(CR) Hibike! Euphonium Season 2

[Romanticide]

They would not have supported her. As someone who has been kicked out before, parents are serious about this, and in this case he would have. It's either listen to what they say or you'll be homeless.

Originally Posted by BleedingUranium

Kumiko is going to have to realize pretty soon here that while she can't turn back time to tell Mamiko to make the right decision, there is something else she can do. She can stop Asuka from making the same mistake.

Don't see how that will work out well, since Asuka's mom physically abuses her.

[SleepingTerror]

Originally Posted by dinodiner

At this point (as compared to being just graduated from high school), Mamiko is an adult - he expects her to support her decisions on her own strength.

Yet he refuses to acknowledge his own mistake. He basically blamed Mamiko for listening to him, which is hypocritical. Instead of aiding her like he should have a couple years back, he chooses to abandon her instead. Yes Mamiko is an adult, but she wasn't an adult when this issue began. And she isn't just any adult, she's their daughter. It'd be one thing if he was doing this because he thought it was better for Mamiko, to grow up and become fully responsible for herself. But he's not, he's doing it as some kind of punishment.

[deadite]

I'm liking the themes an parallism of this episode. It comes back to the theme of being quitting and being special. I remember Asukas words about Mizore using Yuuko as insurance when we realize that Kumiko is using Reina as a surrogate for the old Mamiko. I love how Aoi was brought back to be used as an allegory about the decision of quitting. These interweaving of story arcs is really good.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by SleepingTerror

Yet he refuses to acknowledge his own mistake. He basically blamed Mamiko for listening to him, which is hypocritical. Instead of aiding her like he should have a couple years back, he chooses to abandon her instead. Yes Mamiko is an adult, but she wasn't an adult when this issue began. And she isn't just any adult, she's their daughter. It'd be one thing if he was doing this because he thought it was better for Mamiko, to grow up and become fully responsible for herself. But he's not, he's doing it as some kind of punishment.

Yeah. That. He refuses to take responsibility for the pressure he put on his high school daughter and the way the choices he forced on her trapped her.

I also get the feeling that maybe, for all those choices, her parents promised her that things would get better "later". A later that never came, and never would come.

[BBOvenGuy]

This was my favorite episode of the season so far. And coincidentally, it's Episode 8 again. Not as stunning as last year's Episode 8, but still good.

Regarding Mamiko... well, I'm going to be old for a minute, and reminisce about the fact that I almost quit college with one year to go, because I'd had some success as a writer and wanted to do that instead of being an engineer. My parents forced me to go back - and thirty years later, I'm very glad they did. These days, my engineer training supports my writing. Just sayin'.

Mamiko is going through a difficult point in her life, so it's no surprise that she's grumpy and questioning everything. She'll get through it.

It was good to see Reina and Midori get some attention. They were the characters that interested me most in S1, and they've been woefully underused in S2.

And as for Shuichi... well, it was nice to see him not being useless. I have a theory forming about him, but I'll keep it to myself for now. Unless I go over to the LN thread, that is.

[BleedingUranium]

Originally Posted by BBOvenGuy

And as for Shuichi... well, it was nice to see him not being useless. I have a theory forming about him, but I'll keep it to myself for now. Unless I go over to the LN thread, that is.

Would you mind sharing it here once it's not (potentially) a spoiler?

As for Mamiko, unlike Asuka's situation I don't think this one is supposed to be as clear-cut. Both sides are to blame, but neither are "wrong", it's just an unfortunate situation that's come of past decisions/mistakes on both sides.

As I see it as something Kumiko is supposed to take as a lesson learned and bring that to solving Asuka's issues, that makes sense. I don't think Mamiko's issues is going to be "resolved" in the same way, no one can undo those mistakes, but everyone involved can mend damaged relationships, and that's something at least.

[dinodiner]

I think my view has changed. Mamiko being made to change schools in addition to giving up on music band makes it appear that her life was controlled like a marionette. She found the courage to defy her parents only in the second year of college unlike Asuka who is trying to do so in third year of high school.

I still think applying parental pressure is par for the course in all families but certainly not to the limit applied on Mamiko - even the father acknowledged it being "a lot". But why didn't Mamiko stand up for herself earlier? We will never know what would have happened if Mamiko had refused to take college exams. The father's phrase saying Mamiko was "the one who decided to take the exams" and Mamiko's look (I think it is bitterness and frustration at having missed an oppurtunity to break free) at that are loaded with possibilities.

So I think the father should be faulted - heavily - for refusing to stand by his daughter once she decided to think and act for herself, even at this late stage given that they controlled her life so excessively earlier. I guess the shock of two years of expenses wasted and his daughter's future suddenly being ambiguous is not allowing the father to get his daughter's feelings.

Like @BleedingUranium says, the past is done, and I am looking forward to how the bridges would be mended.

[Bordix]

Mamiko asking for a recording of Kumiko's playing was definately the highlight of the episode. It was a touching and heart-warming scene, got quite emotional there.

I'm surprised Shuichi went to visit Kumiko considering his presence physically hurts her so it might do more harm than good (I can already hear the loud moaning sounds when he messages her through the intercom) He definitely did earn some points by reminding Mamiko of the past and might have salvaged the sisters relationship which was getting worse and worse. Reina was also conveniently there to witness his crowning and GODLIKE achievement. Maybe this time he'll finally settle whatever issue there is with Kumiko but knowing Kyoani who's fond of hitting the reset button I won't be surprised if we're back to zero again. Can't develop their relationship as it might cause an apocalypse

[Romanticide]

Originally Posted by dinodiner

I think my view has changed. Mamiko being made to change schools in addition to giving up on music band makes it appear that her life was controlled like a marionette. She found the courage to defy her parents only in the second year of college unlike Asuka who is trying to do so in third year of high school.

I still think applying parental pressure is par for the course in all families but certainly not to the limit applied on Mamiko - even the father acknowledged it being "a lot". But why didn't Mamiko stand up for herself earlier? We will never know what would have happened if Mamiko had refused to take college exams. The father's phrase saying Mamiko was "the one who decided to take the exams" and Mamiko's look (I think it is bitterness and frustration at having missed an oppurtunity to break free) at that are loaded with possibilities.

So I think the father should be faulted - heavily - for refusing to stand by his daughter once she decided to think and act for herself, even at this late stage given that they controlled her life so excessively earlier. I guess the shock of two years of expenses wasted and his daughter's future suddenly being ambiguous is not allowing the father to get his daughter's feelings.

Like @BleedingUranium says, the past is done, and I am looking forward to how the bridges would be mended.

Given his threats of disowning/kicking her out now, he probably did that shit then too. Also Japan is really really bad with parents who want their kids to succeed for them, to the point of making them drop any and all activities outside of studying and college exams. That's why cram schools are a thing.

[deadite]

Shuichi lives in the same building actually.

[Sixth]

Another nice episode. I don't really like how Shuichi played a role in the sisters, but it was nice to see Mamiko remembered that she was Kumiko's inspiration to play concert band. She asking for Kumiko's CD was an emotional scene. I hope that Mamiko will stop treating her sister like a crap in future episode. It would be great if Mamiko come and watch the Nationals in upcoming episode. And wow, Shuichi is really tall. If I don't know better, I would have thought that Mamiko and Shuichi were a couple in that part.

I knew it is kinda late to ask this but....is Asuka's mother is a widow? She said that she raised Asuka alone or something like that in the last episode.

It must be genetic...Kumiko and Mamiko have a nice fluffy hair, and why is the sisters have different hair color than their parent again?

[Arya]

Originally Posted by BBOvenGuy

Regarding Mamiko... well, I'm going to be old for a minute, and reminisce about the fact that I almost quit college with one year to go, because I'd had some success as a writer and wanted to do that instead of being an engineer. My parents forced me to go back - and thirty years later, I'm very glad they did. These days, my engineer training supports my writing. Just sayin'.

Mamiko is going through a difficult point in her life, so it's no surprise that she's grumpy and questioning everything. She'll get through it.

I'm holding back my judgement for now, leaning toward your position. Not saying Mamiko's father is in the right, but I can see the reasons he is acting in this way now that she has just an year left.
And Kumiko successes should have reawakened Mamiko's frustrations.

Not sure how this situation can be comparable to Asuka's in term of similar resolutions. But given the big hint of the episode about her and her situation, the real point of Asuka's mother also may not be "rational", but emotional. If this is it, I can see the show giving Kumiko the opportunity to share her experience enlightening and pushing her to let it go. But I'm not sure I'd like to see it resolved so easily. Surely I'm expecting Kumiko to meet her mother despite what Asuka said. I'm also curious to see if Asuka will explain what she sees in Kumiko.

Sad, but glad to see that the band it's still having an hard time to go back on track. Asuka's absence really hit them. I hope she will stop with this "I wont be a problem" thing, because she is an issue, better would be to address it with the whole group. Of course, as we already knew, Asuka arranged to make her dismissal less complicated for Taki and the band when instructed beforehand Natsuki. But it's more a technicality in comparison.

Finally, Shuuichi, finally has been your turn. (uff, after this episode I think the show really should have given him more room instead of say, the Mizore and Nozomi arc). Anyhow I hope he will have some role in the resolution of Kumiko / Mamiko's situation. And he already made his first move. Curious to see if the show will go back to show us if Shuuichi met with Reina and if he met Kumiko after that (I don't think so about the latter).

We got another take of Mamiko's situation in Aoi, who apparently at the end of her conversation with Kumiko seemed ambiguously pleased to know about Asuka problems, or I got it in the wrong way?

ETA:

Originally Posted by deadite

Shuichi lives in the same building actually.

Really, because it was framed as he and Mamiko never met each other from a very while. Didn't Shuuichi went to her apartment specifically?

Originally Posted by Sixth

I knew it is kinda late to ask this but....is Asuka's mother is a widow? She said that she raised Asuka alone or something like that in the last episode.

I thought it too when we first met her, but this episode seems to hint otherwise if you couple it to Asuka's mother remarks during the previous ep.

[Sixth]

^ well Asuka's mother could have divorce with her husband, i guess?

Forgot to mention it in my previous post.... do you think that the name of euphonium cd, is Asuka's father?

Kumiko and Reina said that the cd music sounded similar to Asuka's euphonium.

[EasternOtaku14]

Originally Posted by deadite

I remember Asukas words about Mizore using Yuuko as insurance when we realize that Kumiko is using Reina as a surrogate for the old Mamiko.

I just found an image about the symbolism in Hibike and it proved your point. It's about Kumiko being the earth, Mamiko being the water/river and Reina being the water/rain.

Images

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[seiftis]

I can relate to Mamiko, having a dad with similar attitude..

[Arya]

Originally Posted by Sixth

^ well Asuka's mother could have divorce with her husband, i guess?

Forgot to mention it in my previous post.... do you think that the name of euphonium cd, is Asuka's father?

Kumiko and Reina said that the cd music sounded similar to Asuka's euphonium.

Yep. Just to be sure I'll put it under spoiler tags.

Spoiler for about Asuka's family past and whatnot:

At this point I'd say that Asuka's father is a famous euphonium player who divorced from her mother, who was against it and it broke her. What I can't explain is the unmatched surname. Unless as a reaction she didn't force Asuka to change her surname with, supposedly, hers. This last bit is the one that made me leans toward the divorce instead of the demise.

... mmm, now that I think about it, the divorce option would work if we take for granted they were married to begin with, but if they weren't it would explain Asuka's surname, meaning also she was an unwanted child, at least by her father.
But against this option there is Asuka's instrument and special attachment to it. The detail about how her way of play resemble/evoke his father's would suggest there's no animosity toward him, if not even a deep connection of sort.

[Marina2]

Originally Posted by Arya

We got another take of Mamiko's situation in Aoi, who apparently at the end of her conversation with Kumiko seemed ambiguously pleased to know about Asuka problems, or I got it in the wrong way?

"Oh, so even Asuka has the same problem to choose between the Band or the study like me?"

"At least, unlike her, I know that I can't do both thing at the same time and chose to quit the band to focus on study only. I guess my decision was correct after all."



..............................................

[Kuroageha]

Originally Posted by EasternOtaku14

I just found an image about the symbolism in Hibike and it proved your point. It's about Kumiko being the earth, Mamiko being the water/river and Reina being the water/rain.

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Interesting, I wonder what makes Shuichi then. Wind?

[GMT]

Originally Posted by SleepingTerror

Yet he refuses to acknowledge his own mistake. He basically blamed Mamiko for listening to him, which is hypocritical. Instead of aiding her like he should have a couple years back, he chooses to abandon her instead. Yes Mamiko is an adult, but she wasn't an adult when this issue began. And she isn't just any adult, she's their daughter. It'd be one thing if he was doing this because he thought it was better for Mamiko, to grow up and become fully responsible for herself. But he's not, he's doing it as some kind of punishment.

But it was Mamiko's choice to make. She could accept her parents' free college ride, or she could learn what it really means to pursue what she really wants to pursue. Becoming a beautician or a musician would put her in exactly the same life circumstance that her father is presenting her with now. It's not like either field is filled with opportunities to rise above "starving artist" or "perpetual part-timer with a Philosophy degree" on the economic scale.

And maybe Father Oumae speaks from experience. We don't know anything about the parents. Maybe they had a close relative who decided to pursue music and now spends their time bouncing from one shitty garage band to the next, playing for beer tokens at dive bars at night, while scrubbing toilets at McDonalds during the day (or for a more show-relevant example, a player for a non-notable orchestra who needs another job to afford to live, because they're making way less money than even a starting teacher in a really crappy school district.) Maybe Father Oumae was that guy in the shitty garage band who managed to somehow claw his way through college and get a good job after all.

[Arya]

Originally Posted by Marina2

"Oh, so even Asuka has the same problem to choose between the Band or the study like me?"

"At least, unlike her, I know that I can't do both thing at the same time and chose to quit the band to focus on study only. I guess my decision was correct after all."



..............................................

eheh, my take was slightly more malicious ... more in the vein of "serves her right!"!