Physical Attractiveness

[Risari]

Well I really don't care to judge people on outer looks but I've learned that people I know and care about do sadly. I don't think its right to judge people on looks or even anything! I sadly do have problems with my own personal self esteem due to the fact I'm judged for being pale,etc.No I'm not a perfect barbie doll!

When you think about it the situation is like racial segregation when they wouldn't hire a person depending on their color of skin. Its a never ending case of pure Discrimination, whether it be race or looks or even sexual preference.

And just so you know where I am coming from no I'm not a hardcore political party, No I'm not pushing my beliefs on you all, and no I'm not some hippie (even though my parents were XD) I'm just a normal everyday person upset with people still being judged to this day

[Throne Invader]

Originally Posted by 0utf0xZer0

I have to actually admit that I cannot for the life of me approach people who look like they expend a lot of effort on their appearance. For some reason I tend to stereotype them as more judgmental, which is a HUGE turnoff for someone like me who is quite timid and tends to avoid even "routine" confrontation, arguments, etc.

I think I understand what you mean. Girls with too much makeup on can look scary and guys who appear vain are major turn-offs. Despite not a regular user of makeup, I even have to sometimes help my close friends with their makeup and save them from themselves
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I guess we're all stereotyped when we're first seen by others and we tend to stereotype others too. It's natural I guess. Last 2 years ago, I remember getting stereotyped as a flirt, and then it transformed in "she goes around sleeping with guys". I heard they were started by a few biatchy girls from the upper years. Another friend of mine who's very pretty got the same thing. Some of our friends said the girls are just plain biatches, some friends said they just wish they looked like us. The whole thing doesn't matter although my friend cried when she found out about the rumors which all started because of unreasonable stereotyping. Not to mention those girls hang out with perverts. Ugh!!

People hear stuff about you and say stuff about you but it shouldn't change who you are, but if you think that there's room for improvement, go ahead. But then silly stereotyping such as above and other shallow loser useless remarks aren't even worth your time to entertain. Everyone is special. If you think you're getting stereotyped as something negative or by something that you think insults you, just brush it off. You're always bound to meet people who are also stereotyped as the same thing you are. You're not alone

[Jazzrat]

Reality is a harsh mistress, heck even fantasies are filled with such discrimination.

But back on topic, in my view, being attractive or not changes how others interact with you. It's up to a person whether they wish to exploit it or not (personally, i exploit it quite often outside of my friend and family circle).

It's definitely not fair or nice but that's how our society is.
Either you adapt to the fact or deny it.

[-HyugaNeji-]

I was always able to connect to everyone, no matter the gender, looks or age. I don't know if that's what got me the job in the bank back then, but i'm open minded. After all, it's about HOW you react when confronted with someone who might not look too great. Yes, we established now that we have some kind of instincts that let us judge people within the first seconds. And that beeing attractive can have positive effects for your carreer and social status. BUT, the important thing is, HOW you react after that first impression. Are you willing to look behind that first impression or does it determine already wheater you talk and respect a relativley unattractive person or not? And i am willing to do that. The problem often is, that people who tend to be not so attractive have some kind of prejudice themselves. Like: Yeah i know i don't look so good, go fuck yourself, you're not serios about me anyway, which is unfair too. So in the end it can result in a circle, where those who're relatively unattractive get less and less self esteem and trust, thus, limiting themselves and taking opportunities away.

Take Susan Boyle for example. When she walked up the stage, people began to laugh. Like: OMG what is SHE doing up there? They automatically assumed, that a person like her could not be able to sing, without even waiting for her to try. When she started, everyone was stunned. Sadly, her sucess is not a result of her beeing the best singer ever, but merely because no one expected her to be good. I mean she is not really bad, but also not the best singer in the universe. If she would have looked gorgeous and sing in the same way, people probably would have said: Yeah whatever, some Britney clone. Bleh. Boring.

[Liddo-kun]

Originally Posted by Theowne

Even I didn't think it went this far. So now people's health is being compromised because of individuals being biased towards attractiveness. Of course, it is random chance that one individual is more attractive than the other, but now their health will be affected due to it. It's not really much different than race or gender discrimination, when you think about it.

It's too much to ask that people who pay the same taxes/insurance be given equal treatment.

That's the world.

Have been busy at work so my reply is late...

As I've said on a previous post on this thread, I treat the rest of my patients "regularly", meaning they are not being mistreated or maltreated in any way. Here in my country we have the Professional Regulation Commission or PRC for short, the PRC has the power to suspend the license of doctors that mistreat their patients. Obviously, I don't want my license suspended.

In saying earlier that I tend to be more helpful towards someone good looking, because those people brighten up my day... What I simply mean is I give them "added" attention. It does not mean that others who aren't good looking get their health compromised, they still get what they paid for.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by AmoreDoll

I guess we're all stereotyped when we're first seen by others and we tend to stereotype others too. It's natural I guess. Last 2 years ago, I remember getting stereotyped as a flirt, and then it transformed in "she goes around sleeping with guys". I heard they were started by a few biatchy girls from the upper years. Another friend of mine who's very pretty got the same thing. Some of our friends said the girls are just plain biatches, some friends said they just wish they looked like us. The whole thing doesn't matter although my friend cried when she found out about the rumors which all started because of unreasonable stereotyping. Not to mention those girls hang out with perverts. Ugh!!

People hear stuff about you and say stuff about you but it shouldn't change who you are, but if you think that there's room for improvement, go ahead. But then silly stereotyping such as above and other shallow loser useless remarks aren't even worth your time to entertain. Everyone is special. If you think you're getting stereotyped as something negative or by something that you think insults you, just brush it off. You're always bound to meet people who are also stereotyped as the same thing you are. You're not alone

That's what I was trying to talk about. People say "those boys/girls should not care blablabla", but when a person gets stereotyped, like what happened to you or your friend, it "might" change the view that some people have about him/her. Not that it is that bad if it stops at this point, but it can go too far like for example when perverts try to pick up a girl who's not like the stereotype they heard, but they think she is like what they heard because of what the others said about her.

If it starts to create some "problems", i think it's time for the girl/boy to care about.

Originally Posted by Jazzrat

Reality is a harsh mistress, heck even fantasies are filled with such discrimination.

But back on topic, in my view, being attractive or not changes how others interact with you. It's up to a person whether they wish to exploit it or not (personally, i exploit it quite often outside of my friend and family circle).

It's definitely not fair or nice but that's how our society is.
Either you adapt to the fact or deny it.

I don't think it is about denying it or not. It's up to the persons' morals. There are people who don't deny it but think it's bad to exploit their appearance, and so refuse to do it.

And well... when you think it can go as far as seeing women sleeping with men to get better jobs and such.... (whether they hit on men on purpose, or when the men make indecent proposals to them)

[Jazzrat]

Originally Posted by Narona

I don't think it is about denying it or not. It's up to the persons' morals. There are people who don't deny it but think it's bad to exploit their appearance, and so refuse to do it.

And well... when you think it can go as far as seeing women sleeping with men to get better jobs and such.... (whether they hit on men on purpose, or when the men make indecent proposals to them)

I meant you have to accept the fact that your appearance does affect how others treat you and how others treat you also affects you as a person.

[zebra]

Originally Posted by Narona

And what about the men who eventually choose their GF mostly based on the look of the girl? It is shallow too. They don't really plan a long term relationship at all, I think. Because when you do plan, you actually care for the personality/character of the other person a lot, because that's the person you're supposed to spend the rest of your life with xD

Well, I did say it's just as shallow. The extreme cases: a woman waiting for the rich guy to die and a guy taking the sexbomb, just to fool around and not caring at all. Both aren't taking the feelings of the other in account => Scum

I might have phrased it poorly, but the following was regarding the less extreme cases, where you just go for the guy with the better income / for the girl with the bigger rack without the intend of using them ^^

[cheyannew]

Originally Posted by Narona

Do you really know how much time they spend on it or do you assume?

I just wanted to re-ping on this....

Not that I honestly care what anyone thinks of me, but I don't generally go out of the house without a light dusting of powder (sorry the shiney forehead thing? no, thanks), and a thin line of black eyeliner at my upper lashes. I've done the same thing for the last... uhm.. 15+ years (my husband and I have discussed just getting it tattooed on there for crying out loud lol), and mascara.

Why? Because all through middle school and much of high school, I was made fun of for having my teeth a bit out of alignment. I can't build any dams with them, but kids are cruel, so I learned to bring out my overly-awesome eyes to detract from my mouth.

I WILL NOT go out of my house without doing this. Again, I don't care what someone says anymore, but it's a habit, a carryover, if you will.

I also have past waist long, very thick hair, which requires a LOT of work. I like my hair long....

All this may LOOK like it takes a long while but honestly? my makeup takes a whopping 5-7 minutes depending on if I bother to do bottom eyeliner, etc.

Does that seriously make me superficial, or implied to be a dumb prettygirl? I sure as hells hope not, because nothing's further than the truth...

I can't honestly say I make those kinds of assumptions.. people are who they are...

I *DO* admit to being mildly prejudiced against voluntary obese people. I do not like them receiving handicapped car tags, etc etc. They CHOSE this lifestyle, and I do not support them being given special rights such as disability pay, special parking, etc. Those with no control such as medication related, diabetes (though ofttimes this can be avoided in the first place), and thyroid issues, etc, hey, not their fault, and almost every such case I have ever met doesn't WANT special treatment. So, hey, I don't like obese people, I'm horrible, meh... whatever...


Back on topic, though, (IMO) whether we want to take the high road or not (or claim to), the fact of the matter is, instinctively, we will generally accept an attractive person into our "space" than we will unattractive. Why? Quite simply put, humans are animals. Animals drive out the weak, etc. That means the "mutant" white tiger would be exiled, die early, etc, because it's not the norm in their "society". Most humans, being of a "higher intelligence" can overcome this initial reaction (revulsion?) and look past someone's appearance. There's too many studies out there to prove otherwise; looks *DO* matter. Are they the end all be all? Certainly not; we've evolved past that, for the most part, I should think. People are cruel to those they see as different, not pretty, etc. If you think about it, that reaction early on could very likely shape someone for the rest of their life. If you grow up being called names, etc you are most likely going to have self esteem/confidence issues. So when you go and interview for that job, and the person before you with the same experience/skillset who's "pretty" or "normal looking", or whatever, it's probably going to affect you. THEY grew up confident, treated normally, etc. YOU grew up having to hunch down to avoid being seen lest the bullies come after you again. Chances are, you'll lack the confidence the person before you (or after you) had, and that will reflect on your ability to get the job. It's not entirely looks, I think. People who're picked out as "ugly" or whatever DO suffer emotional abuse in many (most?) cases.

Please don't start me on how people literally CRINGE from someone who's mentally handicapped (down's syndrome etc); it breaks my heart to see people literally shy away from them because they look different or whatever.
Maybe people like Susan Boyle will help "change the world"... I doubt it, because I think it's all but hard-wired into humanity, due to our animalistic nature.

[Kafriel]

Hmm...I believe that looks only matter as far as women are concerned. I'm not saying this because I'm a man, but I've noticed many women's behaviour and the patterns with which they judge their partners: how old they are, if they have a rough personality, what job they do etc.
Men also don't care about their appearance as much as women (they just tend to their hair and beard, 5 mins a day) while women do...well,iunno what they do but it certainly takes a lot more time. Their choice of clothes is also larger and more important (to women) and they talk more about appearances than men do (at least my friends did).
As for whether appearance has a GREAT impact on your life, I'd say no. I can look at myself at the mirror without breaking it, I've made it clear that I don't give a dime about fashion or appearance and so the people around me have learned to judge me from my actions instead.
I can't tell if the woman I like is pretty or not (since I'm biased) but I doubt appearance plays a role in love. Looks do matter in jobs though, I suppose looking good means being able to take care of yourself, shows that you're sticking to certain rules and behaviour, thus being a better candidate for a chance job.

[Mystique]

Originally Posted by Kafriel

Hmm...I believe that looks only matter as far as women are concerned. I'm not saying this because I'm a man, but I've noticed many women's behaviour and the patterns with which they judge their partners: how old they are, if they have a rough personality, what job they do etc.
Men also don't care about their appearance as much as women (they just tend to their hair and beard, 5 mins a day) while women do...well,iunno what they do but it certainly takes a lot more time. Their choice of clothes is also larger and more important (to women) and they talk more about appearances than men do (at least my friends did).

Vain men exist
I can break that stereotype 10 times over, I was raised by one. xD
I dunno if this can fall into groups of race but I'll say this much from what I see in my town and places around me.
There are a lot of well groomed black looking guys out there, plenty take the vanity aspect as far as their cars and jewellery (as zebra mentioned, status of wealth) as well as their clothes right down to their hair.
(There's a reason for those afro combs standing out in afro hair, you know, lol)
Sadly there are women there who fall for simply that kinda thing, I tend to shun guys who call me from their cars.
(Prejudiced? Yes, it cuts both ways)
But it doesn’t men care any less, methinks simply the number of those who don’t far outnumber those who do on the surface, you just have to pay close attention to see who does.
(Or perhaps since I’m a woman, it’s something I’m more prone to notice in and around London and if a man smells good like while queuing at the shops or serving a customer at work… he’s gonna get my attention, lol.)

Women seemingly have to make more of an effort with themselves probably cause the fashion and beauty industry in it’s billions of pounds or dollars target women as the main gender for sales.
However with this approach of ‘metrosexual male’ and the push to educate men on basic grooming and that good, clean hygiene, combed hair, some aftershave and a pressed shirt doesn’t hurt idea has been increasing (least in the UK)
Women are attracted by a man who looks after himself well as much as men are attracted by the women who wear make-up or clothes well.
(Men obviously being more vocal and obvious with their appreciations, thus making our eyes roll at times, lol)
But works and is appreciated on both fronts

As for whether appearance has a GREAT impact on your life, I'd say no. I can look at myself at the mirror without breaking it, I've made it clear that I don't give a dime about fashion or appearance and so the people around me have learned to judge me from my actions instead.
I can't tell if the woman I like is pretty or not (since I'm biased) but I doubt appearance plays a role in love. Looks do matter in jobs though, I suppose looking good means being able to take care of yourself, shows that you're sticking to certain rules and behaviour, thus being a better candidate for a chance job.

Perhaps not in love, but in the initial physical attraction which draws people to take the first few steps, then it does. (Which can lead to the couple falling in love)
This is the thing.
It becomes a case of two extremes now.
To say ‘I don’t care about fashion or appearance’ to someone who doesn’t know you brings out a negative image, esp on the latter note’
“I don’t care about myself and I don’t care that you have to interact with me either.”
Is what it can be seen as.

You don’t have to follow the latest brands, grab the newest Gucci, or even follow the latest fashion ‘fad’ just to try to be popular, but the extra 5-15mins a man can spend to make sure that they are clean, groomed, looking and smelling good is as valuable as brushing your teeth or wearing clean, fresh washed clothes often.
Like I said, our bodies and appearances are our CV to each other in life.
You may not actively care what others think, but as long as you interact with new people or strangers, their reactions will influence and add to your general social history of getting on with others and that will influence how you perceive people.

A little bit of care goes a long way; it also serves to feed your own self confidence and makes a general pleasant social environment to those you encounter.
As many beauty and health experts chant out as a mantra.
“Eat well, look good, feel great.”

[Showtime]

Originally Posted by -HyugaNeji-

I was always able to connect to everyone, no matter the gender, looks or age. I don't know if that's what got me the job in the bank back then, but i'm open minded. After all, it's about HOW you react when confronted with someone who might not look too great. Yes, we established now that we have some kind of instincts that let us judge people within the first seconds. And that beeing attractive can have positive effects for your carreer and social status. BUT, the important thing is, HOW you react after that first impression. Are you willing to look behind that first impression or does it determine already wheater you talk and respect a relativley unattractive person or not? And i am willing to do that. The problem often is, that people who tend to be not so attractive have some kind of prejudice themselves. Like: Yeah i know i don't look so good, go fuck yourself, you're not serios about me anyway, which is unfair too. So in the end it can result in a circle, where those who're relatively unattractive get less and less self esteem and trust, thus, limiting themselves and taking opportunities away.

Take Susan Boyle for example. When she walked up the stage, people began to laugh. Like: OMG what is SHE doing up there? They automatically assumed, that a person like her could not be able to sing, without even waiting for her to try. When she started, everyone was stunned. Sadly, her sucess is not a result of her beeing the best singer ever, but merely because no one expected her to be good. I mean she is not really bad, but also not the best singer in the universe. If she would have looked gorgeous and sing in the same way, people probably would have said: Yeah whatever, some Britney clone. Bleh. Boring.

^ This post.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by Jazzrat

I meant you have to accept the fact that your appearance does affect how others treat you and how others treat you also affects you as a person.

Ah. That was that. I agree then.

Originally Posted by cheyannew

I just wanted to re-ping on this....

Not that I honestly care what anyone thinks of me, but I don't generally go out of the house without a light dusting of powder (sorry the shiney forehead thing? no, thanks), and a thin line of black eyeliner at my upper lashes. I've done the same thing for the last... uhm.. 15+ years (my husband and I have discussed just getting it tattooed on there for crying out loud lol), and mascara.

I asked that to him, just to see if he knows what he is talking about. But whetherb the girl spends a lot of time or not, I still don't see any problem.

I don't see any problems if a person spends a lot of time to take care of his/her body. My main point was that all those things are also a kind of *hobby* and can include many other hobbies (sports, cooking [to have a good health, you also have to eat properly] etc.) , and that I don't see a real link between that and being more judgemental than the other people.

Whether the person is good looking or not, we have only one body. So we better take care of it.

About make up, nail polish, and such things for women, I am quite fond of that, so no way that I will criticize you in any way

My only grip IRL, is that many young girls seem to not know how to use make-up properly. It can give an ugly result.

Originally Posted by Kafriel

women's behaviour and the patterns with which they judge their partners: how old they are, if they have a rough personality, what job they do etc.

How old they are: I am part of the girls who don't really care about age gaps... well at least if it's not a really big age gap (like 15 or 20yo), but I talk about what kind of relationship i personally seek. About the other couple, I don't care. Even if the age gap is big, if they are really in love, then there's nothing to criticize about. But it's true that many people (not only women) prefer to avoid a big age gap. What I also saw in France/Slovakia is that in many couples, the guy tend to be older than the girl. And while some people still has prejudice when the age gap is >=10y, it's worse when it's the girl who is older. You have to take in consideration that if the girl wants a long term relationship, she might already think about having babies and such. If the guy is older by a lot, it can be seen as a problem on that matter. The fear to see him dying without having spend lots of time with his children and grandchildren.

If they have a rough personality: In which sense do you say that? I don't see any problem in wanting to be with a man who has a sweet personality.

What job they do: You know I am part of the girls who want a family. I want childrens (a lot), so if the guy has a poor job, it can be a problem, because we would not be able to make a baby for years (till we get better jobs), and maybe not be able to educate them properly if we're stuck on crappy jobs. You may think those girls calculate on that, but when you want a long term relationship, you have to think about the future. And for those girls, it includes childrens. I admit that my personal opinion is a bit biased, because I would want to be able to take care of my babies/childrens at home, which would includes to quit my job because I want to devote myself to my childrens. And it would not be possible if my husband doesn't have a good job.

[SaintessHeart]

Originally Posted by Mystique

Women seemingly have to make more of an effort with themselves probably cause the fashion and beauty industry in it’s billions of pounds or dollars target women as the main gender for sales.
However with this approach of ‘metrosexual male’ and the push to educate men on basic grooming and that good, clean hygiene, combed hair, some aftershaveand a pressed shirt doesn’t hurt idea has been increasing (least in the UK)
Women are attracted by a man who looks after himself well as much as men are attracted by the women who wear make-up or clothes well.
(Men obviously being more vocal and obvious with their appreciations, thus making our eyes roll at times, lol)
But works and is appreciated on both fronts

Men, in general, don't wear the following as a clothing need :

1. Bra
2. Skirts (unless you are a Scottish Highlander or related armed forces / culture)
3. Or even, underwear (heard of going commando?)

Thus I would say men need less of grooming products and "specialised clothing". In fact, dressing simple can be a pro for saving money, just T-shirt, jeans, track shoes / sneakers and short hair will do. No need for some flamboyant tube top that slips off the chest, or collared shirt that makes you look professional.

I passed by a boutique once and saw this skimpy clothing worth $150. I spoke my mind out a little too loud and went, "How the **** can this piece of handkerchief cost so much?" But yeah, today it is all over the place. And we have girls complaining of rape and molestation but wear such clothing. Obviously they traded too much of their brains for looks.

Perhaps not in love, but in the initial physical attraction which draws people to take the first few steps, then it does. (Which can lead to the couple falling in love)
This is the thing.
It becomes a case of two extremes now.
To say ‘I don’t care about fashion or appearance’ to someone who doesn’t know you brings out a negative image, esp on the latter note’
“I don’t care about myself and I don’t care that you have to interact with me either.”
Is what it can be seen as.

I go for cuteness, more of those kind that like girls with adolescent looks but heads beyond their age a.k.a DFC.

But for your point, it could just be a indication that the person is highly judgemental, and thus best to be ignored.

You don’t have to follow the latest brands, grab the newest Gucci, or even follow the latest fashion ‘fad’ just to try to be popular, but the extra 5-15mins a man can spend to make sure that they are clean, groomed, looking and smelling good is as valuable as brushing your teeth or wearing clean, fresh washed clothes often.
Like I said, our bodies and appearances are our CV to each other in life.
You may not actively care what others think, but as long as you interact with new people or strangers, their reactions will influence and add to your general social history of getting on with others and that will influence how you perceive people.

Good point! How others treat you will result in your perception of others. Everyone is biased in their own way.

A little bit of care goes a long way; it also serves to feed your own self confidence and makes a general pleasant social environment to those you encounter.
As many beauty and health experts chant out as a mantra.
“Eat well, look good, feel great.”

Notice that many of these "beauty and health experts" work for private health & beauty companies. It is just an overlying principle to use their products.

A more pragmatic and realistic mantra would be "Eat well. Stay fit. Die anyway." There is nothing more important in this world than time.

Originally Posted by Narona

I don't see any problems if a person spends a lot of time to take care of his/her body. My main point was that all those things are also a kind of *hobby* and can include many other hobbies (sports, cooking [to have a good health, you also have to eat properly] etc.) , and that I don't see a real link between that and being more judgemental than the other people.

The problem is about time. When one doesn't have enough, he/she will have to make do. Keeping things simple would be fine, but not to the extent of dressing in slippers, shorts and shirt to look like what we call, in local slang, an "Ah beng".

About make up, nail polish, and such things for women, I am quite fond of that, so no way that I will criticize you in any way

My only grip IRL, is that many young girls seem to not know how to use make-up properly. It can give an ugly result.

You should upload your thought engrams onto the internet for my local girls to download. Due to the fact that most guys here don't openly criticise girls on their use of makeup, it gets more atrocious.

IMO, I feel that Asian girls don't really need skin makeup (powder, etc) due to their natural skin colour. Somehow it makes them look more nauseating. A little mascara and lip gloss to cover parched lips will do fine, and if best, no makeup at all.

How old they are: I am part of the girls who don't really care about age gaps... well at least if it's not a really big age gap (like 15 or 20yo), but I talk about what kind of relationship i personally seek. About the other couple, I don't care. Even if the age gap is big, if they are really in love, then there's nothing to criticize about. But it's true that many people (not only women) prefer to avoid a big age gap. What I also saw in France/Slovakia is that in many couples, the guy tend to be older than the girl. And while some people still has prejudice when the age gap is >=10y, it's worse when it's the girl who is older. You have to take in consideration that if the girl wants a long term relationship, she might already think about having babies and such. If the guy is older by a lot, it can be seen as a problem on that matter. The fear to see him dying without having spend lots of time with his children and grandchildren.

Spoiler for OT:

My grandma died in my first year in high school, and my grandpa died one week before I enlist (ONLY my dad was there to see me off). My dad was a troublemaker all his life (so I was a chip off the old block, haha), so I could say my turn going to the army could be a consolation to my grandparents that my father had done fine enough in life.

Life is full of ups and downs. Nobody can predict death, but when your time is up, it is up. Suck it up and move on if it is your kin.

If they have a rough personality: In which sense do you say that? I don't see any problem in wanting to be with a man who has a sweet personality.

She probby meant those guys who would act rather than talk, or maybe to an extent, "Do first, talk later". I am one of such, I believe that it is a waste of time talking when more things can be done. Too bad for teamwork and pre-planning.

What job they do: You know I am part of the girls who want a family. I want childrens (a lot), so if the guy has a poor job, it can be a problem, because we would not be able to make a baby for years (till we get better jobs), and maybe not be able to educate them properly if we're stuck on crappy jobs. You may think those girls calculate on that, but when you want a long term relationship, you have to think about the future. And for those girls, it includes childrens. I admit that my personal opinion is a bit biased, because I would want to be able to take care of my babies/childrens at home, which would includes to quit my job because I want to devote myself to my childrens. And it would not be possible if my husband doesn't have a good job.

Raising a child requires around 20 years and a few million dollars, exclusive of tax and inflation. It is about work-life balance.

[LeoXiao]

IMO, I feel that Asian girls don't really need skin makeup (powder, etc) due to their natural skin colour. Somehow it makes them look more nauseating. A little mascara and lip gloss to cover parched lips will do fine, and if best, no makeup at all.

Generally my view on makeup is that if you're already pretty it doesn't do much except make you stand out more and to me that has the connotation of "attention whore." If you're ugly, that just makes it worse. When girls use makeup I feel that they're trying to act "adult," but really there is the effect of making them seem like old ladies who dye their hair and try to look younger (give up, grandma) and instead just seem ridiculous.

Raising a child requires around 20 years and a few million dollars

A few million? About 100,000 (or 5000 a year) seems more appropriate, unless you really spoil your kid.

[Irenicus]

Beauty, eh? Those who don't have it wishes for it. Those who do...well, I'm not one of them. What do you of the Fair Folk think?

Originally Posted by SaintessHeart

I passed by a boutique once and saw this skimpy clothing worth $150. I spoke my mind out a little too loud and went, "How the **** can this piece of handkerchief cost so much?" But yeah, today it is all over the place. And we have girls complaining of rape and molestation but wear such clothing. Obviously they traded too much of their brains for looks.

Careful there, oi. You're coming ridiculously close to blaming the victim for the rape crime, despite the topic at hand having absolutely nothing to do with that in the first place. Knee-jerk statements have their places but do try not to imply anything more than you should.

Also, I find different styles of clothing to be fun. Not for me, I couldn't be bothered in the least. But it's amazing how attractive people can put on crazy different things together and look good. I mean, you like anime, right? Do you like anime girls dressing in different and fun outfits? It's not that different. That $150 tank top that offended you so costs a lot because of the luxurious brand. And, well, branding for status is a whole different issue from wearing "handkerchiefs."

[Throne Invader]

Originally Posted by SaintessHeart

I passed by a boutique once and saw this skimpy clothing worth $150. I spoke my mind out a little too loud and went, "How the **** can this piece of handkerchief cost so much?" But yeah, today it is all over the place. And we have girls complaining of rape and molestation but wear such clothing. Obviously they traded too much of their brains for looks.

It all depends if girls buy the items for the right reasons. If they bought it cuz they just simply like it, then I say it's fine. Rape problems always lie with the rapist, never the victim. It's all a matter of control.

[Mystique]

Originally Posted by Kafriel

Men also don't care about their appearance as much as women (they just tend to their hair and beard, 5 mins a day) while women do...well,iunno what they do but it certainly takes a lot more time. Their choice of clothes is also larger and more important (to women) and they talk more about appearances than men do (at least my friends did).

Originally Posted by SaintessHeart

Men, in general, don't wear the following as a clothing need :

1. Bra
2. Skirts (unless you are a Scottish Highlander or related armed forces / culture)
3. Or even, underwear (heard of going commando?)

Thus I would say men need less of grooming products and "specialised clothing". In fact, dressing simple can be a pro for saving money, just T-shirt, jeans, track shoes / sneakers and short hair will do. No need for some flamboyant tube top that slips off the chest, or collared shirt that makes you look professional.

Totally missed my point and I can counter your examples:
Female = Male

Bra = Vest
Skirts = Shorts
Underwear = Anyone going commando (male or female) is nasty, short of looking for someone to have sex with asap then it'd be useful.
Or for guys, you're fine with using the toilet and just tucking back straight into your jeans without cleaning (eeeeeeew)
Or are fine with having more likelihood of the zip of your jeans being caught up in your pubic hair.
(Or worse...)
More power to you then.
- In terms of fashion, I already mentioned the beauty industry's main target audience and thus gave examples of other areas men generally keep note of when looking after their physical appearance.
It doesn't just boil down to clothes only.

Notice that many of these "beauty and health experts" work for private health & beauty companies. It is just an overlying principle to use their products.
A more pragmatic and realistic mantra would be "Eat well. Stay fit. Die anyway." There is nothing more important in this world than time.

In your opinion.
We're all gonna die but your outlook there is just damn well cynical, heh.
Which if I'm to make a judgement based off the story you wrote about what you've suffered from people, your general attitude and somewhat cynical and harsh perception seems to stem from it, that just happens to be who you are.
On the time note, I agree - an uplifting version of the same pragmatic approach would be:
"Time is precious, live life well, have few regrets"
But it doesn't invalidate the 'eat well, look good, feel great' mantra.
I can read that and go:
“that's kinda true, I'm gonna try to improve my lifestyle' and not spend a damn penny on any specialised product from the tons of private manufacturers out there but amend my current lifestyle to suit me and incorporate that message.”

But that's me going tangent some now.
My previous post was in response to 'men not needing to care as much' - men do, everyone does, just maybe there's "less" work involved for guys but doesn't mean they care less.
Shaving is a chore I often hear my male friends complain about, then again, I try offering wax to them and they look at me like I'm crazy xD
(and no, I'm not so masochistic as to inflict that kinda pain on myself, however i can see why it's useful for 10mins-1hr of pain = 3-4 weeks of peace)

[Jazzrat]

Looks like there's a lot of guys against girls taking the effort in being pretty
It's superficial but personally, i enjoy looking at them.

As for the girl being rape bait, i say guys should keep their dick to themselves in such case.

[Kafriel]

There's also cases of women raping men, it's not a one-sided problem.

What job they do: You know I am part of the girls who want a family. I want children (a lot), so if the guy has a poor job, it can be a problem, because we would not be able to make a baby for years (till we get better jobs), and maybe not be able to educate them properly if we're stuck on crappy jobs. You may think those girls calculate on that, but when you want a long term relationship, you have to think about the future. And for those girls, it includes children. I admit that my personal opinion is a bit biased, because I would want to be able to take care of my babies/children at home, which would includes to quit my job because I want to devote myself to my children. And it would not be possible if my husband doesn't have a good job.

Well, someone could have inherited a fortune or won the lottery and not work at all, but still they'd lose face in front of everyone else, being thought of as lazy or incompetent. There's also schedules to be taken into consideration: working hours can vary from the casual 8~15 to 20~3 depending on the job. Some people also worry about occupational hazards, flexibility and stability (teachers don't change schools as often as soldiers change countries) and many more things I can't think of right now since I just woke up.

A few million? About 100,000 (or 5000 a year) seems more appropriate, unless you really spoil your kid.

You will spend a lot more if you raise one now with the incoming crisis~ (and there's also tuition fees, medical treatment,an extra room in the house, additional furniture etc.)