CPU-independent drivers[12] - Flexible pre-OS environment, including network capability - Modular design I don't know too much about a motherboard's BIOS other than how to overclock them, but UFEI just looks more fancy and streamlined giving sensor, status and component info on a silver platter. I feel like they're trying to make the BIOs more user friendly to people who don't know much about computers so that they can learn. A few other things I have heard though sound interesting regarding UFEI. Overall because of it's improved basic I/O on the software side it makes POST functions faster so it usually cuts down on boot/POST up times compared to BIOS boards. It also is supposedly more diagnostic friendly so problems on a broken board can be quickly isolated and repaired as there seems to be more sensors and status feedback. But as Jinto has said it is relativity new to consumer market boards so the GUI and functions are less straight forward than BIOs. I recently bought a Gigabyte Z77-UD5H motherboard LGA 1155 for my new gaming rig which I hope it last me for a good 5+ years. I'm loving this my new computer so far. __________________ Last edited by Wandering_Youth; 2012-12-06 at 07:45.

2012-12-06, 10:28	Link #10
SaintessHeart NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~ Join Date: Nov 2007 Age: 35	The only thing I have found useful is that UEFI boards read 3+TB HDDs. It is not like these things can run an OS without bricking anyway. __________________ When three puppygirls named after pastries are on top of each other, it is called Eclair a'la menthe et Biscotti aux fraises avec beaucoup de Ricotta sur le dessus. Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.

2012-12-06, 10:51	Link #11
SeijiSensei AS Oji-kun Join Date: Nov 2006 Age: 74	Plus you know that companies like HP will use up all four primary partitions no matter what size the drive and stick the large Windows partition in the middle so it cannot be easily resized if you want to add another operating system. Is it not possible to boot a 2+ TB drive using a standard BIOS if it is partitioned to include a small initial partition with the boot loader installed there on in the Master Boot Record? __________________ Taking Anime Seriously - Politics by the Numbers - Sports by the Numbers - MAL List - Avatars - Images