Anime or not?

[bhl88]

Originally Posted by Shyni

Well, it wasn't written in Japanese.

I meant the way they speak, not the language.

Originally Posted by Shyni

It was made by Gainax, and licensed by Crunchyroll and Funimation. Why isn't being animation made by an anime company in Japan, distributed by anime companies outside Japan, and called an anime not enough?

But I did consider it anime. Though my mind wavers a bit from that.

Originally Posted by Shyni

Are you saying kid-friendly, pass-censors-easily anime doesn't exist?

Ghibhi is one of those.

@Kyuu: I think I remembered someone talking about Avatar (here somewhere) and changed his mind because of the dialogue (not the language).

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Kyuu

Case in point: American anime is inevitable.

Honestly, I have to disagree. And not just for some semantic reason, but because American animation is by and large not shifting in an anime direction right now. I don't see much, if any, recent evidence that the anime visual style is what American animators are leaning towards. The vast majority of American animation is either 3D CGI Pixar style, or what many would call "cartoony" (Simpsons, Family Guy, etc...).

[Kyuu]

I applied the word "inevitable" to specify a time between now and infinity.

If it takes for the old American animators (and executives) to die off -- and be replaced by younger animators with greater influence from anime -- then so be it.

[Kudryavka]

Originally Posted by Kyuu

I applied the word "inevitable" to specify a time between now and infinity.

If it takes for the old American animators (and executives) to die off -- and be replaced by younger animators with greater influence from anime -- then so be it.

American animation is already showing signs of anime. Well some stuff.

But there is no need to feel like American animation will be Japanese styled someday. Why do you think American animators would all eventually decide to follow Japanese animation instead of stick with their tried and true own stuff??

And as RRR says American animation is by and large going towards 3D animation, especially big budget stuff. Seeing how little 3D stuff Japan puts out how would Americans be influenced by Japanese 3D animation?

Though I must admit, if America ever goes back to mostly 2D animation (lol won't happen) I could imagine it only being because studios adopt Japanese animation shortcuts to make things much less expensive. Those animation shortcuts which are tightly woven into the Japanese industry are why we have so, so many anime nowadays; they make animation much less expensive.

[Shyni]

The fact that some American shows use Japanese-ish art styles is just a natural sign of cultural influence. I recall reading that the general anime style today evolved from Japanese people copying the style of old Disney animation. Even anime styles don't quite stay the same.

Anyway, I think it's simpler to define anime just based on Japanese-ness. There will be a few things that are neither this way nor that, but for the most part, it should be easy to figure out. Trying to decide by feel would mean that I have to actually watch something before I can definitely call it an anime, and that's not very convenient. That, and I'm pretty sure you can get different feels depending on what era the anime is from, although I don't know in what way since I don't watch enough variety in era, and I have terrible memory as to how different shows felt.

I meant the way they speak, not the language.

Well, English translated from Japanese isn't going to sound like speech that was actually written in English, I imagine. Although I don't really know.

[Kudryavka]

Originally Posted by Shyni

The fact that some American shows use Japanese-ish art styles is just a natural sign of cultural influence. I recall reading that the general anime style today evolved from Japanese people copying the style of old Disney animation. Even anime styles don't really stay the same.

Yup, modern Japanese animation is modeled after Tezuka's work, and he was highly influenced by various American cartoons (most notably Betty Boop, but he may have been influenced by some Disney stuff as well).

[Kyuu]

Originally Posted by Shyni

The fact that some American shows use Japanese-ish art styles is just a natural sign of cultural influence. I recall reading that the general anime style today evolved from Japanese people copying the style of old Disney animation. Even anime styles don't quite stay the same.

Indeed. Y'got "styles" implemented by different artists, directors, studios, and so on so forth. For example, KyoAni's style. As I visualize Tamako, I want to pinch her cheek.

So, y'know what? "Style" isn't the best word to broad brush anime itself. Instead, I'm proposing the word "technique" or "form", as in there is a distinct set of techniques that makes anime as anime, and separates itself from other forms of animation. On top of that, these techniques have been developed and used by Japanese artists, directors, studios, etc. for so many decades now.

But, that's as far as I'll go with the Japanese distinction. That's only because, the techniques to draw and produce anime can be ported in other countries. It's only a matter of whether it fully happens or not.

Now look at this guy. His drawing technique is pretty down pat. Not perfect, but that's freakin' good.

[Shyni]

I don't know either. Is it so hard to accept that there is such a category that can include Doraemon and Madoka Magica, plus a shitton of other things?

wow, now my post just looks... uh... should I delete this too?

[Akito Kinomoto]

Originally Posted by Shyni

The fact that some American shows use Japanese-ish art styles is just a natural sign of cultural influence. I recall reading that the general anime style today evolved from Japanese people copying the style of old Disney animation. Even anime styles don't quite stay the same.

Bingo.

It's easier to limit the definition of anime to "funded by a Japanese studio" when considering the OP's stipulation of the animation being made somewhere other than Japan. Using the "feel" of a show to determine its "authenticity" is like painting a horse with black and white stripes; it's not a zebra. It's still a horse.

[RichardFromMarple]

Totally Spies is fairly anime-isque but mostly made in France (not sure if the amimation is outsourced).

[bhl88]

Originally Posted by Akito Kinomoto

Bingo.

It's easier to limit the definition of anime to "funded by a Japanese studio" when considering the OP's stipulation of the animation being made somewhere other than Japan. Using the "feel" of a show to determine its "authenticity" is like painting a horse with black and white stripes; it's not a zebra. It's still a horse.

I still depend on the "feel" though, but it's only 90% accurate.

[Kyuu]

Originally Posted by Akito Kinomoto

Using the "feel" of a show to determine its "authenticity" is like painting a horse with black and white stripes; it's not a zebra. It's still a horse.

On the same analogy:

Yet, make a zebra and a horse produce an offspring -- then y'got something.

Spoiler:

DISCLAIMER: I'm not into animal porn.

[Akito Kinomoto]

Originally Posted by Kyuu

On the same analogy:

Yet, make a zebra and a horse produce an offspring -- then y'got something.

Spoiler:

DISCLAIMER: I'm not into animal porn.

But what do we call it then? If we use the "feel" then Panty and Stocking isn't an anime while Avatar is an anime.

Spoiler:

You've never read a doujinshi with a halfway decent cowgirl have you?

[bhl88]

I wouldn't classify Avatar as one though... (watched enough anime to distinguish between them).

[Kyuu]

Originally Posted by Akito Kinomoto

Spoiler:

You've never read a doujinshi with a halfway decent cowgirl have you?

Nah, I don't really read doujinshi's. Hell, I don't even devote time to printed media anymore. I just stick to animated stuff. But, I'm sure there are plenty good ones made by.... say... non-Japanese.

But what does said cowgirl look like?

[bhl88]

Originally Posted by Kyuu

Nah, I don't really read doujinshi's. Hell, I don't even devote time to printed media anymore. I just stick to animated stuff. But, I'm sure there are plenty good ones made by.... say... non-Japanese.

But what does said cowgirl look like?

Yeah I read some Western ones. Poor big bad Light Wolfami...

[Lord of Fire]

Originally Posted by Akito Kinomoto

But what do we call it then? If we use the "feel" then Panty and Stocking isn't an anime while Avatar is an anime.

A zebra/horse hybrid is usually known as zorse, so maybe 'anitoon' for an anime/cartoon hybrid, or a cartoon that could easily pass off as anime? Would fit as a nice abbreviation or 'anime-inspired cartoon', IMO.