Valid argument about anime and cartoons?

[deadlights911]

While I do enjoy some American cartoons, I love anime much, much more because of the art style, the wide variety of genre, the stories, the characters, etc. Comedy is really the only genre I see in American cartoons.

So, I'm curious to see why you guys prefer Anime over American cartoons.

[Kyuu]

Japanese animation produces prettier girls -- and more of them. For every 1 pretty animated character from American studios, there are 1000 from Japan.

[Tempester]

Animesuki allows bumping old threads for a reason.

[deadlights911]

Originally Posted by Kyuu

Japanese animation produces prettier girls -- and more of them. For every 1 pretty animated character from American studios, there are 1000 from Japan.

Haha, that's true! Anime females are so much more attractive than American cartoon females.

[Chaos2Frozen]

I guess because these days very few cartoons appeal to an older crowd... Outside of comic book superheroes and satire stuff?

To be fair though, its not like I actively seek them out like I do with Anime...

[aohige]

American sit-com cartoons > Japanese sit-com cartoons.

While shows like Chibi Maruko-chan is certainly adorable and wholesome to watch, the venom-filled social critique of South Park, King of the Hill, and Simpsons make them very entertaining to waste your time.

That's one genre America's pretty much peerless in.
Thanks to hundreds of sit-coms that came and went throughout history, they are rich in the know-hows.

Only if Kochikame was still animated...

[NoemiChan]

Anime is hot and sexy....

[bhl88]

If America can make one Avatar a year, Japan can make tens

[SeijiSensei]

Originally Posted by aohige

While shows like Chibi Maruko-chan is certainly adorable and wholesome to watch, the venom-filled social critique of South Park, King of the Hill, and Simpsons make them very entertaining to waste your time.

Political satire does not seem part of the Japanese political culture the same way it does in the West. Most satires focus on social trends like Welcome to the NHK!. There have been a small number of shows in the past few years attacking censorship and political repression as concepts like Oh! Edo Rocket, Toshokan Sensou, or AKB0048, but nothing about contemporary Japanese politics. Perhaps Japanese audiences put two and two together and realize these shows have a deeper message about modern Japan?

Politics rarely enters into anime except at the most simplistic level like corrupt officials and back-room deals. Yakushiji Ryoko no Kaiki Jikenbo is one example.

[Shyni]

This review attempts to give one major difference between anime in general and western cartoons in general. Basically, it's a sense of "timing".

Originally Posted by Justin Sevakis

And so it is with anime: even the lamest dude-falls-on-boob gags are delivered with awkward silence, a pregnant pause, and THEN a sight gag. At the other end of the spectrum, quiet moments of pathos are given space: they're unlikely to be filled with obviously emotional music queues or operatic gestures. A sad character in anime is more likely to just sit there silently in the rain for a few beats. Those quiet moments are essential to anime. They are truthful, and they connect us emotionally to content that might otherwise be just as lame as its most dire Western counterparts.

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

Political satire does not seem part of the Japanese political culture the same way it does in the West. Most satires focus on social trends like Welcome to the NHK!. There have been a small number of shows in the past few years attacking censorship and political repression as concepts like Oh! Edo Rocket, Toshokan Sensou, or AKB0048, but nothing about contemporary Japanese politics. Perhaps Japanese audiences put two and two together and realize these shows have a deeper message about modern Japan?

Politics rarely enters into anime except at the most simplistic level like corrupt officials and back-room deals. Yakushiji Ryoko no Kaiki Jikenbo is one example.

I suppose western animation has that edge. If well down.

Then again, perhaps they want to avoid Family Guy style bullshit politics, where satire is thrown in for the sake of being it, without any sense of subtlety or decent thought to it.

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

Political satire does not seem part of the Japanese political culture the same way it does in the West. Most satires focus on social trends like Welcome to the NHK!. There have been a small number of shows in the past few years attacking censorship and political repression as concepts like Oh! Edo Rocket, Toshokan Sensou, or AKB0048, but nothing about contemporary Japanese politics. Perhaps Japanese audiences put two and two together and realize these shows have a deeper message about modern Japan?

Politics rarely enters into anime except at the most simplistic level like corrupt officials and back-room deals. Yakushiji Ryoko no Kaiki Jikenbo is one example.

This may speak more about Japan's perceptions of its politics as much as anything else. I'd love to watch a show about one of those weird people who drive around with loudspeakers on their vans, but I don't think it'll happen any time soon.

Heck, Senko no Night Raid tried to make an episode about Japan's involvement in Manchuria in 1931, and they couldn't even air it. If anime can't (or isn't allowed to) tackle political events that took place over 80 years ago, I doubt it's ready for modern politics.

[SeijiSensei]

I recall that event well. I thought it was rather brave of A-1 to take on a story about the Japanese occupation of China until I started watching it. It avoids all the politics and focuses on a group of spies with super powers whose affiliations with the Japanese military were left somewhat murky. As you say, the most controversial episode could not even be carried on television.

Thanks for reminding me about Senkou no Night Raid because it illustrates my point exactly even though it's not a satire.

In a famous classification of political cultures by Gabriel Almond and Sidney Verba, Japan would fall at the "subject" end of the "subject-participant" dimension. US attitudes are more "participant," while the British lie somewhere in between.

[Kyuu]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

I suppose western animation has that edge. If well down.

True. Controversy -- a topic, by which many Japanese writers are flat out not comfortable to deal with. At least, this is the case with visual media. Print media? Probably.

Case in point, I bring out Legend of Koizumi. It has a full fledged print media, but it's only complemented by 3-episodes of animation.

[SeijiSensei]

Originally Posted by Kyuu

True. Controversy -- a topic, by which many Japanese writers are flat out not comfortable to deal with. At least, this is the case with visual media. Print media? Probably.

I don't read manga so I cannot say how much it applies there, but I'm pretty sure it's not the writers who are avoiding controversy in anime but the production committees. I don't have a sense that writers exert much influence in anime except for a few names like Okada or Urobuchi. Since most shows are adaptations rather than original works, the writers get told what to work on based on the decisions by the boys (usually) upstairs. In most cases the anime is intended to sell the manga, VN, etc., or associated licensed character items like figurines and dakimakura.

[aohige]

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

Political satire does not seem part of the Japanese political culture the same way it does in the West. Most satires focus on social trends like Welcome to the NHK!. There have been a small number of shows in the past few years attacking censorship and political repression as concepts like Oh! Edo Rocket, Toshokan Sensou, or AKB0048, but nothing about contemporary Japanese politics. Perhaps Japanese audiences put two and two together and realize these shows have a deeper message about modern Japan?

Politics rarely enters into anime except at the most simplistic level like corrupt officials and back-room deals. Yakushiji Ryoko no Kaiki Jikenbo is one example.

I wasn't talking about political satire.
I was talking about SOCIAL satire, which is also rare.

Therer are stereotypes made fun of, but that's pretty much the extent.

All the example I mentioned, focus far, far, FAR more on social satire than political one.
The Simpsons, King of the Hill, South Park, all mostly focus on the culture of the society itself than politics.

[ChainLegacy]

Originally Posted by bhl88

If America can make one Avatar a year, Japan can make tens

If Japan made ten Avatars a year, I'd be watching a lot more anime...

I consider anime a type of cartoon that is flavored by Japanese culture. There's more variety in anime than American cartoons (not saying there's a ton of variety for either), and I think there's more flexibility in subject content in anime than typical American cartoons. I love both, though.

American cartoons are generally better for comedy, in my opinion, though the inability for a series to stop once it has reached past its prime is a bad problem (ie Family Guy, which was hilarious early on and is now just awful, or The Simpsons). I also tend to enjoy American superhero cartoons like 90's Batman + Spiderman, or Justice League better than any action anime, but those superhero shows are few and far between. Of course, there are exceptions, too, DBZ can equal or surpass any superhero show.

Anime is great for stuff you just can't find in American animation, though. The epic journey, the mech adventure, the space opera. Surreal, adult oriented fantasy, sci-fi, etc, etc. I think if American cartoons had the same type of variety you see in anime I probably wouldn't watch as much anime. I loved Avatar and really wish it had set more of a trend in the industry, but not much seemed to change in its wake despite its popularity.

[bhl88]

Originally Posted by ChainLegacy

If Japan made ten Avatars a year, I'd be watching a lot more anime...

lol your taste would be different from mine then

Though in a bad economic situation with tons of moe, I'd say: Japan makes 4 Avatars a year.

Originally Posted by ChainLegacy

American cartoons are generally better for comedy, in my opinion, though the inability for a series to stop once it has reached past its prime is a bad problem (ie Family Guy, which was hilarious early on and is now just awful, or The Simpsons).

Ones that I'm meant to watch and forget.

[Ryu_Hirakashi]

Originally Posted by Qilin

This is one topic I'm honestly tired of seeing, but I can't help but share a few thoughts on the matter.

First of all, I don't understand why there would be such a strictly defined dichotomy between "cartoons" and "anime". They are simply alternative labels for the animation medium, which no single culture has a monopoly on. Any other noticeable differences that might exist are the result of differences in the application of the medium. As such, while the medium takes many forms, there is still a significant overlap between trends in various cultures. In other words, this issue is not much a question of defining terms as it is a question of statistics.

In that respect, Japanese animation is better received than its Western equivalent because of its wider demographic reach. In Japan, animation is a well-established entertainment medium that is accessible to people of all ages. As a result, their animation covers a myriad of different genres thanks to the medium's general appeal. In contrast, Western animation is targeted towards a more specific demographic within the younger age groups, with a more niche market for adult audiences. Just from this, it's pretty easy to see how "cartoons" are often perceived to be for children. In terms of sheer diversity and variety, Japanese animation tends to win over Western animation.

Of course, one can always argue that recent hits like Avatar: The Last Airbender put the West on par with Japan's animation, but these are often few and far in between. Until the West can can treat animation as a medium in itself rather than as a mere genre, I'm not sure it can maximize the use of its animation.

This post sums up my exact feelings on the subject. I used to like disney films as a kid, but as an adult I find them childish in their delivery. I outgrew disney's type of storytelling, because I realised that only my childish self enjoyed them.

Over the years, there have been very few animated movies,tv series, or direct home releases that my current self would enjoy. They exist for certain. I'd be a fool to say that they don't exist.

The problem with this situation is that you can enjoy animation in this manner so long as you stay in your basement and not tell anybody about it. American society isn't very tolernt of views outside the "norm".

[DragoonKain3]

Pfft. Anime is anime to me because ~25% of shows every cour feature at least one opposite sex childhood friend pair, with vast majority of them having at least one half of the pair romantically interested in the other.

So until western animation (or any other cartoon for that matter) approach that level of consistency, no one is gonna stop me from making a distinction between anime and other cartoons.