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Miraluka · 2012-06-14, 15:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by mironicus

Oh, I guess she could do it without problems with her straight personality. Sena also wants Kobatos affection seriously and asks Kodaka what she might like. You can't force anyone to like you, Sena knows that already - even if she makes some creepy jokes sometimes.

Asking Kodaka directly to be her boyfriend would be unfair against Yozora if Sena takes advantage of this situation. She plays fair and square. She don't want to loose to Yozora but she is not this kind of bitch. She also might think of Yozora as her friend, so she don't want to cheat on her in this kind of way.

The problem is if you noted well... Yozora isn't playing fair at all but yet all she does ends backslashing her, talking about karma

.

Oh well, still have Hirasaka Yomi's voodoo doll just in case he wants to troll fans again.

mironicus · 2012-06-17, 09:28

Quote:

Yozora isn't playing fair at all but yet all she does ends backslashing her, talking about karma

Just thinking about her bad luck and everything backslashing... if Sena really gets Kodaka then Yozora is responsible for bringing them together because she founded the club. So how would Yozora react if Kodaka thanks her for that ...?

Kodaka: "Thank you! I will always be grateful to you that you brought Sena and me together!"

Yozora: "Errr......"

Kodaka: "You will always be my best friend!"

Yozora: "Friend...?"

Kodaka: "Of course! Without your club I would have never gained happiness in my life. But now I found the love of my life thanks to you..."

Something breaks in Yozora's mind.

Yozora: "He, he, he...."

Kodaka: "Yozora? Aren't you feeling well...? What, what... are you holding in your hand...? No... don't do it! Don't!!!!"

The End.

sky black swordman · 2012-06-17, 20:03

^ This reaks of Yandere man . Or tsundere.
Yozora as a Yandere how will this play out.

dragonroots · 2012-06-17, 23:17

I honestly think Yozora could turn into a dangerous yandere, before i read the v7 summary Yozora was my personal pick from the girls, but after the things she said, Sena overtook her, i dislike yandere's, they usually scare me (only 2 yandere's i've found do not) and if Yozora becomes a yandere, she'd drop way behind all the other girls for me.

mironicus · 2012-06-18, 11:46

Did you remember the dream Kodaka had at the end of Volume 5 (Time Machine)? He ran away from Yozora who was hunting him and at the end she'll shoot him and shouts "You belong to me!". This could be interpreted as an instinctive warning from his inner conscience that he might be in danger if he rejects Yozoras feelings.

Yozora also says to Sena in a very serious quarrel that she wishes that she never existed and she seems to be convinced that she and Kodaka could be already a ... (she is not completing the sentence so the word "couple" is left out) if Sena never joined the club (later in Volume 7).

Anything could happen if Yozora's selfish world breaks apart.

Johnny · 2012-06-18, 13:54

Yeah, Yozora's the only selfish character we have in the story...

mironicus · 2012-06-18, 17:12

The author let all evil deeds backfire on her. So she never get the things done her way. And she does not learn, does not reflect and shows no signs of empathy. She is only thinking about herself and her bad luck, pitying herself constantly, also blames others for being responsible that she is unlucky (in her case she blames Sena).
Yozora makes an giant afford and thinks about how to get Kodakas attention and friendship. She founded the club with the intention to refresh the old friendship with him - and only with him. To launch the club she even blackmails, slaps and hits little innocent and defenseless children so she can be alone with her beloved Kodaka. She is betraying him from the beginning, the whole existence and the intention of the club was just a big lie because off selfish reasons. Yozora is indeed someone you can call a "false friend".

So... who is more selfish than her?

And how selfish is Sena? In her quarrel with Yozora in Vol. 7 she indirectly requested her to confess her love to Kodaka and not to constantly cling to the past. You should do what you gotta do! Sena cares for Yozora even though they are love rivals. Sena is not hitting on Kodaka within the club and is focussing on club activities. Sena did not join the club because she wanted to be Kodakas girlfriend (unlike Yozora and Rika). Sena qualifies herself as being a "true friend".

And Rika was honest from the beginning that she wants Kodaka for herself.

***relentlessflame*** · 2012-06-18, 18:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by mironicus

Yozora makes an giant afford and thinks about how to get Kodakas attention and friendship. She founded the club with the intention to refresh the old friendship with him - and only with him. To launch the club she even blackmails, slaps and hits little innocent and defenseless children so she can be alone with her beloved Kodaka. She is betraying him from the beginning, the whole existence and the intention of the club was just a big lie because off selfish reasons. Yozora is indeed someone you can call a "false friend".

So... who is more selfish than her?

Do you think maybe you're being just a tad bit sinister and unsympathetic here?

If all the characters in this story were transparent, honest, and free of issues, there would be no need for the club in the first place. They all act under false pretences some of the time, but so does everyone. The way you phrase things above, you make it sound like Yozora is cold, calculating, and vicious in her attempts to control and ensnare Kodaka. That could perhaps have been the case if she weren't so comically incompetent at it. I don't necessarily feel sympathy towards her all the time, but I think her actions stem more out of being something of a social misfit than a truly "bad person". (The whole "little innocent and defenseless children" line is a bit of a laugh too -- there are no such characters in this story. You're turning everyone else into angels so you can frame one character as a devil.)

I think you've really missed a large portion of this story if you can paint Yozora and Sena in such extreme black-and-white terms. Neither of them are either totally good or totally evil, and they each have issues that cause them problems socially. That's why they need the club, and each other. I think that's really the heart of this story.

Miraluka · 2012-06-18, 19:01

The way she pities herself once and once again reminds me of Shoe.

potchip · 2012-06-18, 19:50

Ah..The holy crusade against Yozora begins, this time of the month?

This novel is self-styled zennen love comedy...The characters are all supposed to be zennen (yes gasp Sena included). Great you love Sena as a character and she's an inspiration for some and all, though everything you described about Yozora, might, gasp, be a moe point for other people? There's no such thing as good or evil in a love comedy, perhaps eventual winners and loser. Kodaka is not destined for any particular girl by design (and he sure doesn't quite deserve anyone right now). Sena sure qualifies herself as many things, whether that viewpoint is shared by other people (and other characters included) is debatable. Hey, that's her zennen aspect.

I just want to CUDDLE Yozora's awkwardness! I maintain Sena is too much of a 'bro' character for me (perhaps because her boobies didn't quite have as much an impact on me) , just not girly enough. As Rika aptly puts it, "female power rating of 5, what trash" :P

Actually the thing that probably annoys most Sena shipper is, there are hints that Sena cares more about Yozora than Kodaka. That all this time you are dreaming about how Kodaka's perfect with Sena blah blah, is irrelevant! Though it is one bonus point for Sena being the closet M, through and through

Btw that dream was about Kodaka's own guilt. Just like how he asked Yozora in the holiday house ghost story whether he'll be punished for betraying a friend. Had Yozora played it straight, and told him how shitty he made her felt during the relevation scene, Kodaka will probably be eager to make amends. Alas she's too much of a tsundere so it's the 'think nothing of it, past is the past', exactly the opposite of how she felt to avoid the embrassment of admitting - which made Kodaka uncertain about how much Yozora cared.

Miraluka · 2012-06-18, 20:25

That's what is called status quo, its a typical technique used by various authors, I like Rika's perverted antics a lot. Ah, and Sena isn't M, she just isn't the kind of girl who keeps fighting back others, she is a "princess" afterall.

mironicus · 2012-06-20, 08:31

Quote:

I maintain Sena is too much of a 'bro' character for me (perhaps because her boobies didn't quite have as much an impact on me) ,

Her "bro" attitude towards Kodaka is the right way to gain his trust. Normally Kodaka blocks any approach if it is directed towards him. In this one chapter where Sena wants to choose a perfect present for Kobato she learns much about Kodaka and his sister because he is talking very openly to her - to the extend that he is getting on her nerves because he talks too much.

Quote:

just not girly enough.

If Sena is in distress she acts VERY girlish, crying for Kodaka to help or rescue her. And that might be a key point here. Yozora was once a buddy to him, both were outcasts and they fighted together. But if there is a girl he wants to protect, everything is clear.

Quote:

Actually the thing that probably annoys most Sena shipper is, there are hints that Sena cares more about Yozora than Kodaka.

Sena just approaches Yozora so much, because she wants to be her friend. And as we all know, she is so hardheaded and won't give up so easily, it's the same with Kobato. She just didn't find a walkthrough-guide for the Yozora and Kobato route yet.

Just think about it: If Sena succeeds in conquering Yozora (friendship) and Kobato (accepting her), there is no obstacle any more for the Kodaka route, which is the end of the game.

Quote:

Just like how he asked Yozora in the holiday house ghost story whether he'll be punished for betraying a friend.

Well, I remember some other important part in the holiday house ghost story. Yozora asked Kodaka if he also was scared after hearing her story. In this case Yozora was honest and admitted that the story scared herself. However, he denied that he was scared - and that was a lie. She was able to open up a little bit to him, but he refused to share his own feelings - which makes her sad. In the manga this scene seems to be worked out more and for Yozora it is a sign that he does not trust her very much. This kind of feeling is going through the whole novel. There is a point where Yozora can't reach him and Kodaka might also don't want her to step over it.

Johnny · 2012-06-20, 10:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by mironicus

In the manga this scene seems to be worked out more and for Yozora it is a sign that he does not trust her very much. This kind of feeling is going through the whole novel. There is a point where Yozora can't reach him and Kodaka might also don't want her to step over it.

Huh? Would you as an adolescent young man actually admit that a ghost story scared you? I think your Sena tinted glasses sometimes warps your views of what's actually going on in the story...

Also what actually makes Yozora sad is that she wants to go back to the Sora and Taka relationship they had in the past and it ain't happening...

mangamuscle · 2012-06-20, 11:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by mironicus

Just think about it: If Sena succeeds in conquering Yozora (friendship) and Kobato (accepting her), there is no obstacle any more for the Kodaka route, which is the end of the game.

I thought it was already well established that Sena (as well as Rika) is bisexual

Johnny · 2012-06-20, 11:45

Maybe in some h manga that I've seen, but anything else is just them shooting the shit as the saying goes...

bastek66 · 2012-06-21, 11:34

Latest volume reveals that

Spoiler for family matters:

Miraluka · 2012-06-21, 11:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by bastek66

Latest volume reveals that

Spoiler for family matters:

Is out already?
Also, WTF! that feels like asspull, really really, I demand to see the whole volume or its last chapter, seriously, I was wondering that if this series could the cousin fetish and voila! Oh Japan, realky?
*goes to stab Yomi's doll agaun*

bakAnki · 2012-06-21, 11:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by bastek66

Latest volume reveals that

Spoiler for family matters:

Well...

Spoiler:

Aeshma · 2012-06-21, 12:03

But I thought Sena was way more popular than Yozora.

This development feels really weird, especially with the botched engagement and all.

Okashira · 2012-06-21, 12:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aeshma

This development feels really weird, especially with the botched engagement and all.

Actually, that kinda gives an strong reason of why the folks were shipping them together

What the kids think, well, that's another matter entirely

2012-06-17, 20:03	Link #843
sky black swordman Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: California	^ This reaks of Yandere man . Or tsundere. Yozora as a Yandere how will this play out. __________________

2012-06-17, 23:17	Link #844
dragonroots Carefree Dragon Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Canada Age: 32	I honestly think Yozora could turn into a dangerous yandere, before i read the v7 summary Yozora was my personal pick from the girls, but after the things she said, Sena overtook her, i dislike yandere's, they usually scare me (only 2 yandere's i've found do not) and if Yozora becomes a yandere, she'd drop way behind all the other girls for me. __________________

2012-06-18, 17:12	Link #847
mironicus Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011	The author let all evil deeds backfire on her. So she never get the things done her way. And she does not learn, does not reflect and shows no signs of empathy. She is only thinking about herself and her bad luck, pitying herself constantly, also blames others for being responsible that she is unlucky (in her case she blames Sena). Yozora makes an giant afford and thinks about how to get Kodakas attention and friendship. She founded the club with the intention to refresh the old friendship with him - and only with him. To launch the club she even blackmails, slaps and hits little innocent and defenseless children so she can be alone with her beloved Kodaka. She is betraying him from the beginning, the whole existence and the intention of the club was just a big lie because off selfish reasons. Yozora is indeed someone you can call a "false friend". So... who is more selfish than her? And how selfish is Sena? In her quarrel with Yozora in Vol. 7 she indirectly requested her to confess her love to Kodaka and not to constantly cling to the past. You should do what you gotta do! Sena cares for Yozora even though they are love rivals. Sena is not hitting on Kodaka within the club and is focussing on club activities. Sena did not join the club because she wanted to be Kodakas girlfriend (unlike Yozora and Rika). Sena qualifies herself as being a "true friend". And Rika was honest from the beginning that she wants Kodaka for herself. Last edited by mironicus; 2012-06-18 at 17:38.

2012-06-18, 19:50	Link #850
potchip Senior Member Join Date: May 2007	Ah..The holy crusade against Yozora begins, this time of the month? This novel is self-styled zennen love comedy...The characters are all supposed to be zennen (yes gasp Sena included). Great you love Sena as a character and she's an inspiration for some and all, though everything you described about Yozora, might, gasp, be a moe point for other people? There's no such thing as good or evil in a love comedy, perhaps eventual winners and loser. Kodaka is not destined for any particular girl by design (and he sure doesn't quite deserve anyone right now). Sena sure qualifies herself as many things, whether that viewpoint is shared by other people (and other characters included) is debatable. Hey, that's her zennen aspect. I just want to CUDDLE Yozora's awkwardness! I maintain Sena is too much of a 'bro' character for me (perhaps because her boobies didn't quite have as much an impact on me) , just not girly enough. As Rika aptly puts it, "female power rating of 5, what trash" :P Actually the thing that probably annoys most Sena shipper is, there are hints that Sena cares more about Yozora than Kodaka. That all this time you are dreaming about how Kodaka's perfect with Sena blah blah, is irrelevant! Though it is one bonus point for Sena being the closet M, through and through Btw that dream was about Kodaka's own guilt. Just like how he asked Yozora in the holiday house ghost story whether he'll be punished for betraying a friend. Had Yozora played it straight, and told him how shitty he made her felt during the relevation scene, Kodaka will probably be eager to make amends. Alas she's too much of a tsundere so it's the 'think nothing of it, past is the past', exactly the opposite of how she felt to avoid the embrassment of admitting - which made Kodaka uncertain about how much Yozora cared. Last edited by potchip; 2012-06-18 at 20:15.

2012-06-21, 11:34	Link #856
bastek66 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012	Latest volume reveals that Spoiler for family matters: Sena's mother and Kodaka's mother were sisters

2012-06-18, 11:46	Link #845
mironicus Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011	Did you remember the dream Kodaka had at the end of Volume 5 (Time Machine)? He ran away from Yozora who was hunting him and at the end she'll shoot him and shouts "You belong to me!". This could be interpreted as an instinctive warning from his inner conscience that he might be in danger if he rejects Yozoras feelings. Yozora also says to Sena in a very serious quarrel that she wishes that she never existed and she seems to be convinced that she and Kodaka could be already a ... (she is not completing the sentence so the word "couple" is left out) if Sena never joined the club (later in Volume 7). Anything could happen if Yozora's selfish world breaks apart.

2012-06-18, 13:54	Link #846
Johnny Working the bags... Join Date: Mar 2009	Yeah, Yozora's the only selfish character we have in the story...

2012-06-18, 19:01	Link #849
Miraluka Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Age: 34	The way she pities herself once and once again reminds me of Shoe.

2012-06-18, 20:25	Link #851
Miraluka Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Age: 34	That's what is called status quo, its a typical technique used by various authors, I like Rika's perverted antics a lot. Ah, and Sena isn't M, she just isn't the kind of girl who keeps fighting back others, she is a "princess" afterall.

2012-06-20, 11:45	Link #855
Johnny Working the bags... Join Date: Mar 2009	Maybe in some h manga that I've seen, but anything else is just them shooting the shit as the saying goes...

2012-06-21, 12:03	Link #859
Aeshma Member Join Date: Jul 2007	But I thought Sena was way more popular than Yozora. This development feels really weird, especially with the botched engagement and all.