Gundam Seed/Seed Destiny General Discussion Thread

[brightman]

Originally Posted by MoonLightShadows

when I saw the hot spring. I wonder if they drain the water back into tanks when the ship is in combat. The Impulse VS Freedom battle the front end of the ship was tilting down pretty far to escape for water to not splash everywhere inside the Arch Angel.

Don't forget Arnold Neumann's barrel rolls Don't wanna be in there when it happens.

[kaito-kid]

Arnold can do whatever the **** he wants! by far the best pilot in CE.

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

I just checked this thread and.......all this fuss about an onsen aboard a giant ship ......

Wait untill you see this :

Spoiler for from Destiny Astray:

Yeah, that’s a bathroom with a bathtub inside a Mobile Suit's backpack. And maybe I have to remind you that Astray Outframe was constantly running around, climbing, and do some fighting. Makes you wonder how they manage that bathtub.

FYI, Astray Outframe:



And the girl who built it was Yoon, a former Morgenroete technician that joins Junk Guild. That said, I bet she’s also the culprit who built that onsen on AA. I can almost imagine how it happened:

*One day, the decommissioned AA in ORB needed some maintenance. They called in some of the best Junk Guild repairmen (and women). Yoon came along. After finished with the repairs, she saw some empty rooms that rarely used. She ask Kira & the gang, “It’s such a waste to let those rooms be. How ‘bout I make a pool for you?”, Kira being the only one with a Japanese name in the gang (amirite?) said, “Can you make an onsen instead?” and Yoon who wouldn’t back down from a challenge said “You got it, pal!”.

[monster]

Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor

I just checked this thread and.......all this fuss about an onsen aboard a giant ship ......

Wait untill you see this :

Spoiler for from Destiny Astray:

Yeah, that’s a bathroom with a bathtub inside a Mobile Suit's backpack. And maybe I have to remind you that Astray Outframe was constantly running around, climbing, and do some fighting. Makes you wonder how they manage that bathtub.

FYI, Astray Outframe:



And the girl who built it was Yoon, a former Morgenroete technician that joins Junk Guild. That said, I bet she’s also the culprit who built that onsen on AA. I can almost imagine how it happened:

*One day, the decommissioned AA in ORB needed some maintenance. They called in some of the best Junk Guild repairmen (and women). Yoon came along. After finished with the repairs, she saw some empty rooms that rarely used. She ask Kira & the gang, “It’s such a waste to let those rooms be. How ‘bout I make a pool for you?”, Kira being the only one with a Japanese name in the gang (amirite?) said, “Can you make an onsen instead?” and Yoon who wouldn’t back down from a challenge said “You got it, pal!”.

Let me guess: That chapter was released after this episode?

[Rising Dragon]

In defense of the Astray Out Frame, it's a civilian use mobile suit in the hands of a reporter who frequently is out on long excursions for his job. He can get away with having a bathtub installed in its backpack. Also note that a bathtub is far easier to put a storage casing on to prevent loss of water than it is for an onsen.

The Archangel is a military-use carrier-slash-warship and even owned by ORB should follow military regs. It is extremely unlikely that it'll have a replica onsen installed, "Whatever the hell they want" or not. The use of the onsen aboard the Archangel is remarkably good at breaking many viewers' suspension of disbelief so it's little wonder that people are upset about it, in the original run or the Remaster.

[monster]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Also note that a bathtub is far easier to put a storage casing on to prevent loss of water than it is for an onsen.

They could simply drain the water. The Archangel is a big ship and it has obviously been modified.

The use of the onsen aboard the Archangel is remarkably good at breaking many viewers' suspension of disbelief so it's little wonder that people are upset about it, in the original run or the Remaster.

That should've happened the moment a group of people could take a warship, operated by civilian crewmembers, without the Orb government knowing about it.

Compared to that, complaining about an onsen in a futuristic ship seems petty nitpicking. At the very least, they obviously have the technology to build and operate an onsen inside the Archangel.

[Skye629]

Originally Posted by cyberdemon

If you think about it, a submarine and a spaceship aren't that much different. The only difference is that one is in water and one is in space. Either way you can't just freely step outside either and for both spend anywhere from weeks or months without making port.

True, but thats considering its in space, in this instance the AA is on earth, and they had no intention of returning to space other than if war broke out or tensions increased to the point where they had to leave (as they were considering earlier in Destiny)


Another question of curiosity, if in space, wouldn't an Onsen be rendered useless since the water would well......float around?

[cyberdemon]

Originally Posted by Skye629

True, but thats considering its in space, in this instance the AA is on earth, and they had no intention of returning to space other than if war broke out or tensions increased to the point where they had to leave (as they were considering earlier in Destiny)


Another question of curiosity, if in space, wouldn't an Onsen be rendered useless since the water would well......float around?

artificial gravity. They were shown to be able to take showers while in space which seems even harder to do. They probably have artificial gravity installed in those rooms.

It's just meant to help them relax while they were stuck on the ship. especially if they were hiding like the did underwater for a long time since it would take time to do their investigations and make plans. The water is likely drained into a container as soon as they enter battle and put back after it is over. Even warships have ways to take the stress off of it's crew.

The crew of the AA knows how stressful it is since they were involved in pretty much non-stop battles since they first boarded the AA in Seed. They probably also thought their infamy would make them targets in the future. So they installed it to take off the stress between battles and make the AA more comfortable to live in if they were forced to go into hiding.

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

Originally Posted by monster

Let me guess: That chapter was released after this episode?

Maybe not.

Destiny Astray began serialization in November 2004, and that bathtub event happened in earlier chapters (chapter 3, to be exact). When each chapter was released monthly, that makes the "bathtub chapter" appeared in January 2005.

SEED Destiny began airing in October 2004 and the onsen event is featured in what, episode 24? That’s more or less 6 months after the initial airing. So, the "onsen episode" most likely appeared around February or March 2005.

So, the "bathtub-bathroom in a MS" actually precede the "onsen in a giant space-warship" .

[monster]

This episode originally aired in April of 2005. So, anyway, nice.

[Hagoshod]

Spoiler:

So this is a thing that happened on 4chumps today.

I think I'm gonna go back to uploading stupid Breaking Bad-related videos on my Youtube channel now.

[Kurohane]

First off, Atrhun wasn't screaming his head off at Durandal, but he did want an explanation for why he ordered the destruction of the Archangel and the Freedom. Then, Durandal used his silver tongue to give a believable explanation and actually gave hints to his destiny plan in that conversation. Also, Athrun didn't steal the GOUF until AFTER Durandal framed him.

[Hagoshod]

Yeah, Durandal sure is a shady silver-tongue manipulator, what with him giving a completely logical answer to Athrun's B-B-BUT THEY WERE MY F-F-FWIENDS whining and everything.

And prior to Athrun ASSUMING this was the end and ASSUMING the MPs were out to straight up kill him on sight, all we see are Durandal and Rey talking about how Athrun is becoming unreliable (which is a valid conclusion) and how the photos of the beach scene tragically fall in place to show he's been sympathetic to Kira's warmongering shenanigans the entire time (which, in hindsight, is also a valid conclusion). Where is Durandal doing any kind of framing or jumping on any kind of warped falsehood here?

The tone of the writing and the soundtrack (oh god the soundtrack) is trying REEEALLY hard to tell me Durandal is being sort kind of super-evil manipulative villain here, but all I see is a guy reacting in a relational way to one of his troops going nuts.

[S.Freedom]

Ok silly question here. But why would they even be discussing them before Athrun went "rogue" on them if they weren't planning on using them to justify what ever they did to Athrun?

After all they had access to the audio Luna provided. Which conveniently provides context to what the pictures show. Which of course they wouldn't release to make Athrun look as bad as they could.

[Hagoshod]

Originally Posted by S.Freedom

But why would they even be discussing them before Athrun went "rogue" on them

Why would they let Athrun's non-stop obsession with trying to justify the Archangel's terrorist attacks go completely unchecked?

You guys keep going back to this idea that Durandal was pulling strings to dig up shit long before Athrun started spitting in his face. You need to go back and watch episode 36.

[The American Average]

Originally Posted by Hagoshod

Spoiler:

funny thing about this picture is it started in a Gundam Age thread http://boards.4chan.org/m/res/9618050, so why can't Seed discussions stay in their own areas instead of running into other gundam discussions? it happens all the time.

and these discussions will never end sadly because people like to beat the dead horse when it comes to Seed/Destiny

[I Fail at Life]

Originally Posted by The American Average

funny thing about this picture is it started in a Gundam Age thread http://boards.4chan.org/m/res/9618050, so why can't Seed discussions stay in their own areas instead of running into other gundam discussions? it happens all the time.

and these discussions will never end sadly because people like to beat the dead horse when it comes to Seed/Destiny

Because they want to keep pushing this propaganda that Seed/Destiny is the vile of the universe, that you should dislike so and so character, and this said character ruins the show...even after a decade later.

Which just goes to show that the backbone of the franchise is also the worst part of it.

[S.Freedom]

Originally Posted by Hagoshod

Why would they let Athrun's non-stop obsession with trying to justify the Archangel's terrorist attacks go completely unchecked?

Yes because grieving over a friends death and seeking answers makes you an evil jerk or something.

And answer me this question. Who benefits more from the real Lacus being killed than Durandal who just happens to have an imposter waiting in the wings?

[Aquaman OS]

Since his opinion was supposedly why Durandal wanted him to sign up in the first place "Hey Athrun if you ever think I'm doing the wrong thing you should totally confront me on this." was what got him to agree to rejoin, why wouldn't Athrun think he could speak his mind? And yet when Athrun objected Durandal decided Athrun was thinking too much and needed to go.

And Durandal caps off his explaination by deliberately provoking Athrun to storm off by adding that Kira should have come running to serve him because "Lacus" supported him, so why didn't her friends from the last war. Which is a lie, and he knows Athrun knows its a lie, so that comment served no constructive purpose.

Plus the conversation between Durandal and Rey at no point suggests they aren't trying to frame him from what we see. Luna turned in a data disc and audio tape with those pictures so they know exactly what he was saying there (and it wasn't anything but supporting Durandal) and all they talk about is how he's no longer useful and he thinks too much and isn't happy fighting the guys he's told to fight. None of which suggests they actually believe he betrayed them to Kira.

And then Meer came in, who heard the entire conversation, and says Athrun didn't give Durandal the answer he wanted and he needed to go apologize for questioning him and start fawning over his new unit like Shinn was he was gonna be in trouble with Durandal. Again, if Durandal had been talking about how he really believed Athrun had betrayed them Meer would have said this, and just told him to run, not start sucking up to Durandal and apologizing for doubting him.

And then after Athrun was shot down, Durandal tells Shinn it's ok he did that because Athrun must have been a Logos spy (a lie. He knows AA isn't allied with Logos, especially since they were actively fighting them in Berlin), and he stole Operation Ragnarok data with Meyrin's help (another lie. Meyrin only hacked for a few seconds to start the alarm. They say nothing about any data, have no disc on them, and once Athrun is on AA he says nothing about Ragnarok to anyone which would have been the first thing out of his mouth if the reason he'd left was to deliver this data to AA).

Originally Posted by S.Freedom

And answer me this question. Who benefits more from the real Lacus being killed than Durandal who just happens to have an imposter waiting in the wings?

Best to also add that aside from a small group of people in Zaft helping Durandal with his Meer deception, and the people that actually have the real Lacus with them and Athrun, everyone else in the world, including Lord Djbril believes Meer is the real Lacus Clyne.

[Hagoshod]

Originally Posted by The American Average

funny thing about this picture is it started in a Gundam Age thread http://boards.4chan.org/m/res/9618050, so why can't Seed discussions stay in their own areas instead of running into other gundam discussions? it happens all the time.

Yeah, I actually made that thread.

Typical evolution of a Gundam SEED Destiny / Gundam AGE / Muv-Luv Alternative: Total Eclipse / Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade thread:

- I have an opinion
- Well I good sir have a differing opinion
- rabble rabble rabble
- u talkin shit bout mai waifu?
- Endless string of Legend of Galactic Heroes reaction images
- Someone makes a comment on how everyone has just been repeating the same argument for years
- Abicion threatens to post fan fiction
- Discussion spirals into completely unrelated political / ethical / moral speculative debate
- Thread gets bumped a couple more times by another guy posting random anime girl pictures
- Thread dies

Originally Posted by S.Freedom

And answer me this question. Who benefits more from the real Lacus being killed than Durandal who just happens to have an imposter waiting in the wings?

Here's the problem: Trying to use this fuzzy "Well they coincidentally gain the most out of it, so that must mean they plotted it all along and they're evil!" reasoning to identify your heroes from your villains is bad writing in any context. This is the ONLY thing GSD ever uses to get its point across, and it's not the slightest bit careful about it.

That said...

Who coincidentally benefits the most from sitting on a beach two years, hiding an illegal nuclear weapon in her basement, charging into battle attacking all sides so she can drive a tense situation further into warfare, and then going "See! See! This shows you're hopeless without me and you NEED me as Empress of the entire Earth Ephere!"? Who coincidentally gains the most out of their questionable choice of actions at the end of the actual series?

Congrats. Your own logic just turned Lacus into the supreme mastermind supervillain behind GSD. If circumstantial evidence is all we're using to distinguish right from wrong in this universe, then Durandal is comparably an okay dude. That shit works both ways, bro.