2010-08-01, 10:29 | Link #14981 |
BUY MY BOOK!!!
Join Date: May 2009
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Yeah but that's like saying "The key doesn't work in the lock; I must just be using it wrong."
Is that really reasonable? If a key doesn't fit in a lock, it's the wrong key. It might be a key to something, but not to the things we're trying to fit it into. Now sure, you can argue "Yes, but the locks it does fit are very important." That's fine. It could even be true. But that doesn't cause the other locks we've been staring at for a couple years to cease to exist. Something has to open those, and if the "key" we have isn't fitting, jiggling it around in the lock hoping something will click rises to the level of desperation.
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2010-08-01, 10:34 | Link #14982 | |
Back off, I'm a scientist
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
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If Kanon just didn't exist, everything would be fine, it's all the evidence that something that looks like Kanon and talks like Kanon is seen by people who aren't privy to Shannon's innermost thoughts that makes it so dubious.
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2010-08-01, 10:34 | Link #14983 |
別にいいけど
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
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I don't think it that way.
Remember the epitaph, it looks like it's easier to find the key than the lock. At a certain point Eva was sure she knew what the key was and yet didn't know where to use the key. You are assuming we already know the lock, I think that's naive. We have the key, we just need to find the right lock now.
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2010-08-01, 10:37 | Link #14984 |
Dea ex Kakera
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sea of Fragments
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Battler directly observed that the stake was jammed in Jessica's back. I won't accept a theory that she was faking unless someone can explain how he could have been fooled given the structure of the stake, as well as why other people faking their deaths didn't use the same method.
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2010-08-01, 10:46 | Link #14986 | |
Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
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2010-08-01, 10:47 | Link #14987 | |
Back off, I'm a scientist
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
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That would actually be quite amusing if this were the sole actual supernatural kind of thing happening.
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2010-08-01, 10:55 | Link #14989 | |
BUY MY BOOK!!!
Join Date: May 2009
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Are we just in denial now? When was the last time we seriously thought about some of the closed room constructions? Do any of our theories do much of anything to explain those? Are we going to just pretend they aren't important and don't matter? Is it because everybody feels burned by red text tricks? Faith has been shaken, so why bother trying to puzzle it out? If somebody wants to be the first to suggest intellectual dishonesty on ryukishi's part, be my guest. I'm still not totally convinced, but I'm getting there. Really, his redemption or condemnation is just a few weeks away.
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2010-08-01, 10:55 | Link #14990 | |
Dea ex Kakera
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sea of Fragments
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EDIT: A collapsing stake would theoretically be possible using the structure shown in the anime, but that structure is completely inaccurate. See the description in the game and images in the manga.
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2010-08-01, 11:07 | Link #14991 | |
Back off, I'm a scientist
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
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Imagine a reel of metallic tape, tightly wound. You can closely simulate it with a reel of 35mm photographic film if you still have such a thing. Hold the outside, push the middle out. Voila, collapsible, spiral structure. The problem with a collapsible stake, to me, is not how to make a collapsible object of such shape, it's how to hold it on the body. You can do it for Jessica's back, for this it needs a sharp point that you would stick into a board that would be beneath the clothing. I can't imagine a ready way to do this for Eva's head without lots and lots of makeup.
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2010-08-01, 11:11 | Link #14992 | |
Shall we do it?
Graphic Designer
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2010-08-01, 11:27 | Link #14993 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2009
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And considering how bloodthirsty other Ushiromiya family members can be, I wouldn't put it past any Ushiromiya to kill a person... except Battler. |
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2010-08-01, 11:29 | Link #14994 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
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2010-08-01, 11:31 | Link #14995 | |
Shall we do it?
Graphic Designer
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2010-08-01, 11:34 | Link #14996 |
Junior Detective
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Germany
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I don't think you can compare Kanon and Sakutarou. To me, Kanon is another 'being' inside Shannon, a second personality. That's why everyone is able to communicate with Shannon and Kanon respectively.
Sakutarou is more of an illusion, because he's a stuffed animal which becomes alive in Maria's imagination. |
2010-08-01, 11:37 | Link #14997 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2009
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By Episode 4, we had all the tools and information we needed to solve Umineko. In Episode 5, Ryuukishi gave us the Knox's Decalogue and proof that it was solvable. In Episode 6, he outright revealed the key which solved all the closed rooms. Well, either I hate Ryuukishi's key, or the more likely case, I'm an idiot and didn't find one. Either way, I don't have a key to solve those closed rooms, and nor do most other people on this forum. So people are still willing to put off going back to look at the closed rooms until they find what they think is the key. So yes, they did become less important to most people, so that's why most of the theories don't deal with them nowadays. |
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2010-08-01, 11:42 | Link #14998 |
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
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Renall: C’mon, take it easy, man, it’s just a story after all.
I perfectly understand where you are coming from: you hate Shkanon with a passion, so do I. However, although your write-ups against it make for a good reading, I can’t help feeling all your outrage boils down to is just a rejection on an aesthetic level. Attempts to cover this with logical reasoning look progressively less convincing; calling people names over it won’t help, either. Let’s face it: after Ep6 the prospect of Shkanon being true is, as a certain agent might have put it, “inevitable”. And it’s not because it’s the key to anything, it’s because the author says so. Yep, I’m afraid you have to blindly trust the author on that for now, and logical explanations will follow in due time. Alternatively, you are welcome to uncover and present them yourself. All you are doing now, I’m afraid, is fussing over what may eventually turn out to be a minor plot point, anyway. As for me, I’d rather prefer a game that makes 20% sense to the one that makes none, and that is what you are asking me to do if I subscribe to your reasoning. Sorry, but I don’t like to spend my time on zero payoff games, and I trust R07 won’t waste his time writing one, either. Amen. Meanwhile, let's enjoy the ride.
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2010-08-01, 11:42 | Link #14999 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2009
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However, this goes against the magical logic of the series, since Shannon, as Beatrice, is an Endless Witch, and not capable of producing a soul from nothing, like Maria can. |
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