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Old 2012-05-22, 02:10   Link #2301
NoemiChan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flawnalyst View Post
Anyways, while I didn't like the way this show was adapted, I didn't say anything about the format. I stated that the editing was bad. Each of the arcs felt really cut down and rushed, and some of the sex scenes weren't worked in well.
I kinda agree with you. If all of the sex scenes were complete remove and making this a romance ecchi and harem anime (and not a borderline) like Amagami, this would have been appreciated more or at least make a diffence.

Last edited by NoemiChan; 2012-05-22 at 02:39.
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Old 2012-05-30, 09:00   Link #2302
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Originally Posted by rejer View Post
Yosuga no Sora got approved by the Tokyo Gorverment. This is big news guys.
Now expect every anime to feature a real sister getting captured by the protagonist!!
This is like a dream come true!!!
What are you talking about...? The government in Tokyo introduced a law some time ago that allowed them to -- if they want -- control the distribution of certain works by classifying them as adult-only (not suitable for sale to minors). There is no "approval process". If they did not reclassify this anime, it doesn't necessarily indicate approval or anything -- just that they didn't reclassify it. And the rest is silly.

Do you have any links or sources to clarify what you are referring to?
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Old 2012-05-30, 10:11   Link #2303
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Originally Posted by relentlessflame View Post
What are you talking about...? The government in Tokyo introduced a law some time ago that allowed them to -- if they want -- control the distribution of certain works by classifying them as adult-only (not suitable for sale to minors). There is no "approval process". If they did not reclassify this anime, it doesn't necessarily indicate approval or anything -- just that they didn't reclassify it. And the rest is silly.

Do you have any links or sources to clarify what you are referring to?
Maybe he's referring to this:

http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=447095

I'll quote:

Quote:
According to the minutes of the proceedings recorded at the 623rd Tokyo Metropolitan Council for Healthy Nurture of Juveniles held on May 14th, TV anime "Yosuga no Sora" was brought up for discussion. Although the section chief of the Youth Affairs concerned about the description of incest in the anime, he reached a conclusion that Yosuga no Sora does not violate Tokyo government's anime and manga regulation ordinance because the description was not excessive and there was no intention in the anime to present incest as socially accepted.
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Old 2012-05-30, 11:36   Link #2304
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You think that if anyone reads that info, is starting a petition for a season 2 of the show?^^;;
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Old 2012-05-30, 11:43   Link #2305
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Originally Posted by MAX_COLA_POWER! View Post
You think that if anyone reads that info, is starting a petition for a season 2 of the show?^^;;
Why would there be a need for a 2nd season unless you want the same stories retold in better detail than the few episodes that was used for every arc or if you want the stories from the fandisc animated (which were in my opinion not that good).
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Old 2012-05-30, 11:45   Link #2306
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I could imagine when they adapt the fandisc into 2-part OVA.
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Old 2012-05-30, 12:04   Link #2307
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Well, it may give the class rep and Motoka's friend to get a shot at Haru since they were wickedly shafted in the first story, especially the former-v-. When it comes to better detail, I'm just thinking since the fans the pairing of the twins more than any other pairing, I just figured they wanted to see more.
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Old 2012-05-30, 14:21   Link #2308
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Originally Posted by Peanutbutter View Post
Quote:
According to the minutes of the proceedings recorded at the 623rd Tokyo Metropolitan Council for Healthy Nurture of Juveniles held on May 14th, TV anime "Yosuga no Sora" was brought up for discussion. Although the section chief of the Youth Affairs concerned about the description of incest in the anime, he reached a conclusion that Yosuga no Sora does not violate Tokyo government's anime and manga regulation ordinance because the description was not excessive and there was no intention in the anime to present incest as socially accepted.
Ah, I see. Indeed, they decided to not place it on the list, which isn't really "approval"... but could probably be seen as precedent. I'm not too surprised because this anime is rather old by now so isn't nearly as prominent as it once was anyway; there would be little to be gained in reclassifying it now. But I suppose it does put the anime's subject-to-interpretation ending in a different perspective, as that's really what cements that it's not being shown as "socially accepted". Each case helps creators understand more clearly what the lawmakers are really going after (which seems to be "excessive portrayals of immoral behaviour in a positive light"), given that the wording of the law is far too vague.
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Old 2012-05-30, 18:22   Link #2309
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Dunno, I found the rational for not rebranding it as R-18 hilarious (SC-translation, because I'm lazy):

Quote:
Depicts a brother engaging in incestuous activity with his younger sister. However, it is presented in a way which might be socially approved of and the depictions were not excessively detailed or frequent.
All I have to say is that it didn't sell that much, so better make it into a true R-18, rather than a faux-hentai like all those shounen manga with clever censorship... but still I am glad that:



Come on, the only manga they have "rebranded" are shoujo that feature independent women and the saddest thing is that his "laws" are celebrated by feminists and those irresponsible self-proclaimed pedo-hunters, that equate their children's right with drawings
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Old 2012-05-30, 19:21   Link #2310
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I suspect the translation on Sankaku Complex is incorrect, rendering your image even more pointless than it already is. I don't think they are saying that the depiction was "socially acceptable", but rather that it was not pitched as socially acceptable. The fact that it was forbidden and wrong was a major theme of the work.

As for the sales, it was certainly one of the best-selling eroge adaptations in years, so I think their approach was arguably rewarded. If they had made it a "true R-18" show, we wouldn't have gotten even the 12 episodes we had, so I think it was better this way.
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Old 2012-05-30, 19:30   Link #2311
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I feel as though that, after all the VN sales, Animé sales, and Manga sales this series had, saying that now it's acceptable, not so rejected, or however it's taken, I'm gonna go with Relentless' take, I don't really see a point to it. It came, it saw, it conquered. Most people wish there would be more of it, but sadly, there won't be for the time being.
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Old 2012-05-31, 04:49   Link #2312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by relentlessflame View Post
I suspect the translation on Sankaku Complex is incorrect, rendering your image even more pointless than it already is. I don't think they are saying that the depiction was "socially acceptable", but rather that it was not pitched as socially acceptable. The fact that it was forbidden and wrong was a major theme of the work.

As for the sales, it was certainly one of the best-selling eroge adaptations in years, so I think their approach was arguably rewarded. If they had made it a "true R-18" show, we wouldn't have gotten even the 12 episodes we had, so I think it was better this way.
Yes, the people on sankaku have translated the minutes wrongly.

http://www.seisyounen-chian.metro.to...23gijiroku.pdf

It's like Relentlessflame said, there was in fact no indication that Yosuga no sora wanted to make incest socially acceptable. (beginning of page 6)
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Old 2012-05-31, 07:08   Link #2313
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So Artefact was accurate in translating the "infrequently" and "inexcessively"

As for snubbing hentai, you guys are assuming a hentai without the budget the anime had. The anime IMHO was very good, but it could have been better shouldn't it worry about self-censorship, and go all-out on its taboo themes with more realistic and graphic depictions... especially for the last two arcs and Motoka shorts.

@relentlessflame: 冗談(= pointless talk)that's what jokes are... pointless and I hoped erroneously (again) harmless
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Old 2012-05-31, 21:44   Link #2314
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As for snubbing hentai, you guys are assuming a hentai without the budget the anime had. The anime IMHO was very good, but it could have been better shouldn't it worry about self-censorship, and go all-out on its taboo themes with more realistic and graphic depictions... especially for the last two arcs and Motoka shorts.
Well, how many "hentai anime" are there that actually have a budget equivalent to a TV series? Not many that I'm aware of, anyway. Realistically, if it hadn't gotten a TV series, I would expect the usual collection of maybe 2 or 3 OVA volumes filled almost entirely with sex scenes and no notable story at all. To me personally, that wouldn't have been an improvement. From my point of view, I don't even see what would be gained by being even more graphic than it already was, which was already seen as pushing the limits even for AT-X. I'm not sure how much more we really needed to see... but that's just me.

At the end of the day, I didn't find the depictions in the original eroge to be particularly "realistic or graphic", even though it obviously included full sex scenes. I think the anime did fairly well (most of the time) at keeping the story driving the narrative, and using those scenes to support the story.
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Old 2012-06-02, 00:27   Link #2315
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Well, how many "hentai anime" are there that actually have a budget equivalent to a TV series? Not many that I'm aware of, anyway. Realistically, if it hadn't gotten a TV series, I would expect the usual collection of maybe 2 or 3 OVA volumes filled almost entirely with sex scenes and no notable story at all. To me personally, that wouldn't have been an improvement.
That's the sad thing about hentai animation in Japan. There's nothing intrinsic to the genre that's stopping hentai animation shows from becoming well-made pieces of media with fleshed-out characters and storylines, but the fact of the matter is that for the most part, it's considered part-and-parcel of the Japanese pornography industry (where the standards for such quality are much lower), and so the budget necessary to include those elements (along with good animation) is next to impossible to obtain. A rare few titles have managed to do so (the Wet Summer Days OVA series is one such example), but as long as the standards of quality + audience expectations + probable return on investment for h-anime remain so low, it'll be a rare gem that can obtain enough of a budget to claw itself free of all that muck.

There was another option for the Yosuga no Sora anime though, one that could have released full-on h-scenes AND have sold a lot. All they had to do would be to release uncensored, full on h-versions of the episodes (possibly in their own special collectible blu-ray set) after releasing the main series, and sit back and charge a good price while the slavering otakus lap it all up. Mind you, the deal in this case would be that they'd have to buy the main series blu-rays AND the full-on h-episodes separately if they wanted the complete package, but otakus have been known to shell out more money for even less value.

Quote:
Originally Posted by relentlessflame View Post
I think the anime did fairly well (most of the time) at keeping the story driving the narrative, and using those scenes to support the story.
I would agree with this; YnS was a groundbreaker in this regard for eroge-to-anime adaptations. It'll be interesting to see whether other would-be creators of eroge-to-anime adaptations will follow suit with the same or better level of quality. In some ways I think Amagami SS suffered for not going "all the way" in this one respect.
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Old 2012-06-02, 00:34   Link #2316
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You know, every time I got on this thread, I get like this wicked depression on me-v-;;. It's not because of the users here because what you guys say makes sense, it's because the fact that this made it to the older series section, and we'll never see another series like this one again .
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Old 2012-06-02, 15:10   Link #2317
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Originally Posted by Mazryonh View Post
There was another option for the Yosuga no Sora anime though, one that could have released full-on h-scenes AND have sold a lot. All they had to do would be to release uncensored, full on h-versions of the episodes (possibly in their own special collectible blu-ray set) after releasing the main series, and sit back and charge a good price while the slavering otakus lap it all up. Mind you, the deal in this case would be that they'd have to buy the main series blu-rays AND the full-on h-episodes separately if they wanted the complete package, but otakus have been known to shell out more money for even less value.
I think that can't happen because the of the various production partners. The line between "H" and "non-H" is pretty clear in the public-facing side of the industry (even if it's pretty fuzzy in terms of the content), and I'm not sure that some of the companies would have gotten involved or invested if they knew it was going to be altered to cross into the "adult anime" section. What would be more likely would be, rather than a re-release of the anime, to make new H OVAs not related to the previous production. This happened with Princess Lover, for example. That way, even though it's the same franchise, the line between the two sides of the industry don't get crossed. A lot of it is about keeping up appearances (just like how many voice actors use fake names for their H work).
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Old 2012-06-03, 23:10   Link #2318
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Originally Posted by relentlessflame View Post
The line between "H" and "non-H" is pretty clear in the public-facing side of the industry (even if it's pretty fuzzy in terms of the content), and I'm not sure that some of the companies would have gotten involved or invested if they knew it was going to be altered to cross into the "adult anime" section. What would be more likely would be, rather than a re-release of the anime, to make new H OVAs not related to the previous production. This happened with Princess Lover, for example. That way, even though it's the same franchise, the line between the two sides of the industry don't get crossed. A lot of it is about keeping up appearances (just like how many voice actors use fake names for their H work).
Yes, "keeping up appearances" is a strong cultural incentive in Japan. Yes, the "Princess Lover Solution" could work, though it could work better if the H-OVAs were better integrated into the story. For example, in episode 7 of the anime, there is a strikingly similar situation in the game's CGs that show an H-scene that happened there (and Nao's expression in the morning of the next episode strongly implies this). An H-OVA picking up there could be titled "N2.5" (meaning it's supposed to be played just after Nao's second episode but before her third).

I personally don't understand why seiyuus have to use pseudonyms for their H work. There's quite a lot of well-written eroge that involves voice work as serious and involved as any other "mainstream" production now, so why would segueing into that be looked down upon?

Still, I wonder if the person who proposed the idea for the YnS anime's branching structure was duly awarded for this kind of innovation. It certainly contributed to the high sales for this series in Japan.
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Old 2012-06-04, 01:46   Link #2319
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Originally Posted by Mazryonh View Post
I personally don't understand why seiyuus have to use pseudonyms for their H work. There's quite a lot of well-written eroge that involves voice work as serious and involved as any other "mainstream" production now, so why would segueing into that be looked down upon?
There used to be thread about eroge seiyuu's in the general somewhere in this forum, but anyways i think that these seiyuu's don't want to be associated with these kind of work eventhough they occasionally have to take these kind of jobs.
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Old 2012-06-04, 02:10   Link #2320
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Originally Posted by Mazryonh View Post
Yes, "keeping up appearances" is a strong cultural incentive in Japan. Yes, the "Princess Lover Solution" could work, though it could work better if the H-OVAs were better integrated into the story. For example, in episode 7 of the anime, there is a strikingly similar situation in the game's CGs that show an H-scene that happened there (and Nao's expression in the morning of the next episode strongly implies this). An H-OVA picking up there could be titled "N2.5" (meaning it's supposed to be played just after Nao's second episode but before her third).

I personally don't understand why seiyuus have to use pseudonyms for their H work. There's quite a lot of well-written eroge that involves voice work as serious and involved as any other "mainstream" production now, so why would segueing into that be looked down upon?

Still, I wonder if the person who proposed the idea for the YnS anime's branching structure was duly awarded for this kind of innovation. It certainly contributed to the high sales for this series in Japan.
Seriously, you need to read about the topics that the Japanese members around these forums contribute.

There was one case I read, as an example, in the past about a very famous seiyuu during her time. I forgot the seiyuu's name, but I do remember she formed part of the Neon Genesis Evangelion's main voice cast at the time.

When it was found that she also had done some roles in erotic H-Anime, she was terribly lambasted and there was a public outcry against her. It took about 10 years, quite more or less, so that public opinion could completely forget the whole incident. However, during all that time in between her career got both jeopardized and spiraled down.

Reason why seiyuus have need and use for pseudonyms to prevent incidents like that one from ever materializing.
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