Learning Japanese

[oompa loompa]

Originally Posted by iLney

Halp!

My flashcards turn into Japanese only

Question: 急がしですから、掃除の時間がありません

Explanation : いそがしですから、そうじのじかんがありません.

Can I translate it as "Hurry up! There is no time for cleaning" ?

But から here means?....

急がし = hurry up right? (I only know the kanji...)

Edit: いそがし, when I saw this, I thought of "busy" but it didn't match kanji. However, it fit well with "から." => "I am busy. To hell with cleaning"

err... if you translate that literally, いそがしですから、そうじのじかんがありません, doesnt it simply translate to, i dont have time for laundry because i am busy ( or am in a hurry )? - to be more specific, i'm asking why it doesnt translate to that

[iLney]

Just want to be creative You are right though. The sentence is not that rude If it were something rather than ありません, would my translation be more reasonable?

Thank you two very much. Maybe it was a mistake....

[wao]

から here would mean "because" or "_____, so _____" here. Like "dakara" or "desukara" which is really "copula + kara" on its own...
Not the から meaning "from" (e.g. お父さんからプレゼントをもらった)

Similar examples: 暑いから水をたくさん飲んでね。
It's hot so drink lots of water.

時間がないから後に電話します。
I have no time so I'll call later.

気持ち悪いからやめて。
That's disgusting so stop it.

気持ち悪かったからやめた。
It was disgusting so I stopped it.

A similar but more polite bit of grammar would be ので, I believe.
忙しいですから、掃除の時間がありません。
忙しいですので、掃除の時間がありません。

[RandomGuy]

Originally Posted by oompa loompa

err... if you translate that literally, いそがしですから、そうじのじかんがありません, doesnt it simply translate to, i dont have time for laundry because i am busy ( or am in a hurry )? - to be more specific, i'm asking why it doesnt translate to that

Well, for one thing, "laundry" is 洗濯（せんたく）and not 掃除, which means "cleaning" in the sense of a room or similar. Also, "いそがし" is the Classical form of 忙しい, and at any rate is never used with the kanji 急. (While the adjective is regularly derived from the verb 急ぐ, it means "busy" and uses the Chinese character to match.)

[oompa loompa]

Originally Posted by RandomGuy

Well, for one thing, "laundry" is 洗濯（せんたく）and not 掃除, which means "cleaning" in the sense of a room or similar. Also, "いそがし" is the Classical form of 忙しい, and at any rate is never used with the kanji 急. (While the adjective is regularly derived from the verb 急ぐ, it means "busy" and uses the Chinese character to match.)

whoops - i yeah i knew that. my mistake ( difference b/w せんたく and 掃除 ) , well yeah, the kanji dont match, so is the sentence just incorrect? - if いそがし is as in 忙しい is used, then its fairly straightforward, but what does it mean now?

[Ryuou]

I think the wrong kanji was just being used for いそがしい.

[iLney]

Originally Posted by RandomGuy

Also, "いそがし" is the Classical form of 忙しい, and at any rate is never used with the kanji 急. (While the adjective is regularly derived from the verb 急ぐ, it means "busy" and uses the Chinese character to match.)

Ah, this information is yummy

Thank you all^_^

Edit:

ヘレン： 東京の電車はいつも混んでいますか？

混んでいますか?

Can I replace でいますか by ですか?

And "混ん"? Is 混 alone read "kon"?

Edit 2:

学生は中島さんと洋子さんです

Uhm, is this the normal way people say it in Japan?

[wao]

Originally Posted by iLney

Ah, this information is yummy

Thank you all^_^

Edit:

ヘレン： 東京の電車はいつも混んでいますか？

混んでいますか?

Can I replace でいますか by ですか?
And "混ん"? Is 混 alone read "kon"?

For the first one, no. Go learn your verb conjugations again... There is no such thing as 混んですか, only 混みますか, 混んで, etc.

Split 混んでいます into 混んで (-te form of 混む) and います (I'm sure you know this).　Following this you can use 混んでいる.
Using -te form + imasu/iru implies that whatever verb it is is happening. Forgot the fancy name for it, present participle or something...

When describing the train in everyday speech you don't say 電車は混みます (dictionary form) because then it sounds funny, like it's going to be crowded or is sometimes crowded but not necessarily right now. If someone said 東京の電車は混みますね I'd take it as "Tokyo's trains do get crowded", but 東京の電車は混んでいますね it would be more like "the train(s) in Tokyo is crowded".

Whether to use 混んでいますか or 混みますか depends on the situation. Are the trains always crowded? Do the trains always get crowded? I think that's the difference between the two.

Some examples of -te + iru
くすりが効く
The medicine works
くすりが効いている
The medicine is working.

鳥が鳴く
The bird chirps
鳥が鳴いている
The bird is chirping.

Also, 混 is "kon" when it's not a verb, like 混乱, 混沌, 混迷... but stop reading kanji separately from the verb conjugates, read it together as 混んで(います). 混む→混んで→混んでいます

学生は中島さんと洋子さんです

Uhm, is this the normal way people say it in Japan?

aohige'd be more qualified to comment but it doesn't sound egregiously wrong What are you trying to say? Whether it's normal or not depends on that... One thing is why is one person referred to by surname (Nakajima) and the other by given name (Youko)? That's a little odd. It's like saying the participants at this IT conference are Mr. Gates and Mr. Steve.

[iLney]

Thank you.　I don't learn grammar so...

Next question!

々: what is this?

Ninja? It's neither kana nor kanji?　And it's chibi!

Edit: Wait! 混　in my example sentence was verb???

I put "desu" coz I thought it was an adj....

[Tri-ring]

Originally Posted by iLney

Thank you.　I don't learn grammar so...

Next question!

々: what is this?

Ninja? It's neither kana nor kanji?　And it's chibi!

Edit: Wait! 混　in my example sentence was verb???

I put "desu" coz I thought it was an adj....

It's used as a kanji to repeat the kanji right beforehand　to intensify the meaning like
赤々、青々、滾々、etc.

[iLney]

So if it appears after the Kanji, I will just have to repeat the kanji twice?

In the sentence I found it, 時々 reads "ときどき" though...

[Raiga]

Originally Posted by iLney

So if it appears after the Kanji, I will just have to repeat the kanji twice?

In the sentence I found it, 時々 reads "ときどき" though...

This has to do with a pattern where the first kana in a kanji reading becomes voiced when it's at the end of a kanji combination... or something of the sort. Like 人々 is read ひとびと, where you'll notice the ひ gains the dakuten.

[Tri-ring]

Originally Posted by iLney

So if it appears after the Kanji, I will just have to repeat the kanji twice?

In the sentence I found it, 時々 reads "ときどき" though...

That's right.
Dakuon is considered the same.

[Ryuou]

学生は中島さんと洋子さんです

Uhm, is this the normal way people say it in Japan?

It would be normal if you were answering the question, "Who are the students?" But if you were just making a normal statement about them being students, then it's a little weird not to have them as the subjects of your sentence. And then you have the thing with the names, but that depends on situation really.

[whitepearl]

Originally Posted by Tri-ring

It's used as a kanji to repeat the kanji right beforehand　to intensify the meaning like
赤々、青々、滾々、etc.

It's used in Chinese but, as far as I know, it functions more like ditto marks. Rather than write two words consecutively (like the characters for "father" or "mother"), the first one is written and then 々 is added.

Japanese names have these as well, right? The names "Sasaki" and "Nanako" come to mind as names that use that character.

[RandomGuy]

Originally Posted by whitepearl

Japanese names have these as well, right? The names "Sasaki" and "Nanako" come to mind as names that use that character.

As has been mentioned before, 々 is the iteration mark for kanji, which means that the previous kanji is repeated. It's used frequently in Japanese for reduplication, which serves to intensify or pluralize a word by repeating it. You see it in words like 人々 (people)、日々 (days) 時々 (sometimes)、etc. Other times, it's just to avoid having to write the same kanji twice, as I assume is the case in the names 佐々木 and 奈々.

Japanese technically also has a hiragana iteration mark, ゝ which can also be combined with dakuten to show voicing, as in the car company いすゞ (Isuzu). It has become exceedingly rare in modern writing, as the norm is now simply to write the kana out in full. The katakana equivalent, ヽ, is used in the same way as its hiragana counterpart, but is virtually nonexistent these days.

In vertical writing, there's also an iteration mark for two kana at a stretch, which looks like an extra-tall く (with or without dakuten). Again, this is uncommon in modern Japanese, possibly because it's annoying to typeset as it has to be broken in two to fit the usual square spaces for Japanese text.

[Circular Logic]

Originally Posted by RandomGuy

In vertical writing, there's also an iteration mark for two kana at a stretch, which looks like an extra-tall く (with or without dakuten). Again, this is uncommon in modern Japanese, possibly because it's annoying to typeset as it has to be broken in two to fit the usual square spaces for Japanese text.

You can also dakuten half of it for even more fun.

[wao]

Originally Posted by iLney

Edit: Wait! 混　in my example sentence was verb???

I put "desu" coz I thought it was an adj....

Yes it was a verb, 混む (komu). Keep reading more and more Japanese sentences and try picking out the verbs, no matter how they are conjugated, either in your head or using highlighters. I've never done that but if you keep noticing verbs you'll figure out how to identify them without much difficulty

You may start noticing patterns like んで after a kanji, which would usually mean it's a -te form of a verb that "ends" with む, ぶ, ぬ. Personally I got the hang of verb conjugation by having to check them up on WWWJDIC so many times...

[Ryuou]

Originally Posted by RandomGuy

Japanese technically also has a hiragana iteration mark, ゝ which can also be combined with dakuten to show voicing, as in the car company いすゞ (Isuzu). It has become exceedingly rare in modern writing, as the norm is now simply to write the kana out in full. The katakana equivalent, ヽ, is used in the same way as its hiragana counterpart, but is virtually nonexistent these days.

Wow, I didn't know that. Interesting. Guess that goes to show how unused it is these days.

[Circular Logic]

Originally Posted by Ryuou

Wow, I didn't know that. Interesting. Guess that goes to show how unused it is these days.

It's actually quite commonly used in some words like 日々、時々、人々、木々、様々, and in some names like Suzuki. Katakana doubler/double reduplicator is generally only for old stuff.

EDIT: Oh wait, I misread, thought you were talking about the kanji duplicator. You generally only find hiragana duplicators in old stuff too