Characters you are intended/ expected to hate by creators but end up liking

[fukarming]

Are there any characters that it is very obvious that the creators want you to hate them, but you end up sympathizing/ liking them? I am not talking about characters like anti-heroes that are made to be sympathize (like most characters in code geass or gundam franchise), but out and out (supposedly) despicable characters.

For me, that would be:

Shido - Highschool of the Dead.
Anime this season and is still going. I found Shido to be relatable compare to all the main cast ., all his actions are necessary for his own survival, especially if you are not some type of superhuman wearing unbreakable plot armor. If zombie apocalypse indeed happen, I would become/ join Shido any day over the main characters.

Legato - Trigun
Although he is not the main and final villain (Million knifes is), he is much more memorable and his final scheme to sacrifice his own life to make Vash kill proving Vash wrong are just cool to the extreme.

Naraku - Inuyasha
I like him that he is the supervillain with a brain. Naraku is never overpower (except very early on when he got most of the Shikon Jewel) compare to inuyasha and co. Instead of using blunt force, he tries to use schemes and strategies to weaken Inuyasha's group.

[Marisa Kirisame]

I'm just gonna leave this here

[Tai223236]

.....Er, I'll get back to you on this...

...You know, after I figure out how I didn't know about that site of awesomeness Marisa posted....

[Roloko vi Britannia]

hmm well some people prefer despicable characters whether or not the creators intended/expected the characters to be hated it all comes down to the fan's preference in the end.

As for me I do love Shido too myself he is awesome and I think I would also join him too

[shaolinx]

Originally Posted by Roloko vi Britannia

As for me I do love Shido too myself he is awesome and I think I would also join him too

I don't understand why anyone would join his group. Clearly, his actions are for personal gain and will sacrifice YOU when he needs to.

I personally will join the other group, as there is alot more trust and team work.

[roriconfan]

This is silly; the makers strive to NOT have hateful characters. If they do they probably DON'T have sympathetic, not even amongst the heroes.

[C.A.]

One of the fundamental principles of character design is called appeal.

Appeal doesn't mean that the character has to look good, or must either be loved or hated by audience. A character with good appeal is simply one who gets a reaction from the audience.

There will always be love or hate for any type of character, a character designer doesn't choose to make a character lovable or hateful. The designer only gives the character traits and personalities to make him appealing, to bring the character to life.

[fukarming]

Originally Posted by Marisa Kirisame

I'm just gonna leave this here

Out of my three examples, Legato is probably the most borderline as he is made despicable awesome. But Shido will be my point as it is very obvious in the anime that the director want you to hate Shido, but yet I find him engaging and relatable.

Originally Posted by Roloko vi Britannia

hmm well some people prefer despicable characters whether or not the creators intended/expected the characters to be hated it all comes down to the fan's preference in the end.

As for me I do love Shido too myself he is awesome and I think I would also join him too

There are plenty of despicable yet popular character. But my point is if there are any characters that the director want you to hate.
So you think it is more the audience perspective rather than the character?

Originally Posted by shaolinx

I don't understand why anyone would join his group. Clearly, his actions are for personal gain and will sacrifice YOU when he needs to.

I personally will join the other group, as there is alot more trust and team work.

It is not the HOTD thread so I will not be responding here. When Shido first appear in HOTD I try to stir up a meaningful discussion in the HOTD thread but I don't get any response. All I get is "Shido should go to hell blah blah blah"

Originally Posted by roriconfan

This is silly; the makers strive to NOT have hateful characters. If they do they probably DON'T have sympathetic, not even amongst the heroes.

What are you talking about? Of course there are characters that the author intend you to hate. Use your favorite LOGH as an example, the author clearly wants the audience to hate the corrupting leader of the Free Planet.

Originally Posted by C.A.

One of the fundamental principles of character design is called appeal.

Appeal doesn't mean that the character has to look good, or must either be loved or hated by audience. A character with good appeal is simply one who gets a reaction from the audience.

There will always be love or hate for any type of character, a character designer doesn't choose to make a character lovable or hateful. The designer only gives the character traits and personalities to make him appealing, to bring the character to life.

So you are saying the creator, when they design a character, they do not have the audience reaction in their mind?
I can't say I agree to that. I believe most commercial anime series have all these calculated.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by roriconfan

This is silly; the makers strive to NOT have hateful characters. If they do they probably DON'T have sympathetic, not even amongst the heroes.

There are characters that the audience is meant to hate, in order to get the full emotional effect of certain scenes.

For example, a fair number of antagonists/villains are made sooooo incredibly evil and/or sadistic. The creator's thinking behind such characters is often that the average viewer will be so repulsed by such characters that there will be a real emotional high for the viewer in watching these characters get their "just desserts", as it were.

However, its a mistake to think that all antagonists/villains are like that. Some are meant to be sympathetic and add moral ambiguity to the conflict, while some others are meant to simply be amusing and entertaining more than anything else. The viewer is not meant to outright hate these types of antagonists or villains.


Some characters are also not outright villains, but are set up as a way for the author to critique certain personality types or character elements. I've seen a fair number of characters like this in the Star Trek shows.

[Kudryavka]

Heather from Total Drama, but only because

Spoiler for td spoilers:

her evilness is shadowed by other characters' in Action and World Tour, and pity because she's been routinely physically abused ever since the Owen/Gwen teamup in Island. But it's glaringly obvious the audience is supposed to hate her in Island, and a few key events, most notably the Bike Race episode in Island, led to all of the campers disliking her to some extent (most just steer clear of her, but the ambitious few have made archenemies of her. She has like three or four people who hate her guts now? Even the new nerdy girl in World Tour avoids her ).

Mio Akiyama for another. Hated her for being such a shallow, yet popular character at first, but now I've come to like her.

[C.A.]

Originally Posted by fukarming

So you are saying the creator, when they design a character, they do not have the audience reaction in their mind?
I can't say I agree to that. I believe most commercial anime series have all these calculated.

What I'm saying is that no character can only invoke one type of reaction, even the designer himself cannot fully decide how a character must be liked or disliked.

What the designer can do is choose a bunch of traits to create a type of appeal.

You can design an evil character, make him sadistic, sarcastic, loves kicking baby pets etc, one might think that he will be hated, but in the end he might be too funny to hate.

Creating appeal is about having audience reaction in mind, but the expected reaction will never be the same for any audience.

[fukarming]

Originally Posted by C.A.

What I'm saying is that no character can only invoke one type of reaction, even the designer himself cannot fully decide how a character must be liked or disliked.

What the designer can do is choose a bunch of traits to create a type of appeal.

You can design an evil character, make him sadistic, sarcastic, loves kicking baby pets etc, one might think that he will be hated, but in the end he might be too funny to hate.

Creating appeal is about having audience reaction in mind, but the expected reaction will never be the same for any audience.

Exactly. That is the whole reason I come up of this topic. This topic is meant to be about opinion, not facts. I am fully aware that Shido is meant to be hated, and plenty of audience hating him, but I found him engaging.

So I am asking everyone, is there any characters that they think the intended reaction and expected reaction are so drastically different? I know there are plenty of characters that are intended to be liked but end up drawing anger/hatred from the audience so I try to narrow the discussion by leaving that aspect out.

[Kittenlady]

I guess Rei Ayanami sort of counts? We weren't supposed to hate her, exactly, but we weren't supposed to like her that much either.

[roriconfan]

Originally Posted by fukarming

What are you talking about? Of course there are characters that the author intend you to hate. Use your favorite LOGH as an example, the author clearly wants the audience to hate the corrupting leader of the Free Planet.

He was not a generic villain. It is excused as he was just taking advantage of peoples' superficial minds. Thus he was an excused villain. I did not hate him. I don't want to be like him either; I just say he was not hateful but just an opportunist, like most people are in any given situation.

Originally Posted by Kittenlady

I guess Rei Ayanami sort of counts? We weren't supposed to hate her, exactly, but we weren't supposed to like her that much either.

None was meant to be likable in the full extend but to grow sympathetc to you along the way.

Originally Posted by fukarming

So I am asking everyone, is there any characters that they think the intended reaction and expected reaction are so drastically different? I know there are plenty of characters that are intended to be liked but end up drawing anger/hatred from the audience so I try to narrow the discussion by leaving that aspect out.

Makoto from School Days. I don't think he was intended to be hated THIS much. He took the entire anime down even when other characters were better.

[Kudryavka]

Originally Posted by roriconfan

He was not a generic villain. It is excused as he was just taking advantage of peoples' superficial minds. Thus he was an excused villain. I did not hate him. I don't want to be like him either; I just say he was not hateful but just an opportunist, like most people are in any given situation.

None was meant to be likable in the full extend but to grow sympathetc to you along the way.

Makoto from School Days. I don't think he was intended to be hated THIS much. He took the entire anime down even when other characters were better.

It's near impossible not to hate Makoto, but it made the last episode oh so much better. Ugh, just thinking about him, how can anyone not loathe his guts?

[Pikasprey]

Originally Posted by shaolinx

I don't understand why anyone would join his group. Clearly, his actions are for personal gain and will sacrifice YOU when he needs to.

I personally will join the other group, as there is alot more trust and team work.

I would do the exact same. I hate that guy.

[wingdarkness]

I made a thread like this on this very site like 6,7 years ago and I did it all because of Legato Bluesummers' (Trigun) character...At the time I found him to be the most wasted character in anime history (Knives is a sideshow in comparison and nothing close to as awesome IMO)...His persona, story, and overall l33tness was more compelling than any villain I had ever seen at the time (I would later place Shinobu Sensui of YYH in-front of him by a hair although I loved him even before his backstory was fleshed out for sympathy)...So I do understand the sentiment in creating this thread...

Here's a few more that fit the bill:


Seta Sōjirō of Kenshin TV (Am I the only one who thinks him beating Kenshin would have been fitting? I know they sympathize him a bit but still...)


Hisoka of Hunter X Hunter (What's not to hate? I mean he's Ronald McDonald with kill-techniques, but still he has great presence and a rather wicked kind of fairness)

Brian Hawk from Hajime No Ippo (This American dude was presented as the most despicable boxer in the series...But all I could do was smile and clap my hands as he took on spoils of Japanese women using them sexually just to piss off Takamura...He's a cool terrible sonuvab!tch...

Shin of Fist of the North Star (He did some horrible $hit to Ken including being responsible for the death of his beloved, but he was pretty charismatic in his own love for her...He died pretty cool too committing suicide before Kenshiro's techniques blew him up from the inside^^)


Kaiba from Yugioh (LOL, it's sad I know, but whenever his generic hip-hop music started playing I used to be so energized watching him duel, probably not a good choice for this list ;D)

[Elo the Blue]

Judau Ashta from Gundam ZZ. I'm usually not a fan of the main character in most anime shows I watch but Judau really grew on me as the series wore on. I actually felt bad for him during his search for his sister and when he believed she was dead and it was good to see them reunited at the end of the series. His growth as a pilot was also fun to see.

[fukarming]

Originally Posted by Kittenlady

I guess Rei Ayanami sort of counts? We weren't supposed to hate her, exactly, but we weren't supposed to like her that much either.

Rei's popularity can be a whole different topic that worth to have its own forum. It is very obvious that Gainax want you to like her (Rei's first smile, among other scenes, scream "go buy Rei's merchandise") But I think even Gainax is surprised by how much Rei is loved and basically creating a whole new genre of anime girls.

Originally Posted by Komari

It's near impossible not to hate Makoto, but it made the last episode oh so much better. Ugh, just thinking about him, how can anyone not loathe his guts?

I think the game producer/ anime director want you to hate him. That's why they have the bloody ending. You don't see Tokimeki memorial or other galgame have bloody ending. The worst ending is you don't end up with any girls.

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

I made a thread like this on this very site like 6,7 years ago and I did it all because of Legato Bluesummers' (Trigun) character...At the time I found him to be the most wasted character in anime history (Knives is a sideshow in comparison and nothing close to as awesome IMO)...His persona, story, and overall l33tness was more compelling than any villain I had ever seen at the time (I would later place Shinobu Sensui of YYH in-front of him by a hair although I loved him even before his backstory was fleshed out for sympathy)...So I do understand the sentiment in creating this thread...

Here's a few more that fit the bill:


Seta Sōjirō of Kenshin TV (Am I the only one who thinks him beating Kenshin would have been fitting? I know they sympathize him a bit but still...)


Hisoka of Hunter X Hunter (What's not to hate? I mean he's Ronald McDonald with kill-techniques, but still he has great presence and a rather wicked kind of fairness)

Brian Hawk from Hajime No Ippo (This American dude was presented as the most despicable boxer in the series...But all I could do was smile and clap my hands as he took on spoils of Japanese women using them sexually just to piss off Takamura...He's a cool terrible sonuvab!tch...

Shin of Fist of the North Star (He did some horrible $hit to Ken including being responsible for the death of his beloved, but he was pretty charismatic in his own love for her...He died pretty cool too committing suicide before Kenshiro's techniques blew him up from the inside^^)


Kaiba from Yugioh (LOL, it's sad I know, but whenever his generic hip-hop music started playing I used to be so energized watching him duel, probably not a good choice for this list ;D)

I think we are supposed to like Seta Sojiro? Given his character design and back story and such. In Kenshin I think ShiShio Makoto fit my intended discussion better? Hisoka and Kaiba certainly fits the bill though. I just love Kaiba when he berate Jonouchi/ Joey which basically say everything I want to say myself.

It seems my initial OP did not get my point out very well. If you make a thread similar to my topic 6-7 years, would you please clarify anything I didn't make clear?

Originally Posted by Elo the Blue

Judau Ashta from Gundam ZZ. I'm usually not a fan of the main character in most anime shows I watch but Judau really grew on me as the series wore on. I actually felt bad for him during his search for his sister and when he believed she was dead and it was good to see them reunited at the end of the series. His growth as a pilot was also fun to see.

I think you are intended to like Judau? Basically you are supposed to like all the Gundam main character except Shinn in GSD.

[Tsuyoshi]

Mello from Death Note. Now it's clear that the author(s) intended us to dislike Mello, considering he kidnapped Kira's sister in exchange for the Death Note, and was also set up as the antagonist against Near's investigation, who was supposed to be L's rightful predecessor. But I liked him because he was also as smart as L but displayed his cunning in a more unique fashion. He was more wild and carefree compared to L. Near made him look even more original and made me appreciate Mello more because Near was simply a replica of L. Although the similarity was symbolic in the sense that N inherited L's will, it wasn't really brought about correctly.

Spoiler for manga spoiler:

Legato from Defense Devil. He's the ultimate villain in the series and he's bringing destruction to humanity. But when he does it while looking so badass in a bishounen way and in a hot tub on top of that, the fact he's evil only makes him look more awesome