Shakugan no Shana II - Episode 9 Discussion / Poll

[Kiyoru]

I don't really understand the whole Silver thing. I don't think I have been concentrating very much D;

Could someone explain please?

Either way, it's interesting. As a guess, is Silver like.. the guy Margery was fighting against in the past or something. I really liked the action in this episode, it's about time we got some fights.

[DazarGaidin]

Margery life is dedicated to killing a tomogora that uses silver flames, the guy int he suit of armor with the million eyeballs.

Great episode with a lot of good fighting and information too.

Couple things about earlier posts:

Re Margery tears: Margery showing those underlying feelings shouldn't come as a surprise at this point. In season one a large part of her story was how she put on a facade of not really needing or caring about her two roommates there, but when it came to it she was worried about them/wanted to protect them too (just like the kid eh?). This just shows even more depth into why she puts on that facade and how in the end she can't help but feel that way. I don't think she could deny she cares about them anymore, but shes kinda asking them to not put her further in that position, especially if it means them vs her revenge.

I don't think he is going to let it drop though, he never said he would and i think he might be willing to take the risk.

The kids special ability there at the end was a energy cocoon, that is how it is related to moths i guess.

The fog guy was kinda weak, that is probably WHY he hired syd as a body guard, it would be kinda lame to have him real strong and then getting someone else to protect him (tho you see this all the time for some reason... )

Re flame haze cooperating: I think that its important to remember that flame haze maintain balance, so its probably unbalancing to have too many in one place for a long period of time. The instance with ball masque might have created an exception (or yujis existence rather) as it is severely unbalancing (baddies flock there so haze need to counter). But i think in general, flame haze work alone where they are needed to balance things out, and people that work alone get used to it.

[KaneDragon]

Originally Posted by Kiyoru

I don't really understand the whole Silver thing. I don't think I have been concentrating very much D;

Could someone explain please?

Either way, it's interesting. As a guess, is Silver like.. the guy Margery was fighting against in the past or something. I really liked the action in this episode, it's about time we got some fights.

If I recall correctly, Silver was that giant suit of armor guy who messed up Margery's life before Margery became a flame haze, and how she wants to kill him.

...And apparently, Yuji now has Silver's mojo.

[grey_moon]

Maybe silver senior is going to not like someone stealing his mojo and come after Yuji and that gives Margery a chance for revenge.

[ashlay]

Originally Posted by grey_moon

Maybe silver senior is going to not like someone stealing his mojo and come after Yuji and that gives Margery a chance for revenge.

does Silver even have a personality necessary for an ego?

seemed like he was just a bunch of freaky red eyes and insect legs under the armor...

[DX HBK]

I wonder ,prior to Margery first meeting the Silver, what her occupation was at the time?

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by DazarGaidin

Re flame haze cooperating: I think that its important to remember that flame haze maintain balance, so its probably unbalancing to have too many in one place for a long period of time. The instance with ball masque might have created an exception (or yujis existence rather) as it is severely unbalancing (baddies flock there so haze need to counter). But i think in general, flame haze work alone where they are needed to balance things out, and people that work alone get used to it.

I think it may just be a personality thing. The Crimson Lords who contract Flame Haze are basically people who decided to go to all the trouble of going to Earth to hunt down their own kinds.

They each have their reasons for doing it. Alastor does it out of sense of righteousness, Marcosius because he likes to fight. I don't think he much cares about balance, beyond not eating people himself.

And the Crimson world seems pretty anarchic. They do stuff because they can, and who's going to do anything about it? So it's not like a police action. They just decide to kill their own kind, for their own reasons.

So, how much would it take for a Crimson Lord with a Flame Haze to decide that another Crimson Lord with a Flame Haze is a bad guy that has to die?

[Grimkill7]

Whew, FINALLY this interesting boring flashback arc is over and now we can get back to the irrelevant cute and adorable Konoe. THANK GOD. I was worried there for a second.

[KaneDragon]

Originally Posted by grey_moon

Maybe silver senior is going to not like someone stealing his mojo and come after Yuji and that gives Margery a chance for revenge.

Or maybe Silver got sucked into the Raging Mango? That would be... anticlimactic. Or maybe Silver is like a Transformer, and is the Raging Mango's true identity! Yuji having a robot transformation would be pretty... interesting...

[Eisdrache]

Most (Not all) of you gave those two episodes high ratings because there was some "action" in it. And 95% already start complaining how boring the next episodes will be etc etc. Please remember that Shana was NEVER an action series. Some fights are not a reason to go crazy.

I see the same people complaining in threads after almost every episode how boring/slow/irrelevant it was. Obviously its not your genre and therefore I recommend dropping this series instead of ranting here.

Now back to OnTopic:
They sure know how to come up with some unexpected events. Yuji being possibly related with Silver was quite a surprise. The flash back was nice as well, Yuri being able to take out a Tomogara proves how much skill he has. Too bad he died so fast. Someone also mentioned in the previous thread that Anna Berg wanted to profit from technological advance, leading into war. Huge amounts of existence could be consumed in a war without anyone noticing. Dont remember the name but I guess he/she was right about that.

[serenade_beta]

Originally Posted by tripperazn

Yeah, seriously, if only Shana tripped a little in the Fuuzetsu and sliced her up. At least as a torch we would know her presence is only temporary >.<**

Well, if that happened, the stupid idiot called Yuuji would probably go "use my existence to restore her" like he did in the first season, at school, after Friagne's attack.

Voila, Fumina recovers and continues to live.

[Skyfall]

Originally Posted by Eisdrache

Most (Not all) of you gave those two episodes high ratings because there was some "action" in it. And 95% already start complaining how boring the next episodes will be etc etc. Please remember that Shana was NEVER an action series. Some fights are not a reason to go crazy.

It was also never the poor excuse of a continuation that the season has been feeding us thus far. I don't know about others, but it is not the action i necessarily liked (though there is nothing bad about liking that either), but the fact that something actually relevant with a semblance of actually being relatively important (even if only for character background) happened.

The whole Konoe arc is basically the same thing over and over and over again, not to mention it rides on continuity inconsistencies and a whopping plothole regarding to season 1 to exist in the first place. (and a good measure of formerly not present idiocy cluelessness on Yuji's side) There is a difference between being slow paced and seemingly pointless, and the whole Konoe arc is much closer to the later. And while Shana was not a pure action series (though actually some people are trying to push this claim too far), it was never a crappy highschool romance flick either. Everything important this show was built upon has become nothing more than a trivial background decoration and nearly forgotten.

Thats why i at least like the last two episodes - they resemble what Shakugan no Shana used to be, and i just hope they can keep up the momentum from now on, because everything else that has happened in this season could easily be discarded and nothing would change, because there is nothing that has happened outside of these last episodes, be it in terms of plot or relationship progression (regression doesn't really count). Besides some microscopic development between Eita and Ogata that is, which is about the only thing this season has managed to achieve thus far.

[ashlay]

Originally Posted by Skyfall

Besides some microscopic development between Eita and Ogata that is, which is about the only thing this season has managed to achieve thus far.

well, and Yuji's progression in training.

[Skyfall]

Indeed, forgot to mention that. Though considering it took them 9 episodes (around 1 minute /episode) to produce something workable from that, it isn't exactly something to write home about Thus far second season is seriously lacking in redeeming qualities ... i am holding on to hope the future episodes might change that.

[Grimkill7]

Indeed. These past 2 episodes had "Shakugan no Shana season 1" written all over them. I knew in the first couple of seconds from these episodes that they were different. You could just feel it. In season 1, you had some school life stuff, but you were constantly reminded of Yuji's life as a torch as well as the choices and consequences of said choices he would have to make regarding such a life. All of which happened during the school life elements. If a first time Shana watcher watches season 2, they would almost mistake it as a generic school life anime. That's how much the Konoe story detracts from it. Watch the past 2 episodes and then watch the episode where Shana destroys the flame wheel Tomogara. If it weren't for the characters, I would think I was watching a different anime altogether. I can't explain it really, but Konoe just doesn't fit.

[X207]

looks like yuji will have to get strong pretty fast, it wont take too long for margerie to find out who he is.

[FlareKnight]

I agree that the series isn't all about action. But there are action elements present in the story so I don't think there is anything wrong in discussing them as well. It's almost like saying ignore part of what this series is because it doesn't fit as the biggest part of the series.

Agree that it wasn't a lack of action that was the problem earlier. It was a lack of anything feeling important here. Spending time with Shana and Kazumi figuring out that the feeling of jealously isn't a fun one didn't feel greatly important. Plus they did a good job of fixing the world of Flame Hazes with the one Yuji was trying to hold onto. It isn't a series with one simple dimension. So nice when it touches on all the parts that make it what it is.

So anyways should be interesting where things go from here. How does Satou move forward? Obviously he can't help as he is. Since if he's too weak then he can't go with her since she'd be afraid of sacrificing him for her revenge. Toss in Yuji's situation and you've got some interesting times right now.

[tripperazn]

Originally Posted by X207

looks like yuji will have to get strong pretty fast, it wont take too long for margerie to find out who he is.

Well considering where the lines of battle are drawn if Margery does somehow find out about Yuuji's flame, I'd say he is fairly safe. You're forgetting that he has Shana, and if everything somehow goes wrong, Wilhelmina can come back at Shana's request.

Margery has no allied flame haze and no cordial relationship with Shana at all. She has Satou and Tanaka, who can't do anything besides move in a Fuuzetsu.

Just from looking at the Flame Haze, you have Shana and potentially Wilhelmina vs Margery. It's quite easy to see who would win there.

For the human/mystes category, you have Yuuji, with spells and enough PoE to match a Guze no Ou vs 2 humans without any abilities at all.

Assassinating Yuuji isn't going to work either. The required Fuuzetsu makes surprise virtually impossible, especially since Shana will be staying with Yuuji again. His dodging is pretty good already from at least a year of training. If he is attacked he will be awake and will have a good chance of at least buying time for reinforcements.

[Thentus]

Originally Posted by Kinny Riddle

Things are beginning to make sense now. Rami's reasons for not revealing to Margery about "Silver's" wherabouts is now clear, not that he wants to help "Silver", but he is very concerned about the safety of someone nearby if he told her there and then what "Silver" has become and where he is right now. (Though it's becoming obvious, I'll not name who that "someone" is, just to be safe. )

I know this is late, but I think I have actually been able to figure out who it is. Yes, now it makes a LOT more sense on why he had done that. Hopefully she never figures out who it is .

[X207]

Originally Posted by tripperazn

Well considering where the lines of battle are drawn if Margery does somehow find out about Yuuji's flame, I'd say he is fairly safe. You're forgetting that he has Shana, and if everything somehow goes wrong, Wilhelmina can come back at Shana's request.

Margery has no allied flame haze and no cordial relationship with Shana at all. She has Satou and Tanaka, who can't do anything besides move in a Fuuzetsu.

Just from looking at the Flame Haze, you have Shana and potentially Wilhelmina vs Margery. It's quite easy to see who would win there.

For the human/mystes category, you have Yuuji, with spells and enough PoE to match a Guze no Ou vs 2 humans without any abilities at all.

Assassinating Yuuji isn't going to work either. The required Fuuzetsu makes surprise virtually impossible, especially since Shana will be staying with Yuuji again. His dodging is pretty good already from at least a year of training. If he is attacked he will be awake and will have a good chance of at least buying time for reinforcements.

for some reason i feel that eventually near the final battle those 2 flamehaze will be momentartily suppressed leaving yuji vs margery for a quick battle.