2012-05-02, 10:31 | Link #28662 |
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I still wonder about that door too. It was explicitly stated that the door from the courtyard to the boiler room had no lock, and it's a very nice solution for EP3's First Twilight, but it was never mentioned again in the VNs. I haven't read the manga, so I'm curious about what was said about it too, if it was "fixed".
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2012-05-02, 12:11 | Link #28665 |
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They showed the boiler room at 0:16, and I didn't notice any bar. Or are you referring to something else?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SUTuR...feature=relmfu
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2012-05-02, 15:40 | Link #28666 | |||||||||
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Also it' possible that the truth had reached the future so, while Battler knew nothing about Kyrie being his mom, in the future is public knowledge Rudolf switched the babies. After all it was said they digged in Rudolf's past and it turned out he wasn't exactly a little angel. I wouldn't be surprised if some news reporter had discovered that Asumu and Kyrie had a baby the same day and that one was a stillborn. He might have found the thing intriguing, have done some investigations and found out the truth. Quote:
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Maybe this is an odd idea but I wonder if that red applied to MetaBattler or to PieceBattler and Beato twisted things so that MetaBattler would think it applied to him while it applied to PieceBattler. Though evidently somehow Beato might have found out the truth. Rudolf might have confessed it to Kinzo when he remarried and Shannon/Kanon might have incidentally heard it. Also, if actually Battler even found out in RokkenjimaPrime and MetaBattler is nothing else but Toya's dream/fantasy/whatever, while MetaBattler isn't aware of the truth Toya is and therefore he can consciously/unconsciously dictate which red can be said and which can't. Quote:
Okay, it can be a wordplay as only his body would remain there but not his soul but somehow it doesn't make much sense... Oh and Renall before I forget: The way you had Battler solve the logic error was AWESOME. I so love it! |
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2012-05-02, 16:35 | Link #28667 |
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Location: United Kingdom.
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I need everyone's input on this, since it's been bugging me for a while. (I was going to finish up EP8 beforehand).
Put simply, why is Maria described to be dead at the end of each fiction? Most people would determine that she died after the explosion and leave it at that. Unless this is something made at the end that only we get to see, the only solution to this I can think of is that someone wants everyone to be sure that she's dead. The only scenario that I can think of is that she is actually alive, and that her believed death is a requirement. It's bugging me.
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2012-05-02, 17:11 | Link #28668 | |
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Anyway in the first 2 episodes Maria is likely killed by the explosion. But in Ep 3 we know she died pretty early due to strangulation and in EP 4 she died late by poisoning. Maria's death however was confirmed in Prime (a piece of her jaw was found if I'm not wrong) merely because the message bottle found was signed Ushiromiya Maria, which might have implied she survived and wrote it so the author wanted to make sure we would discharge that reasoning. Probably other pieces from other Ushiromiya were found but even if they found... let's say Jessica's head in a recognizable shape, the novel didn't bother confirming her death. What we can assume is that Battler, Rudolf and Kyrie's deaths were 'unconfirmed' (no recognizable pieces of them were found) as Ange still hope they might be alive. |
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2012-05-02, 18:29 | Link #28669 | ||||||
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Or perhaps, more flippantly, Step-moms are moms, too. Quote:
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I sometimes wonder, when Ange says she'll accept "anyone at all" coming home, if Godha pulled up in a coupe, took off his hater blockers, and was all "Hey girl. You KNOW I meant to call you after that whole, tch, EXPLOSION thing. It was c-razy. How you doin'?" |
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2012-05-02, 18:38 | Link #28670 | |
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Or Maria's alive and still has her jaw. Another person's jaw + forged dental records to ID them as Maria's... Think it's far-fetched? Well, it's a trick RK07 actually used before in Higurashi so I wouldn't say it's out of the question. In fact, it calls attention to itself precisely because of that. |
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2012-05-02, 19:11 | Link #28672 | |
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Location: In the Meta- World... on Virgillia's bed.
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I would like to think of Beatrice as bird trying to free herself from her cage. If she were to go with George, she would be able to leave the island at the expense of her fate being decided by some guy she doesn't really like. Remember that Lion's hair is up to the middle of his back. If Yasu had that much hair, she wouldn't be able to hide it in her small wigs.
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2012-05-02, 22:04 | Link #28674 | |||
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2012-05-03, 07:26 | Link #28676 | |
別にいいけど
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Location: forever lost inside a logic error
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2012-05-03, 08:01 | Link #28677 |
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Speaking of corpses, I always wondered.
Who do you guys think placed Kinzos corpse in the furnace in the games where it occurred? Shkannon certainly could have done it, but I feel like Krauss/Natsuhi could just have easily have done it themselves/ordered it. It certainly takes the stress off them having to protect the study. More importantly, where the heck did they keep that thing for 2 years? |
2012-05-03, 08:38 | Link #28678 | |
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2012-05-03, 10:24 | Link #28679 |
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I had this in mind for quite a long time:
The name of the stillborn child of Asumu is "Ushiromiya Battler". So there are 2 Ushiromiya Battlers, but 1 of them died 18 years ago. With 18 years i mean of course from the standpoint of the Rokkenjima incident. |
2012-05-03, 10:31 | Link #28680 |
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
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In order to explain logically and consistently how Maria could be still alive you need to come up with a lot of unmentioned background set ups.
That is however the same that you needed to do to explain the "burned corpse" in Higurashi. Who the hell could have imagined that in the earlier episodes without going onto the field of wild speculations? I always maintained that the "work" of the reader should be limited to pinpointing the hints and realizing the possibilities of certain plot points beforehand. Or in other words you can only guess what the author made guessable, if you go too far you are jumping from the field of speculations in that of fanfictions. For example understanding that "Kinzo is already dead" or "shannon is kanon" are the only things you could rationally deduce as possibilities due to the hints given, but as for the exact reasons and the why, it wasn't really possible with a sensible margin of certainty. That being said... I did try to imagine a logical explanations for Maria to be still alive as part of certain fan fiction idea that I had, but then discarded. What I'm going to explain now is just a fan fictional idea that tries to explain how Maria could be alive logically within all that was said in the original story. I'm making this clear: I don't think this is what truly happened, nor I even remotedly think that this is what Ryuukishi had in mind. Okay? So in a few points: 1) When Eva escaped to Kuwadorian, she wasn't alone, Maria was with her. 2) After the huge explosion happened the military reacted promptly and arrived to the site before everyone else. So unlike what was stated officially Eva and Maria were found almost instantly, but that wasn't disclosed until later 3) The military quickly realized what happened and the grave consequences that such story would cause if spread. They couldn't just tell that they let a madman hold onto a secret military base and 900 tons of explosive that they (whops) forgot to retrieve, and in the confines of the Tokyo district no less. 4) So the secret services promptly came up with a cover up story to pass it as an "unfortunate accident", most likely a volcanic eruption, seeing as how the izu islands are volcanic and all. 5) That was easily done, now as for the witnesses... after discussing with Eva they found that she was cooperative, she actually didn't want to tell a thing of what really happened on that island. Obviously they had suspicions on her. I mean... how in the world she conveniently escaped the explosion while almost the entirety of her family was left behind? Something must have happened. But as long as she was willing to keep silent about certain military secrets, they were more than willing to let every suspicions drop. 6) Now as for Maria... while Eva was willing to take costudy, common practice dictates that when you find a child you try to contact his parents first. So they retraced Maria's father and they found him in europe or america (whatever) married with another woman. 7) Surprisingly enough the man once contacted declared that he was more than willing to welcome Maria into his family. Why? Because the woman he ditched Rosa for turned out to be infertile and they have been trying to adopt a child for a long time without success. What more "fortunate" event could they wish for? 8) For the military that was a win situation, the less witnessess around the better it was, Eva was cooperative, but Maria was a wild card. Getting her out of the country was just perfect. But then why not make it even "more perfect"? They completely erased Maria's existence and replaced it with a new identity exclusively tied with her natural father and the foster mother. Even if she later tried to expose the truth once grown up, she'd have no way to prove she was Maria Ushiromiya, and she'd be just labeled as yet another rokkenjima mistery maniac trying to draw attention. Obviously her father was "adequately compensated" on top of the child, and in the first place he was more than glad to sever any connections he and Maria had with Rosa. Those guys even justified the whole thing from a moral stand point, because "it is a lot healthier for this child to grow up without the burden of this messed up tragedy on her life". Should they let the general puplic know that she was still alive, as one of the two witnessess, she'd keep being pestered by people and reporters about what happened on that day. Apart from how bad that woud have been for Maria, they also absolutely didn't want anyone to ask her questions, because she wasn't exactly capable of keeping secrets. She would have ended up telling sensible informations that they tried to keep under cover. 9) The last problem they faced was the lack of corpses. In all honesty they themselves couldn't be sure how many died and if there were other survivors, as unlikely as it was (and we know it actually happened) there were too many unanswered questions about the whole deal to be sure of anything. So they fabricated an evidence to at least one corpse. Why Maria? Because they were certain of her whereabouts and they already tampered with her records enough. What if they forged an evidence for... let's say... Battler, and then he showed in front of some reporter showing how he was still alive and well? Better if it was someone whose fate was known and they could control. So that's basically it. It's not 100% perfect since there isn't really such a need to create fake proofs for dead bodies, but I think it generally works enough. There is a plus point on that. This scenario can give an explanation regarding Maria's diary and the stake of Mammon. Ange was simply told that they retrieved those stuff from Maria's house, in reality they ended up somewhere in Eva's house because in all the mess that happened Maria forgot to take her purse oversea. The purse obviously contained her diary and somehow even one of the stakes. Eva not knowing what to do with all that stuff placed them among the various other belongins of her deceased relatives. Ange later found them while rummaging between them in the attempt to reminisce the lost ones.
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Last edited by Jan-Poo; 2012-05-03 at 10:49. |
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