2012-02-28, 14:37 | Link #27961 | |||||||||||
The True Culprit
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Not to mention that George and Battler have been compared throughout all of Umineko. Erika proposed George as an alternative culprit in Bern's game when it turned out to be Battler. Not to mention, George did say he's willing to kill his whole family for Shannon. Dur. Quote:
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The Murder Mystery Game solves all of her problems, assuming nothing goes horribly wrong. But with the game going on, how easy would it be for someone to hijack it and murder people without suspicion?
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2012-02-28, 14:53 | Link #27962 |
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Of course, they'd still need a reason to do it. Battler and George are suspicious, but neither seems to have a motive.
Granted, the "takes the murder 'game' too seriously, acts in self-defense" thing doesn't require a motive. But you'd think it wouldn't lead to everyone dying.
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2012-02-28, 16:05 | Link #27965 |
Ordinary Magician
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Considering how Ange reacted after reading Eva's diary I doubt Kyrie's group were the culprits.
It only makes sense if George is the culprit after all. Eva hides it, Ange is not impressed. Everything fits.
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2012-02-28, 16:11 | Link #27966 | |
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Also, even if George would kill for Shannon, there has to be an eventuality in which he would both desire and need to do so. I don't think "I'd do anything for the one I love, even kill" translates to "killing someone is the first option!"
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2012-02-28, 16:33 | Link #27967 | |
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2012-02-28, 16:57 | Link #27968 |
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She looked rather beat up after she read it though, I'm sure it affected her a bit. But then Battler goes on and says something like : the truth wasn't so important right? Perhaps they got it from Kyrie.
Offtopic (I noticed that Battler told Ange he read Maria's grimoire (at the scene right after Ange reads the diary.). So that's a minus to IkukoYasu theory. That's how Battler got to know about stuff he wouldn't have normally known without IkukoYasu telling him. Though this is just golden land Battler.
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2012-02-28, 17:18 | Link #27969 | |
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And regardless, it does have "Beatrice's" handwriting in it, so that at least is a point in favor of it either being forged by "Beatrice" or a genuine Maria-penned diary with "Beatrice" contributions. And if Tohya got it in real life (which we aren't sure about, but still), that means it had to come from somewhere, and the obvious source would be Ikuko. She can claim that she purchased it from someone, but that doesn't prove a thing.
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2012-02-28, 17:45 | Link #27970 |
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Perhaps Tohya never read it. It was Battler who read it, on the day of the conference.
I don't really think Maria's grimoire is fake, though there is something else that might hint it. After all Beato did sent a message bottle in Maria's name. So perhaps she could write the grimoire using her name as well. Bah, I don't like it, it's unnecessary.
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2012-02-28, 18:29 | Link #27971 |
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I only have one thing to add to this discussion: I'm getting the impression that people are saying Ange's reaction to Eva's diary in EP8 was... Underwhelming. And I do not understand this, because it made her jump off some 10+ stories worth of bookshelf to her death. It also made her go into complete denial and hysterics.
Of course, this was Meta!Ange, who is not necessarily Ange. But, that's the only reaction we have. We don't have epilogue!Ange's thoughts on the matter, and it's possible that she never read it. R07 seems to refer to the diary as more of a metaphorical choice for Ange to make in an interview, which makes me think that it probably doesn't even exist in a literal sense. But anyway, that's why I'm quite confused here. Did I miss something, or am I getting the wrong impression, or...? |
2012-02-28, 18:37 | Link #27972 | |
The True Culprit
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2012-02-28, 18:40 | Link #27973 |
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I think that scene was portraying the events prior to the reading. Seeing how the goat girls from Ange's school appeared, it was more like her memories, how she used to hate Eva and all. And also she jumped, which didn't really happen.
After all it wouldn't make much sense to act desperately like that and then say that the truth wasn't really that important. Pfff Now that I've looked back at it; that scene is very confusing.
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2012-02-28, 18:41 | Link #27974 |
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...So then, you think that all that drama was just an act she put up, or what? I don't think it's even possible to say that, since we know that Meta-World death equates to, essentially, a mental BSOD. She mentally shut down in response to it.
Yes, she revived soon after that, but that doesn't mean she was all fine and dandy with what she had read. |
2012-02-28, 19:13 | Link #27975 | |
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2012-02-28, 19:27 | Link #27976 |
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Y'know, I always had a vague suspicion that the book was totally blank, and that Ange's reaction was that there isn't any truth and she'll never, ever know.
Probably not based on anything that can be backed up with evidence. I should probably just read EP8 again sometime. |
2012-02-28, 19:32 | Link #27977 | ||
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I'll respond to the rest at the same time that I respond to Renall. Quote:
Before I explain this, keep in mind that when she revived, she was in the Golden Land with all her fantasy buddies, apologizing to Battler for ever pursuing the truth in the first place. She then went and tried to keep the truth from being revealed to anyone else, and the majority of the remainder of the novel focused on that. This culminated in a brilliant display of "no fuck you Bernkastel, I don't care about the Truth, I'll believe whatever I want, I'll even believe that everybody survived somehow if I want to, and I'll show you by keeping them here with me even though you've denied them all in Red." So let's think about it: How do people respond when faced with a truth they cannot come to terms with? Yes, there are times when they will suddenly become calm. However, this would be one of roughly 2 situations: 1. The person in question is so completely in denial that they will continue to deny it no matter what you say/do to them. 2. The person in question has completely given up and is about to kill themselves or something. ...If it's the first situation, then everything makes perfect sense doesn't it? In that case, naturally her response would be "I wish I had never learned this at all. Why did I seek it in the first place? The truth isn't all that important. In fact, I should probably keep everyone else from learning about it too." And this is pretty much exactly what happened. The two endings were pretty much "stay in denial" or "come to terms with the Truth and get yourself a Bad End." Of course, I'm just putting all of this in really nasty terms, but I'm just trying to say it in a way that's easily understood. |
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2012-02-28, 19:36 | Link #27978 | ||
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2012-02-28, 19:46 | Link #27979 | ||
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2012-02-28, 20:56 | Link #27980 | ||
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1) Because of how Kinzo behaves with almost any women (unless Yasu is actually a guy I guess...) 2) Shannon isnt treated in a particularily distant way - thats the way Kinzo basically is with everyone. Kanon's treatment by Kinzo is what's "special" so I think if it was as you said, Shannon would've pictured herself particularily despised by Kinzo, which isn't the case. Quote:
Most of these memories would make sense if they were memories that Lion lived in arc 7. So what he's doing remembering these is basically the same thing as Beato (3) remembering things Beato 1 and 2 did. Last edited by UsagiTenpura; 2012-02-28 at 21:23. |
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