[MANGA] Bleach Chapter 326 Discussion

[Amirali]

Originally Posted by neuromancer

And Yumichika is no better, since he admited he would not have used his shikai if it was visible to others. As far as I'm concerned Kubo ruined these two characters. In my view they might as well join Aizen since, at this point, they are both equal to scum.

Or it could just be that even Yamachika and Ikkaku know their fights are pointless, because the captains can intercede if they're losing.

I'll give Yamachika the benefit of the doubt myself. He did tell Charlotte he wouldn't have used shikai openly, but he might simply have been posturing. It's easy to make cool statements about your ideals after kicking the enemy's ass. When he was really desperate, he didn't hesitate to go shikai against Hisagi, even though he had no guarantee Hisagi wouldn't spread the word.

[Mr. DJ]

::shrugs:: some people would rather stand by their pride as foolish as it may be *points to a certain Saiyan Prince*

[Formely_anon]

Originally Posted by neuromancer

*snip*

Sorry about the rant... just not pleased with what Kubo is doing atm.

Your arguement doesn't hold water. You said that Ikkaku was too much like Kenpachi.Too much like Kenpachi doesn't exist. I will never believe it.

Anyway there is a precedent for Ikkaku being too eager to throw away his life isn't there?

[Amirali]

True, that's exactly what Kenpachi told him after he beat him. Ikkaku is probably crazier than Zaraki in that sense.

[Casshern]

Originally Posted by Amirali

Or it could just be that even Yamachika and Ikkaku know their fights are pointless, because the captains can intercede if they're losing.
...

I don't see how they can have the liberty to take risks with the pillars. Tetsuzaemon rebuilt it in the nick of time. Ikkaku had only just been defeated and the real Karakura was already reappearing. What if they hadn't made it in time? I expect that the real Karakura will appear almost inevitably in the course of the story, but Ikkakus's actions still aren't in line with his comrades.

Also, just because he has back-up, how does it justify Ikkaku not fighting to win? If he's not fighting to win why is he there in the first place?

Originally Posted by Formely_anon

Your arguement doesn't hold water. You said that Ikkaku was too much like Kenpachi.Too much like Kenpachi doesn't exist. I will never believe it.

Anyway there is a precedent for Ikkaku being too eager to throw away his life isn't there?

It's like Amirali just said Ikkaku is probably crazier than Zaraki in that sense. What I said was that in trying to follow Zaraki's path Ikkaku's become a misguided fool. Do you really think there is any excuse not to fight at full strength against Po?

And what is the precedent for Ikkaku to throw his life away? Zaraki told him to live on and keep fighting. How does he keep fighting if he just lets Po kill him? Also, if he really does have a precedent to throw his life away, why does he choose to do it at Gotei13's most crucial battle where there are others depending on him? If he wants to die he should die by himself, not risk another million.

[Langus]

Perhaps he's deluded himself into thinking that if he dies in battle against Aizen it will be a glorious death and he will become a hero (regardless of the circumstances).

Most times after a war, the dead are remembered as heroes, even if they died in less than glorious, selfish, cowardly or otherwise ignoble ways.

Just a thought, but maybe with characters like Ikkaku Kubo is trying to draw parallels to Japan's Kamikaze pilots during the Second World War... Or maybe I'm just too much of a history nerd *shrug*

[TeNMaN]

Man, people get way too worked up over this stuff. In my mind, KT can't win no matter what he does. If Ikkaku easily wins this fight, people would be still whining about how weak the fraccion's are and how pointless these battles are. Instead, he goes in a different direction and has the strongest of the 4 guardians lose to make it interesting (even if Ikkaku was sandbagging - but hey that is his personality and everyone should know that). Obviously, KT needed to give some love to some other characters we haven't seen that much so it works out better anyway. Maybe we get to see some cool action from Koma and Iba now since we don't know much about them either. We've already seen a lot from Ikkaku so I don't understand why this is such a bad thing. This isn't real life or death - it's just a manga with a bunch of crazy characters!! Props to KT for at least shaking it up a little bit!

[Casshern]

Originally Posted by TeNMaN

Man, people get way too worked up over this stuff. In my mind, KT can't win no matter what he does. If Ikkaku easily wins this fight, people would be still whining about how weak the fraccion's are and how pointless these battles are. Instead, he goes in a different direction and has the strongest of the 4 guardians lose to make it interesting (even if Ikkaku was sandbagging - but hey that is his personality and everyone should know that). Obviously, KT needed to give some love to some other characters we haven't seen that much so it works out better anyway. Maybe we get to see some cool action from Koma and Iba now since we don't know much about them either. We've already seen a lot from Ikkaku so I don't understand why this is such a bad thing. This isn't real life or death - it's just a manga with a bunch of crazy characters!! Props to KT for at least shaking it up a little bit!

These fights are pointless because Kubo, for some reason, is just delaying! Genryusai pulls an unbreakable cage out of his ass with zero effort, which imprisons even Aizen for... as long as Kubo wants to delay the real action. We have the real Karakura replaced with a fake Karakura, when it's almost certain the real Karakura will have to appear for the Vaizards to take the stage. The only thing missing is Don Kanoji to convince even the most devout readers that what we're reading is the equivalent of filler.

And while it's irritating to read these devoid-of-content chapters, Ikkaku's fight was exceptionally bad. If he used bankai and lost, ok I'd be a bit dissapointed, but if the opponent is that strong then he is simply that strong. But happens instead? Ikkaku finds it disgraceful to use bankai on a "worthless" opponent, but being killed by said "worthless" opponent is OK! Go figure...

It seems to me, Kubo doesn't want one of his good characters to lose at full power, he doesn't want to rinse/repeat the previous fraccion fights, he doesn't want to repeat the Edorad fight, he does want to delay even longer and he still wants Ikkaku to look cool. The result is that he just made Ikkaku look bad.

[BleachOD]

I don't think Aizen is trapped. I think that's an illusion. I don't think Aizen is there at all.

Just my two cents...

[Ryuuken]

Originally Posted by neuromancer

...including 1 million lives... gotcha. One million lives are a good trade-off for a single decent fight. That makes perfect sense.

Exactly, I mean I don't criticize KT, I only say that Ikkaku isn't worth anything anymore.
The duty of a soldier on a battlefield is to fullfill the mission objectives, even if it means dying in the process.

Originally Posted by BleachOD

I don't think Aizen is trapped. I think that's an illusion. I don't think Aizen is there at all.

Nope, that's impossible. Aizens powers are not that unreal.
Remember he has to release Kyouka Suigetsu in front of the victims, and they have to look.
This was proven by the fact that Tousen remains unaffected and that Aizen had to invite all Gotei 13 to show his Zanpaktous ability before Bleach even started, as Kotetsu Isane stated.

Since the event on Soukyoku Hill, there is an end of hypnotism as the manga title also said =D

[BleachOD]

Originally Posted by The Small One

You seem to miss the point: He has to release it in front of them only once, and afterwards they are caught in his illusions whenever he wants them to.

Thanks for that. You saved me the trouble of saying just that.

@ Papa-Ishida. (Ryukken) Who says that he didn't release immediately before Yamaji trapped him? Do you really think Aizen is that stupid?!

P.S. People explaining how the weapons work is a pet peeve of mine I understand it just fine. In fact I often do the explaining. Please don't do it unless you know what you are talking about. Thanks!

[Formely_anon]

Originally Posted by neuromancer

How does he keep fighting if he just lets Po kill him?

If you want to feel better then how about this? Ikkaku could not go Bankai because he was just too beat up. He was very cocky and underestimated his opponent, who beat him so bad he couldn't go bankai.

Makes some sense.

[Ryuuken]

Originally Posted by The Small One

You seem to miss the point: He has to release it in front of them only once, and afterwards they are caught in his illusions whenever he wants them to.

until he stops it, which he did in front of Unohana and Isane.

Originally Posted by BleachOD

Thanks for that. You saved me the trouble of saying just that.

@ Papa-Ishida. (Ryukken) Who says that he didn't release immediately before Yamaji trapped him? Do you really think Aizen is that stupid?!

Ain't go nothing to do with stupidness.
He is confident about his Espada, so...

Originally Posted by BleachOD

P.S. People explaining how the weapons work is a pet peeve of mine I understand it just fine. In fact I often do the explaining. Please don't do it unless you know what you are talking about. Thanks!

My bad, Mr. OD Sir...


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Aizen wouldn't do something like that. You may even consider that he broke down Kyouka Suigetsu in front of Unohana, but it was infact also an Illusion, but just doesn't have to do something like that.

The fact that negacion rescued him when Yoruichi and Soifon got him, pretty much proves that he hadn't and couldn't release.

[MAQI]

Originally Posted by Ryuuken

My bad, Mr. OD Sir...

Actually it Miss/Mrs. (I forgot which one for the moment) OD Mam
---

Originally Posted by Ryuuken

Aizen wouldn't do something like that. You may even consider that he broke down Kyouka Suigetsu in front of Unohana, but it was infact also an Illusion, but just doesn't have to do something like that.

The fact that negacion rescued him when Yoruichi and Soifon got him, pretty much proves that he hadn't and couldn't release.

I think we should let KT do the explaining of "how a wepon works" because he seems to change stuff all the time so we never are 100% on anything in bleach. And I just have to say one thing about this last chapter, I USED to be a big Ikkaku fan, now... not so much. He is too chicken shit to show his bankai because then people would make him be a captain (he thinks) and he couldn't hide under Zaraki's warm comfortable skirt anymore... sheesh talk about fear of achivement... sometimes KT pisses me off like no one else... I mean come on, Ikkaku got beat by Zaraki like 50 years ago and now that he has power, he doesn't want to fight him again??? I thought thats what Ikkaku was all about. Someone spare me and have him fu@%ing killed or something.

@ OD can you tell how pissed I am about the way this manga is panning out? Anyway sorry for ranting its good to be back. Kind of.

[Ryuuken]

Originally Posted by MAQI

Actually it Miss/Mrs. (I forgot which one for the moment) OD Mam

Oh really ? No wonder... =D

[Mr. DJ]

Originally Posted by MAQI

Actually it Miss/Mrs. (I forgot which one for the moment) OD Mam
---



I think we should let KT do the explaining of "how a wepon works" because he seems to change stuff all the time so we never are 100% on anything in bleach. And I just have to say one thing about this last chapter, I USED to be a big Ikkaku fan, now... not so much. He is too chicken shit to show his bankai because then people would make him be a captain (he thinks) and he couldn't hide under Zaraki's warm comfortable skirt anymore... sheesh talk about fear of achivement... sometimes KT pisses me off like no one else... I mean come on, Ikkaku got beat by Zaraki like 50 years ago and now that he has power, he doesn't want to fight him again??? I thought thats what Ikkaku was all about. Someone spare me and have him fu@%ing killed or something.

believe it's a Miss OD atm ;P I remember a post specifically pertaining to her boyfriend :3

Also...about Ikkaku, didn't he say he wanted to kill Kenpachi himself one day? I can see reasoning for him not releasing his bankai if that was the case, he may feel he's not strong enough to even stand up to him, considering w/ his bankai he was only able to defeat that one Arrancar named Edorad, albeit barely while Kenpachi goes on to defeat Espada #5, Nnoitora. The reasoning is still kinda dumb...because it sounds like he'd rather die than be forced to fight Kenpachi when he's no where near ready.

bah self defeating reasoning...

[Photonbeam]

I think he said he wanted to serve under Kenpachi for the rest of his life and not kill him.

[Konpachi]

Originally Posted by Amirali

On an another topic , it was rather odd seeing all the captains so surprised at a loss of Ikkaku, a mere number 3. Add in that it was irregular for a number 3 to be part of the elite VC ighting squad to begin with.

Ikkaku's number 3 cos Yachiru's lieu. Im quite sure they all know Ikkaku is at the very least lieu lvl, also he is in the COMBAT div, that presumably puts his battle lvl slighty above the average lieu alrdy.

Originally Posted by Ryuuken

until he stops it, which he did in front of Unohana and Isane.

... explaining his plan and stopping it are two VERY different things. They are STILL under his hypnosis, even though they are aware of it. Aizen says it still works even if his victims know that they are hypnotize himself.

Originally Posted by Ryuuken

My bad, Mr. OD Sir...

I believe its a Mrs.

Originally Posted by DjTrizz

believe it's a Miss OD atm ;P I remember a post specifically pertaining to her boyfriend :3

Also...about Ikkaku, didn't he say he wanted to kill Kenpachi himself one day? I can see reasoning for him not releasing his bankai if that was the case, he may feel he's not strong enough to even stand up to him, considering w/ his bankai he was only able to defeat that one Arrancar named Edorad, albeit barely while Kenpachi goes on to defeat Espada #5, Nnoitora. The reasoning is still kinda dumb...because it sounds like he'd rather die than be forced to fight Kenpachi when he's no where near ready.

bah self defeating reasoning...

I thought she has a Chibi OD running around alrdy? (juz realized she's banned again, lol)

Ikkaku doesnt want to kill Zaraki himself, but rather he wants to DIE UNDER Zaraki's command. releasing Bankai would get him promoted therefore destroying his goal.

[MidnightViper88]

Showing off bankai won't automatically make Ikkaku a Captain; Ikkaku's just afraid that all the important people of the Soul Society might try to convince Ikkaku to push for Captain, since the Soul Society is open 3 Captain spots and in need of some strong people to fill those voids...Ikkaku would still have to demonstrate his powers and be approved by the other Captains or the members of the division Ikkaku would be Captain of...

In either case, Ikkaku could still easily back down; His desire to serve under Kenpachi is no different than Renji's persistence to serve under Byakuya in order to surpass him...I don't see anyone pushing Renji for Captain and he's still a VC with bankai; Ikkaku's just more uncomfortable with the peer pressure than Renji is, and seeing how Ikkaku follows closely in Kenpachi's footsteps, people might see him with a certain kind of potential...

[Ryuuken]

aside that,
I think Hisagi will definitely become captain and replace Tousen.
but I think, other than the method kenpachi used (killing the former captain), you have to have bankai. so it may take some time

same story maybe with Kira