Fate/kaleid liner PRISMA☆ILLYA - Episode 6 Discussion / Poll

[Shadow5YA]

Is it ever explained how Ilya was able to overpower Saber in that Excalibur clash? Because with the way tracing works, Ilya's Excalibur should have been only equal to Saber's at best, and weaker at the worst.

[The Green One]

If you know Ilya's original origin it would be clear where this extra power is coming from, but I imagine they'll address this soon enough.... Just finished watching the subs version, more awesomeness. Quite a thrilling fight, especially glad they gave it an extended length compared to the manga.

Rather cute how much Miyu has clearly softened to Ilya at this point, getting your life saved like that certainly earned some points, carrying Ilya home like that was quite heartwarming.

[SeventhNight]

I kinda feel sorry for the people who disregarded this series simply because of how awesome that fight was

Originally Posted by Kanon

You know, I think this is the first time Archer's fighting style was animated correctly. It was said in the VN that it was similar to dancing and I can definitely see that here. In DEEN's adaptations, his attacks were too straightforward.

I've thought this for years, he's movements always felt incredibly stiff in Deen's stuff.... nice to see some other people thought this too.

[Avatar of Dreams]

Originally Posted by Shadow5YA

Is it ever explained how Ilya was able to overpower Saber in that Excalibur clash? Because with the way tracing works, Ilya's Excalibur should have been only equal to Saber's at best, and weaker at the worst.

I don't think they are sticking that close to the original canon. Archer dies if he traces Excalibur anyways.

[ukulelembo]

Originally Posted by Avatar of Dreams

Archer dies if he traces Excalibur anyways.

Did you say something?

[Shadow5YA]

Originally Posted by Avatar of Dreams

I don't think they are sticking that close to the original canon. Archer dies if he traces Excalibur anyways.

Where is this from? I don't remember that being stated at all.

Shirou would have that trouble, but Archer?

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by Shadow5YA

Where is this from? I don't remember that being stated at all.

Shirou would have that trouble, but Archer?

From the Type-MOON Wiki concerning Unlimited Blade Works:

Spoiler:

Originally Posted by Type-MOON Wiki

↑ 2.0 2.1 Complete Material III: Q: What is the limit of replication in UBW? The highest level of NP (sword types) is probably Ea, but while it might be impossible for Shirou, could Archer make it? Also, under the meaning of weapons, to what extent can he make modern weapons? Must it be only blade types or can he make guns and mobile weapons?
A: Divine constructs like Ea and Excalibur are non-replicable. There might be some degraded NPs with similar performance in stock though. Also, since sword is becoming his origin, the weapons that he has stored are fundamentally limited to close combat.

[Shadow5YA]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

From the Type-MOON Wiki concerning Unlimited Blade Works:

That does not state that Archer would die from tracing Excalibur. All it implies is that Archer can't replicate divine swords at all, so he would trace something similar.

[blitz1/2]

It's so sad that Shirou isn't here to watch his sister shine.

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by Shadow5YA

That does not state that Archer would die from tracing Excalibur. All it implies is that Archer can't replicate divine swords at all, so he would trace something similar.

Also from the Type-MOON Wiki:

Spoiler:

Originally Posted by Type-MOON Wiki

Even if he attempts to replicate a Excalibur-class holy sword, he does not have the magical energy necessary to bring out its full potential and may simply end up fading away after using all his energy in a suicidal attack.

[Shadow5YA]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Also from the Type-MOON Wiki:

If mana issues are the only reason why Archer can't do it, then it makes sense why Ilya could.

But even then, that doesn't explain why Ilya outright overpowered Saber with the same sword. Again, shouldn't they have been equal?

[The Green One]

The non spoiler answer is Ilya has something Saber doesn't, it's something Saber just flat out can't compete with. The scene with the chains and the lock opening is a hint. As for the details more information is coming in the upcoming episodes, it should explain it.

[Geburah]

Biggest thing imo is plot armor but we can also rationalize that after battling Rin and Luvia, Saber wasnt high on prana so her last Excalibast was not at full power.

On Heavens Feel Alter Saber has unlimited prana due to her conection with Sakura, but nothing indicates that she has unlimited prana on this world. and since Saber said that a full Excaliblast uses most of her prana, its unlikely that she had much more prana left, so she lost against a full power "degraded version"

[The Green One]

Originally Posted by Geburah

Biggest thing imo is plot armor but we can also rationalize that after battling Rin and Luvia, Saber wasnt high on prana so her last Excalibast was not at full power.

On Heavens Feel Alter Saber has unlimited prana due to her conection with Sakura, but nothing indicates that she has unlimited prana on this world. and since Saber said that a full Excaliblast uses most of her prana, its unlikely that she had much more prana left, so she lost against a full power "degraded version"

To add to that theory, this was her second time using Excalibur in a very short period.

[Avatar of Dreams]

Originally Posted by Shadow5YA

Where is this from? I don't remember that being stated at all.

Shirou would have that trouble, but Archer?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozqGMnMpgOc#t=4m40s

Original Japanese text:
オレとて聖剣など投影しては自滅する。

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Avatar of Dreams

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozqGMnMpgOc#t=4m40s

Original Japanese text:
オレとて聖剣など投影しては自滅する。

We should keep in mind he had no master at the time and had already used tons of prana. Under normal circumstances, he might be able to use it. He can certainly do it in CCC (might just be a retcon though, wouldn't be the first time Nasu does it) although it's not exactly the real deal since divine materials are impossible to replicate, hence why it's called Excalibur Image. No idea how its output compares to the original, but it's definitely lower. Illya was able to win because plot and rule of cool. If you want a more reasonable explanation, I think Geburah's works. Saber couldn't fire her blast at its maximum output because she didn't have enough prana left, so Illya who had a shit ton of it won.

[Master_Yoma]

That was one awesome fight

[Unknown Soldier]

Originally Posted by Shadow5YA

If mana issues are the only reason why Archer can't do it, then it makes sense why Ilya could.

But even then, that doesn't explain why Ilya outright overpowered Saber with the same sword. Again, shouldn't they have been equal?

It's important to realize who Illya actually is in the Fate/ universe. She's an Einzbern homunculus. The amount of prana she stores inside of her is essentially unlimited. If there's anyone who could overpower Saber Excalibur, it would be Illya doing Excalibur. Even Saber has a finite amount of prana she can use, and it can run out when her Master is unable to supply her with any more. Excalibur is just a huge outpouring of prana after all, and this is the only possible scenario where Saber cannot release more prana at once than someone else!

[novalysis]

Originally Posted by Unknown Soldier

It's important to realize who Illya actually is in the Fate/ universe. She's an Einzbern homunculus. The amount of prana she stores inside of her is essentially unlimited. If there's anyone who could overpower Saber Excalibur, it would be Illya doing Excalibur. Even Saber has a finite amount of prana she can channeling, and it can run out when her Master is unable to supply her with any more. Excalibur is just a huge outpouring of prana after all, and this is the only possible scenario where Saber cannot release more prana at once than someone else!

So basically, in Nasuverse, when you cross magic beams, the one with the highest capacity to channel Prana, or the one with the greatest Prana Pool would win?

In-fact, we should just classify Excaliablast as a Prana Beam Cannon.

And since Illya even in Fate Prisma has both superior Prana pool and Prana "channeling capacity" (apologies to Nasuverse if that's the wrong term to use), if anyone tried to cross beams with an Illya at full power, defeat is assured?

Hmm, the breaking of the lock clearly implies that Illya's Prana has somehow been sealed. Which leads to a few questions. Who sealed it? When was it sealed? What was it sealed?

[Unknown Soldier]

Originally Posted by novalysis

Hmm, the breaking of the lock clearly implies that Illya's Prana has somehow been sealed. Which leads to a few questions. Who sealed it? When was it sealed? What was it sealed?

This would be a spoiler to answer. You need to read the 2wei manga to find out, or wait God Knows How Long for the 2nd season of the animu.