Da Capo Second Season

[AvatarST]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

Spoiler:

Actually, you're right (although it was somewhat by accident, since they were looking for Aisia not Nemu). But that she would do it twice - once before the tree's power had fully taken over, and then again after - is probably even more of a resolution for her character, in that sense. I guess the point I was trying to make is that, unlike the beginning and middle of the show where she couldn't support Nemu head-on (awkward scene in the medical room, awkward "I love Asakura-kun" at the beach, etc.), by the end, she had moved past that and was actually helping bring them together. That's why it was her and not "Random other girl who loved Junichi", and that's why I call it progress for her character in the show. By the time Aisia's plan was enacted, Kotori had already found the strength to move on and do the right thing (as opposed to just "not doing the wrong thing", if that makes sense.)

Spoiler:

I'm not saying she was completely unimportant either. I do agree that she was the main girl of the harem, and I said that before a few times. I just think that her purpose in the show was not very different from the rest of the girls in the harem, in terms of how delivered the message, and herself he didn't really have much character development either, which is why I find her to be underutilized having such a prominent role in the promo art and everything else, since if there was anything who should've been all over the place there, it should've been Aisha and Aisha alone (since they couldn't put Nemu and Jyunichi together).

It does make me wonder why they had Nemu leave though. I guess it was necessary for the other girls to harbour unrequited love but I wonder if they could've gone around that in some other way? It'd have probably made her look better, at least in my eyes, if she'd stayed.

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by AvatarST

Spoiler:

I'm not saying she was completely unimportant either. I do agree that she was the main girl of the harem, and I said that before a few times. I just think that her purpose in the show was not very different from the rest of the girls in the harem, in terms of how delivered the message, and herself he didn't really have much character development either, which is why I find her to be underutilized having such a prominent role in the promo art and everything else, since if there was anything who should've been all over the place there, it should've been Aisha and Aisha alone (since they couldn't put Nemu and Jyunichi together).

Spoiler:

Well, obviously, you're not going to promo a sequel by highlighting only the new girl - that'd never work. That doesn't mean that they were "misleading" though... Even if you call her "the main girl of the harem", that still makes her the second most important character in the show next to Aisia, considering that the Nemu x Junichi thing needed to be kept a "question mark" at first. Plus, because of the way Kotori and Aisia's stories complimented each other, I personally thought it made sense. But, I mean, really, it's just promo art.

I guess it comes down to the fact that I can't say "I would have enjoyed this show a lot more if it had a different premise". I tend to judge a show based on whether it lives up to the premise it established for itself, and I thought this show did. And I guess the fact that I enjoyed the journey means that I don't really have any regrets about it or reasons to question it. When I start playing the "what if" game, I always come up with more problems than solutions, and I always come to the conclusion that "that's what the games were for". So, maybe that's just me - who knows.

Originally Posted by AvatarST

Spoiler:

It does make me wonder why they had Nemu leave though. I guess it was necessary for the other girls to harbour unrequited love but I wonder if they could've gone around that in some other way? It'd have probably made her look better, at least in my eyes, if she'd stayed.

Spoiler:

Well, probably to bring it in sync with the game and manga, would be my guess. If the sequel was going to be set two years into the future, you had to have some way of putting the relationship on "pause" for those two years. And, I imagine they figured they couldn't easily bring all the P.S. characters into the plot if they just started Second Season at "the next day" - otherwise, everyone would say "where did they all come from?" So, the two year gap gives them some leverage, puts the main relationship on pause so it can be continued in the show, and also has the added benefit of creating this odd situation that Aisia can misunderstand. So, I guess there probably were a bunch of different ways they could have done a continuation, but this method seems to have a bunch of pluses, at least.

[AvatarST]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

Spoiler:

Well, obviously, you're not going to promo a sequel by highlighting only the new girl - that'd never work. That doesn't mean that they were "misleading" though... Even if you call her "the main girl of the harem", that still makes her the second most important character in the show next to Aisia, considering that the Nemu x Junichi thing needed to be kept a "question mark" at first. Plus, because of the way Kotori and Aisia's stories complimented each other, I personally thought it made sense. But, I mean, really, it's just promo art.

I guess it comes down to the fact that I can't say "I would have enjoyed this show a lot more if it had a different premise". I tend to judge a show based on whether it lives up to the premise it established for itself, and I thought this show did. And I guess the fact that I enjoyed the journey means that I don't really have any regrets about it or reasons to question it. When I start playing the "what if" game, I always come up with more problems than solutions, and I always come to the conclusion that "that's what the games were for". So, maybe that's just me - who knows.

Spoiler:

Yeah, second most important next to Aisha, disregarding NemuxJyunichi and maybe Sakura, I agree. But overall, not as big a role as any of those 4 (except possibly Sakura), and by a fair bit if you ask me. And it might be just promo art (also the OP and what the director of Circus said, not to mention the first 5 episodes where Kotori did look a bigger character than the other girls), but it certainly raised my expectations a lot. I'm not saying that they intentionally tried to mislead people either, just that it might've been a mistake, since I really don't consider Kotori to be as important as the true main characters of the story - but of course that's just from my POV.

I think I'd have had no pre-fabricated expectations on this and enjoyed the show for what it was if it wasn't for the fact that this is, after all, a sequel. On DC first season, I already knew that Nemu and Jyunichi were going to end up together since the very beginning, but the whole story was new to me, so even if IMO the writing wasn't as good as in this season, and they could've done a lot more with the time they had, it was just more fun. This season, however, I really wanted to see something more than another JyunichixNemu love story, and DCSS failed to fulfill my expectations in regard to that. That's why I say that I didn't enjoy this as much as I could have more because of what the story was about rather than how it was done. It doesn't help that I've played the games either, and since the first season was already all about JyunichixNemu, I thought we'd see more of everyone else now, especially because this was also a new story and not a conversion from any of the games (though it was related to the manga which I haven't read, but new to me anyway because of that reason). Ah well...

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

Spoiler:

Well, probably to bring it in sync with the game and manga, would be my guess. If the sequel was going to be set two years into the future, you had to have some way of putting the relationship on "pause" for those two years. And, I imagine they figured they couldn't easily bring all the P.S. characters into the plot if they just started Second Season at "the next day" - otherwise, everyone would say "where did they all come from?" So, the two year gap gives them some leverage, puts the main relationship on pause so it can be continued in the show, and also has the added benefit of creating this odd situation that Aisia can misunderstand. So, I guess there probably were a bunch of different ways they could have done a continuation, but this method seems to have a bunch of pluses, at least.

Spoiler:

Yeah, I guess that's a good point. It was the best thing to do. I do think that they could've made Nemu look nicer in her return though...I mean, she's nowhere near my favourite in the game, but the anime does make her look bad compared to the game. Just take a look at for example Kotori's route, or what she does in the end in Sakura's.

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by AvatarST

Spoiler:

I think I'd have had no pre-fabricated expectations on this and enjoyed the show for what it was if it wasn't for the fact that this is, after all, a sequel. On DC first season, I already knew that Nemu and Jyunichi were going to end up together since the very beginning, but the whole story was new to me, so even if IMO the writing wasn't as good as in this season, and they could've done a lot more with the time they had, it was just more fun. This season, however, I really wanted to see something more than another JyunichixNemu love story, and DCSS failed to fulfill my expectations in regard to that. That's why I say that I didn't enjoy this as much as I could have more because of what the story was about rather than how it was done. It doesn't help that I've played the games either, and since the first season was already all about JyunichixNemu, I thought we'd see more of everyone else now, especially because this was also a new story and not a conversion from any of the games (though it was related to the manga which I haven't read, but new to me anyway because of that reason). Ah well...

Spoiler:

Yeah, well, I guess that's really what it comes down to in the end - you didn't want to see more Nemu x Junichi, and I guess I didn't mind it. When I think about it, it's certainly not that I would have minded an entirely Kotori-driven story either, but I didn't want it so badly that it became an expectation. There are many different kinds of "sequels", I guess, but this was more like a continuation. Really, S.S. episode 1 could have easily been called "episode 27", and so on. Would it have been as bad if they hadn't waited two years to show it? Who knows... (Incidentally, it occurred to me now that that's probably the most obvious reason for the two year gap - because it's been two years since the first season aired...)

Originally Posted by AvatarST

Spoiler:

I do think that they could've made Nemu look nicer in her return though...I mean, she's nowhere near my favourite in the game, but the anime does make her look bad compared to the game. Just take a look at for example Kotori's route, or what she does in the end in Sakura's.

Spoiler:

Well, I guess that's true. I don't remember if it was before or after the forum reset, but I remember us discussing once about how they expressly made "liking Nemu" not the point. I think this was to make Aisia's argument come out more strongly and really build the jealousy that fueled her wish to the tree. It probably also made you sympathize with Kotori more, since Kotori's a more "likable person", all around, than Nemu is. But yeah, that's part of the point, I think. It didn't matter whether Nemu was the best choice anymore or not - their already-established love survived the test of time apart, and that was that. Sort of cruel, really, but yeah... that's the point too. Not really a "happy end" for everyone else, except in the sense that they can now fully move on. Life's like that.

[Searcher]

From relentlessflame
It's easy to say "everything's a life experience that you can learn from", but try living some of those life experiences

I have, my parents are also divorced. But unlike you (it seems), i am not a only child.
I have 3 brothers and 1 sister besides me, so we could share the pain between us.
To make matters worse my brother, who i am very close with, his marriage failed a few years ago.

But, it's so easy to say "just move on" until you actually try to do it, or until you live surrounded by people who won't or can't

I know it's sounds "easy" to say it. But I have to believe in moving on, otherwise mine brother, whose marriage failed would have just stopped moving on.
If that happend to him, i also would have stopped moving on. Wondering why it happend to him.
And i don't have the luxery to do that, i am the responsible brother, the one who the rest of mine broters and sister look for advice, strength or hope.
Having been voted by my sister as the dearest broter for life, doesn't help in reducing mine responsibility.
So I have to be strong for every one else, never show weakness. Suffer in silence.
If mine brothers and sister can move on, then i am happy.
That's why i have to believe in moving on, never stopping. Learning from every experience so that i will see the signs before something worse happens.

the experience is never fun or positive

Bad experience is never fun or easy to handle. But just like you can learn from good experience, so can you do it from bad ones. I hurts like hell, but i must.
That's why i haven't watched haremseries for quite some time, don't like it that someone got hurt.
And it got complicated when watching DCSS with my favourite girl suffering all the time and not moving on. I got too fanatical.

I do think that we are going WAY of the topic.
All i asked was, why don't people want to believe in a couple that would break up, i am not talking about what happend to them in the last show.
Just having them break up, i know it sound romantic believing in eternal love.
But life isn't that simple, bad things happen why not in anime. Doesn't mean i wanna see some really bad things, just for instance a simple break up.

Ps. if you and avatarST keep on talking, this tread will always be open

[AvatarST]

Ehh, you, furudanuki and a couple of other people with the ocassional post like Xellos also give this thread life, it's not just us, heh.

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

Spoiler:

Well, I guess that's true. I don't remember if it was before or after the forum reset, but I remember us discussing once about how they expressly made "liking Nemu" not the point. I think this was to make Aisia's argument come out more strongly and really build the jealousy that fueled her wish to the tree. It probably also made you sympathize with Kotori more, since Kotori's a more "likable person", all around, than Nemu is. But yeah, that's part of the point, I think. It didn't matter whether Nemu was the best choice anymore or not - their already-established love survived the test of time apart, and that was that. Sort of cruel, really, but yeah... that's the point too. Not really a "happy end" for everyone else, except in the sense that they can now fully move on. Life's like that.

Spoiler:

Pretty sure it was after. And yeah, they love each other - they should be together. They did kinda make Nemu worse than in the game though...I never really understood why. In the game, her leave is justified for example. Here, they never tell the public the real reason behind Nemu's leave. It makes her look far more selfish than in the game; in the game it was just badly timed IMO, probably selfish of her to do that as well at that moment, but the anime doesn't talk about her real motivation behind leaving, so it's less understandable. And that's just an example...I don't think that the anime did enough justice to her character. Yes, I'm actually defending Nemu here - who'd have thought we'd see this.

Anyway, I don't really see it as a sad ending either, since it does look like the girls moved on, and while that's not easy to do, once you do it, you can just look back at what happened and it's a life experience or memories. You've become stronger and now you're ready to look towards the future, so I think it's not a bad ending really. I am however worried about Kotori's fate till I find out about it - I really do think that the whole making her pitiful and miserable is something that they do to make us love her more (and it works, though look at Kotori's routes, she's just as lovely there AND happy ), and I'm afraid they might pull it off again. Hopefully not.

If not there's always the games I guess, but considering that there's a DCII, and if things go that way, that'd mean Kotori had a bad ending in canon, and that can't really change even if you choose Nanaka or whatever. >.>

[relentlessflame]

Well, Searcher, sounds like we have more in common than I thought based on your comments. (I do have two sisters by the way; I'm the oldest.) I do know that moving on and seeing things as a life experience is what you have to do, of course. Obviously, learning lessons from it is what I'm always trying to do.

Spoiler:

But I guess I did relate a lot more with the way Kotori actually was presented in the show, because it reminds me an awful lot of myself. Seeing her struggling to move on rung true with me because of my life experiences, which is why her taking action in the end meant a lot to me. I guess it's probably just a matter of personality types, or something. Not seeing her moving on and finding a new love didn't upset me - seeing how she struggled through it was what I loved about the way she was portrayed in D.C.S.S. It just felt more real to me, personally. Obviously, everyone's different, though.

Originally Posted by AvatarST

Spoiler:

I am however worried about Kotori's fate till I find out about it - I really do think that the whole making her pitiful and miserable is something that they do to make us love her more (and it works, though look at Kotori's routes, she's just as lovely there AND happy ), and I'm afraid they might pull it off again. Hopefully not.

If not there's always the games I guess, but considering that there's a DCII, and if things go that way, that'd mean Kotori had a bad ending in canon, and that can't really change even if you choose Nanaka or whatever. >.>

Spoiler:

Well, I guess we'll have to wait and see, obviously. I'm not sure if the manga is technically considered "canon", but it is still running at least. The funny thing is, with Nanaka being adopted, there's really no way to trace back lineage. Kotori's grandchild might actually be any of the other girls, as Kotori would have taken her husband's last name. The only thing we can say with relative certainty is that the two Asakura girls are Nemu & Junichi's grandchildren. I am curious to see how much connection there will be between the two timelines, if any. Only a while left to wait...

And, well, I do feel like we're monopolizing the thread, but... nobody else is talking, so...

[AvatarST]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

Spoiler:

Well, I guess we'll have to wait and see, obviously. I'm not sure if the manga is technically considered "canon", but it is still running at least. The funny thing is, with Nanaka being adopted, there's really no way to trace back lineage. Kotori's grandchild might actually be any of the other girls, as Kotori would have taken her husband's last name. The only thing we can say with relative certainty is that the two Asakura girls are Nemu & Junichi's grandchildren. I am curious to see how much connection there will be between the two timelines, if any. Only a while left to wait...

And, well, I do feel like we're monopolizing the thread, but... nobody else is talking, so...

Spoiler:

Nanaka adopted? Wha? That's not confirmed yet, is it? >.> Both ways, she looks too much like Kotori not to be related to her. And maybe the "having the same last name as the grandmother" is something we're not supposed to give a lot of thought to, and just accept that that's the way to show that those are the girl's descendants.

And what's going on in the manga currently? I didn't read it, and don't know where or how to find it either...can't buy it over here in Argentina...so tell me a thing or two about the current events if you don't mind.

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by AvatarST

Spoiler:

Nanaka adopted? Wha? That's not confirmed yet, is it? >.> Both ways, she looks too much like Kotori not to be related to her. And maybe the "having the same last name as the grandmother" is something we're not supposed to give a lot of thought to, and just accept that that's the way to show that those are the girl's descendants.

And what's going on in the manga currently? I didn't read it, and don't know where or how to find it either...can't buy it over here in Argentina...so tell me a thing or two about the current events if you don't mind.

Spoiler for D.C.S.G. and D.C. II rumours?:

Well, that's what I've heard about the game, but it may only be a rumour. It's hard to seperate fact from fiction until more info is released. I believe someone posted about it on the pre-reset forum, so perhaps they'll come back and reveal more?

As for the manga... well, I did get volume 2 just before Christmas (special bundle with the cute little Nemu figure ), but I'm afraid I haven't taken a look at it yet (and I'm away from home at the moment). Ordered it from Amazon.co.jp, for what it's worth. I do know that, on the whole, it's a fairly different take on the story (just as the original D.C. manga was a bit of a different take compared to Season one) - in the volume 1 of D.C.S.G., Sakura and Nemu were already there when Aisia came, Nemu left home (IIRC), and Aisia ended up staying at Sakura's house instead of Junichi's. I understand from past posts in the forum that it goes on to feature a bit more of a direct confrontation between the different girls. And actually, I may have mispoke -- it looks like the last issue of Comptiq may have had the last chapter, since there doesn't seem to be a chapter in the February 2006 issue... need other forumites to share more!

Hey, lurkers - I know you're out there! I see you in the "currently reading this thread" list If you've read anything about the upcoming D.C. II game or the D.C.S.G. manga and how it relates or connects to the D.C.S.S., please post! Don't be shy!

[Theundyingmage]

http://circus.nandemo.gr.jp/sakuhin/dc2/index.html

go here for the official Homepage of the D.C II game by Circus.

Page contains all the characters and their relations to each other via a chart.

But it still doesn't have a release date yet.

[AvatarST]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

Spoiler for D.C.S.G. and D.C. II rumours?:

Well, that's what I've heard about the game, but it may only be a rumour. It's hard to seperate fact from fiction until more info is released. I believe someone posted about it on the pre-reset forum, so perhaps they'll come back and reveal more?!

Spoiler:

It was me who said that . If you look at Nanaka's quote, she's like "It's Nanaka! No, Na-na-ka! which I thought was a clear reference to Kotori who'd rather be called Kotori than Shirakawa, so I thought that maybe she was taken in, just like Kotori, by the Shirakawa household...though maybe it's something that she just picked up from her grandmother and Kotori told her that she was adopted, since they really do look alike.

[MonkeyBrains]

Originally Posted by AvatarST

Spoiler:

Nanaka adopted? Wha? That's not confirmed yet, is it? >.> Both ways, she looks too much like Kotori not to be related to her. And maybe the "having the same last name as the grandmother" is something we're not supposed to give a lot of thought to, and just accept that that's the way to show that those are the girl's descendants.

And what's going on in the manga currently? I didn't read it, and don't know where or how to find it either...can't buy it over here in Argentina...so tell me a thing or two about the current events if you don't mind.

You didn't ask me, but here's what I know about the Manga.

Spoiler for DCSG Manga:

Volume 2 is, I think, the most recent volume. It came out very recently (I got it for the Nemu figure). Here's the real Cliff's Notes version of what's going on.

Sakura and Nemu are there from the start. Nemu is doing the nurse training thing like the anime.
Nemu and Junichi had a falling out around the end of volume 1 (and Nemu was therefore not seen that often in vol 2, usually walking away in a huff).
Aisia is in the manga, but blessedly, for most of volume 2, she is rarely there (her biggest appearance is in the last chapter).

The falling out between Junichi and Nemu appears to have been resolved at the end of volume 2, with Aisia helping, if memory serves correctly, in the last chapter (although Miharu also tried to "help" by, if my interpretation is correct, trying to injure Junichi throughout one of the chapters so he'd go to the nurse's office and have to see Nemu).

Interestingly, there seemed to be a lot more Mako focus in volume 2, rather than a Kotori focus like DCSS (Kotori major appearnace was partway through one of the chapters). Mako seemed to be playing a role similar to Kotori in DCSS, pining over unrequited love with Junichi (the volume starts with Mako waking up from a dream about Junichi confessing to her), but she also feeling guilty about it in front of Nemu (particularly after she calls the Asakura house and talks to Nemu). Mako appears to get the most page-time of any of the girls in this volume. Since I like Mako more than Kotori, that's kind of nice.

[AvatarST]

Heh, I love Mako too. But I love Aisha and Kotori as well.

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by AvatarST

Spoiler:

It was me who said that . If you look at Nanaka's quote, she's like "It's Nanaka! No, Na-na-ka! which I thought was a clear reference to Kotori who'd rather be called Kotori than Shirakawa, so I thought that maybe she was taken in, just like Kotori, by the Shirakawa household...though maybe it's something that she just picked up from her grandmother and Kotori told her that she was adopted, since they really do look alike.

Spoiler:

Oh was it? LOL. It's all a blur. Well, I thought I had heard it elsewhere too, but who knows. Wait and see is the thing, I guess... I guess Comptiq is supposed to have a story about it in the current issue, so maybe somebody's read it.

[AvatarST]

Yeah. Just make sure to come and post it here as soon and if you find anything, because I'm eager to know, you'd do me a favour. And that goes not just for you but for everyone else.

[MonkeyBrains]

Originally Posted by AvatarST

Heh, I love Mako too. But I love Aisha and Kotori as well.

It's like marriage in the south. It's all relative.

[relentlessflame]

Well, time for a D.C. merchandise check-up, for those of you keeping score...

First off, there's an update on the D.C. II story page in case anyone's interested in taking a look (and maybe translating?) Still no release date announced, but there appears to be a hint on the omake page to keep your eyes on the home page and magazines for more info to come...

Earlier this month saw the release of the limited edition DVD 4 including the cute little Aisia figure (who can sit next to the Nemu figure included with D.C.S.G. volume 2 released in December). Coming out on Wednesday, though, is Volume 2 of the OST by Hikaru Nanase - a real highlight for me - featuring the always-lovely Kotori on the cover. Also being released Wednesday is volume 1 of (what I think is?) the radio drama.

Coming out next month, in addition to DVD 5, is a D.C.F.S. mini-vocal album (also graced by our lovely Kotori) and volume 2 of the D.C.S.S. radio show.

This report is brought to you by the Coalition of International D.C.S.S. Merchandise Purchasers; I take comfort in the fact that at least our numbers can't go down too much further.

[Spuffy]

Might as well post them here too.
Some scans I made from a D.C. II/Circus article that was in Dengeki-hime 2006/2. They're almost a month old by now though.

[Shiroth]

If there was one thing i loved about Second Season.. was the music. And with that on the mind - the second ost is out! ^^

Its more of a depressing kinda ost compared to the lighter first one, but both of them joined together are amazing, have to be one of my fav' ost's.

[justsomeguy]

In the end, this turned out to be a near-useless show. Every old character was the same as from the previous series, and they didn't change at all. The plot, if there ever was one, dropped like a rock once Nemu returned (far too early). Kotori did nothing; there was no "war" at all between her and Nemu. The new characters did nothing. No relationships changed, or were even challenged until the final episodes. Heck, it's like the moral of the show is that nothing should change. I like to entertain the amusing idea that the writers scrapped the original plot they had to write Nemu back in because they were tired of having people ask "What happened to Nemu?" a hundred times on the message boards.
Fortunately, there was a conclusive ending and no barrage of flashbacks. Otherwise I would have declared this to be the Destiny of Da Capo.