Higurashi - Game Discussion (spoilers lurk here)

[st_nick5]

Originally Posted by Levani

there have been titles from official companies, (*cough* old MangaGamer) where they didn't care for the quality of their translation

You ever read Family Project? The translation was an absolute joke.

[sona-nyl]

Originally Posted by st_nick5

You ever read Family Project? The translation was an absolute joke.

That was not by Mangagamer though...

[st_nick5]

Originally Posted by Usami_Haru

That was not by Mangagamer though...

Oh yeah, that was Jast. Got mixed up there.

[xPearse]

Originally Posted by Levani

Don't take this the wrong way xPearse, but you're machine translating and improving it with your own knowledge right? I don't think I'd be rude to say that you're inexperienced in this, thus your final result may need tweaking to have a quality release. The thing is, bad translations ruin Visual Novels in the west. We're the kind of demographic that has bad translations everywhere and we accept it, there have been titles from official companies, (*cough* old MangaGamer) where they didn't care for the quality of their translation, simply because they had assumed that we, the readers, didn't care and would jump into it anyway. Which is totally what we did in Higurashi's case. They think that, translation wise, we are easy to please, so they give us crap. That needs to definitely change and it is changing. Also, because we have bad translations even in localized games, it hurts our image to someone who might be interested in Visual Novels as well.

I'm not hating, believe me, but...eh, the world is an ugly place xD

Yeah, don't worry. I understand your concerns, here's a few examples. Although I do change things a little to make it flow slightly better.

Spoiler for JP & ENG Examples:

　バァンと天井の板が跳ね飛び、そこから３人の人影が舞い降りてきたのである！！\
　Slam！　A ceiling plate bursts off, and the shadows of three figures come floating down！！\

「勝ちたいのにどうしても勝てないんだ。@どうしてだろう…。」@
「Even though I want to win, I never do.@　I don't know why…」@

「Ｋ。@あなたはどうして勝ちたいんですか？@/　負けたくないから勝ちたいんですか？」\
「K.@　Why do you want to win？@/　Because you don't want to lose, is that why you want to win？」\

[Vokoca]

Originally Posted by Daisu

People should be happy that it is being translated. There a lot of non-perfect translations; when translating between two languages some words can not be fully translated to have the same meaning. Honorifics tends to look weird.
You guys are far too hard on the fellow.

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with this completely. Call me an ass, but I'm sick of arguments like 'We should be happy we have something at least!' or the even worse 'They're doing it for us (for free!), so we should accept it no matter the quality!'. No, this should never be the reason to lover our standards so low. I'm not asking everyone to be an ungrateful bastard, but not everything should get this sort of a free pass.

If you don't know the two languages well, don't translate.Even if you do, I feel like it's absolutely necessary to have a quality checker at the very least, and a translator checker on top of that if possible. With big projects like VNs, this shouldn't be such an impossible thing to ask - I'm doing a translator checker on an ongoing VN translation myself, and judging by how many corrections I had to make already, this is definitely not an useless position. This is not to say the translator is bad or can't be trusted, but let's face it, everyone makes mistakes, so it's best to get your work checked by someone else - just like a quality checker will go over the actual flow, grammar and spelling of the text after me.

TL;DR - We shouldn't accept shit translations just because there always is someone who'll make them, we should have higher standards and hopefully evetually the quality of TL will go up with them. Anyone who has read enough english translated VNs knows that we sorely need that - with official translations a lot of the times too, on top of that. This should be unacceptable.

Originally Posted by Levani

They think that, translation wise, we are easy to please, so they give us crap.

You know it's especially bad when even the writing in an English visual novel looks so bad it makes you want to suspect it's secretly an amazing satire of the state of regular translation quality. But no, it's like that because that's apparently what people 'want'.

Kami help us.

[sona-nyl]

Originally Posted by xPearse

Yeah, don't worry. I understand your concerns, here's a few examples. Although I do change things a little to make it flow slightly better.

Spoiler for JP & ENG Examples:

　バァンと天井の板が跳ね飛び、そこから３人の人影が舞い降りてきたのである！！\
　Slam！　A ceiling plate bursts off, and the shadows of three figures come floating down！！\

「勝ちたいのにどうしても勝てないんだ。@どうしてだろう…。」@
「Even though I want to win, I never do.@　I don't know why…」@

「Ｋ。@あなたはどうして勝ちたいんですか？@/　負けたくないから勝ちたいんですか？」\
「K.@　Why do you want to win？@/　Because you don't want to lose, is that why you want to win？」\

While 人影 can mean the shadows of people it typically just means figure, though in English we don't really say "the figure of a person" like in Japanese either.

[TheGuraGuraMan]

Originally Posted by Vokoca

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with this completely. Call me an ass, but I'm sick of arguments like 'We should be happy we have something at least!' or the even worse 'They're doing it for us (for free!), so we should accept it no matter the quality!'. No, this should never be the reason to lover our standards so low. I'm not asking everyone to be an ungrateful bastard, but not everything should get this sort of a free pass.

If you don't know the two languages well, don't translate.Even if you do, I feel like it's absolutely necessary to have a quality checker at the very least, and a translator checker on top of that if possible. With big projects like VNs, this shouldn't be such an impossible thing to ask - I'm doing a translator checker on an ongoing VN translation myself, and judging by how many corrections I had to make already, this is definitely not an useless position. This is not to say the translator is bad or can't be trusted, but let's face it, everyone makes mistakes, so it's best to get your work checked by someone else - just like a quality checker will go over the actual flow, grammar and spelling of the text after me.

TL;DR - We shouldn't accept shit translations just because there always is someone who'll make them, we should have higher standards and hopefully evetually the quality of TL will go up with them. Anyone who has read enough english translated VNs knows that we sorely need that - with official translations a lot of the times too, on top of that. This should be unacceptable.



You know it's especially bad when even the writing in an English visual novel looks so bad it makes you want to suspect it's secretly an amazing satire of the state of regular translation quality. But no, it's like that because that's apparently what people 'want'.

Kami help us.

Some years ago, a chinese student who was still learning english made the first translation of Jojo's Part 4, well know as "Duwang". Why ? Because there wasn't any (and still took years before getting a better one) and he was a big fan who still took his time to make the whole thing. Translation was full of wrong grammars, but people didn't care and still thanked him for this work. Hell, it's even now still used as a popular joke by using some of the sentences as meme.

Between 0 and 1, I would obviously choose one.

[Vokoca]

Originally Posted by TheGuraGuraMan

Some years ago, a chinese student who was still learning english made the first translation of Jojo's Part 4, well know as "Duwang". Why ? Because there wasn't any (and still took years before getting a better one) and he was a big fan who still took his time to make the whole thing. Translation was full of wrong grammars, but people didn't care and still thanked him for this work. Hell, it's even now still used as a popular joke by using some of the sentences as meme.

Between 0 and 1, I would obviously choose one.

Well, here you have it, it's precisely because of people like you that the translation standards are where they are now. Maybe if you actually didn't accept any garbage that comes your way, it'd be a bit better by now.

I'm not trying to attack xPearse here or anything, it's nothing personal, just taking the fan-translation scene as a whole. If you're going to translate, at least translate into proper English instead of just getting stuck somewhere between the two languages, and get someone to check your stuff. I don't think I'm asking for too much here, I'm not expecting masterpiece translations. Just something that's actually correct.

[Klashikari]

Originally Posted by Vokoca

Well, here you have it, it's precisely because of people like you that the translation standards are where they are now. Maybe if you actually didn't accept any garbage that comes your way, it'd be a bit better by now.

I don't want to play the devil's advocate as I also believe people who barely know Japanese or the language they are translating it into shouldn't do anything related to translation as a whole, but you are barking at the wrong tree.

Whether or not people are fine with low quality translation, it wouldn't change the fact there are a lot of projects spawning left and right even when the demand isn't particularly high.
The fact there are more and more translation projects doesn't change that point, and more often than not, the issue comes from -multiple translations process- like JP => CH => EN and the likes.

[Vokoca]

Originally Posted by Klashikari

Whether or not people are fine with low quality translation, it wouldn't change the fact there are a lot of projects spawning left and right even when the demand isn't particularly high.
The fact there are more and more translation projects doesn't change that point, and more often than not, the issue comes from -multiple translations process- like JP => CH => EN and the likes.

Yeah, I do agree with that as well, I'd just like to think that if people were perhaps less accepting of bad translations, it could force the translators to try harder so they'd actually be able to get their work out there - but maybe I'm just being a bit too idealistic here.

[Levani]

I personally can't get through bad translation, no matter how much I'm interested in the story.

[xPearse]

Originally Posted by Vokoca

Well, here you have it, it's precisely because of people like you that the translation standards are where they are now. Maybe if you actually didn't accept any garbage that comes your way, it'd be a bit better by now.

I'm not trying to attack xPearse here or anything, it's nothing personal, just taking the fan-translation scene as a whole. If you're going to translate, at least translate into proper English instead of just getting stuck somewhere between the two languages, and get someone to check your stuff. I don't think I'm asking for too much here, I'm not expecting masterpiece translations. Just something that's actually correct.

Well, I'm with Gura on this one. Its actually the main reason I started this sort of thing, because it wouldn't get done otherwise. Games and media in general sit around for years untranslated, and even though people may be interested in them, nobody lifts their arses to do anything, so to speak. I'd generally accept anything, even Chinese to English as long as its readable, because even if it may not be worded correctly and the like, you are still able to understand the story and what is happening, which to me is what counts, not the perfect wording of things. Anyhow, that doesn't necessarily mean I approve of low quality translations, but I'd accept it if there's nothing else, because I and most people cannot read moon runes.

Anyway, progressing into the current arc a little, and it seems Satoko pairs up with Rika for wiping the windows with their butts in Angel Mort uniforms, interesting to note. Mion's punishment is also different, she only has to teach the class for an entire day while wearing a swimsuit, which is pretty tame compared to its anime counterpart. Banzai anyone? Shion too, she only has to wear PE clothing on top of a swimsuit and then take off only the underwear, pretty tame Ryukishi07. I can even think of better punishments off the top of my head, involving whipped cream and a bananna that is.

[Shikou]

Originally Posted by Levani

I personally can't get through bad translation, no matter how much I'm interested in the story.

I kinda wonder how bad the translations in Higurashi DVD bootlegs are like.

[LAMBDADELTO]

xPearse you are doing a great work, personally i read higurashi hou with your very first patch and i love it nwn
cant wait for this one, thank you so much my friend nwn

[Shikou]

A new gameplay video was uploaded half an hour ago. Im not sure why they put in a "to" in the end of the video. Secret message?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkx_EGAM55M

[Katsu Koneko]

Glass breaking... "to"

Higurashi Hou?

Probably not though.

[Vokoca]

Originally Posted by Shikou

A new gameplay video was uploaded half an hour ago. Im not sure why they put in a "to" in the end of the video. Secret message?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkx_EGAM55M

Kind of hoping that'll turn into a PS4 version announcement, since I'd prefer getting that over the Vita one, but I doubt they'd announce that this late.

Maybe some more content? But do you really need more than 19 arcs?

[Shikou]

I think a PS4 version would't be any different but just be the exact same. I dont think its late ether because Final Fantasy X|X-2 Remastered got announced to have a PS4 version worldwide even though its been more than a year since the game came out in Japan. Then again Alchemist are not really known to be re-releasing a port later like Square does so who knows.

There isn't much more you can do with Higurashi at this point. Higurashi Sui is basically Higurashi HD Collection having all of the arcs from the Matsuri and Kizuna games with one new one when you complete the final arc so you have 20 arcs.

[st_nick5]

Originally Posted by xPearse

Well, I'm with Gura on this one. Its actually the main reason I started this sort of thing, because it wouldn't get done otherwise. Games and media in general sit around for years untranslated, and even though people may be interested in them, nobody lifts their arses to do anything, so to speak. I'd generally accept anything, even Chinese to English as long as its readable, because even if it may not be worded correctly and the like, you are still able to understand the story and what is happening, which to me is what counts, not the perfect wording of things. Anyhow, that doesn't necessarily mean I approve of low quality translations, but I'd accept it if there's nothing else, because I and most people cannot read moon runes.

You should always strive for the highest quality possible. Not putting the effort into making a good quality translation (in this case, proper spelling and grammar, and making sure the sentences flow naturally in English, basically just using common sense) using the excuse that nobody else is doing it is just sheer laziness.

[Levani]

and even though people may be interested in them, nobody lifts their arses to do anything, so to speak.

This rubbed me the wrong way. I'm not interested in translating titles from Japanese to English because of my incompetence in both of these languages, that's why I don't lift my "ass". Some people prefer quality over quantity and I'm one of those people.

Most English translated VNs suck, old officially localized VNs also suck, best way for me, as I suspected, is to learn Japanese.

because even if it may not be worded correctly and the like, you are still able to understand the story and what is happening, which to me is what counts, not the perfect wording of things.

If something is horribly written, if the prose in English is terrible, I personally couldn't give a crap about what the story was. I don't want to read something that looks like a fanfiction. I may have been young when Higurashi got released, but if I wanted to get into the series now, I wouldn't be able to get through MangaGamer's translation and automatically deem the story as pure garbage. Translations matter to a lot of people.