Kyoukai Senjou no Horizon - General Discussion

[Aoi Toori]

Originally Posted by MorningGlory

^
Futayo is just being loyal by waiting order from Mikawa/testament union ....

yeah I agree, that's what I mean by she just do what's the best move for the situation right now, allied with the more powerful testament union rather than musashi.

Originally Posted by serpiente

This show have reach a peak when everything from now on will be decisive...

no, this is just another harem anime like IS...



jk


btw, is this pic (kinda NSFW) the new bonus for BD1?
http://genesis-horizon.net/products/bd.html

[articuzwolf]

I really like the scene when Kimi worried about her 'foolish' brother

It's so sweet....

[ars89]

WTF who kills a little girl to cut her up and make her into weapons. Poor Horizon. At least Aoi was right that P-01s was Horizon. Like the fight between Tadakatsu and Muneshige. Nice that he finally ended up with his wife. So i'm guessing Masazumi kicked AOi before he said anything to save him. At least we know how the him and his friends are involved now. So i'm guessing he's going to try and go after her. Also why did Tadakatsu hand over his weapon?

[Xacual]

Originally Posted by ars89

Also why did Tadakatsu hand over his weapon?

Tadakatsu said he won the fight, Gin responded that a rematch should be done with his successor. So he gave her the spear to give to Futayo since she's his successor.

[Xellos-_^]

he was also planning to die. no reason to keep the spear.

[thundrakkon]

So with Episode 5, the story finally moves in a different direction. The story is more straightforward, even though the actions of the characters can be a bit confusing at times.

Matsudaira came out as a little nutty, but I guess they are trying to do the Nutty Professor look. He seems to be the mastermind who wants to change history and stirring up conflict for the impending apocalypse. He is crazy and goofy at the same time, with him killing a little girl to create her into a weapon. It is a bit hard to take him seriously, but he is dead so we can move on.

Tadakatsu Honda was very much awesome in the episode. One of my concerns with him is why he committed suicide in the end? Also, why did he deflect the shot from Muneshige of Espana that would have blown up the nuclear reactor, when in the end he wanted the nuclear reactor to blow?

As for Masazumi Honda kicking Aoi Toori, I can only assume she did that because if he did confess, P-01s (aka Horizon) would not want to leave Toori, which in turn will make the guards kill Toori in order to make her leave. Either way, they still could have grabbed her regardless, killing him or not. Well, the other possibility is that by confessing, he forms a contract with her, and she becomes his weapon. At that point, the guards would need to kill him in order to break the contract.

As it stands, it looks like the battle collect all 9 Deadly Sins is on, with the victor getting... Not sure yet. The purpose was to change history enough to be able to go into space, but not sure if collecting those weapons would do that. I guess it is for another purpose.

[Xellos-_^]

could list Nine sins? I know the usual 7 but i am not familiar with 8th and 9th.

[thundrakkon]

Originally Posted by stuopidget

I think you guys are still watching this anime with the normal world in mind.

Well, the story itself relies on religious and historical reference in our world, so there is some relation. Yes, it is another world, but so is a lot of anime. With those references, it is hard not to try to relate it to what we know in the normal world.

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

could list Nine sins? I know the usual 7 but i am not familiar with 8th and 9th.

For the seven deadly sins, they are:

1) Pride
2) Envy
3) Wrath
4) Sloth
5) Greed
6) Gluttony
7) Lust

However, for the anime, they used an older concept in the original creation for the deadly sins. Envy was removed, and these two were added, total 8:

1) Sadness
2) Vainglory

In anime, the last one added, which is also similary to Envy, is:

3) Jealousy

So to recap,

Pride, Wrath, Sloth, Greed, Gluttony, Lust, Sadness, Vainglory, and Jealousy.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by thundrakkon

Well, the story itself relies on religious and historical reference in our world, so there is some relation. Yes, it is another world, but so is a lot of anime. With those references, it is hard not to try to relate it to what we know in the normal world.



For the seven deadly sins, they are:

1) Pride
2) Envy
3) Wrath
4) Sloth
5) Greed
6) Gluttony
7) Lust

However, for the anime, they used an older concept in the original creation for the deadly sins. Envy was removed, and these two were added, total 8:

1) Sadness
2) Vainglory

In anime, the last one added, which is also similary to Envy, is:

3) Jealousy

So to recap,

Pride, Wrath, Sloth, Greed, Gluttony, Lust, Sadness, Vainglory, and Jealousy.

Thanks

But how did the ancient differ Pride form Vainglory? And how is sadness a Sin?

[thundrakkon]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

Thanks

But how did the ancient differ Pride form Vainglory? And how is sadness a Sin?

It was Pope Gregory I who slimmed down the list due to its similarity between some of the sins. Sadness (Sorrow/Despair) was combined with Sloth, and Vainglory was combined with Pride. He also added Envy after that to make up the current 7 Deadly Sins.

I guess for sadness, it is the fact that you are not doing what you can be doing, so you are spending time on unproductive things.

As for Vainglory, it was a form of boasting, or showing off. Whereas pride is something more internal.

Envy was added and differ from Greed in that Greed is material goods desire. Envy is more action oriented from another individual.

[Allen]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

Currently Aoi and his classmate can't even fight the peons. Is there going to be a timeskip to where Aoi and his classmates are more powerful then they currently are?

There are power-up events for specific characters later, but not something like: "After two months of training they came back." Btw, about the end of the fifth episode:

Ulquiaga was taken by surprise by three/four guys;
Neshimbara isn't a character that focus on fights;
For Noriki... It's better if I don't say anything about him yet.

Originally Posted by Aoi Toori

btw, is this pic (kinda NSFW) the new bonus for BD1?
http://genesis-horizon.net/products/bd.html

Not a new bonus, they just added this pic and more info about the novel that will come with the limited edition of the BD1. And about the pic it's just Kimi-nee acting as she normally acts

[Chaos2Frozen]

Originally Posted by thundrakkon

It was Pope Gregory I who slimmed down the list due to its similarity between some of the sins. Sadness (Sorrow/Despair) was combined with Sloth, and Vainglory was combined with Pride. He also added Envy after that to make up the current 7 Deadly Sins.

I guess for sadness, it is the fact that you are not doing what you can be doing, so you are spending time on unproductive things.

Evagrius Ponticus, the monk who first wrote the right evil thoughts, believe that sadness or despair is a great sin because it damages you and by you being damage it affects others around you.

Basically in the old days it was simple, anything that's occupying your mind from worth shipping God can be considered a sin, that includes food, sex, money, and despair. Because despair means that you've lost faith in God

[Xacual]

Originally Posted by thundrakkon

Tadakatsu Honda was very much awesome in the episode. One of my concerns with him is why he committed suicide in the end? Also, why did he deflect the shot from Muneshige of Espana that would have blown up the nuclear reactor, when in the end he wanted the nuclear reactor to blow?

As for Masazumi Honda kicking Aoi Toori, I can only assume she did that because if he did confess, P-01s (aka Horizon) would not want to leave Toori, which in turn will make the guards kill Toori in order to make her leave. Either way, they still could have grabbed her regardless, killing him or not. Well, the other possibility is that by confessing, he forms a contract with her, and she becomes his weapon. At that point, the guards would need to kill him in order to break the contract.

In Tadakatsu's case, he had to stop the attack because it would prevent the reactor from doing what they wanted it to, which was different then a simple blow up I guess. I would also assume he let himself go out in the end because his lord had also died and he felt that he had completed his life's purpose. At least that's how I saw it.

For Masazumi kicking Toori, Toori was getting on the nerves of the grunt commander guy. That's pretty much all I saw it as. The grunt commander guy could have just had him killed to shut him up. I really doubt they care whether or not they kill him even if they did identify him as the leader of musashi. He's just a foolish idiot they let have power after all.

[serpiente]

Originally Posted by thundrakkon

So with Episode 5, the story finally moves in a different direction. The story is more straightforward, even though the actions of the characters can be a bit confusing at times.

Matsudaira came out as a little nutty, but I guess they are trying to do the Nutty Professor look. He seems to be the mastermind who wants to change history and stirring up conflict for the impending apocalypse. He is crazy and goofy at the same time, with him killing a little girl to create her into a weapon. It is a bit hard to take him seriously, but he is dead so we can move on.

Tadakatsu Honda was very much awesome in the episode. One of my concerns with him is why he committed suicide in the end? Also, why did he deflect the shot from Muneshige of Espana that would have blown up the nuclear reactor, when in the end he wanted the nuclear reactor to blow?

As for Masazumi Honda kicking Aoi Toori, I can only assume she did that because if he did confess, P-01s (aka Horizon) would not want to leave Toori, which in turn will make the guards kill Toori in order to make her leave. Either way, they still could have grabbed her regardless, killing him or not. Well, the other possibility is that by confessing, he forms a contract with her, and she becomes his weapon. At that point, the guards would need to kill him in order to break the contract.

As it stands, it looks like the battle collect all 9 Deadly Sins is on, with the victor getting... Not sure yet. The purpose was to change history enough to be able to go into space, but not sure if collecting those weapons would do that. I guess it is for another purpose.

As long as I was able to understand from the sparse words in english here and there, the shot from Muneshige was meant to keep the reactor to explode. Also, tadakatsu has sworn loyalty to his master so he may want to end his life alongside him, because his purpose in life is fullfilled, not to mention that his own wife has given his life to help him deviate the muneshige shot, which otherwise could have ruined Tomonobus´s Plan.

I wonder why you cant take seriously a guy like Tomonobu, who s capable of jeopordize everyones beliefs and change the course of history of the world in one act, giving his own life in the process. A guy like that has to be dead serious about his reasons and purposes, even when the others cant realize yet the true reasons for that act. He laughs and jokes at the ignorance of the others because hes beyond that point. This kind of carzyness is far for being funny.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by serpiente

I wonder why you cant take seriously a guy like Tomonobu, who s capable of jeopordize everyones beliefs and change the course of history of the world in one act, giving his own life in the process. A guy like that has to be dead serious about his reasons and purposes, even when the others cant realize yet the true reasons for that act. He laughs and jokes at the ignorance of the others because hes beyond that point. This kind of carzyness is far for being funny.

On screen it is funny,

In real life, this kind of person will make you dig a bomb shelter

[thundrakkon]

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

Basically in the old days it was simple, anything that's occupying your mind from worth shipping God can be considered a sin

Hence, spending time on unproductive things.

Originally Posted by Xacual

In Tadakatsu's case, he had to stop the attack because it would prevent the reactor from doing what they wanted it to, which was different then a simple blow up I guess. I would also assume he let himself go out in the end because his lord had also died and he felt that he had completed his life's purpose. At least that's how I saw it.

I guess it is a difference of blowing up a nuclear base versus the nuclear base having a nuclear meltdown. Both will create damage, except one will be much more than the other.

I can understand the pride factor of going down with your lord, but he leaves behind his daughter to take the brunt of his actions. Also, it forces her to action instead of giving her a choice, which he originally stated that she would get (a chance to choose).

Originally Posted by Xacual

For Masazumi kicking Toori, Toori was getting on the nerves of the grunt commander guy. That's pretty much all I saw it as. The grunt commander guy could have just had him killed to shut him up. I really doubt they care whether or not they kill him even if they did identify him as the leader of musashi. He's just a foolish idiot they let have power after all.

Hmm... it just seems like there was more to that scene.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by thundrakkon

, it forces her to action instead of giving her a choice, which he originally stated that she would get (a chance to choose).

Him being dead complete free her of any choice he made. She can now make choice without him lurking the back ground.

Hmm... it just seems like there was more to that scene.

I think that was pretty much it myself, the old peon looks like he was ready to kill Aoi before Masazumi kick in

[Kunagisa]

Haha, you guys are so calm! Floating texts were full of ;___; at the end of the stream.

Originally Posted by Sides

Not sure if I understand correctly,

Spoiler for not even sure if it is a spoiler:

does it mean the souls of people can be locked into the dolls, or other devices? Like Honda's wife and Horizon?

Quoting from the infodump.

Automated doll (Automaton)
A race of dolls with a soul residing in them; a servitory nature towards their masters is built-in.

I think they actually need a soul hence why it's "Android" (with heavy emphasis on the andro part) not "Robot".

Originally Posted by felix

It would be weird if they could. What would that make their teacher then?

You're still thinking of them as students!! In this world, they are legitimate politicians and could even be considered in the army. Don't underestimate these guys ( ¯‿¯).

Originally Posted by articuzwolf

I really like the scene when Kimi worried about her 'foolish' brother

It's so sweet....

She's what Allen and I were talking about in Episode 9 =).

Saving some other plot discussion for until the TAN sub comes out, and as usual I recommend rewatching still because even though the speedsub's great, there is a couple of major mistranslations (the last part that was untranslated is actually REALLY important too).

Finally



R.I.P.

PS: For those who didn't notice, pay extra special attention to this lady's hair ornament in that scene, that's when I really went full emo and super extra kudos to Sunrise for adding that); not many studios can pull off this kind of impact within 2 episodes of introducing a character like Suzuku already mentioned.

A novel detail that was chopped

Spoiler for Novel comparison:

the part that Tadakatsu held the jewel to the moon, that's the scene of his wife poking fun at him for "proposing" to her.

[Nightengale]

Like Tadakatsu himself said... he's entirely in the dark about what his master, Motonobu is planning. He's doing what he's doing purely because it's his lord's orders and is driven by loyalty, nothing else.

Originally Posted by thundrakkon

I can understand the pride factor of going down with your lord, but he leaves behind his daughter to take the brunt of his actions. Also, it forces her to action instead of giving her a choice, which he originally stated that she would get (a chance to choose).

Well, she was clearly trained and nurtured to be facing the decision she's forced to take at that point of time. The whole 'make her own choice' thing is pretty much an expectation that there will come a time when she has to choose between what she feels is right against filial loyalty.

[Xacual]

Originally Posted by stuopidget

Saving some other plot discussion for until the TAN sub comes out, and as usual I recommend rewatching still because even though the speedsub's great, there is a couple of major mistranslations (the last part that was untranslated is actually REALLY important too).

Yeah the translator said he knew he made some mistakes he mainly wanted a decent version to get out before a certain other group. He said he'll try better next week.

About the ending bit, from what I was told, it's just Masazumi summing up what had just happened and saying the Horizon is now the heir to Mikawa? Something along those lines anyway.