(L) Sora no Woto

[ReddyRedWolf]

Originally Posted by Bikerider

I'm noticing that there are NO RADIOs. There are telephones on wires. That's about it.

Considering there are only 4 guys who can possibly make a lens in Heltvia a lot of skill and knowledge was lost.

Makes you wonder how the tech went retro specifically German tech. Does this mean there is library with German tech specifications somewhere?

[Solace]

Originally Posted by Vexx

Aye.. its possible there are atmospheric effects that make radio useless. Its possible radio would have been abandoned if early versions had failed to be reliable.

The other possibility is that it is simply a lost technology. Just think of how we've mostly abandoned formats like AM in favor of satellites and internet streaming. I doubt most people nowadays even understand how a radio works let alone how to build one - especially for broadcasting purposes. This could be especially true in a far off future where the radio is considered an antique format.

We see such a mix of technology in the story that it is hard to say for sure, but the glass maker does provide a hint - he's one of the top craftsman in the country and even he can't replicate a lens from ages past. He even uses an Asimov styled phrase by calling the old technology "magic".

It's quite possible the radio simply ceased to exist and the knowledge of how to build/use one was lost to the ages because a newer technology came along, but this technology was also rendered useless after the war (most likely the first one) because there just wasn't anyone left who could understand how to fix/create/use it.

So far we've been shown that newer technology isn't common, older technology is in disrepair and few know how to work with it, and education is almost nonexistent due to the fractured languages and customs.

In regards to the war, my theory for why things are in such a state is possibly due to the idea that the first war never actually "ended"...but that there was so much destruction from the earlier years that conditions just got worse and worse and things regressed backwards as there were fewer and fewer people who could man/understand the more modern tech. In addition, because of the destruction, records and educational materials were probably scarce and people who could understand and use them were probably even scarcer.

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." -Albert Einstein

[BBOvenGuy]

Okay, I finally saw the episode with subs and everything. Here are a few comments:

First, it was phenomenal. It was what I refer to as a "We're not kidding around here" episode - all this time you've thought you were watching a show about cute girls being cute, and now they've hit you over the head with something big and dark and serious. I really like shows that do that.

Next, about PTSD - You never really "get over it." You can get better, but there's always the chance something will trigger it again, and then it's like you were right back there where it all started. My sister's best friend in high school had a father who lost both his legs in Vietnam. He came back from that, had a family, built a career, even became an Episcopal priest, but then the Iraq War started, and all those reports of soldiers getting blown up by IED's triggered flashbacks that drove him to suicide.

In Filicia's case - as others have pointed out, there don't seem to be any radios left in the world. The military units have to signal each other with bugle calls, and during the battle, Filicia's job was to cover the bugler. The attack that hit them came from "3 o'clock," i.e. from the right side, where they weren't expecting it. In other words, the enemy had outflanked them. So not only does Filicia have to deal with seeing all her friends killed and the survivor's guilt of still being alive, she also has to deal with her failure to do her duty. Not that the "failure" was her fault, really, but the question of who's really "at fault" doesn't always matter.

And as for who the enemy was in the "old times," I didn't really see anything that would suggest an alien invasion. The way the few remaining humans continue to fight each other reminds me of the old H.G. Wells movie, Things To Come, and there were no aliens in that. On the other hand, I didn't see anything that conclusively ruled out an alien invasion, either. I don't think it really makes much of a difference - things went boom, and things are still going boom even though so few people are left.

So what do you suppose they have in store for us next week?

[SuperKnuckles]

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

Considering there are only 4 guys who can possibly make a lens in Heltvia a lot of skill and knowledge was lost.

Makes you wonder how the tech went retro specifically German tech. Does this mean there is library with German tech specifications somewhere?

That sounds farfetched to me, but yeah, they are having so much problems with such a simple industrial issue as making a lens, so...

Also, I have to wonder if such a catastrophic war may have downed the viability of electronic communications in the conventional sense?

[totalnet]

Spoiler for Another theory:

My theory is that there was no Aliens at all. The 1st war was between human and something like Skynet from Terminator or sentient machines from Matrix. After human some how won that 1st war. They outlaw the manufacturing and usage of hi-technology like digital computer and networks. Later on, human had forgotten both the reason for the ban and the knowledge on manufacturing hi-tech equipment.

Taking a step further, I think those monitoring structures from ep5 were meant to detect if radio signals for digital communication are being use once again. With no radio communication, messages could only be sent through the bugle. So were Takemikazuchi on the human side or not?

[Syntron]

Originally Posted by totalnet

Spoiler for Another theory:

My theory is that there was no Aliens at all. The 1st war was between human and something like Skynet from Terminator or sentient machines from Matrix. After human some how won that 1st war. They outlaw the manufacturing and usage of hi-technology like digital computer and networks. Later on, human had forgotten both the reason for the ban and the knowledge on manufacturing hi-tech equipment.

Taking a step further, I think those monitoring structures from ep5 were meant to detect if radio signals for digital communication are being use once again. With no radio communication, messages could only be sent through the bugle. So were Takemikazuchi on the human side or not?

The Spidertanks were 100% on the human side, if there was a non-human side. Just look into the tanks... seats, controls, english interface.

[Dop]

Originally Posted by Solace

He even uses an Asimov styled phrase by calling the old technology "magic".

It was Arthur C. Clarke who said "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic".

[Syntron]

Originally Posted by Dop

It was Arthur C. Clarke who said "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic dragons".

fixed it for you

[totalnet]

Originally Posted by Syntron

The Spidertanks were 100% on the human side, if there was a non-human side. Just look into the tanks... seats, controls, english interface.

Spoiler for Takemikazuchi:

While Takemikazuchi was originally built for human, it's computer system could have been taken over by some AI thru the digital network and Takemikazuchi was use against the human. Or it was shutdown thru digital network and couldn't be use at all, Battlestar Galactica style.

[klare]

another theory i think is something similar to Scrapped Princess, humans lost and were forced to live in a controlled world where their advanced technology were forgotten, a fake myth were created to make the humans think they have won... and humans continued to do what they have been doing --> fighting each other in wars

human are destined to be saved/freed by somebody who can play a certain tune with a bugle --> Rio/Kanata (the "music saving the world" feel is strong with this show)

[Solace]

Originally Posted by Dop

It was Arthur C. Clarke who said "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic".

My bad, got the quotes mixed up. I always seem to think of Asimov when I remember that one though, dunno why.

[Bikerider]

STEAM PUINK !!! that's what this show reminds me of. It's sort of 19th Century tech level with some 20th century tech mixed in.

[Shiroth]

Originally Posted by Bikerider

STEAM PUINK !!! that's what this show reminds me of. It's sort of 19th Century tech level with some 20th century tech mixed in.

Sorry to burst your bubble, though this show is far from being Steam Punk, though i can see why you'd think it.

[Bikerider]

Oh I know it isn't steam punk. It's post appocalyse aftermath. It reminds me of steam punk because of the tech level.

[Sheba]

Actually, steampunk would imply that they did not go over the steam engine, or that the electric devices are not more widespread than pre 1910-era. Let's just stick to post-apo, it's less confusing.

[SuperKnuckles]

My theory right now is:

Spoiler:

With the last generation's war, mankind has either fought an AI or simply fought eachother with advanced weaponry. From the way the old man said it, it could be construed as any human enemy side or AI. But no doubt technology in warfare was the fearsome part. Considering how the technological knowledge for electronics have fallen considerably in the recent war, perhaps the last generation's war was ended by an EMP of sorts, or strategic nuclear strikes, rendering electronics dead for perhaps many decades, rendering common knowledge of electronics defunct. And after the recent war has ended, the rest are trying to pick up the pieces and with limited electrical equipment coming back to life.

[Cosmic Eagle]

Originally Posted by totalnet

Spoiler for Takemikazuchi:

While Takemikazuchi was originally built for human, it's computer system could have been taken over by some AI thru the digital network and Takemikazuchi was use against the human. Or it was shutdown thru digital network and couldn't be use at all, Battlestar Galactica style.

Ah...but the first war shows the humans using the Takemikazuchis against the unknown enemy

[SuperKnuckles]

Regarding the human use of Takemikazuchi:

Spoiler:

Some signs perhaps that the first war's humans tried to emulate the enemy version of the Takemikazuchi? Perhaps that is why though it is a very advanced tank, it paled in comparison compared to the actual thing

[NinjaYali]

Originally Posted by BBOvenGuy

Okay, I finally saw the episode with subs and everything. Here are a few comments:

First, it was phenomenal. It was what I refer to as a "We're not kidding around here" episode - all this time you've thought you were watching a show about cute girls being cute, and now they've hit you over the head with something big and dark and serious. I really like shows that do that.

Next, about PTSD - You never really "get over it." You can get better, but there's always the chance something will trigger it again, and then it's like you were right back there where it all started. My sister's best friend in high school had a father who lost both his legs in Vietnam. He came back from that, had a family, built a career, even became an Episcopal priest, but then the Iraq War started, and all those reports of soldiers getting blown up by IED's triggered flashbacks that drove him to suicide.

In Filicia's case - as others have pointed out, there don't seem to be any radios left in the world. The military units have to signal each other with bugle calls, and during the battle, Filicia's job was to cover the bugler. The attack that hit them came from "3 o'clock," i.e. from the right side, where they weren't expecting it. In other words, the enemy had outflanked them. So not only does Filicia have to deal with seeing all her friends killed and the survivor's guilt of still being alive, she also has to deal with her failure to do her duty. Not that the "failure" was her fault, really, but the question of who's really "at fault" doesn't always matter.

And as for who the enemy was in the "old times," I didn't really see anything that would suggest an alien invasion. The way the few remaining humans continue to fight each other reminds me of the old H.G. Wells movie, Things To Come, and there were no aliens in that. On the other hand, I didn't see anything that conclusively ruled out an alien invasion, either. I don't think it really makes much of a difference - things went boom, and things are still going boom even though so few people are left.

So what do you suppose they have in store for us next week?

Yeah I was wondering about that as well. From what I've read PTSD is consistent. With Meganekko Mugi, it's on and off. Most days she's happy and smiling and normal and then one day it just starts all over again.

But I agree with the two war theory so far with a couple of changes.

Spoiler for theory remixed:

United States, (yeah I'll blame it on the US) wages war on Russia or China and in the process creates the 'fire demons' or biological weapons. China nukes Japan, Russia nukes Western Europe, US nukes back. And to make it worse, the fire demons quickly grow out of control and begin attacking the rest of humanity.

Come post apocalypse, Japanese, French and English are forced to move to Spain because parts of the world have been rendered unhabitable and hence the monoculture that started as a combination of Japanese Shinto and Celtic culture.

But, it then turns into the Post-Post Apocalyptic War as what I'll call the French-Spanish alliance has to fight say Germany (the other obvious movie villain) for resources. Both sides reverse engineer Spider Tank to create more rustic versions to fight in a destroyed urban setting and create older weapons base on what they salvage from blueprints and museums.

Germany then takes control of what little remains of Russia's nuclear arsenal and begin using tactical weapons on the enemy as well as chemical warfare which quickly pollutes the sea. Continues for maybe 3 years until the armistice.

So now the question is will we get to see what happen to the rest of the world beyond Japanese-speaking Europe.

[IMG]With the last generation's war, mankind has either fought an AI or simply fought eachother with advanced weaponry.[/IMG]
These AI you speak of, does it use robots that look like this...

Rio: We are outnumbered by machines. This is John Connor. If you are listening to this, you are the Resistance.

Next season, a Takezamuchi gets sent back in time to assassinate Rio Kazumiya before she was born. Thankfully the resistance sends back Krauss to fight off the robot and in the process gives birth to Rio. The robot is killed but in the process screws us all over as it is reverse engineered by Cyberdyne.

Season 3: Rio becomes a delinquent and another robot is sent back to kill her. Good thing this time, a reprogrammed Tank kun is sent back to protect Rio. Rio gets her mother out of an asylum where she has buffed up and together try to destroy Skynet before it is created.

Season 4: Oh noes, Skynet has not been destroyed and it sends back a femme tank to kill them all as well as her liutenants Kanata, Kureha and Noel. Rio meets her all ahem friend Felicia who is now working as a vet. Okay, they kissed in the basement before she ran away. Felicia's life is ruined when her fiance dies thanks to the tank and is chased by femme tank-x. Although she does rekindle her relationship with Rio. Meanwhile her father activates Skynet in order to stop a virus. Needless to say they are all fucked as the machines take over.

Rio and Felicia's life are saved however when they are tricked into going to a bunker thinking Skynet will be there. Somewhere in this time they get married.

And we will not acknowledge Season 5 ever will exist.

[MeoTwister5]

The thing is with PTSD is that it's usually very consistent insofar as the triggers that cause the attacks for the person are consistent in bringing out the effects whenever they happen. Having PTSD doesn't exactly mean that sufferers live with the shellshock every moment of their lives. Yes for many of them they're conscious of their memories but the sudden and intense emotional response don't usually manifest unless an event occurs that the person specifically ties to their traumatic experience. At least this goes so far to describe sudden onsets of altered mood and behavior. The psychology of the more minor alterations to the person as a result of such trauma are much harder to define, much less identity.

In that sense Felicia's attacks are realistic to the idea that there are certain events, like say the sight of blood and some injury, that makes the scars of her trauma manifest, again assuming she's really had these bouts ever since.