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AuraTwilight · 2011-09-26, 20:23

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But here's another question: Why doesn't he convince random girls/Madoka to wish for enough energy to be created to stop entropy?

Because Entropy is eternal. You would need infinite energy, meaning that no matter what, you're going to have to keep contracting girls forever.

Except in the case where Madoka becomes a witch, envelops the planet, and essentially acts like an immortal sun that radiates magic.

Besides, there's a balancing act in the cosmos so that the good you cause with magic creates an equal "bad." Creating this much energy would probably like...require people to be sacrificed to it as a power source or something.

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How so? I clearly remember that Kyuubey told several girls throughout the series that he can fulfill any wish whatsoever. And we know that Kyuubey is unable to lie/provide false information, so his statement must have been true.

Let's say you wish for there to be no more witches. Depending on your power, you can either do what Madoka did, or you can become a Magical Girl who is really good at her job, and has the ability to tell when a Magical Girl is going to Change so you can destroy their Soul Gem before it becomes a Grief Seed.

The wish is granted either way, but differently depending on your level of power, don't you think?

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I think of "sensible" wishes in Madoka in somewhat local terms. That is, each girls' soul gem is a source, and that energy source can be applied to any wish conceivable. So, wish for there to be no such thing as gravity? Sure, go ahead. However, because each girl's magic/soul energy is certainly limited--irrational in origin or not--I'd imagine the girl would run out of magic, fall into despair, and turn into a witch before their wish would have too much of an effect on the universe. So, maybe shifting the gravitational constant a few thousandth places (would still 'cause major complications and probably kill everybody). Or else causing everything to float for a few seconds. But probably not anything more than that, because the universe is simply too large for global wishes to be conceivably sustainable.

That's certainly probable.

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With Kyuubey, by the time he collects a girl's Grief Seed, I think he'd have obtained every last drop of emotional energy from her anyway. That's the nature of the Soul Gem to Grief Seed conversion process. So there is not really any need for Kyuubey to trick girls into wishing for energy itself--they would not be able to produce more energy than what he'd get from their Grief Seed anyway. Makes more sense for the girls to wish for something that they actually have hope for, actually desire personally. The existence/nature of the magic/wish/emotional wish system in itself defies Entropy--but that does not mean it is completely free from its influence. Each girl possesses a certain degree of emotional energy that can be put to work defying the death/homeostasis of the universe--but in no sense is that infinite.

Indeed. Not only that, but their emotional input seems to influence how much power they DO have. The more you put into your wish, the greater your wish seems to be regardless of what you actually said outloud.

Jimmy C · 2011-09-27, 03:43

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Originally Posted by O.D.

Why doesn't he convince random girls/Madoka to wish for enough energy to be created to stop entropy?

He can't suggest what to wish for to the girls. For maximum effectiveness, the girls must pin all their hopes on their wish. Even if he could make them think the wish is important, that doesn't mean they're giving it all their hopes and the result could be they get less energy at the end or the scale of the granted wish isn't as far reaching as they desire. Either would be undesireable.

mols · 2011-09-27, 07:28

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Originally Posted by O.D.

I see, wishing for entropy to disappear is quite risky.

But here's another question: Why doesn't he convince random girls/Madoka to wish for enough energy to be created to stop entropy?

How so? I clearly remember that Kyuubey told several girls throughout the series that he can fulfill any wish whatsoever. And we know that Kyuubey is unable to lie/provide false information, so his statement must have been true.

That is not actually true. QB is capable of lying or leaving important information out of the conversation. This was shown clearly when he did not inform Kyouko that there was no way to save Sayaka. He even said that nobody knows, nobody tried, etc. But when asked again after their failure, he said something like "of course it was impossible, but Kyouko's failure will help me in convincing Madoka into making a contract". (he did not say it like that, but the meaning was the same).

QB does not understand human behavior, so he does not usually lie because he does not see the problem in telling things the way they are.

ThereminVox · 2012-08-29, 17:33

I'd like to apologize in advance. My other half planted the idea in my head that Kyubey should have his own theme song. With that thought floating around my brain, I went to work today where the office radio was playing the local earworm station, and this is the result.

In particular, I apologize if the song seems eerily familiar to anyone.

Spoiler for Contract Maybe?:

SPARTAN 119 · 2012-08-31, 08:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThereminVox

I'd like to apologize in advance. My other half planted the idea in my head that Kyubey should have his own theme song. With that thought floating around my brain, I went to work today where the office radio was playing the local earworm station, and this is the result.

In particular, I apologize if the song seems eerily familiar to anyone.

Spoiler for Contract Maybe?:

I have at several times thought while listening to various (mostly heavy metal) songs, that this could be modified to reflect Homura's view of Kyubey.

Might post one later...

Shyni · 2013-01-14, 11:02

QB sorta reminds me of Mephilas-seijin from Ultraman. I mean, they're both aliens based on Mephistopheles, with vaguely cat-like features and talk without using a mouth. Both have some trouble understanding human emotion too, it seems. Ultraman found Mephilas' plan downright laughable since humans would never give up the earth, no matter what he offered. Although, Mephilas was more blatantly evil,

and QB hasn't got much physical resemblance to him.

ArrowSmith · 2013-06-04, 22:00

My reaction when finding out Kyubei wasn't a cuddly little creature was....

KILL IT WITH FIRE!!!!

ALPHA-Beatrice · 2013-07-30, 10:04

It's not that Kyubey doesn't lie.

He doesn't know what a lie is, he himself said he has no concept of Human emotions, the fragile breaking point, et al. All Kyubey and his planet of incubators care about is Human energy, and doing whatever it takes to make that happen.

To them, it's moral and without fault. Actually, to them, everything they do is without moral and without fault.

The Incubators are sociopathic and it would've been nice if Kyubei were given more of a role in the final battle so to speak.

bhl88 · 2013-07-30, 10:20

As a doll strapped to a pipe bomb.

2012-08-29, 17:33	Link #884
ThereminVox Guess what time it is? Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Nova Scotia, Canada Age: 38	I'd like to apologize in advance. My other half planted the idea in my head that Kyubey should have his own theme song. With that thought floating around my brain, I went to work today where the office radio was playing the local earworm station, and this is the result. In particular, I apologize if the song seems eerily familiar to anyone. Spoiler for Contract Maybe?: You've got a beautiful room Sorry for startling you But see I'm fluffy and cute There's no need to be shy Say do you like frilly skirts? Yeah, parents right? They're the worst. I've got a notion, but first Did something make you cry? You're quite the keener Pure heart, kind demeanor Could stand to be a little leaner I can help if you're a dreamer (Chorus) Hey I just met you My name is Kyubey And I grant wishes So contract maybe? My face is frozen The terms are shady But I grant wishes So contract maybe? Hey I just met you My name is Kyubey And I grant wishes So contract maybe? I've had my eyes on you The world needs saving And I grant wishes So contract maybe? Is there a boy that you like? Fancy a shiny new bike? Your brother's sick? The poor tyke Too bad you two can't play You seem like you're pretty bright Could be a champion of light You're what, 14, am I right? 13? Well that's okay. I had the feeling A miracle would sound appealing Fame, cash, friends or healing If you're ready let's start dealing (Repeat Chorus) Just call me if you wanna talk thermodynamics Thermodynamics Thermody-na-na-mics (x2) My face is frozen The terms are shady But I grant wishes So contract maybe? Hey I just met you My name is Kyubey And I grant wishes So contract maybe? Hey what's the problem now? You're all such babies I don't get humans Stop crying maybe? Just call me if you wanna talk thermodynamics Thermodynamics Thermody-na-na-mics Just call me if you wanna talk thermodynamics Thermodynamics And contract maybe?

2013-07-30, 10:20	Link #889
bhl88 Otaku Apprentice Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Unseen Horizon	As a doll strapped to a pipe bomb. __________________ OS-tan Collections (temporary): https://discord.gg/Hv2rBs3

2013-01-14, 11:02	Link #886
Shyni Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: nowhere	QB sorta reminds me of Mephilas-seijin from Ultraman. I mean, they're both aliens based on Mephistopheles, with vaguely cat-like features and talk without using a mouth. Both have some trouble understanding human emotion too, it seems. Ultraman found Mephilas' plan downright laughable since humans would never give up the earth, no matter what he offered. Although, Mephilas was more blatantly evil, and QB hasn't got much physical resemblance to him.

2013-06-04, 22:00	Link #887
ArrowSmith Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009	My reaction when finding out Kyubei wasn't a cuddly little creature was.... KILL IT WITH FIRE!!!!

2013-07-30, 10:04	Link #888
ALPHA-Beatrice Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2013	It's not that Kyubey doesn't lie. He doesn't know what a lie is, he himself said he has no concept of Human emotions, the fragile breaking point, et al. All Kyubey and his planet of incubators care about is Human energy, and doing whatever it takes to make that happen. To them, it's moral and without fault. Actually, to them, everything they do is without moral and without fault. The Incubators are sociopathic and it would've been nice if Kyubei were given more of a role in the final battle so to speak.