Episode was good, the battle between former and current Beatrice was good and entertaining. Even though it sounds that in the original VN the battle was much better.
So it seems that Battler is back to the fight with the help of Virgilia, it almost seems like she is his furniture.
Well it seems that Eva was able to find the gold thanks to the clue that she had of the river which was given to her by young Eva long time ago. Thanks to that she was able to find the gold at some secret basement in the house.
In the VN, there's actually a lot more discussion over the epitaph and its possible meanings, so it's a little more than this that gets Eva to realize. The Anime cut what I think was a really significant part of that especially, in that Rosa notices something and sort of gives her a 'hint' about it which is what leads to the lightbulb going off in Eva's head. I'm hoping they'll touch on this somehow in the next episode because that's the scene that made me realize Rosa is a lot smarter than she comes across.
Though in the VN as well, the river seemed to be the most significant part that clued Eva in, at least that's what I gathered from some of the cryptic talk. Maybe Ryukishi intentionally had them cut out the epitaph talk to highlight the fact that the river part is the most important? Though I still don't like how they made it seem like Eva figured it out instantly -_-
Well now that I've watch the episode with subs, I've revised my opinion a little bit.
Spoiler for :
The more I hear Ohara in the newer episodes the more I can't think there'd be anyone more perfect for the role of Beatrice. I went back and watched some of the earlier episodes of EP2 again and it's clear that she's improved a lot in such a short amount of time. She had a more downplayed and elegant style earlier on (though the laughs still had that touch of insanity), but now she's bringing out the undignified, childish Beato a lot better. Perfect timing, too; she's more detestable in EP2 as she comes across as a 'villain', but this is the arc where we really start to see some other sides of her, so it's great to hear Ohara capturing the various facets of her personality.
I never noticed before, but anyone else think it's odd that the adults spent all night in the dining room and didn't even remotely notice the smell of a burning body until they opened the door? Call me crazy, but even if I lived in a mansion that large, opening the door to the adjacent room wouldn't go from 'absolutely no smell' to 'overpowering smell' so quickly.
Nanjo is always so suspicious. "Lol sup guise what's goin' on I was just in the next room totally minding my own business all night while you were all talking about money and a bunch of people mysteriously died in this very mansion, what'd I miss?'. I really don't trust that guy at all. After reading through EP4 of the VN he still has to be the only character who's gotten almost zero character development, and he comes across so innocent and bumbling that it just has to be an act. And of course, being a doctor is all too convenient if he's an accomplice. I think he's definitely smarter than he acts and he's hiding something, but I don't peg him for being a mastermind...but an accomplice? Definitely.
I guess I didn't notice it with the crappy RAW I'd seen, but the border in Virgilia's crime scene reconstructions looks really tacky.
The Meta Battle still bores me to tears due to poor music choice, but honestly both that and the Schrodinger's Cat Battler/Virgilia scenes were perfect. They didn't leave out any of the major details in either scene, and that's what really matters.
Young Eva really does sound too much like Adult Eva. Really hope Ito sorts that out for the next episode. It was great when she first appeared.
I know in the VN as well it said that the door to the gold had the Tenth Twilight written on it, but for some reason I didn't really put two and two together and connect it with the same paint being used to draw the magic circles. This could just be poor production values, but the red on the door looks fairly fresh. In the VN I figured that writing had probably been there since the mansion was originally built and the gold was stored inside (just because Kinzo only had the epitaph displayed for two years doesn't mean he didn't have the riddle plotted out in his head beforehand). Is it possible that the culprit (or at least the one drawing the circles if they aren't the same person) was the one to write this on the door as well? Does this mean they assumed someone really would manage to solve the 'unsolvable' epitaph? Or was it a 'just in case' measure? I'm going to keep this in mind now...
Maybe it's the subs, maybe it's just watching it a second time, but I feel a little better about this episode now. I'm still upset about the epitaph talk being cut down so much, but as I said, perhaps Ryukishi said 'well the river is really the most important' and just cut out all the extra clues? Either way, the episode was otherwise really well done, and Schrodinger's Cat is so important that I'm glad they handled it perfectly (I was a little afraid they wouldn't since they cut out all of Hempel's Raven in a previous episode). 8/10.
Hi there, just registered so I could post my opinions and theories here.
I am an anime only viewer, but I always read the anime related threads here and I enjoy the VN player's insights and added missing info from the VN.
Anyway, for me this episode was very good. The meta/tea scene was very exciting and interesting. The meta-battle was good also, if it was any bigger I think it would start to bother me. And while the adults' scenes did feel somewhat disjoined (it seems like they were just lounging around for a while for no reason, and then Eva just went A-haa (cue a chorus singing *allelujah* :P ) and solved the epitaph. But it didn't bother me much. In general I feel the VN viewers are too hard on this episode. I don't know how much it cut from the VN but it still is leaps and bounds better than episodes from the other arcs.
Now that Battler is making *some* effort to solve the murders the anime has gotten waaay more interesting (since, if I understood what you're saying here, I would classify myself as anti-fantasy), but I really wish he would try more things with beato, say a lot more theories, force some more red text out of her. For example, was the cause of death the wounds they received or was it something else? Did they die in the room or were they already dead and dragged in? (especially Kinzo, since no-one really saw him and we can reject the magic scene we saw in which he died (which was the whole point of the schrodinger scene, right?) he could be dead for quite a while). Also didn't sickness or natural causes pass through Battler's head? (I guess I'm thinking about Kinzo again, since if I remember correctly, he was sick supposedly). It seems I kind of wish Battler had the deductive powers of L :P because at least until now, I feel I could be doing a lot better than him (at least if my psyche survived the madness of the whole situation :P ).
Also, are all the rooms really closed rooms? Beato said it explicitly for the first one with shannon, but not really for any other one (and she didn't say it with red text, so can we really believe her?), none of the rooms had another door?
I kind of feel that the first six killings in this arc are very solvable... I'll think about it some more and come back with a theory.
Yeah, I thought that too. Beatrice never red texted about the other 5 rooms. There's a back door in the boiler room that they showed us in the first arc, and I don't think it was touched on this time. Apparently it leads to the courtyard? Also, I realised earlier today that in the 2nd arc, the red text regarding ths chapel did not deny the existance of a secret door/passageway... So maybe there is??
Forcing more red truths would definatly be useful... For both Battler and the viewers... But that could ruin the story Ah well...
I don't get why the VN readers are complaining so much... I thought this episode was awesome ^^ (And the continuity problem with George's jacket was funny) Is the VN that much better than the anime?? I gotta read it some time...
Hmm... True... Maybe it's just a dictionary or an atlas or something??? Unlikely but still... Would be so much easier if we knew what the book was... =.=
Check the epitaph thread, I have posted a summary of the adult's discussion and Eva's reasonings, there it is also said what kind of book Eva was looking for.
Ooh!!! Thank you Wow... ALOT was cut out... =.= How are the anime viewers supposed to figure anything out?!?!?!? O.o I'm gonna finish reading that and then go and read my entire atlas
Then now you understand why the novel readers are so unimpressed by this episode XD
However the only thing that I can say is that it was wrong to begin with to squeeze 4 novels into 26 anime episodes. It is well accpeted that Deen isn't the best animation studio out there, but regardless of that even production IG couldn't avoid to make major cuts with such a small alloted time.
I'm under the impression that the VN players haven't solved it even with the extra information.
But then one wonders...it is important? Or is it flavor? Or is it one of those things that happens in adaptations of VNs...encouragement to play the game to see what you missed?
Well for the first two arcs the info was too condensed to make any sense out of it.
I mean, at least without rewatching them, I have no clear picture of how the murders happened in the first two arcs and how they were impossible (it seems they are full of holes to me, not enough info to neither deem them as impossible or possible).
In this arc, the meta-discussions really clear some of the things out and give a clear picture of the murders.
I just rewatched some parts of ep 14 and while for the first rooms it is stated that they are closed rooms, then battler says "So it keeps going like this for all 6 people?" and after that, the phrase "it was a closed room" is not repeated and that includes the boiler room. Although if this is the solution for these murders I'll feel kind of cheated, because it seems like we're being fooled by some wordplay.
But then one wonders...it is important? Or is it flavor? Or is it one of those things that happens in adaptations of VNs...encouragement to play the game to see what you missed?
personally I don't think the epitaph is relevant to the main plot, however there are people that totally disagree ^^;
Even so, the epitaph is an important element of the whole Umineko story. It's like saying that the hairs aren't necessary for survival, you can shave your head and you still live without the slightest problem. However doesn't a person normally look better with the hairs?
Quote:
Hmm... Wonder if with the info that the VN readers have, if the epitath is solvable yet? Maybe someone will be able to solve it with a lucky guess??
Well I wonder XD certainly you have some solid foundations to build your theory upon (and nonetheless the vast majority of the theories i've seen completely ignore them), however there's still the fact that no one to my knowledge was able to reach a sound theory about what the key should be.
If it is solvable it's extremely hard.
But hey, this is 10 tons of gold worth riddle, what did you expect? XD
In the first arc, Beatrice's letter said something like, they have to solve the riddle rather than try to figure out who she is, but Eva solving the epitath doesn't sopt the murders, does it?
Yeah... Ah well ^^ I don't really seem to care that much when a character dies anymore, because I know that they'll be back in a few episodes anyways But why did they have to kill Kanon so early... *sob*
Purely from watching the anime, here's my thoughts:
Spoiler for eps14:
Last week we had StarCraft battle. The Zealot is fighting the Dark Templar. The Dark Templar miraculously lose. Then the Dark Templar summon her Carrier allies to swarm the Zealot with their funnels. But the Zealot summon his Arbiter that use Stasis Field to protect them both. They're doomed due to no reinforcement.
This week we have Yu-Gi-Oh! battle. "It's my turn!" Virgilia summon the Spear of Gods(?). Virgilia attacks! Beatoricee defends with Shield Golems! "I activate my trap card! The Four Towers!" Virgilia's attack is reflected back at her! Virgilia is defeated.
Next week will be?
Yeah, sorry guys.
Spoiler for hm:
BTW Beatrice is cute when her openings are exposed. (Doing that is a grave crime, FYI)
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Purely from watching the anime, here's my thoughts:
Spoiler for eps14:
Last week we had StarCraft battle. The Zealot is fighting the Dark Templar. The Dark Templar miraculously lose. Then the Dark Templar summon her Carrier allies to swarm the Zealot with their funnels. But the Zealot summon his Arbiter that use Stasis Field to protect them both. They're doomed due to no reinforcement.
This week we have Yu-Gi-Oh! battle. "It's my turn!" Virgilia summon the Spear of Gods(?). Virgilia attacks! Beatoricee defends with Shield Golems! "I activate my trap card! The Four Towers!" Virgilia's attack is reflected back at her! Virgilia is defeated.
Next week will be?
Yeah, sorry guys.
Haha, both are pretty hillarous analogies. Meanwhile Battler has lifted his Command Center and is refusing to concede.
And Yugioh did come to mind with the witch fight. When those words came out (Smoothered mate??) I couldn't stop laughing.
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Ah well...
Meow meow nano desu~ 
Nipah~
But why did they have to kill Kanon so early... *sob* 
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