The Novel and Manga of Haruhi Suzumiya

[Khu]

This thread is so full of spoiler tags. lol.

Spoiler:

Why do I get the feeling the Haruhi novels are taking on a darker tone?

[quigonkenny]

Originally Posted by Khu

This thread is so full of spoiler tags. lol.

Spoiler:

Why do I get the feeling the Haruhi novels are taking on a darker tone?

Because for one thing...

Spoiler for spoiler:

this Haruhi novel is taking on a darker tone...

Spoiler for How's:

But it's also partly perspective...

Spoiler for this:

We've just had the movie adaptation

Spoiler for for:

of the darkest novel in the series so far,

Spoiler for 'full:

and now, they've got a chance

Spoiler for of:

with the alternate timelines,

Spoiler for spoiler:

to have a story that is intentionally much darker than before

Spoiler for tags'?:

because you've got a big red RESET button

Spoiler for ^_^:

built right in...

[Yumeka]

Originally Posted by Clarste

Spoiler:

Given that the apparent new member of the SOS-dan is currently in the alpha story, isn't it more likely that the beta version will be the one kept while the alpha one is destroyed? I mean, in order to be a slider she has to travel between the worlds. It's kind of meaningless to present two worlds if the slider isn't going to participate in both.

Spoiler for sliders and parallel worlds:

My idea of parallel worlds (at least from some other literature) is that, when a "fork in the road" comes up, in other words, a point in time where different possible outcomes exist, a parallel world for each possible outcome comes into being (and each one in turn spawns more parallel worlds as more possible outcomes come up). It's like in certain games and chapter books where you can get different events and endings depending on the choices you make. It's my imagining that a slider is someone who can travel freely through all these possible outcomes. Of course, my theory here could be meaningless if Tanigawa has a different concept of sliders.

Right now I'm thinking that the choice that gave rise to the alpha and beta stories is who called Kyon at the beginning. While the drama and sci-fi elements have escalated in the beta story, they're pushed into the background in the alpha story in favor of normal non-fictional activities, like Haruhi tutoring Kyon and the SOS Brigade getting potential new members. Since the beta story has been getting more focus, right now it seems like that's the "real" world. So perhaps the alpha story is there just so we have an idea about sliders before she makes her appearance in beta. I suspect that if she will appear in beta, it will be at some climactic moment. Perhaps Kyon will be forced to choose between two worlds again.

[dnab]

Spoiler for alpha beta interplay:

My personal take is that alpha, among many of its intended purposes, also serves as a dramatic contrast for the beta (the idyllic alpha-7 vs. the freefall of beta-7). And as mentioned elsewhere, there's a strong possibility that the two dimensions may somehow cross paths. The question likely is not "if" but "how", with possibilities abound in Haruhi-verse. The Brigade Leader is fully capable of puncturing the dimensional walls if she wills it, as do Yuki & Friends. A more interesting possibility is if the beta-Kyon crosses over and borrows the alpha-Kyon (Kyonism rulez) a la the Good Lex Luthor.

Why is there a spoiler tag when there's nothing to spoil above? Why, we're in a costume party no?

[Roger Rambo]

Because this isn't marked a spoiler thread. The spoiler thread is.

[Clarste]

Originally Posted by dnab

Spoiler for alpha beta interplay:

My personal take is that alpha, among many of its intended purposes, also serves as a dramatic contrast for the beta (the idyllic alpha-7 vs. the freefall of beta-7). And as mentioned elsewhere, there's a strong possibility that the two dimensions may somehow cross paths. The question likely is not "if" but "how", with possibilities abound in Haruhi-verse. The Brigade Leader is fully capable of puncturing the dimensional walls if she wills it, as do Yuki & Friends. A more interesting possibility is if the beta-Kyon crosses over and borrows the alpha-Kyon (Kyonism rulez) a la the Good Lex Luthor.

Why is there a spoiler tag when there's nothing to spoil above? Why, we're in a costume party no?

Spoiler:

Well, the broader point is that the SOS-dan needs a slider character to join, in order to satisfy Haruhi's subconscious prophecies. What that implies is that this character needs to have some sort of monopoly on sliding, just like Mikuru has a monopoly on time travel, even though she's taken Kyon along for the ride a few times. The slider character needs to be the key to the sliding, rather than Haruhi or Yuki. And right now, the person most likely to join is the enthusiastic freshman who got a detailed description in the alpha story. She has to be the key to all of this, in one way or another.

[Tyabann]

So, did anyone else notice that

Spoiler for vol. 10:

Kyon never looked at Asakura ONCE? That he never saw her face at all?

That's got to mean something.

[Zaresh]

And it's really interestng the fact that...

Spoiler:

Kuyou not only correct herself about humanity concerning Kyon not one time but twice.

[Team Rocket Elite]

Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon

So, did anyone else notice that

Spoiler for vol. 10:

Kyon never looked at Asakura ONCE? That he never saw her face at all?

That's got to mean something.

Spoiler for Novel 10:

"I received reports that there were sightings of both Suou Kuyou and Kimidori-san."

Interestingly Itsuki never recieved a report about Asakura's existance. It's possible Asakura wasn't really there.

[Roger Rambo]

Originally Posted by Team Rocket Elite

Spoiler for Novel 10:

"I received reports that there were sightings of both Suou Kuyou and Kimidori-san."

Interestingly Itsuki never recieved a report about Asakura's existance. It's possible Asakura wasn't really there.

Spoiler:

Or Asakura was only present while they were in the cut off space. So Agency observers wouldn't have spotted her.

[GMT]

Originally Posted by Roger Rambo

Spoiler:

Or Asakura was only present while they were in the cut off space. So Agency observers wouldn't have spotted her.

Indeed. Reading the relevant passages would suggest that:

Spoiler:

Asakura appeared when she erected her data-space around them. Besides, she's probably betting that she can limit Kuyouh's effectiveness by keeping Kyon between them. After all, capturing Kyon seems to be Kuyouh's objective and it probably wouldn't do to have him blown up.

And, of course, there's Kyon's actions to take into consideration too:

Spoiler:

He refuses to look at her, after all; for fear that he might see her smiling face and be tempted to forgive her.

[Clarste]

Originally Posted by GMT

And, of course, there's Kyon's actions to take into consideration too:

Spoiler:

He refuses to look at her, after all; for fear that he might see her smiling face and be tempted to forgive her.

Spoiler:

If I were Kyon, I'd probably associate her smile with death and it wouldn't tempt me to forgive her in the slightest. Think about his reaction to meeting her in Disappearance, and that was before she actually stabbed him. He's terrified of her smile, and of her in general. His stated reasoning for not looking at her was that he was afraid it'd make her more real to him in some psychological sense, and while he's not exactly the most reliable narrator, I think we can trust him here. Because it matches up with his past reactions to her.

[Heatth]

Just read it, and it is, as expected, awesome. Really glad Tanigawa didn't lose the track, actually, I would say it is even better then usual.

Thanks a lot, you, cnet128 for the translation (you do translate more things right? Like Negima!). And thanks you too, DJ_RockmanX-danchou, as the raw provider.

Now my take on the preview:

Spoiler for Spoiler:

It is just me or the whole thing was just a big misunderstanding? Kuyoh is creepy but, at last at first, there was nothing indicating she meant to harm Kyon. Quite the opposite, actually. Who started everything was Asakura, Kuyoh just became aggressive after Ryouko showed up.

My theory is that the Canopy Dominion is not as aggressive as it seem. Yuki is sick because her mission, she is overworking herself. It is the Canopy Dominion 'fault', but indirectly. For Kuyoh attacking Kyon, she was just responding violence with violence. Actually, I just thought, as Kaisos pointed out, Kyon never actualy saw Ryouko's face, what if she was not really there? Maybe she was, like, controlling Kyon, and Kuyoh could only see one person (although shew as aware there was someone else), which would explain why she attacked Kyon, not Asakura. Ryouko holding a 'knife at Kyon's throat is something just him can see, and it is more metaphorical. Well, in any case, I doubt Kuyoh is nearly as aggressive as Kyon think she is.

Another thing that took my attention. At first I thought Yuki falling sick was because Kyon met Kuyoh at the restaurant at Sunday, therefore she only became sick after it. However, now we learnt it was not the case, and she became sick as soon, or just a bit after, Kyon received Sasaki's call. If she is sick because she is trying to make contact with the Canopy Dominion, why she isn't in the α timeline? The only thing I can think of is the IDE didn't like the idea of Kyon having a particular meeting with Kuyoh, so the rushed a bit in the attempt of contact with the enemy faction. That would explain why Yuki get sick, she rushed in her job. In the α timeline, since Kyon never met Kuyoh in particular, there was no problem so Yuki could take her time.

To end it, a small question to cnet128: Make things even more confusing by changing the translation of 'SOS' and inventin yet another translation for Yuki's boss? Not that I want to complain, or that your translation is bad (I actually thing your adaption of SOS is better then Baka-Tsuki/official translation). Just found it curious.

Originally Posted by quigonkenny

Spoiler for spoiler:

As for the first part, I wouldn't be "surprised" at all if beta!Haruhi figures everything out this book. In fact I suspect it's the primary meta reason why the author introduced a second timeline, being that it allows him to have an irreversable event occur without making the story irreversably changed. He can have the "big reveal", and maybe even set beta!Kyon up to "get the girl" or do all kinds of stuff we'd never normally see, and then wipe it all out at the end when the beta!verse is invalidated somehow (Earth is blown up to make way for a hyperspace bypass or some such)

Spoiler for Same:

I agree with it. Similar to how Sighs was made so we (and Kyon) could understand what Haruhi's powers could do if went loose, I believe the new book is likely to show what happen if Haruhi discover everything in the 'wrong way'/'bad time'. As knowing all her friends are hiding things from her, she would also discover there is a very real danger, including to herself, maybe. It is all worse if she discover it for herself (instead having Kyon telling her), specially if Kyon does, indeed, 'defect' to the enemies (even if just to protect Yuki, who said Haruhi will know it?). Yeah, I say β timeline is doomed, and who will end it is Haruhi herself. I am curious if she will just destroy everything (as Itsuki says) or if she will just part to another world she create (as Yuki defend).

[dnab]

Without being a spoiler, please note that:

1) the last time Haruhi snapped (vol.1), she almost reformatted the universe

2) the last time Yuki snapped (vol.4), she did reformat the universe (save a restore point)

3) both times were triggered by the baka Key who didn't do nearly as stupid a thing as he's about to do at the end of the Sneaker preview.....

Spoiler for a Yuki-shipper's take:

By throwing himself to the lions, exactly as Yuki in her ever so subtle way indicated not to. And it could be an IDSE setup, deliberately overloading Yuki so that Kyon would do something that'll a) cause a Haruhian info explosion or b) a Yukian evolutionary acceleration or c) God help us all. This won't be the first time, as IDSE must have implicitly permitted the Disappearance. A flipped Yuki is a good Yuki.

There is a non-trivial possibility that Asakura = [the said slider girl], as there's no reason for a reconstituted interface to retain the original look. And voice wise a decent VA (I fully expect vol.9&10 to hit the theater as 2nd or 3rd movie, as anything with Yuki angst sells tickets) can sound like completely different persons a la Usagi/Misato.

Which brings to the point of ......

Isekaijin literally means a Person from a Different World, which leaves what a Different World is open for interpretations. Some speculates Kyon, since he's obviously not ordinary (despite Itsuki's claims) and have time(?) traveled (can't dismiss the many worlds interpretations of time; Haruhi created the symbol to call Kyon there, Yuki gave him the same symbol to call him back). And another interesting candidate for isekaijin that I seldom seen discussed in English forums is ........ YOU, yes you dear reader. You beyond the 4th wall, you in the 3rd dimension, you who are witnessing SOS exploits and you who was present at Haruhi's roll call. Should Tanigawa never pen another word in his Haruhi novels about The Other Worldian, you were already there.

[Blayne Barudorii]

So... Anyone got a link to a fantranslation of the new chapter? I noticed someone started putting some info of the new chapter at tv tropes.

[Tyabann]

Some random speculation here regarding what I brought up earlier...

Spoiler for spec:

As I said, Kyon never looks at Asakura at all. You can't tell me that's not important. Something like that is never not important.

For starters:

Isn't there something wrong with Asakura's hair in this image? It's too... round.

Look at how Itou normally draws Asakura:

Notice how her hair is squared off at the tips? The hair in the new picture doesn't have that unique feature.

And then there's the knife. Although it's identified as 'the combat knife' in the text, it's clearly neither the knife she uses in the anime nor the knife Itou originally drew her with...

I don't know, maybe I'm looking too much into a single image, but I really doubt that girl is Asakura, at least not physically.

[Joe4evr]

Originally Posted by Blayne Barudorii

So... Anyone got a link to a fantranslation of the new chapter? I noticed someone started putting some info of the new chapter at tv tropes.

It's only a few pages back in this exact thread.

[Blayne Barudorii]

Okay my apologies I found it fairly quickly as well I was worried about finding spoilers.

But that chapter was awesome~ and I want more, within a year.... Noooooo...

[Yumeka]

Spoiler:

As for the first part, I wouldn't be "surprised" at all if beta!Haruhi figures everything out this book. In fact I suspect it's the primary meta reason why the author introduced a second timeline, being that it allows him to have an irreversable event occur without making the story irreversably changed. He can have the "big reveal", and maybe even set beta!Kyon up to "get the girl" or do all kinds of stuff we'd never normally see, and then wipe it all out at the end when the beta!verse is invalidated somehow (Earth is blown up to make way for a hyperspace bypass or some such)

Spoiler:

Maybe at some point, Haruhi's power will be taken away from her (whether transferred to Sasaki or someone/where else). Perhaps she'll find out everything after that, in which case it wouldn't be catastrophic since her emotional outbursts can't trigger data anomalies without her powers.

But what if someone else gets a hold of her powers besides Sasaki? Something to ponder I guess.

[dnab]

Spoiler for new school year, new hope(?):

Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon

Some random speculation here regarding what I brought up earlier...

Spoiler for spec:

As I said, Kyon never looks at Asakura at all. You can't tell me that's not important. Something like that is never not important.

For starters:

Isn't there something wrong with Asakura's hair in this image? It's too... round.

Look at how Itou normally draws Asakura:

Notice how her hair is squared off at the tips? The hair in the new picture doesn't have that unique feature.

And then there's the knife. Although it's identified as 'the combat knife' in the text, it's clearly neither the knife she uses in the anime nor the knife Itou originally drew her with...

I don't know, maybe I'm looking too much into a single image, but I really doubt that girl is Asakura, at least not physically.

Asakura2.0 - new body, new look, new knife, new tone, same bubbly radical, new tactic(?)

On a purest of pure speculations - the radicals (if exists at all) of IDSE real intent isn't to provoke information explosion from Haruhi at all (but says they do, since it's important that Yuki the evolutionee buys the story) but to instigate Yuki's evolution, like a sick conspiratorial Cupid.

As many a doujinshis have suggested, there are better ways to provoke a woman than to trying to kill her guy. A disguised Interface as school underling in a classic sempai pursuit can sell many a novels and spin off an entire cottage industry.

A slider is still the current odds on favorite, even if it should turn out to be one massive red herring. But since we have months of nothing better to do, speculate ... oh speculate away.