[Manga] The Official Suigetsu Discussion thread

[SuigetsuKun]

In chapter 346 on page 15, he first made his appearance. A young man, as cold and deep as Davy Jones's locker. His name is Hōzuki Suigetsu, student of Momochi Zabusa and brother of Mangetsu Hōzuki, who's been killed by Hoshikage Kisame, which makes him an avenger.

He's the first team member of Sasuke's squad. A nukenin born into Kirigakure, aka Village of the Hidden Blood Mist.

This thread is about this young extraordinary man, to discuss his aims, deeds, words, experiences and fortune.

[Ero-Senn1n]

How could he be Zabuza's student when Zabuza became a criminal when he was about Suigetsu's age? Or didn't he leave the village at that age? We know that Madara is the mizukage, so it may be that killing others is not a crime there. Or maybe Suigetsu left with Zabuza and became a missing nin.

[yaluckyboy]

Suigetsu was not Zabuza's student, they were both students training to receive the Demon Beheading Sword at the same time

But in the end, Zabuza got the sword

BTW Zabuza did not become a criminal age Suigetsu's age, he was just a ruthless ninja that was considered a "Demon", he became a criminal after he met Haku

[james0246]

@Hunter, could we possibly turn this into a Poll thread, similar to the Sai character thread?

That being said, Suigetsu is just one of many villains that has what seems to be amazing powers (he was the only member of Team Hawk (besides Sasuke, of course) that was able to land a conclusive blow against the Hachibi (even if the Hachibi was pulling its punches)), but, for whatever reason, Kishimoto refuses to allow Suigetsu (as well as several other strong villains) to stand equal with Sasuke or other dominant antagonists.

[OtseisRagnarok]

About Suigetsu? Well, he's interesting.... He's after all the seven swordsman of the mist, right? Remember those guys? An old plotline that was left to dangle....

[Ero-Senn1n]

Originally Posted by yaluckyboy

Suigetsu was not Zabuza's student, they were both students training to receive the Demon Beheading Sword at the same time

But in the end, Zabuza got the sword

Suigetsu is much younger than Zabuza, how could they compete when Suigetsu was only a baby or wasn't even born. Unless Suigetsu is 30 years old

Originally Posted by yaluckyboy

BTW Zabuza did not become a criminal age Suigetsu's age, he was just a ruthless ninja that was considered a "Demon", he became a criminal after he met Haku

Zabuza killed all of the genins, i think he overdid that quite a bit. A village needs new ninja, so the village should criminalize him. Unless Madara liked his performance
Anyway it was said somewhere in the Zabuza-arc that he tried to murder some feudal lord but he failed, that's when he became a hunted criminal unless he was already a missing ninja.

[OtseisRagnarok]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

Suigetsu is much younger than Zabuza, how could they compete when Suigetsu was only a baby or wasn't even born. Unless Suigetsu is 30 years old

You can't say he isn't... The man is made of water! He could be older than Madara for all we know!!

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

Zabuza killed all of the genins, i think he overdid that quite a bit. A village needs new ninja, so the village should criminalize him. Unless Madara liked his performance
Anyway it was said somewhere in the Zabuza-arc that he tried to murder some feudal lord but he failed, that's when he became a hunted criminal unless he was already a missing ninja.

Wasn't that the onbly way to get through the ninja academy in mist? I remember hearing that they had to kill each other.

[cheese no koma]

Not much is on his portfolio at the moment, by that i mean fights. We'll get to see the true extend of his abilities soon, if he does get match up with one of the rookie 9. That being said, he is talented, being able to wield Zabuza's chopping knife at will and touted as his successor.

His special ability to turn into water at will is no doubt useful as most physical attacks wouldn't work on him, and like most kirigakure ninja, he can be tough if there is water source at the battlefield. Though even with that he's not completely invincible, a powerful lighting jutsu could easily obliterate him.

[yaluckyboy]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

Suigetsu is much younger than Zabuza, how could they compete when Suigetsu was only a baby or wasn't even born. Unless Suigetsu is 30 years old .

Zabuza was not necessarily training to be a Swordsman of the Mist at that time and even if he was, just look at how Itachi became a Chunin at the age of 10 so Suigetsu might have passed Zabuza if he was a child genius (Although this wasn't the case)

And the whole "Suigetsu being old as water" thing might actually be true, who knows cause they didn't really look into his past that much

[AuroraFlash]

I read that Suigetsu became like that from the experiments of Orochimaru. Before, he was just one student of Zabusa and had a brother. His name doesn't have to stand for his bodytype, it can just be typical for being born into the hidden mist, just as christians are called Michael or David.

[SuigetsuKun]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

How could he be Zabuza's student when Zabuza became a criminal when he was about Suigetsu's age? Or didn't he leave the village at that age? We know that Madara is the mizukage, so it may be that killing others is not a crime there. Or maybe Suigetsu left with Zabuza and became a missing nin.

Why should he leave the village? Students killing each other off was a tradition, not a crime. Still, it's possible that Zabuza became his teacher after he left the Hidden Mist. Maybe they fought side by side against Kisame and retreated after Suigetsu's brother (and maybe others) got killed.
From the time Zabuza left the Mist, Haku must have been around, too.
This could have given them at least the possibility to escape Kisame (like freezing him inside an ice block or sth. like that).

Originally Posted by yaluckyboy

Suigetsu was not Zabuza's student, they were both students training to receive the Demon Beheading Sword at the same time

But in the end, Zabuza got the sword

BTW Zabuza did not become a criminal age Suigetsu's age, he was just a ruthless ninja that was considered a "Demon", he became a criminal after he met Haku

What a story... how can you just say this? This is proven nowhere.

Originally Posted by james0246

@Hunter, could we possibly turn this into a Poll thread, similar to the Sai character thread?

That being said, Suigetsu is just one of many villains that has what seems to be amazing powers (he was the only member of Team Hawk (besides Sasuke, of course) that was able to land a conclusive blow against the Hachibi (even if the Hachibi was pulling its punches)), but, for whatever reason, Kishimoto refuses to allow Suigetsu (as well as several other strong villains) to stand equal with Sasuke or other dominant antagonists.

Kishimoto doesn't refuse.
I'm gonna make him an offer he can't refuse...

[Ero-Senn1n]

Originally Posted by SuigetsuKun

Why should he leave the village? Students killing each other off was a tradition, not a crime.

Killing your opponents can be a law, but he killed *everybody*. How long would a village exist if every year only one ninja survived? The power of a village relies not only in quality of the ninja but also in quantity. When the Zabuza-Haku story was told by Kakashi it was clear that Zabuza did something unprecedented, otherwise Kakashi would never talk about someone who just performs the same task that everyone else did in the mist village. It wouldn't be a story if it was natural. So my assumption is that Zabuza acted on his own, against the orders of the village, which means he became a criminal and had to escape from the village.
But now that we discover Madara's past and that he is mizukage i think maybe he was not regarded as criminal and could continue as the village's ninja.

[SuigetsuKun]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

Killing your opponents can be a law, but he killed *everybody*. How long would a village exist if every year only one ninja survived? The power of a village relies not only in quality of the ninja but also in quantity. When the Zabuza-Haku story was told by Kakashi it was clear that Zabuza did something unprecedented, otherwise Kakashi would never talk about someone who just performs the same task that everyone else did in the mist village. It wouldn't be a story if it was natural. So my assumption is that Zabuza acted on his own, against the orders of the village, which means he became a criminal and had to escape from the village.
But now that we discover Madara's past and that he is mizukage i think maybe he was not regarded as criminal and could continue as the village's ninja.

You tend to forget. He tried to assassinate the Mizukage - and failed. Thus he's become a refugee

[Ero-Senn1n]

Originally Posted by SuigetsuKun

You tend to forget. He tried to assassinate the Mizukage - and failed. Thus he's become a refugee

Refugee? lol He became S-class criminal. The question was when has Zabuza become a criminal, either when killing every genin or when he tried to kill a feudal lord or the mizukage.

[Josh Uzumaki]

i thought this was a suigetsu topic?
but its funny how in retrospect how crap zabuza actually was

[BlackNhite]

Suigetsu is basically Naruto's answer to Roronoa Zoro from One Piece:
-both had a rival/friend that was vying for the same/similar goal
-said rival/friend died untimely
-both now seek to become the greatest swordsman(Note at bottom)
-very similar personalities and interaction between character types(Nami & Karin respectively)

Note: Suigetsu seeks to "collect all the swords" of the seven swordsman. I doubt those still living or any who may have picked up their blades are willing to relinquish them so easily, so Suigetsu will have to become "the best swordsman" if he wishes to retrieve them.

That done, I wonder how Kishi would handle Suigetsu collecting Raiga's swords. He did say he was a member of the Seven though he was only featured in the filler arcs. It'll be interesting to see how that unfolds, but hopefully Kishi won't just go and say Suigetsu randomly finds them and gets yet another freebie. Maybe someone's picked up said blades and now wields them as an accomplished swordsman themself?

[yaluckyboy]

To tell you the truth, there are lots of times when a character or something else that was originally part of a filler arc and the writer liked it so much that they put it into the actual series

Spoiler for Ex: DBZ:

Bardock (Goku's biological father) from DBZ was first introduced in one of the DBZ Movies, but Toriyama liked it so much that he put it into the Manga when Freeza mentioned how he and Goku resemble each other

[BlackNhite]

Originally Posted by yaluckyboy

To tell you the truth, there are lots of times when a character or something else that was originally part of a filler arc and the writer liked it so much that they put it into the actual series

Spoiler for Ex: DBZ:

Bardock (Goku's biological father) from DBZ was first introduced in one of the DBZ Movies, but Toriyama liked it so much that he put it into the Manga when Freeza mentioned how he and Goku resemble each other

I didn't think Bardock's movie was that old, I'd thought it came out long after the manga was past that point.
I have a pathetic sense of time it seems...

[Ero-Senn1n]

Originally Posted by Josh Uzumaki

i thought this was a suigetsu topic?

It is, but we try to get an idea of Suigetsu's childhood and background by analyzing his village. We know about Zabuza, Kisame and Madara, and they are all ruthless ninja. And that means that Suigetsu was raised in a heartless and quite demanding place, most likely the opposite of the "will of fire" of Konoha. And that means that the current Suigetsu is not an "evil" person by nature, he may join the good guys (Naruto and co.) at a later time because he is still young enough to change his ideas about the world. And all that possibility for his character means that he will probably not die in action, which is a good thing for those fans who like him. Well this is all just my assumption

[SuigetsuKun]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

It is, but we try to get an idea of Suigetsu's childhood and background by analyzing his village. We know about Zabuza, Kisame and Madara, and they are all ruthless ninja. And that means that Suigetsu was raised in a heartless and quite demanding place, most likely the opposite of the "will of fire" of Konoha. And that means that the current Suigetsu is not an "evil" person by nature, he may join the good guys (Naruto and co.) at a later time because he is still young enough to change his ideas about the world. And all that possibility for his character means that he will probably not die in action, which is a good thing for those fans who like him. Well this is all just my assumption

Words of wisdom.
I think he would be the best replacement for Asuma, Konoha can get. Suigetsu is not only a brilliant swordsman who can easily wield swords, he's so much more and he definitely is one of the most promising young ninjas. But if Madara is the Mizukage, sooner or later, he has to be replaced... and who could rule the Hidden Mist better than someone made of water?