Little Busters - Episode 17 Discussion / Poll

[AC-Phoenix]

Poor psychopatic massacre (How did he make psychopatic massacre from Saigusa Haruka in the first place oO).
This time she got trolled pretty hard. It appears like Futaki's point is something like: 'Hey You are friends, with Haruka right? Or are you actually MY friends?'
very mean.

Originally Posted by MasterVampire

They dont need to agree to a DNA test

just get some hair or something without them knowing

Actually they have to, otherwise its a crime in most countries .

So depending on where you live secret DNA tests, when you are unsure if your child is really your kid, could could actually bring you in front of a court too.
On another note:
To get those famous 99.99 % results you need more than just the the children's and the father's DNA, you need the other parent's DNA too.
And no, neither wife nor husband can substitute permission for their DNA being used for a test for the other, they can however substitute the permission for their children. (in Germany, only the mother can, In Austria both parents can when they got shared child custody.This might not be up to date though; If something changed then most likely that everyone has to agree.) A court can however order a DNA test, then no more consent is needed.
Don't get me wrong, you can still determine it, but its a lot less accurate,

A reputabable institute would btw never use DNA material for a test without a person's signature.

Another problem is, which is probably tied to the above example, is that the DNA could be taken from anywhere if the person doesn't sign that the DNA used is theirs

[DmonHiro]

OH, FUCK! I just realized what Kud saw at the end of the episode. FUCK THAT FAMILY FOREVER!!!!!

[orpheus2]

Okay... Haruka and Kanata's family is really dysfunctional.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Dr. Casey's comment above left me puzzled, because I couldn't imagine more of last episode's Kanata coming across all that well. But yeah, Kanata is at least an entertaining antagonist now.

I have to admit that little acting performance and mischievous grin she put on at the end of the episode was one hell of a plot twist/cliffhanger. It certainly shocked me, and perked me up! It's good to know that Little Miss Fascist might actually not be a fascist after all, and may well be a much more interesting character once you get pass the public persona.

I like the idea of Kanata developing a crush on Riki, and trying to steal him away from Haruka. Although, I have to wonder if Kanata's acting performance says something a bit more fundamental about her character. I wonder if Kanata ironically envies Haruka, and wishes that she could live without the burdens of family responsibility as Haruka now appears to live. In other words, I wonder if Kanata wishes that she could be a fun-loving, easy-going member of the Little Busters like Haruka tends to be.


Mind you, at some level, that does seem a bit absurd to me. How could you envy a girl who went through the hell that Haruka did? Wow, the girl was viciously abused. This arc makes me wonder if there's even such a thing as child protection services in Japan. Not only that, but I hate it when one of the central conflicts in an anime narrative would have been solved by a simple DNA test. Does the Japanese culture have something against DNA tests?

It's more of the grass is greener on the other side. Essentially, Kanata wanted to be carefree like her sister but her family situation doesn't allow it.

More along the lines it is illegal to do so unless both parties are willing.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by orpheus2

It's more of the grass is greener on the other side. Essentially, Kanata wanted to be carefree like her sister but her family situation doesn't allow it.

That makes sense.


One added bit I wanted to mention here - I feel a bit badly for Kud in all of this. It was subtle, but I could tell how sad and conflicted Kud is feeling right now. Kanata is her roommate, after all, and Kanata agreed to that to help Kud out. And Kanata is nice enough to Kud. So having Kanata and Kud's LB! friends at each other's throats must be very depressing and alarming for Kud.

Actually, I kind of think that Riki should have verbally restrained himself a bit more simply out of respect for Kud and Kanata helping her out (saying "We all hate you" is rather harsh of course). That obviously doesn't justify how Kanata treats Haruka, but I don't like how everybody seems to be forgetting that this is Kud's roommate here.

[GDB]

Kanata: "Who do you think you are to be able to save someone?"
Riki: "Well, I have already saved Komari and Mio..."

Oh Riki, why can't you remember things?

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by GDB

Kanata: "Who do you think you are to be able to save someone?"
Riki: "Well, I have already saved Komari and Mio..."

Oh Riki, why can't you remember things?

Good point. Riki's response to that question was a bit facepalm-worthy to me.

It's good that the dude is humble, but seriously, he tremendously helped two different girls in a matter of weeks. It's not "arrogant" for him to think he could similarly help out Haruka. He's earned the right to say "Hey, I successfully helped out a couple people recently. So I have reason to hope that I can help out Haruka too."

[Benigmatica]

The only thing I could say is “Will the real Haruka Saigusa please stand up?”

And also, I feel that it's biologically and anatomically impossible to have a woman being impregnated by two different guys at the same time! No wonder their family is so screwed up!

[Kudryavka]

Originally Posted by Benigmatica

The only thing I could say is “Will the real Haruka Saigusa please stand up?”

And also, I feel that it's biologically and anatomically impossible to have a woman being impregnated by two different guys at the same time! No wonder their family is so screwed up!

Heteropaternal Superfecundation

[AC-Phoenix]

It would be interesting to know if anyone who has not read the manga/played the game already knows who is Futaki and who is Haruka atm.
One of them is obviously wearing contac lenses, and tbh I wouldn't be too sure the Haruka at the end of the episode is Futaki lol.

looking at it from an objective perspective - the smile and the question point really hard to her being Futaki, however the fact that the Chiffon cake tasted as it was supposed to is actually a contradiction.

"Haruka's" was dry
"Futaki's" was perfect

Haruka claimed that she is really good with dishes including eggs, such as chiffon cake - yet the cake was dry as hell.

So what if dry-cake Haruka was actually Futaki, while oasis-cake Haruka was really Haruka?
It is also a bit strange how "futaki" let the plate fall to the ground when Riki said 'yesterday'.

Maybe I'm just overthinking this though

[Haiprbim]

The episode was amazing, but I truly hope that the 3rd episode will end this arc, 4 episodes would be a bit much. :D

[Kanon]

I just knew they would have one of the twins impersonate the other at some point
Incidentally, since Haruka and Kanata have different fathers, shouldn't they look different? They're not real twins.

The episode was pretty good. They strongly hinted Kanata was in truth treated as harshly as Haruka. Their shared hardships should have brought them closer (and I expect this is what will happen soon), but it's sadly the opposite that happened.

[Haiprbim]

Originally Posted by Kanon

Incidentally, since Haruka and Kanata have different fathers, shouldn't they look different? They're not real twins.

For some unknown funny reason, in almost all the Animes, a daughter gets almost all the looks from her mother. :D
Since the mother is the same, the case is the same ^.^

[Kudryavka]

Originally Posted by Kanon

I just knew they would have one of the twins impersonate the other at some point
Incidentally, since Haruka and Kanata have different fathers, shouldn't they look different? They're not real twins.

That's what I've been thinking recently as well. Half siblings usually look a little more different than eye color and voice. I think that either the family lied from the beginning about them having different dads to prevent the chance they were both children of the convict dad, or more likely, the artist and writer did not collaborate very well.

In my opinion the girls could have stood to look a little more different. It would have made the surprise much more of a surprise (I knew they were linked somehow all along since they had the exact same hair and the same hair ball ornaments).

And no, despite having different fathers, they are still considered twins because they developed at the same time in their mother's womb. Again, heteropaternal superfecundation.

[kitten320]

As suspected Kanata has nothing to do with flyers and is against it.

Going by her conversation with Riki it looks like her life was just as bad as Haruka's. Everyone are thinking that she had it easy since she was accepted by her family, but is it really the case? That slap clearly shows that she is being abused just as much as Haruka if not more.

The only difference is that Haruka openly shows and tells her problems while Kanata keeps everything inside under cool facade.
Haruka might be abused but she has freedom to do whatever she wants while Kanata has to follow strict rules. It would be even harsher on her if murderer happens to be her real father because then she would have to work twice harder to keep the status. I really wouldn't be surprised if she sometimes would pretend to be Haruka to have some fun and freedom.

I might be over thinking but Kanata does care for Haruka in her own way. Riki noticed it and it wouldn't make much sense for her to keep that hair gum otherwise. So I'm wondering if she sometimes took Haruka's place and took the bashing. Though I do admit that I might be giving her a bit too much credit with last statement.

I still can't completely understand what Kurd saw... possible bruises since Kanata always wears long sleeves while in that shot there are none so...

This is my take on her.

[Haak]

I thought Kud was just feeling awkward. I never suspected she might have seen things on Kanata's body, but it might put things into a bit more perspective.

The narrative and execution was still a bit wonky but this has been a very good episode, in the same league as Mio's final episode.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Kanon

The episode was pretty good. They strongly hinted Kanata was in truth treated as harshly as Haruka.

"As harshly as" might be stretching it a bit. It's clear that Kanata isn't spared corporeal punishment, but she might not have had as hard as Haruka did.

Their shared hardships should have brought them closer (and I expect this is what will happen soon), but it's sadly the opposite that happened.

Haruka herself made it sound like Kanata faced hardship/punishment for failing to keep Haruka in line. Honestly, I think this episode did a decent job explaining why Kanata and Haruka don't like each other very much.


in Haruka's eyes, Kanata is the sister who had everything go right for her. Kanata received praise and inheritance for being "the good daughter", and that obviously will breed jealousy and animosity in Haruka's heart.

In Kanata's eyes, Haruka's misbehaving is causing Kanata serious problems with her family. If Haruka would stop acting like a delinquent, Kanata would be spared a lot of the punishment she's received.

It's not hard to see why Kanata has a Zero Sum view of the world. Kanata's being "the chosen daughter" brings Haruka grief. Haruka's fun-loving mild delinquency is bringing Kanata a harder time with her family.

This is a job for Komari's Happiness Spiral!

[Haak]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

In Kanata's eyes, Haruka's misbehaving is causing Kanata serious problems with her family. If Haruka would stop acting like a delinquent, Kanata would be spared a lot of the punishment she's received.

It's possible that Kanata genuinely felt sympathy for Haruka but Haruka vented her frustration on Kanata which Kanata felt she didn't deserve because she was against the family's traditions too, so she eventually responded in turn and thus began a cycle of attrition.

This is purely speculation though...

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by kitten320

As suspected Kanata has nothing to do with flyers and is against it.

Going by her conversation with Riki it looks like her life was just as bad as Haruka's. Everyone are thinking that she had it easy since she was accepted by her family, but is it really the case? That slap clearly shows that she is being abused just as much as Haruka if not more.

Wow. So one slap proves mistreatment on par with (or even greater than!) several years of severe physical and verbal abuse.

Nobody is saying that Kanata had it easy, but don't you think it's a bit presumptive to assume that Kanata was abused exactly as much as Haruka was?

Haruka might be abused but she has freedom to do whatever she wants while Kanata has to follow strict rules.

Might be abused?! What is with the "might" part? It's very clear that Haruka was severely abused. There's no "might" about it.

Why are people on this thread now trying to downplay the abuse Haruka received and/or exaggerate the abuse Kanata received?

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Kudryavka

That's what I've been thinking recently as well. Half siblings usually look a little more different than eye color and voice. I think that either the family lied from the beginning about them having different dads to prevent the chance they were both children of the convict dad, or more likely, the artist and writer did not collaborate very well.

In my opinion the girls could have stood to look a little more different. It would have made the surprise much more of a surprise (I knew they were linked somehow all along since they had the exact same hair and the same hair ball ornaments).

And no, despite having different fathers, they are still considered twins because they developed at the same time in their mother's womb. Again, heteropaternal superfecundation.

The resemblance might actually an actual plot point. I'm starting to think Shou is the father of both girls and that the heteropaternal superfecundation is lie the family came up with so that they could have at least one "proper" heiress.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

"As harshly as" might be stretching it a bit. It's clear that Kanata isn't spared corporeal punishment, but she might not have had as hard as Haruka did.

It's impossible to know for sure at this point, but I have a feeling her treatment, while better in appearance, was actually just as bad as Haruka. What Kud saw which shocked her so much was probably Kanata's scarred/bruised body. She might even be the figure we see in the OP.

[Kudryavka]

Originally Posted by Kanon

The resemblance might actually an actual plot point.

It might be, maybe it's a visual cue to the audience on purpose? We will see next week.