AnimeSuki Forums

~kurayami~ · 2012-09-29, 19:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blonto

I didn't expect anything groudbreaking or tragic, I just expected something more complex. It didn't even feel like the gimmicks were all that important. As I already mentioned, the bodyswapping didn't do anything that couldn't be done normally. Same with the whole "unleashing of desires" gimmick. The gimmicks took second place to drama that is mostly uninteresting on its own.
You'd expect that with a situation such as this the characters would be more significantly affected, but the characters now don't seem much different from how they were at the beginning. We could've dug much deeper into their psyche with all these gimmicks, but it just looks to me like the author didn't have enough ideas for the characters' development beyond scratching the surface and using the gimmicks as an excuse to do that. I wasn't expecting the characters to become totally different people and I didn't expect any life-shattering events, in fact I was looking forward to a lighthearted show with friendly characters, but I wanted it to show a lot more wit.

My god, someone who actually thought this through and was left with a similar impression such as myself. I couldn't explain it better.

Kirito · 2012-09-29, 20:21

Spoiler for Saving Space:

You're probably going to disagree with me on this Guardian Enzo, but "sighs" here it goes.

Ahem:

I agree that certain aspects of this show feels lacking, but isn't the whole point of the way the series is going to to show off character development and sense of connection between the 5 main characters and the struggles they go through to not only connect with others, but to accept and learn about ones self? I'm no TV or show critic, or whatever, but I think the overall resolution of each arc sort of felt awkward and didn't really take much effort to overcome the issue.

I truly agree with your take on Taichi. For me I was hoping this arc that Taichi's problems or personal issues that we haven't seen yet come into play here, but never was initiated because he sort of had to play the role of "observer" while the other were going through the whole experiment. I can't really find anything that feels like he developed as a character because the other 4 overcame and accepted some things while he remained the same.

Arya · 2012-09-29, 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirito

That's a part of her I also find interesting because there's still the issue regarding her sense of "self". For her accepting the present, is probably a means of her acknowledging the current "her" as of this episode, to say the least. The part about her doubting the love she has for Taichi... I wonder if that has to do with the current "her" or the possible on-going confliction with her other "self/selves".

I'd say it's more the latter. Since basically she accepted her self as she is now, so with her multiple selves, so accepting that implied doubting even her feelings. I don't know if it is more a philosophic question of her or a real question due to a real doubt she felt.
Until now her main concern has been her mother safety so she couldn't handle that matter. This should imply that she was doubting her feelings from the start, because she basically stepped back twice, during the second arc and accepting Inaban as a rival. But on the other hand it has been shown how she is quite smart, introspective and philosophic when her true self emerge.
By the way IIRC she said a strange line, something like "don't mess up things this time", that now could be interpreted as a comment related to the fact that she thought her family issues were caused by her behavior, so she shouldn't have ruined even her relationship. But the overall feeling of that is far from being taken as romantic.
Anyways, whatever the case will be I think that her questioning in any case increased the distance (if it were needed) between her and Inaban as possible "winner" girl.

Guardian Enzo · 2012-09-29, 20:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirito

Spoiler for Saving Space:

You're probably going to disagree with me on this, but "sighs" here it goes.

Ahem:

I agree that certain aspects of this show feels lacking, but isn't the whole point of the way the series is going to to show off character development and sense of connection between the 5 main characters and the struggles they go through to not only connect with others, but to accept and learn about ones self? I'm no TV or show critic, or whatever, but I think the overall resolution of each arc sort of felt awkward and didn't really take much effort to overcome the issue.

I truly agree with your take on Taichi. For me I was hoping this arc that Taichi's problems or personal issues that we haven't seen yet come into play here, but never was initiated because he sort of had to play the role of "observer" while the other were going through the whole experiment. I can't really find anything that feels like he developed as a character because the other 4 overcame and accepted some things while he remained the same.

Maybe I'm misreading your post, but I'm not sure what you're expecting me to take issue with - because it seems as if you agree with my post, for the most part.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your interpretation of what the "point" of the series is, but again - my problem isn't with intention, but execution. It may very well be that was intended to be the central theme - but in the end, I don't think it was successfully explored. The characters were never sufficiently developed and while the arcs did a nice job setting up scenarios to develop the themes you refer to, they invariably dropped the ball in actually building on the setup and bringing it to a conclusion.

Kirito · 2012-09-29, 20:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo

Maybe I'm misreading your post, but I'm not sure what you're expecting me to take issue with - because it seems as if you agree with my post, for the most part.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your interpretation of what the "point" of the series is, but again - my problem isn't with intention, but execution. It may very well be that was intended to be the central theme - but in the end, I don't think it was successfully explored. The characters were never sufficiently developed and while the arcs did a nice job setting up scenarios to develop the themes you refer to, they invariably dropped the ball in actually building on the setup and bringing it to a conclusion.

Or maybe I'm just misreading or missing your points regarding series execution. If I am, I do apologize "bows head". I was just pointing out my thoughts on how it's working for me and how it could be better in later episodes, that's all.

You do make a great point, I think that the problems or drama present in each arc was somewhat more focused than on the strong development that could've been explored or present in certain instances. The arcs and premise for each of them ie. body swapping, desires, turning back time/reliving times etc. Were great set ups for character development and the whole "Heart's Connect" feel, but felt lacking in its resolution.

I don't know whether I've hit the mark on this with you, but this is pretty much how I can relate to you on what you're feeling about this because I really do agree with you on the series execution and how it's not living up to certain expectations pretty well.

flack · 2012-09-29, 21:06

Is there suppose to be some kind of important point that the show is trying to get across?

The ending felt like it was forced.

Triple_R · 2012-09-29, 21:14

I think that the point of the entire arc is that people tend to have regrets in their lives. If we carefully go over our pasts, I'm sure that most (if not all) of us can find moments that we feel we could have handled better in retrospect. Now, some of these moments are just small things, but other moments can be pretty big.

We can feel like the mistakes of our past lead to a failed romance, or a broken home, or failing to get that career we dreamed of, or of not doing better in school.

And I think the point that this latest arc is making, with how Aoki moved on from a past love and how Iori rejected Heartseed's offer, is that the people we are now is due (in large part) to all of our past actions and choices - Both the good and the bad.

Even if we could go back in time and fix all "the mistakes", would that not constitute denying who we are right now? And if we did fix all "the mistakes", is it possible we'd lose something in the here and now that we value? - If Iori made all the "right" decisions as a kid, would she still have grown as close to her friends as she did, for example?

I think Iori's story in the latest KC episode is about living without regrets, or rather accepting the mistakes of the past as contributing to who we are today.

Unlike Dawnstorm, I found this pretty compelling, and in fact it hit home with me. I certainly can think of things in my past that I'd like to do differently if I had a 2nd chance, but then what would I lose in the here and now by doing that? Would I even still be posting here on Anime Suki, for example?

So I think the message of this latest arc is something of a self-actualizing one, and of one of not allowing past regrets to consume you.

Chaos2Frozen · 2012-09-29, 21:32

As the name suggest, Kako Random is all about the past, even the gimmick this time around involves returning back to your childhood. At first I thought it was mainly used as a means for the characters to remember their past experiences and personalities to help them confront their current issues, but after reading RRR's above post, I wonder if it sort of meant to give them the chance to do things that they didn't or couldn't when they were at that age?

Though I think it's clear in this episode that Number Two isn't really using this as a 'teaching tool' like Heartseed, he was clearly punishing them by intentionally using it to get in their way of progress.

Hiroi Sekai · 2012-09-29, 22:54

I'm confused, why is everyone acting as if the show just ended forever? I know the BD episodes are separate, but they obviously plan to continue on from where this leaves off.

Kirito · 2012-09-29, 23:03

Spoiler for Saving Space... Just In Case:

I too can sympathize with this statement considering that dealing with the past is a complicated matter and overcoming/coming to terms with it can be a trial in itself.

Iori is no exception. She was given the chance to redo a part of her and realized that even if she did, it would be her denying the person she is today because of the great friends that she's made. I talked about this previously regarding the conflictions with regarding her true sense of "self" because of the "masks" she wore to fit the role of the daughter that any parent could ask for. This resolution came as a denouement to show that her accepting the present as it is like accepting the current "her" she is now.

serenade_beta · 2012-09-29, 23:35

Spoiler for final thoughts:

frivolity · 2012-09-30, 00:42

I for one thought that the characters were pretty realistic. Bear in mind that these five characters came together to form StuCS because they either had no other club to join or because they were kicked out from other clubs. In other words, they don't represent the majority of the people you would meet in school. They represent the minority who just don't really fit in with the crowd.

pudding321 · 2012-09-30, 02:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by frivolity

I for one thought that the characters were pretty realistic. Bear in mind that these five characters came together to form StuCS because they either had no other club to join or because they were kicked out from other clubs. In other words, they don't represent the majority of the people you would meet in school. They represent the minority who just don't really fit in with the crowd.

I second that. Remember the rule: never make riajus in an anime—or else you'll get pwned by otakus.

This setting is far too common...or even cliche in the anime world. I can recall tons of titles with this setting.

blaze0041 · 2012-09-30, 05:52

Once again, the ED song for the Kako Random arc is available over on the Japanese iTunes store:
Salvage - Team.ねこかん[猫]featuring.片霧烈火
Salvage - Team.Nekokan [Neko] featuring.Rekka Katakiri

TL;DR…

Previous two EDs on iTunes

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

I definitely like Salvage and Kokoro no Kana- I'd put them on equal footing in my books. If I had to pick one, though, it'd probably be Salvage (due to my bias towards faster-paced songs

).

I've enjoyed this series thus far, mostly since it tries to make one think:
"What defines someone? Does it hinge on the things that are intangible, like one's personality?";
"Sometimes, we don't speak about what's on our minds, perhaps to avoid an argument or it goes against a social norm. What if we were forced to do so? Would society be better or worse if everyone was forced to speak out their personal truths about anything?";
"One's past defines the person of today. We all make mistakes and bad decisions, how should one deal with them? Should we try to sprint forward, or glance back?"
(...at least, that's what came through my mind whilst watching.

)
It does seem to a bit of a shame that out of the five, we haven't seen much of Taichi in terms of "growth". I can't help but feel that the series might have benefited from few more episodes to flesh out a few things (or perhaps they were issues in the original light novels as well?).

Lantern · 2012-09-30, 06:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by blaze0041

It does seem to a bit of a shame that out of the five, we haven't seen much of Taichi in terms of "growth". I can't help but feel that the series might have benefited from few more episodes to flesh out a few things (or perhaps they were issues in the original light novels as well?).

Taichi is indeed explored.

Spoiler for but chances are...:

And I agree the arc needed at least an extra episode. They've over simplified too many scenes that addresses the characters. We're missing out a ton of stuff.

blaze0041 · 2012-09-30, 06:30

...I had a feeling that was the case, in regards to Taichi. I assume that it's likely we won't see the later light novels animated due to poor BD/DVD sales (or did that incident put the nail in the coffin)?

Chaos2Frozen · 2012-09-30, 06:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by blaze0041

I definitely like Salvage and Kokoro no Kana- I'd put them on equal footing in my books. If I had to pick one, though, it'd probably be Salvage (due to my bias towards faster-paced songs

).

[Salvage] is easily my favorite as well, do we know when the Single will be out?

Quote:

Originally Posted by blaze0041

...I had a feeling that was the case, in regards to Taichi. I assume that it's likely we won't see the later light novels animated due to poor BD/DVD sales (or did that incident put the nail in the coffin)?

Same answer as every other adaptation this season; Very difficult, but not completely impossible.

blaze0041 · 2012-09-30, 06:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

[Salvage] is easily my favorite as well, do we know when the Single will be out?

As I said before, it's already available on iTunes, though you need a Japanese account and 250 yen to spare.
(You can also get it via mora, which is a music store run by Sony. Unfortunately, it's locked down tight in the case of country and DRM restrictions.)
Though, if you're referring to the physical CD version, I'm 99.9% sure that it'll be bundled with the Kako Random BD volume... which I think is releasing on February 27 2013.

Edit: Ah, I couldn't help but notice...

Arturia Polaris · 2012-09-30, 10:24

Salvage grew on me.

All I can say is that I love team nekokan.

First I heard of them was Yosuga no Sora ED, and I loved it.

Now they come back in KC (for me at least) and rock it

Arty

Dop · 2012-09-30, 11:45

I've enjoyed this series much more than I'd ever expected to, and while the final analysis will have to wait until the last batch of episodes come through, and we see if overall the plot made sense, I thought it was one of the better shows of last season.

After the last few Shin Oonuma shows which I could not stick, this (to me) confirms my suspicion that he's a much better director when he stops trying to be Shinbo.

Of course it could all fall down in the last four episodes. I think whether the ending actually makes sense or not (and I think we need to know Heartseed's rationale) will decide whether the series on the whole is good or just OK.

2012-09-29, 21:14	Link #2287
Triple_R Senior Member Author Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Newfoundland, Canada Age: 42	I think that the point of the entire arc is that people tend to have regrets in their lives. If we carefully go over our pasts, I'm sure that most (if not all) of us can find moments that we feel we could have handled better in retrospect. Now, some of these moments are just small things, but other moments can be pretty big. We can feel like the mistakes of our past lead to a failed romance, or a broken home, or failing to get that career we dreamed of, or of not doing better in school. And I think the point that this latest arc is making, with how Aoki moved on from a past love and how Iori rejected Heartseed's offer, is that the people we are now is due (in large part) to all of our past actions and choices - Both the good and the bad. Even if we could go back in time and fix all "the mistakes", would that not constitute denying who we are right now? And if we did fix all "the mistakes", is it possible we'd lose something in the here and now that we value? - If Iori made all the "right" decisions as a kid, would she still have grown as close to her friends as she did, for example? I think Iori's story in the latest KC episode is about living without regrets, or rather accepting the mistakes of the past as contributing to who we are today. Unlike Dawnstorm, I found this pretty compelling, and in fact it hit home with me. I certainly can think of things in my past that I'd like to do differently if I had a 2nd chance, but then what would I lose in the here and now by doing that? Would I even still be posting here on Anime Suki, for example? So I think the message of this latest arc is something of a self-actualizing one, and of one of not allowing past regrets to consume you. __________________

2012-09-29, 21:32	Link #2288
Chaos2Frozen We're Back Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Redgrave City Age: 35	As the name suggest, *Kako* Random is all about the past, even the gimmick this time around involves returning back to your childhood. At first I thought it was mainly used as a means for the characters to remember their past experiences and personalities to help them confront their current issues, but after reading RRR's above post, I wonder if it sort of meant to give them the chance to do things that they didn't or couldn't when they were at that age? Though I think it's clear in this episode that Number Two isn't really using this as a 'teaching tool' like Heartseed, he was clearly punishing them by intentionally using it to get in their way of progress. __________________ Devil Trigger , Subhuman , Crimson Cloud , Mad Qualia

2012-09-29, 23:35	Link #2291
serenade_beta そのおっぱいで13才 Join Date: Dec 2006	Spoiler for final thoughts: What? There are more episodes coming eventually? Great, but I'm evaluating the TV series. They can stick all the OVAs and split episodes they want, but I'm not waiting to evaluate the series. In the first place, I doubt it would be good enough to change my thoughts. Well, the content... I found it generally over-dramatic, but the idea itself is good. However, even though the idea is good, everything around Fuusen Katsura is left open, nothing explained, making him just the handy-dandy magical device that makes all kinds of crazy developments happen. While over-dramatic, I did at least find the stories average, but... The last episode pretty blows. The speed of the developments felt like they needed an extra episode but had to compress it into one. Not much on the characters. To be honest, Inaba's trash talking/lecturing got pretty old by the end. OP was shoumonai. In general, it was an okay anime. It felt like It's existence was eaten by Tari Tari though. Anyways, I'll give it a 6/10. I actually feel like giving it less because of Ijime Connect though, but well, I guess I feel sorry for the author that something like this happened. Fuusen Katsura: "Would you like to start over?" Staff: "Y... yes... sob" __________________ -Blog --> http://tdnshumi.blogspot.com/ (Mainly about video games) -R.I.P. Hiroshi Yamauchi, Gaming wouldn't have been the same without you (9/19/13)

2012-09-30, 05:52	Link #2294
blaze0041 a.k.a. Flammenkrieg IT Support Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Down under...	Once again, the ED song for the Kako Random arc is available over on the Japanese iTunes store: Salvage - Team.ねこかん[猫]featuring.片霧烈火 Salvage - Team.Nekokan [Neko] featuring.Rekka Katakiri TL;DR… Previous two EDs on iTunes Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload? I definitely like Salvage and Kokoro no Kana- I'd put them on equal footing in my books. If I had to pick one, though, it'd probably be Salvage (due to my bias towards faster-paced songs ). I've enjoyed this series thus far, mostly since it tries to make one think: "What defines someone? Does it hinge on the things that are intangible, like one's personality?"; "Sometimes, we don't speak about what's on our minds, perhaps to avoid an argument or it goes against a social norm. What if we were forced to do so? Would society be better or worse if everyone was forced to speak out their personal truths about anything?"; "One's past defines the person of today. We all make mistakes and bad decisions, how should one deal with them? Should we try to sprint forward, or glance back?" (...at least, that's what came through my mind whilst watching. ) It does seem to a bit of a shame that out of the five, we haven't seen much of Taichi in terms of "growth". I can't help but feel that the series might have benefited from few more episodes to flesh out a few things (or perhaps they were issues in the original light novels as well?). __________________ "Make sure you do a good job with your life's blueprint." - Kanna Makino

2012-09-30, 06:30	Link #2296
blaze0041 a.k.a. Flammenkrieg IT Support Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Down under...	...I had a feeling that was the case, in regards to Taichi. I assume that it's likely we won't see the later light novels animated due to poor BD/DVD sales (or did that incident put the nail in the coffin)? __________________ "Make sure you do a good job with your life's blueprint." - Kanna Makino

2012-09-29, 21:06	Link #2286
flack Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Canada, BC	Is there suppose to be some kind of important point that the show is trying to get across? The ending felt like it was forced.

2012-09-30, 00:42	Link #2292
frivolity My posts are frivolous Join Date: Nov 2008 Age: 35	I for one thought that the characters were pretty realistic. Bear in mind that these five characters came together to form StuCS because they either had no other club to join or because they were kicked out from other clubs. In other words, they don't represent the majority of the people you would meet in school. They represent the minority who just don't really fit in with the crowd.

2012-09-30, 10:24	Link #2299
Arturia Polaris Good OP Hunter Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Argentina	Salvage grew on me. All I can say is that I love team nekokan. First I heard of them was Yosuga no Sora ED, and I loved it. Now they come back in KC (for me at least) and rock it Arty __________________ Arturia's Writing Den My fanfiction works include: Tari Tari: Past and Present, As the Gentle Breeze Blows Little Busters: Bird's Song Sword Art Online: Vanquishing of the Laughing Coffin My own works include: Social Fact

2012-09-30, 11:45	Link #2300
Dop Mmmm.... Join Date: Sep 2006	I've enjoyed this series much more than I'd ever expected to, and while the final analysis will have to wait until the last batch of episodes come through, and we see if overall the plot made sense, I thought it was one of the better shows of last season. After the last few Shin Oonuma shows which I could not stick, this (to me) confirms my suspicion that he's a much better director when he stops trying to be Shinbo. Of course it could all fall down in the last four episodes. I think whether the ending actually makes sense or not (and I think we need to know Heartseed's rationale) will decide whether the series on the whole is good or just OK.