Mobile Suit Gundam 00 - Episode 20 Discussion / Poll

[CombiHenge]

Enjoyable paced episode.

Just prior to the appearance of the GN-X's notice that the three Trinity units were about to link up - not just Eins and Drei, but Zwei too - as you can see they all acknowledged and were moving into position. Something new.

From the preview, it appears 10 GN-X's are moving across a continent (Africa perhaps?) and 10 GN-X's are in space... looks promising.

[kari-no-sugata]

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

Even before he played the perfect villain in an episode of "The Hitchhiker", we learn even more meaningful aspects of his personality...It's almost like he has a "Last of the Samurai" or Ruroni kind of ethical standard, but obviously traveling the dark fork in that road...I thought it was really interesting to find out a large part of his sadistic nature lies in the fact he believes he's one of the last true-mercenaries around, and that this current state of events gives him an opportunity that won't come around again (Pridefully he has to embrace it--Would it be fair to say he's almost a true dichotomy to Graham??)

Probably not the way you intended it to mean, but they are the opposite in another way - Graham flatly refused a Gundam, while Ali is going begging for one. Every named pilot now has a Gundam (or will get one next ep) except those two (well, maybe Daryl too).

Billy: So, you like that Gundam?
Graham: Nah, not enough GARlic.

[Blizzer]

I didn't realise that the Gundams were e-carbon!
the power of the GN drives seems to be hugely exaggerated from what they are said to be capable of, if the ms are made out of the same thing.

There seems to be a difference in defensive capabilities of gundams vs. normal ms as well.

Im also confused about when they captured Allelujah's Gundam: the scientists had trouble analysing his suit or were they just reffering to the gn drive?

P.S. oops should have put this in Q and A, oh wellz~

[Shiroth]

Keeping Ali's little talk about his reason behind wanting a GN-X and Graham turning down the chance to pilot one, right there we have a few conclusions for the ending of this season. A final battle between Ali and Setsuna is most likely, though the interesting part is what path the two shall follow until we get to that fight --- not to mention that we have the Trinity's.

All i'm saying is that a lot of paths have been set, and i'm hoping this doesn't completely blow up in our faces. We're sure to see something truly amazing in the episodes leading upto episode 25.

As for Kinue, i'm gonna go with "we didn't see her 100% official die", so i'll keep that in my mind until we see more about her.

[dahak]

Originally Posted by Shiryuu

Anyways, now I'm confused whether it's Alejandro or Wang who gave away the free drives or maybe someone else completely.

Laguna Halvey, President of the Train Company appears to be the one responsible for gettting them into the hands of the 3 alliances.

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

Though to be honest, something is a Gundam if the model-kit box said so. That's really the only thing you can work with.

They tend to have two eyes and a V fin.

[Nanaya]

Originally Posted by squaresphere

While the HRL did a good job at repelling the Trinity, I do understand whey Sergi didn't pursue them. Simple, they suits are untried and untested not to mention even with 10 suits what could they do if the other 4 showed up? As far as he knows they're all on the same side. Also knowing that the other major powers have suits why would he make his forces take all the risk when he probably knows a joint operation to get them is already in the works?

Precisely. It's a matter of not pushing their luck.

To add, Sergei himself already had bad experiences before when he pushed Celestial Being two or three times in his past encounters with them.

And the only thing they know now is that there is a traitor in Celestial Being, not that the first set of Gundams won't cooperate with the new ones, especially since last they saw the new set, the Thrones saved the first four from capture.

I'd still be highly skeptical of any gifts from CB and it looks like only Billy and Graham are even remotely in this line of thinking.

I think it's more that Graham wants to defeat a Gundam because he made a man's oath and he's not the type to go against his words. Billy didn't seem like he had a problem with the idea of Graham becoming a GN-X pilot.

[Double_Edge]

This episode was alright. I liked the scene where Soma fights Michael. It was cool how she was finally smiling and excited about her new gundam.

But I think the BEST part of this episode definately was the last part when the alejandro and Libbons goes to Veda. The music was perfect, and alejandros voice sounded so cool at that part.
*cue guitar riffs*
"Coreh gah Veyda, Eolia Shoehenberg....Yah, Celestal Beeing konkwa oh na sheeshtem!"
*weird guy evil smile*

I don;t know, that part was just so dramamtic...and AWESOME!!!

I wonder what he is planning. It seems like his family has been planning it for a long time.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Blizzer

I didn't realise that the Gundams were e-carbon!
the power of the GN drives seems to be hugely exaggerated from what they are said to be capable of, if the ms are made out of the same thing.

There seems to be a difference in defensive capabilities of gundams vs. normal ms as well.

Im also confused about when they captured Allelujah's Gundam: the scientists had trouble analysing his suit or were they just reffering to the gn drive?

P.S. oops should have put this in Q and A, oh wellz~

The weapons, armour, and proposion of Gundams are all powered by GN particles. The GN drive generates the particles at a fix rate, though infinite in operation time. The Meister has the option of strengening one aspect of the Gundam at the price of decreasing another.

Defensively, a Gundam is tougher than other MS because the GN generates a weak forcefild on the armour. This can be intentionally made weaker if you want stronger weapons or faster acceleration. In the case of Virture, it's got an extra shield generator that could be employed over standard GN armor. However all Gundams use GN armour that have e-carbon as its standard base structure.

As for scaning Al's Gundam, the scaning equipment was unable to penetrate whatever shielding around the cockpit. That could have been intentional or sideffect of the Gundam defenses, but we would likely never find out which.

[SoldierOfDarkness]

Originally Posted by Nanaya

Precisely. It's a matter of not pushing their luck.

To add, Sergei himself already had bad experiences before when he pushed Celestial Being two or three times in his past encounters with them.

And the only thing they know now is that there is a traitor in Celestial Being, not that the first set of Gundams won't cooperate with the new ones, especially since last they saw the new set, the Thrones saved the first four from capture.

I suppose it could do with what Sergei wants to teach Soma. It's most definte that he didn't want Soma to pilot the GN-X's in the first place but was forced to because of his commander. He wants to teach her that's there's more than just fighting and such.

[Blizzer]

Ah I see I see thnx for the info,

(as for Kyrios - maybe the gundam's GN particles interfered with the scan)

Can't wait to see how the new gundams stand up to the CB four.

[Owaranai Destiny]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

I'm not sure why this would be a bad thing. The Trinitys were at their greatest disadvantage, while the GN-Xs hadn't lost any combat effectiveness. Even if the HRL lost a couple of mobile suits to wipe them out, Sergei would have been lauded as a hero.

He still is, though on a much smaller scale.

The possibility that the Thrones will fight back HARD and really damage or even destroy several GN-X's tend to cause the person in charge on hold back the reins. Having something happen like that most certainly wouldn't look good for the HRL and on a more personal level, Sergei.

Blowing up the Thrones would be even better for morale. Unfortunately, it's sort of transparent why this didn't happen.

I would agree that that one was a good opportunity, but as I see it, even though the Thrones knew that there were new units coming in to battle them, the capabilities caught them by surprise, just like how Soma Pieries' capabilities took the Meisters by surprise when they clashed much earlier. It looks different, fires a beam similar to your own, but you don't know what it's capable of in terms of speed and power. In other words, the Thrones were caught by surprise, and I'm pretty sure a regrouping when they get down to it will make them more efficient in fighting back.

Then again, if you consider the range and power of Ein's cannon with Drei and Zwei docked, one might just wonder why there wasn't an extra scene in which Sergei orders the units to give chase until they were out of a certain boundary.

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

Perhaps, but Kinue really did nothing wrong...She was an investigative reporter for the biggest news outlet in her nation...She specifically begged her boss to let her play up some angles (In this business when you do that you have to produce stories to keep that trust with your bosses)...She waited outside a public or federal building in broad daylight trying to get an investigative angle with anyone who talked to President Harvey...It's not like she was pulling a Lois Lane dressing up as one of Lex Luthor's maids or something trying to steal documents out of his titanium safe...This is pretty normal procedures for a governmental investigative reporter...Find a source and exploit it to get to the heart of the story (Something I'll assume her father reinforced with her)...Her only mistake was that she met a 1 out of a million sadistic psychopath that anyone would have mistook for an officer or agent of Laguna Harvey's office...The chick did nothing wrong in the context of good investigative journalism...Put the true blame on Ali, not her...Sneaking around in disguises and $hit trying to get this story and being caught would have put her on the kill-radar much quicker than stopping a car outside a President's building...

This is not so much pointed at you but at the scores of people that wanna bash her over the head for something most reporters would have easily done to break a career-making story...

I know. It's what gets to me, because while most of us know next to nothing about how dangerous a journalist's job can get aside from "appearing on the TV camera and sprouting out news in regards to the situation they are reporting as though they were scripted", we should try to consider the possible shit journalists can get into (imprisonment by a foreign government on the grounds of suspicion that you're a spy, getting friendly with hails of bullets etc) and whether ALL journalists would forego professionalism in their line of work over saving his/her own ass. Actually, if Kinue chickened out there and then, I would have bashed her to the lowest depths of Purgatory. It's almost like the familiar question of: "How far are you willing to go for the truth?"

Considering the fact that she's dealing with a possible financer of some terrorists, I'd say far enough.

Blame shouldn't be laid completely with Ali, though. If anything, Kinue should have checked if Lady Luck was still with her, though I'm sure this has been emphasised upon time and time again.

[06294086]

Originally Posted by sniperz

yea! now i get it too

his family was meant to be an observer for like "forever , eternity"
but until the generation like alexjandro u can see is his greed + exploit + betrayal towards Celestial Being & Veda(Aeolia Schenberg)

so alejandro and libbons are part of a traitor as u can see. they'll certainly pilot some par to par gundams to fight the gundam meisters(future battle predictions) . but i dun think they'll win but put much of a good fight as my prediction tells me.

and of coz... these observer families were like bored out and had to play around betraying. i dun like their styles.


let exia gets more matured and more powerful pilot (GN-ARMS is what i must see!) and i heard there's another godly upgrade for exia in 2nd season or whatever u could call it.

hope setsuna and the gang can totally pawn the 10 GN-X for the time being.

they seem to put a fight already to the gundam thrones. lol.. traitors in celestial being are stupid humans made out of bore i guess > alejandro or either libbons.

and this lagna harvey guy seems to be a major stockholder so his a big president playing a part of "evil role" and may linked to celestial being too. but part of it is his quite neutral from my point of view.


i hope episode 21's battle will be interesting and from 21 onwards, the climax of battle!!

wat im waiting is they're retrieving GN-Arms for exia.. woahh... thats the time to pawn time!





well basically due to a darn traitor in CB that the world power has advantages to level the field now. or otherwise gundam meisters are still winning :P i guess that's how usually human acts and roles run for world power and organisation.

Seems like traitor in CB wants to overtake Aeolia Schenberg's power and origin of Veda. meh. hope tat traitor gets owned by setsuna for real!

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Aeolia is definitely NOT INNOCENT as you think. Remember that Aeolia's real goal is NOT erradication of war.

Allejandro simply wants to move forward his own plan and Vader is simply in his way.

Even the meister's team "real goal" and Aeolia's "real goal" is different...

There no such thing as traitor or betrayal...

So far there are 3 factions in CB, each with their own goals :
1. The meisters - Goal : To erradicate war
2. The thrones + Lagna(+Wang Liu Mei) - Goal : Aeolia's ideals (?)
3. Allejandro + Libbons = Goal : ???

Each factions in CB has their own agenda : The meister's team, The thrones + Lagna(+Wang Liu Mei), Allejandro + Libbons.

So far it's clear that the faction which follows Aeolia's plan are the thrones + Lagna. That's why Wang Liu Mei join them because she also follows Aeolia's ideals.

The meisters team still hold to their goal which was "CB's publicized goal"
to erradicate war. The reason why they join CB is because they think that CB "publicized goal" which is to erradicate war is the "real goal". They still don't know that they're only being used...

Out of the 3 main factions of CB, the meisters are the closest one to the "white side", the other two; even Aeolia are closer to the "black side"

Originally Posted by Blizzer

She also said she doesn't care how it changes even if it means you need to break it, she's willing to turn the world into chaos to satisfy her need for change I don't think she's as innocent as you think.

Anyways, I don't understand why the GN-X were classed as Gundams because of the GN drive, isn't what makes a Gundam the superior alloy it's made of?

Hopefully the secret weapons Celestial Being has will be enough to pwn those noob wannabe-gundams - it seems though that the only edge the GN-X has is it's high mobility.

When both sides in conflict are not so much different in specs and mobility; number of MS, raw piloting/fighting skill, teamwork/combined attacks and war strategy will be the main factors that decide the outcome of a battle.

Non-meisters/thrones aces from the 3 power blocks are superior in raw piloting skills compared to the meisters and the thrones. Not to mention that they have more MSes with specs that are at least at par with the gundams. Adding to that, commanders such as Sergei having superior strategies. Of course the meisters have a very very hard times dealing with them...

The meisters and the thrones are saved so far by the vast gap in capability/specs between gundams and MS without GN drives...

As why the GN-Xes are called "gundam"; I think this is only to differenciate between MSes with GN drive and those without one.

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

The weapons, armour, and proposion of Gundams are all powered by GN particles. The GN drive generates the particles at a fix rate, though infinite in operation time. The Meister has the option of strengening one aspect of the Gundam at the price of decreasing another.

Defensively, a Gundam is tougher than other MS because the GN generates a weak forcefild on the armour. This can be intentionally made weaker if you want stronger weapons or faster acceleration. In the case of Virture, it's got an extra shield generator that could be employed over standard GN armor. However all Gundams use GN armour that have e-carbon as its standard base structure.

As for scaning Al's Gundam, the scaning equipment was unable to penetrate whatever shielding around the cockpit. That could have been intentional or sideffect of the Gundam defenses, but we would likely never find out which.

I also agree, just imagine e-carbon as a much advanced version of carbon nanotubes

Current carbon nanotubes are much harder than diamond and much lighter than steel. They are also extremely pliable/flexible. Just imagine if its much advanced version used in MS production

Adding to that, the GN particle form some sort of field barrier which makes the gundams impenetrable to normal weapons.

I think the reason why a gundam can easily do damage to other gundams is like the field (I forget the name) used in Evangelion. The evangelions and the angels can hurt each other since each of them have same type of field and the field will disappear when they're in contact...

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by Nanaya

Precisely. It's a matter of not pushing their luck.

To add, Sergei himself already had bad experiences before when he pushed Celestial Being two or three times in his past encounters with them.

The situations are different in that Sergei got into trouble because he tried to be cute and capture the Gundams. If he had been trying to destroy them, he would have probably succeeded.

In this case, there's not a whole lot to gain from capturing the Thrones, and they already held all the advantages.

Originally Posted by Nanaya

And the only thing they know now is that there is a traitor in Celestial Being, not that the first set of Gundams won't cooperate with the new ones, especially since last they saw the new set, the Thrones saved the first four from capture.

They already knew that there was a falling out between the two groups. Besides, they had to have a semi-reliable method of figuring out the Gundams' general location by now; otherwise, the GN-Xs shouldn't have been able to get there before the Trinitys completed their attack.

Originally Posted by Owaranai Destiny

He still is, though on a much smaller scale.

The possibility that the Thrones will fight back HARD and really damage or even destroy several GN-X's tend to cause the person in charge on hold back the reins. Having something happen like that most certainly wouldn't look good for the HRL and on a more personal level, Sergei.

This largely depends on whether Sergei's orders were "Engage the enemy, and destroy them if possible." or "Engage the enemy so that they learn about our secret weapons, but don't inflict any serious damage on them."

The Trinitys had already been reduced to about half their firepower without the GN-Xs taking any damage. If they had pressed this advantage, even if the HRL were to lose a couple of their mobile suits, all of the Gundams would have been destroyed. I'm not sure how that could be construed as anything other than a major success.

And if we look at the tally sheets:
A. A destroyed mobile suit base vs. the Thrones driven off with minor damage suffered.
B. A destroyed mobile suit base and 2 dead GN-Xs vs. the annihilation of the Thrones.

Originally Posted by Owaranai Destiny

I would agree that that one was a good opportunity, but as I see it, even though the Thrones knew that there were new units coming in to battle them, the capabilities caught them by surprise, just like how Soma Pieries' capabilities took the Meisters by surprise when they clashed much earlier. It looks different, fires a beam similar to your own, but you don't know what it's capable of in terms of speed and power. In other words, the Thrones were caught by surprise, and I'm pretty sure a regrouping when they get down to it will make them more efficient in fighting back.

It's the other way around: it takes a certain amount of time to be able to adapt to new conditions like this, while it's completely in the attackers' favor to press the advantage. In classical military tactics, that extra bit of effort is what turns a retreat into a rout.

Originally Posted by Owaranai Destiny

Then again, if you consider the range and power of Ein's cannon with Drei and Zwei docked, one might just wonder why there wasn't an extra scene in which Sergei orders the units to give chase until they were out of a certain boundary.

The most probable reason is that it'd be obvious to many viewers that in the Thrones' weakened state, they couldn't have gotten away unless they were much faster.

Originally Posted by Owaranai Destiny

Actually, if Kinue chickened out there and then, I would have bashed her to the lowest depths of Purgatory. It's almost like the familiar question of: "How far are you willing to go for the truth?"

You're bringing up a bit of a false dilemma. It's quite possible for Kinue to have researched Ragna's involvement with Celestial Being without making herself out as such an obvious target.

Originally Posted by 06294086

So far there are 3 factions in CB, each with their own goals :
1. The meisters - Goal : To erradicate war
2. The thrones + Lagna(+Wang Liu Mei) - Goal : Aeolia's ideals (?)
3. Allejandro + Libbons = Goal : ???

Actually, the Trinitys and Liu Mei (and presumably Ragna) all have the goal of eradicating war as well. The difference is that the creators are taking pains to portray one group as villains.

[Owaranai Destiny]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

And if we look at the tally sheets:
A. A destroyed mobile suit base vs. the Thrones driven off with minor damage suffered.
B. A destroyed mobile suit base and 2 dead GN-Xs vs. the annihilation of the Thrones.

Ah, what the heck...There are too many 'maybes' for me here. I'll just end it here. I'm not protesting against the logic of your argument, but if there is a reason (and I consider there to be one, seeing as Sergei don't usually make too many tactical errors. Or at least that's what I think), it ought to be a valid enough for him to grab what you consider as a 'certain victory'.

It's the other way around: it takes a certain amount of time to be able to adapt to new conditions like this, while it's completely in the attackers' favor to press the advantage. In classical military tactics, that extra bit of effort is what turns a retreat into a rout.

Assuming, also, that the GN-X's are able to catch up, set up formations and put the tactics into good use. I wouldn't as much as doubt Sergei to whether he knows what he's doing on the battlefield, but is it a guarantee that his squadron can catch up to them and destroy the Thrones?

You're bringing up a bit of a false dilemma. It's quite possible for Kinue to have researched Ragna's involvement with Celestial Being without making herself out as such an obvious target.

Ah. "How" is what I want to ask. The shitty thing about her situation is we don't know how much effort she has put in, what she has been doing to get her hands on as much information as possible and what orthodox and unorthodox methods she might have used, considering whether she would even advocate the usage of the latter at all.

[edf91]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

The Trinitys had already been reduced to about half their firepower without the GN-Xs taking any damage. If they had pressed this advantage, even if the HRL were to lose a couple of their mobile suits, all of the Gundams would have been destroyed. I'm not sure how that could be construed as anything other than a major success.

What Sergei doesn't know whether there is reinforcement - they really don't need more surprises if the other 4 Gundam show up - 7 to 10 isn't that good of odds, especially when they were on the losing end for so long.

Originally Posted by 4Tran

They already knew that there was a falling out between the two groups. Besides, they had to have a semi-reliable method of figuring out the Gundams' general location by now; otherwise, the GN-Xs shouldn't have been able to get there before the Trinitys completed their attack.

When was this shown? We know about it because of the fight between Exia and Throne, but the rest of the world don't know that - they were fighting in the middle of nowhere, and with the GN particle jamming, how in the world did they know both group don't really work together? I am sure they might suspect something, since the original 4 Gundams don't show up for a while, but they cannot be certain they break off.

Originally Posted by 4Tran

It's the other way around: it takes a certain amount of time to be able to adapt to new conditions like this, while it's completely in the attackers' favor to press the advantage. In classical military tactics, that extra bit of effort is what turns a retreat into a rout.

And it can also lead to a trap - we know there isn't one in this case, but you cannot guarantee there isn't a trap, and whether you can handle it. Yes, it is probably a good move, but typically speaking, unless you have backup or you are really reckless, you don't just blindly go about chasing retreating enemies. If you outnumber them 100 to 1, then I guess you can safely go ahead and do it

Originally Posted by 4Tran

You're bringing up a bit of a false dilemma. It's quite possible for Kinue to have researched Ragna's involvement with Celestial Being without making herself out as such an obvious target.

I think it's hard to argue this point - we didn't know whether Kinue already used up all her resources doing "the other way" before she does it this way. If CB is really being secretive, I doubt they don't know about her by now, as she is not trained to be a spy, so I cannot imagine her outsmarting CB, since CB is so secretive for so long even Union cannot really dig enough dirt on them.

Originally Posted by 4Tran

Actually, the Trinitys and Liu Mei (and presumably Ragna) all have the goal of eradicating war as well. The difference is that the creators are taking pains to portray one group as villains.

Unless various website translation is wrong, we just know that Wang want change in the world, and she doesn't care if a lot of people die in the process. Whether that is equal to no war (I thought people were saying there are no major conflict before the series start), we don't know. Yes, the Throne pilots seem to think they are trying to get rid of wars.

[SuperKnuckles]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

She already suspected the guy of being a financial backer for terrorists; and anyone who could give her more information on that angle would be involved up to their eyeballs. Prudence is supposed to be part of a reporter's repretoire, but it was sorely lacking in Kinue's portrayal.

Considering how desperate Kinue was for a lead, I don't think prudence was really in her. Also, a lot of war reporters in real life aren't exactly known for prudence, but their sheer ability to dig the dirt. Kinue did accomplish a lot, though I think it's just the inherent danger of the job. I would not keep saying that she was a failure of a reporter like everyone keeps saying it is.

They were soldiers. Their job is not to make themselves look good and to scare their enemies - it's to destroy them.

Did I say anything else? The fact of the matter is that CB and its Gundams had that luxury of being able to scare enemies and create a psychological shock effect for enemies. Now that is gone. And that's probably the most crucial thing for CB all along (it's been like what, a year?).

Though if you ask me, I think GN Arms and other sneaky arsenals of CB may turn the game to their favor. Also, the all-purpose GN suits for UN Army probably doesn't come with nearly as much tricks up the sleeve of CB suits. I'd be pretty disappointed if that isn't the case. Barring the obvious benefits of Nadleeh if it can influence other GN suits.

[Nanaya]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

The situations are different in that Sergei got into trouble because he tried to be cute and capture the Gundams. If he had been trying to destroy them, he would have probably succeeded.

And your basis on that is what? Yes, the Gundams could be pushed around with their projectile weaponry, but no weapon other than their carbon blades could even possibly harm a Gundam.

The only thing that he could be sure of destroying at any point is Noriega's spaceship with a Transport ram. That's all.

In this case, there's not a whole lot to gain from capturing the Thrones, and they already held all the advantages.

No, they did not know that. All that Sergei knew at that point was that the GN-X could match up to the Thrones. And that by piloting skill alone, the Gundams were nothing to be feared of anymore.

But this IS the first sortie of the GN-X. It is tactically sound not to push your luck. And even if he only lost a few GN-Xs in exchange for destroying the Thrones, who knows if the the Original Four may come to the Thrones' rescue like the Thrones' did for them during Taklamakan? (before you argue this point, read below)

Sergei would bet his finite GN-Xs to finish off the Thrones while the other powers still retain a full set? I don't think so.

Strategically, that would be wrong.

They already knew that there was a falling out between the two groups.

Whoa there. Just whoa. You're getting pretty much ahead of yourself there.

Nowhere in the series does it even say the powers know that the two Gundam groups are against each other. NOWHERE.

The only thing they know is that there is a traitor from Celestial Being that gave them the GN-X.

Besides, they had to have a semi-reliable method of figuring out the Gundams' general location by now; otherwise, the GN-Xs shouldn't have been able to get there before the Trinitys completed their attack.

Laguna seemingly provided the GN-X to the powers secretly using Ali as a delivery boy. The Thrones take orders from Laguna.

Hmm...

The most probable reason is that it'd be obvious to many viewers that in the Thrones' weakened state, they couldn't have gotten away unless they were much faster.

Or they just got out of the rifles' range. Before Sergei did stop them, they weren't firing anymore.

[Ichimaru]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

Actually, the Trinitys and Liu Mei (and presumably Ragna) all have the goal of eradicating war as well. The difference is that the creators are taking pains to portray one group as villains.

Meisters and trinitys belong in the same group, just that one group is made to look like obsolete, while the other is portrayed as the villians.

Wang liu mei is like ragna, she has the resources and money, and she backs anyside. She could be the one that gave away the information regarding the GN DRIVES. WANG AND HONGLONG and the green hair dude next to alejandro, probably belong to the same group of ppl...they can walk in out access veda like its nothing.

Now back to GUNDAM talk

looks like the HRL soldiers can withstand the GFORCE of the custom flags,

i wanna see graham in that new flag with GN drives, CAUSE his body wasnt able to handle teh gforce in the custom ones.....or did the author forgot about gforce related to HRL soldiers, since therse only one supersoldier only in the group.

[JediNight]

I don't think you quite understand how they work Ichimaru. GN drives essentially cancel out G-forces for the pilot of the suit. That's the only major difference in capabilities between them.

[LoweGear]

Originally Posted by JediNight

I don't think you quite understand how they work Ichimaru. GN drives essentially cancel out G-forces for the pilot of the suit. That's the only major difference in capabilities between them.

Unproven speculation with no basis in the show itself or in official technical data. There is no evidence to suggest any sort of GN Drive induced "G-Force Dampening" effect in the show, in fact the show itself suggests otherwise with Setsuna feeling the G's when he takes off at high speed with Exia in episode 8.