2007-11-05, 12:50 | Link #61 | |
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but still, is it possible for Shana and Alastor's previous flame haze to maybe share the same existance? Cant a person be reborn and contain the same existance as the person they were originally? and also, realize how shana sorta "aquired" hirai yukari's existance by using a small amount of hirai's PoV. isnt it possible that Shana also "aquired" Alastor's original flame haze's existance? because its possible to have more than one existance considering that to almost every other human in the world, Shana exists as Hirai Yukari, yet to Yuji, and the few other humans that know about Shana being a flame haze (Yoshida and Margery's two henchmen or w.e) Shana exists as two people who are the same... im gonna apoligize ahead of time for confusion... |
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2007-11-05, 22:29 | Link #62 | |
the red string of fate
Join Date: Jan 2007
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Sure, a human can't gain another's power of existence, but that doesn't mean they can't gain another's social connections. After all, the Flaming Haired and Blazing Eyed Assassin is supposedly the most well known of all the Flame Hazes. For such a renowned 'position', is it crazy to say that by simply being the successor Shana's own existence was affected? |
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2007-11-05, 22:35 | Link #63 |
*(RAWR*)&rawr
Join Date: Dec 2005
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That idea appeals to me, but it doesn't seem to mesh with other aspects, like Flame Hazes and the like not forgetting (except for by just not caring ) about people who disappear, and how the human existence of a Flame Haze 'disappears' when they become on (if I recall correctly). Which is to say, notoriety doesn't count for people like them.
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2007-11-05, 22:46 | Link #64 | |
the red string of fate
Join Date: Jan 2007
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but on the other hand the entire thing wraps itself up quite nicely: flame hazes have a set PoE once they become a flame haze, so even if Matilda gained fame among the crimson realm, her PoE wouldn't be affected by the fame, which is why she dies. Shana as a human however can benefit from said fame centuries later thanks to the fact Denizens and Lords don't have any set lifespan, meaning the notoriety doesn't particularly die down, and then become a flame haze herself. Would also get rid of that nasty issue of how an orphan would be chosen, since if PoE "size" didn't matter, Wilhelmina and Alastor were just looking for someone who won't have negative feelings about the crimson realm and can be taught to uphold the balance. I dunno, it just seems to be a somewhat appealing theory at the moment. |
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2007-11-05, 23:47 | Link #66 | |
Woot Eclair is a hottie
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2007-11-06, 08:05 | Link #67 | |||||||
Gone for Good
Join Date: Apr 2004
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A Flame Haze has the ability to "butt in" a Torch's existence and assumes the identity of that Torch, usually for reconnaissance purposes. There is a special prequel chapter in volume 0 that chronicles Shana's attempt in doing detective work while assuming a Torch's identity. This was just before she came to Misaki City and met Yuji. Upon completion of her mission and vanquishing the Denizen, Shana no longer has any use for the Torch's "existence", and so she extinguished it. Currently, she's remained as "Hirai Yukari" for far too long than what one would expect. Simply because Shana's begun to be attached to Yuji and Misaki City, which would have repercussions later on in the story. On the other hand, it is not Shana "acquiring" Alastor's existence. It's the other way round - Alastor requires Shana's existence in order for his power to be used to hunt other Denizens without having to steal anyone's PoE. Quote:
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As much as I can understand, any person who forms a contract with Alastor would be conveyed the title "Flame-Haired Blazing-Eyed Assassin", just as anyone who is contracted to Marchosius would be the "Interpreter of Condolences", etc. Think of it like different jobs requiring different qualifications to justify the various salaries. The position "Flame-Haired Blazing-Eyed Assassin" requires someone with the right amount of existence to justify holding Alastor inside her. Shana comes with that huge amount of PoE she has with her. Quote:
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2007-11-06, 09:47 | Link #68 | |||||
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2007-11-06, 10:01 | Link #69 | |||
Gone for Good
Join Date: Apr 2004
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But overall, it does not add to Shana's PoE, she is only borrowing it, just as she's still borrowing Hirai Yukari's remnant PoE. This is the major difference between a Denizen and a Flame Haze. A Denizen (and Reiji Maigo as well) can absorb and add to its total PoE value, a Flame Haze is stuck with what he's got. Quote:
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2007-11-06, 10:24 | Link #70 | ||
Woot Eclair is a hottie
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But then again if u butted into a dead person’s existence… you’d be messing with the balance because then in other people’s eyes, someone will have been revived from the dead. I duno Well, if the PoE of human’s increases with the amount of social connections that they have with other humans, does a social connection with a Crimson Denizen or lord also increase the PoE of a human? For example: An orphaned baby who no one knows about is discovered by say… Hecate. Say Hecate takes care of the baby in secret for a while. Does that human baby’s power of existence increase because of a social connection to Hecate? Or do relationships with members of the opposite world (Guze) not affect a human’s own power of existence since beings of Guze do not exist in the human world? |
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2007-11-06, 11:19 | Link #71 | ||
Gone for Good
Join Date: Apr 2004
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Firstly, a dead person's PoE is too insignificantly small compared to a living person. Even a dwindling Torch has more PoE. Secondly, as you have noticed, everyone now would know that this person's supposed to be dead, so let's say you try and "butt into" Ronald Reagan's existence in the present day, you'll be causing a ruckus rather than trying to investigate in stealth, which defeats the purpose of "butting in" in the first place. Quote:
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2007-11-06, 11:33 | Link #72 | ||
お姉さま、君はどこ
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Vietnam
Age: 32
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I just have some funny ideas about human/ tomogara/ flame haze from Kinny Riddle 's water and pot theory. PoE = water Human = water ball, once it brake , cannot be repaired but can grow bigger Torch = another type of water ball , but cannot keep water being split out and cannot grow bigger Flamhaze = pot , pretty big, contain a lot of water but cannot add in or get water from it. Tomogara = uhm another type of ball like torch but can be refill by getting water. Myste = special type of torch, contain something interesting inside it like water generator ( renji maigo), music box, ring ( azure ) and teddy bear ^^.. |
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2007-11-06, 12:13 | Link #73 | |
Woot Eclair is a hottie
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2007-11-06, 12:57 | Link #74 | |
the red string of fate
Join Date: Jan 2007
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I had been under the impression that such actions were required because Matilda couldn't fully manifest Alastor like Shana could due to PoE restrictions. |
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2007-11-07, 06:57 | Link #75 | ||
お姉さま、君はどこ
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Vietnam
Age: 32
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EX : Yuji began to see the flame in a torch after get inside the fuzetsu and in the preview for the 16 th volume Spoiler for 16th:
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2007-11-07, 11:44 | Link #76 | |
*(RAWR*)&rawr
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Hm. If a torch dies before it burns out, does it still burn out?
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Last edited by KaneDragon; 2007-11-30 at 11:51. |
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2007-12-03, 11:32 | Link #78 |
Bakka Baka!!!
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Estonia
Age: 32
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Well i think it just burns out when the torch dies, you know, at the same time. If i remember correctly this was shown or talked about during shana and Yuijis first encounter with the puppet-lover, although i am not sure of this.
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2007-12-05, 18:53 | Link #79 | |
*(RAWR*)&rawr
Join Date: Dec 2005
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What happens to objects that are moved or changed during a Fuzetsu if these changes are not corrected by applying PoE? Does a person who was inside the Fuzetsu suddenly start thinking that the changes were always there? What about a person who was outside the Fuzetsu (considering that for the duration of the spell they would have forgotten the existence of the entire area that was enclosed)? Just checking.
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2007-12-05, 19:13 | Link #80 | |||
Woot Eclair is a hottie
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