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kyp275 · 2013-05-29, 20:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

I just don't like people looking down on us just because we don't have this and that. We seek American for yes but if not its ok... The government's attitude doesn't reflect the true concern of the nation.

You say I ignore? Sorry I'm not that intelligent in debate but I have common sense I just could not express it the way you guys express it.

I haven't seen anyone looking down on the PHL in this thread. My issue with you is with the faulty information you posted about the shooting incident.

SaintessHeart · 2013-05-29, 20:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

pretty sure Taiwan doesn't have any Aegis ships yet.

I double checked. The only Asian Navy that has Aegis battleships is SK.

NoemiChan · 2013-05-29, 20:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

I haven't seen anyone looking down on the PHL in this thread. My issue with you is with the faulty information you posted about the shooting incident.

So what do you think happened then?

For me, they entered our waters, they ignored our warning.. they tried to ram our ships and we fired in self defense... unlucky for them.. they failed and lost a fisherman...

Apology? Sorry... you didn't listen.

Compensation? How much does is a life worst?

KiraYamatoFan · 2013-05-29, 20:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by SaintessHeart

I double checked. The only Asian Navy that has Aegis battleships is SK.

That's of course if you don't include Japan in the debate, with 2 classes of Aegis ships (I guess we should say one class and a half since the newest class is an improvement over the other).

SaintessHeart · 2013-05-29, 20:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by KiraYamatoFan

That's of course if you don't include Japan, with 2 classes of Aegis ships.

Yeah and them.

@ Genji : Those are DISPUTED waters. It does not belong to anyone officially.

kyp275 · 2013-05-29, 21:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

For me, they entered our waters

Wrong - They were also in their own water - the Exclusive Economic Zone of the two countries overlap, which is where the incident took place. It did not occur inside PHL territorial water.

Quote:

they ignored our warning..

We'll see what the investigation says, but it's interesting to note that the PHL investigators have already said that it's likely that the PCG violated their own regulation with their "warning"

Quote:

they tried to ram our ships and we fired in self defense...

Again, we'll see what the investigation turns out, so far there's no evidence other than PCG's statement (nevermind the rather stupid idea that a fishing boat running away would for some reason decide to ram a ship twice as long and 6 times heavier). My guess is that the video would be quite telling once its released.

Quote:

Apology? Sorry... you didn't listen.

TW wanted official state-level apology, PHL declined to do so.

Quote:

Compensation? How much does is a life worst?

apparently nothing to you.

NoemiChan · 2013-05-29, 21:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

Wrong - They were also in their own water - the Exclusive Economic Zone of the two countries overlap, which is where the incident took place. It did not occur inside PHL territorial water.

That's the other version.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

We'll see what the investigation says, but it's interesting to note that the PHL investigators have already said that it's likely that the PCG violated their own regulation with their "warning"

likely...

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

Again, we'll see what the investigation turns out, so far there's no evidence other than PCG's statement (nevermind the rather stupid idea that a fishing boat running away would for some reason decide to ram a ship twice as long and 6 times heavier). My guess is that the video would be quite telling once its released.

In the odd news.. a lot of Chinese related stuffs... It's still possible..

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

TW wanted official state-level apology, PHL declined to do so.

Why? Is he an official? Have the coast apologize.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

apparently nothing to you.

Personally....lets not act as if we care to every people on earth.

kyp275 · 2013-05-29, 21:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

That's the other version.

I'm not sure how a simple 200 nmi boundary can vary in "versions".

Quote:

In the odd news.. a lot of Chinese related stuffs... It's still possible..

I have no idea what you mean by this.

Quote:

Why? Is he an official? Have the coast apologize.

Huh? That's exactly the sticking point - the coast guard/govt refused to apologize, instead, the one offered were characterized as from the "Philippine people" or others of personal nature.

Quote:

Personally....lets not act as if we care to every people on earth.

You're missing the point here. The compensation is to the family of the one killed, I can assure you THEY care. On that note, the last I heard about the compensation was that PHL refused to clarify what it will do, other than something about collecting donations on behalf of the family

NoemiChan · 2013-05-29, 22:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

I'm not sure how a simple 200 nmi boundary can vary in "versions".

It can be mine or theirs... depending on the claims.. Look at PRC.. she's still claiming the water 146 miles off our shore.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

I have no idea what you mean by this.

Forget it... It'll be a "hate issue"...

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

Huh? That's exactly the sticking point - the coast guard/govt refused to apologize, instead, the one offered were characterized as from the "Philippine people" or others of personal nature.

Why would the government apologize? Let the Coast guards do it if they want... Forcing someone to apologize will not appear sincere anymore

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

You're missing the point here. The compensation is to the family of the one killed, I can assure you THEY care. On that note, the last I heard about the compensation was that PHL refused to clarify what it will do, other than something about collecting donations on behalf of the family

Donation would be good.. no problem... My concern if HOW MUCH will be satisfactory...

kyp275 · 2013-05-29, 22:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

It can be mine or theirs... depending on the claims.. Look at PRC.. she's still claiming the water 146 miles off our shore.

PRC is irrelevant here.

Quote:

Why would the government apologize? Let the Coast guards do it if they want... Forcing someone to apologize will not appear sincere anymore

...the coast guard IS a part of the government.

Quote:

Donation would be good.. no problem... My concern if HOW MUCH will be satisfactory...

Donation on its own is not bad, but it's non-committal in nature and doesn't actually count as compensation - imagine if your house burned down in a fire, and the insurance company compensates you by... collecting donation on your behalf only.

NoemiChan · 2013-05-29, 22:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

PRC is irrelevant here.

Sorry, I thought they're Chinese....my bad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

...the coast guard IS a part of the government.

President, a coastguard just shot a Chinese, sorry Taiwanese... fisherman. They demand an international apology via international media and pay them cash...

What?!

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

Donation on its own is not bad, but it's non-committal in nature and doesn't actually count as compensation - imagine if your house burned down in a fire, and the insurance company compensates you by... collecting donation on your behalf only.

The PR don't insure fishermen.. even our own fishermen...

kyp275 · 2013-05-29, 22:33

I...really don't know what you're trying to say anymore.

NoemiChan · 2013-05-29, 22:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

I...really don't know what you're trying to say anymore.

I just wanted to say to government of Taiwan to stop making a big issue out of this.. like diplomacy is endanger or other stuffs... Our workers are already being harassed and a Filipino student is already being bullied calling us murderers.. is that enough?

kyp275 · 2013-05-29, 23:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

I just wanted to say to government of Taiwan to stop making a big issue out of this..

Except it already IS a big issue, due to actions from both sides.

And while harassing Filipino workers (an issue btw that's been blown way out of proportion) is bad, I find it ironic that you seem to think that harassment is terrible (which it is), but someone actually getting killed shouldn't be "a big issue"

NoemiChan · 2013-05-30, 00:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

Except it already IS a big issue, due to actions from both sides.

And while harassing Filipino workers (an issue btw that's been blown way out of proportion) is bad, I find it ironic that you seem to think that harassment is terrible (which it is), but someone actually getting killed shouldn't be "a big issue"

Innocent harassed 80,000 workers versus a questionable 1 killed trespasser....

flying ^ · 2013-05-30, 00:25

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kyp275 · 2013-05-30, 04:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

Innocent harassed 80,000 workers versus a questionable 1 killed trespasser....

Because a couple isolated incidents is totally the same as a complete systemic harassment on a massive scale

your logic is amazing.

It is also clear from your continued framing of the fishermen as trespasser and deserved to get killed that you have already made up your mind on the facts (despite the facts are still not known since the investigation isn't over yet), and aren't interested in any actual discussion. I see no point in continuing this with you.

JokerD · 2013-05-30, 04:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyp275

Wrong - They were also in their own water - the Exclusive Economic Zone of the two countries overlap, which is where the incident took place. It did not occur inside PHL territorial water.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

That's the other version.

Taipei's Sattelite Record Rejects Manila's Claim of Fishing Boat's Intrusion

Anyone posted this yet? Also can anyone confirm if the location of

Quote:

Based on the satellite record, the fishing boat was "positioned at 122 degrees and 55 minutes east and 19 degrees and 59 minutes north" when it came under fire at around 10:12 a.m.

was in which countries' waters?

Also this (in chinese):
http://news.tvbs.com.tw/entry/212694
According to the video, one Philippine newspaper claims that the coast guard video shows that the fishing boat was blocking (not raming) the coast guard vessel's path to another boat when the firing happened. Can't find any other source to confirm this (TVBS is a Taiwan news station) so take it with a grain of salt.

SaintessHeart · 2013-05-30, 04:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by JokerD

Taipei's Sattelite Record Rejects Manila's Claim of Fishing Boat's Intrusion

Anyone posted this yet? Also can anyone confirm if the location of was in which countries' waters?

Also this (in chinese):
http://news.tvbs.com.tw/entry/212694
According to the video, one Philippine newspaper claims that the coast guard video shows that the fishing boat was blocking (not raming) the coast guard vessel's path to another boat when the firing happened. Can't find any other source to confirm this (TVBS is a Taiwan news station) so take it with a grain of salt.

The problem is that, it is disputed waters. I don't think PH and TW are the only ones involved in contesting it.

By right, it should be all okay until someone died. So do we blame the fisherman for being physically weak or the CG for firing the shot?

JokerD · 2013-05-30, 04:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by SaintessHeart

The problem is that, it is disputed waters. I don't think PH and TW are the only ones involved in contesting it.

By right, it should be all okay until someone died. So do we blame the fisherman for being physically weak or the CG for firing the shot?

Maybe they should have something like a G Gundam-style tournament to decide ownership, saves us all this trouble.

2013-05-29, 22:33	Link #28652
kyp275 Meh Join Date: Feb 2008	I...really don't know what you're trying to say anymore.

2013-05-30, 00:25	Link #28656
flying ^ Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010	Liberal Democrats and their partners are about to take away your lolis of both dimensions (for reals this time!). No exceptions! Enjoy what you have and keep it ENC. http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news...y-law-revision supplement(s) https://dankanemitsu.wordpress.com/2...rnography-law/ https://dankanemitsu.wordpress.com/2...-law-revision/ https://dankanemitsu.wordpress.com/2...ut-censorship/