AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series > Retired > Retired M-Z > Umineko

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2011-01-07, 21:37   Link #261
Ayu-ayu
a.k.a. Akari_House
 
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Somewhere near Seattle
Age: 53
Okay, I've had time now to recover and go back over this thread having read the whole story now.

A few thoughts:

Spoiler for Cake Lamda:


Spoiler for Doll-Beatrice:


Spoiler for Erika vs. Battler closed room duel:


Spoiler for Goat invasion of the Golden Land:


Spoiler for Clair:


Spoiler for Crack hypothesis/thinking out loud:


I can't really buy into the idea though that R07 was only making it up as he went along and cherry picking solutions from the fans. I agree that there was fan influence along the way (obviously, look at the Witch Hunters, for one example), but that such nods to the fans were generally called out. While I admit it is still a catbox, I feel (Subjective truth? Really? Yeah, I know. Sigh...) that a solution is there, though it is possible it could be still left to a last queen-type move, too. I certainly hope that Umineko Rei will settle this some more (or that something will come to light in the interim).
__________________
---

(MyAnimeList banner on hiatus until I bother to update my MyAnimeList status again...)
Ayu-ayu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-07, 21:42   Link #262
Mcjon01
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Well, to answer your question about the doll, the endings are the same. Different scores on the quiz game simply lead to different gifts that end up serving the same purpose.
Mcjon01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-07, 21:49   Link #263
Ayu-ayu
a.k.a. Akari_House
 
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Somewhere near Seattle
Age: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mcjon01 View Post
Well, to answer your question about the doll, the endings are the same. Different scores on the quiz game simply lead to different gifts that end up serving the same purpose.
Ah okay, so no other outcome change. Huh. It's still weird that the gift shows up in the trick end and not the magic one. I kind of wonder if she found it instead of Sakutaro in that fragment. Or if it's simply meant as a further reinforcement of the existence of the meta-world (beyond Erika showing up at the end).
__________________
---

(MyAnimeList banner on hiatus until I bother to update my MyAnimeList status again...)
Ayu-ayu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-07, 22:40   Link #264
Turtleen
Member
*Artist
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Ontario / BC
Age: 31
Send a message via MSN to Turtleen Send a message via Yahoo to Turtleen
Quote:
Originally Posted by rias
How to avoid the hate spiral? Accept the fact that Umineko is fantasy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by auratwilight
Or not be butthurt just because you didn't get your way. Either or.
Aha, that's exactly what I've been telling people. Basically, suck it up xD
Turtleen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-07, 22:53   Link #265
AuraTwilight
The True Culprit
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: The Golden Land
Send a message via AIM to AuraTwilight Send a message via MSN to AuraTwilight
Quote:
ah okay, so no other outcome change. Huh. It's still weird that the gift shows up in the trick end and not the magic one. I kind of wonder if she found it instead of sakutaro in that fragment. Or if it's simply meant as a further reinforcement of the existence of the meta-world (beyond erika showing up at the end).
we were trolled. Magic exists. It's all over.
__________________
When the Silent Spirits Cry: An Umineko/Silent Hill crossover fanfiction
http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=4565173&postcount=531
AuraTwilight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 02:16   Link #266
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Age: 39
So I was supposed to update however I got called in for hospital duty and now I have a wedding to attend lol. I should be able to update later today or by Sunday.
MeoTwister5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 03:49   Link #267
AuraTwilight
The True Culprit
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: The Golden Land
Send a message via AIM to AuraTwilight Send a message via MSN to AuraTwilight
It's alright, we're all patient.
__________________
When the Silent Spirits Cry: An Umineko/Silent Hill crossover fanfiction
http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=4565173&postcount=531
AuraTwilight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 04:04   Link #268
Kylon99
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Meta-Meta-Meta-Space
Whoa.. I just finished EP8. Although I kinda fell asleep going through the Tea Party... and some parts of the last two chapters. Going back to work after a long holiday of sleeping in was so hard...

Not really sure what to say... there wasn't anything too unexpected in this episode. After EP7 I had kinda expected that there was some kind of a boat, that perhaps Yasu had escaped the island with it (although prior to the events; not after) and some people on here kinda thought Battler may have lived...

I like how a lot of our theories have been confirmed, like the Gold Truth (Judoh's came the closest, I would say) and the Author Theory. You know, without that, I wonder if we would've been totally confused and lost.... 8)

Now, let me read the backlog of posts...

EDIT: Oh yah, my favorite parts were the intentional breaking of the fourth walls... and the parodies of the fans. It was funny to see the goats spout ineffectual theories from way back when we were reading earlier episodes.

EDIT2: Speaking of which, I still kinda believe there are a few things he hasn't told us yet. 8)

EDIT3: And by the way, what is it with punching loli's in the face lately? First there was Index S2... and now Erika and Bern... 8)

Last edited by Kylon99; 2011-01-08 at 04:41.
Kylon99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 05:09   Link #269
Ayu-ayu
a.k.a. Akari_House
 
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Somewhere near Seattle
Age: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by AuraTwilight View Post
we were trolled. Magic exists. It's all over.
When....when did we stop thinking?!

Actually I loved when Battler used his old defense more or less against itself during the Night of the Living Goats*. When you stop thinking, you allow the fantasy to exist, indeed.

*Night of the Living Dead was once titled "Batallion" in Japanese... "Battler+Lion"? Hmmm....
__________________
---

(MyAnimeList banner on hiatus until I bother to update my MyAnimeList status again...)
Ayu-ayu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 11:30   Link #270
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Age: 39
Update for today. The Escape to the Golden Land begins.

Spoiler for Summary:


Yes cliffhanger. The next scene is the final battle between Erika and Battler in a locked room. Two individuals but only one comes out (or so the narration says). Who will win? Find out... uh... tomorrow/later afternoon +8 GMT lol. I've gone through some of it and I can assure you it will be glorious.

BTW blog has been updated.
MeoTwister5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 11:39   Link #271
Ayu-ayu
a.k.a. Akari_House
 
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Somewhere near Seattle
Age: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
Update for today. The Escape to the Golden Land begins.


Yes cliffhanger. The next scene is the final battle between Erika and Battler in a locked room. Two individuals but only one comes out (or so the narration says). Who will win? Find out... uh... tomorrow/later afternoon +8 GMT lol.
Maybe it was my own misunderstanding, but I believe they were in each other's closed room scenario, thus two locked rooms which each had to identify the "gimmick" to in order to defeat the other. Literally a closed room "battle".
__________________
---

(MyAnimeList banner on hiatus until I bother to update my MyAnimeList status again...)
Ayu-ayu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 11:41   Link #272
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Age: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ayu-ayu View Post
Maybe it was my own misunderstanding, but I believe they were in each other's closed room scenario, thus two locked rooms which each had to identify the "gimmick" to in order to defeat the other. Literally a closed room "battle".
Considering that the theoretical victim for this showdown is Erika and the theoretical criminal Battler (according to the colored text), it makes more sense for them to be in the same closed room duking it out until one person stands alone.

Heck it's more epic that way don't you agree?
MeoTwister5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 12:57   Link #273
Darkpierrot
The Clown from the abyss
 
 
Join Date: May 2010
It seem episode 8 is awesome!

and im starting to feel bad....for be in the attitude of the goats...
Darkpierrot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 14:04   Link #274
Ayu-ayu
a.k.a. Akari_House
 
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Somewhere near Seattle
Age: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
Considering that the theoretical victim for this showdown is Erika and the theoretical criminal Battler (according to the colored text), it makes more sense for them to be in the same closed room duking it out until one person stands alone.

Heck it's more epic that way don't you agree?
True, though it's a bit weird then that there would be two wildly different solutions to a closed room scenario...oh wait.

Though I wasn't expecting Battler's to be more wack than Erika's... I mean, seriously...
__________________
---

(MyAnimeList banner on hiatus until I bother to update my MyAnimeList status again...)
Ayu-ayu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 14:35   Link #275
Ayu-ayu
a.k.a. Akari_House
 
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Somewhere near Seattle
Age: 53
Some more corrections:

Quote:
She dishes out Kox 8 to counter an ungiven clue. A goat declares the victims dead by homicide and the rooms became secret rooms created by the victims. Dlanor staggers a bit after this.
The goat here actually declared that it was a faked murder, the closed rooms were possible because the "victims" were actually alive (essentially the scenario from episode 6 before Erika ensured the bodies were dead). That's why Will steps in and saves her with Van Dine as it requires the presence of a corpse.

Also:
Quote:
Ange makes it inside the chapel. She finds the diary. Only the game master should be able to open it, and she believes that the real game master is Bern.
Not exactly. She knows still Battler is the original game master, but also knows that Bern is master of the secondary game on the same board, so her own GM powers will nullify Battler's protective seal as they are at the same level. But it's not that she thinks Bern is the real game master over Battler. How else would Battler's protection seal matter if it wasn't created under the GM's authority?
__________________
---

(MyAnimeList banner on hiatus until I bother to update my MyAnimeList status again...)
Ayu-ayu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 18:04   Link #276
ClannadDango
A novice to anime
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Nor*Cal, Rokkenjima, Illusionary World
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ayu-ayu View Post
Okay, I've had time now to recover and go back over this thread having read the whole story now.

A few thoughts:

Spoiler for Cake Lamda:


Spoiler for Doll-Beatrice:


Spoiler for Erika vs. Battler closed room duel:


Spoiler for Goat invasion of the Golden Land:


Spoiler for Clair:


Spoiler for Crack hypothesis/thinking out loud:


I can't really buy into the idea though that R07 was only making it up as he went along and cherry picking solutions from the fans. I agree that there was fan influence along the way (obviously, look at the Witch Hunters, for one example), but that such nods to the fans were generally called out. While I admit it is still a catbox, I feel (Subjective truth? Really? Yeah, I know. Sigh...) that a solution is there, though it is possible it could be still left to a last queen-type move, too. I certainly hope that Umineko Rei will settle this some more (or that something will come to light in the interim).

Lambda cake? That's real?
__________________
ClannadDango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 18:07   Link #277
Klashikari
阿賀野型3番艦、矢矧 Lv180
*Graphic Designer
*Moderator
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Belgium, Brussels
Age: 37
Just read ayu-ayu description... It isn't like she is literally a cake.
__________________
Klashikari is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 18:27   Link #278
ClannadDango
A novice to anime
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Nor*Cal, Rokkenjima, Illusionary World
Hmm since I haven't read this final arc I have to rely on this forum, thank god. It would be interesting if Lambda was a cake.

So far it appears Ryukishi07 has allowed for the reader to solve the story but not the mystery itself. Ryukishi07 did say that those smart enough should have solved the mystery from 2nd arc. I would like to see if the right answer can also be determined from EP8.

The closed rooms appear well written for the mystery fans. I can't wait for the english patch.
__________________
ClannadDango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-08, 20:56   Link #279
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Age: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ayu-ayu View Post
Some more corrections:



The goat here actually declared that it was a faked murder, the closed rooms were possible because the "victims" were actually alive (essentially the scenario from episode 6 before Erika ensured the bodies were dead). That's why Will steps in and saves her with Van Dine as it requires the presence of a corpse.

Also:


Not exactly. She knows still Battler is the original game master, but also knows that Bern is master of the secondary game on the same board, so her own GM powers will nullify Battler's protective seal as they are at the same level. But it's not that she thinks Bern is the real game master over Battler. How else would Battler's protection seal matter if it wasn't created under the GM's authority?

1. Yeah. Read it again and my original summarize doesn't make a lot of sense considering Van Dyne's rule. Will edit it later.

2. I realized it would take a long amount of time to explain how Bern's status would override Battler's status as GM and allowing her to break the seal over the diary so I just went with Bern being the overriding GM. I'll let Witch Hunt be the one to do it right.
MeoTwister5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-01-09, 02:58   Link #280
theacefrehley
Guitar Man
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Brazil
Finished reading it a while ago. I can say I liked it. I'm no mystery fan, so don't blame me if I can't see the nuances of the genre being misused or not.
Let's say I liked the detective stuff.



Honestly, I enjoyed the franchise. I don't regret my time reading it.
I'd read another WTC series.

Maybe I'd be happier with an ending like Higurashi, with a kakera musubi that, if not 100%, answered at least 95% of the questions left after Minagoroshi-hen, but who knows if that's not going to happen in an Umineko Rei? I don't know how people are reacting in Japan, but if it is too bad, maybe he'll have to pull out something like that, or release it in the PS3 port sequel ()

As for the secret rooms, I was already satisfied with Will's cryptic answers by the end of EP7 regarding the how. The same goes to the culprit background.

As for the fuss of the catbox not being opened, even though a bit disappointed after all the cock tease about Eva's diary, I kind of didn't care in the end. Bern's version of the catbox is acceptable to me, only with less evil in the air.

I thought it was quite decent the way the 'dead' Battler came back in the end.

As for Ange's endings, I think the 'bad' ending was awesome and the magic end was the happy ending expected.
__________________
[]'s from Ace
theacefrehley is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 19:13.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
We use Silk.