(L) The Surprise of Haruhi Suzumiya (Novels 10/11) Spoiler Discussion

[TheHaruhiIncarnate]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

Technically Kyon did already, in Disappearance with Yuki. Part of Kyon's quality is that he doesn't treat Haruhi as anything other than a young girl. And that's really what Haruhi needed as a person of great power. It is lonely at the top.

What I really like about Kyon is that he's honest with her (partailly) and calls her out on her bull. It annoys her, but thats what she really needs. And since he's so honest with her (as far as she knows) she trusts him immensly.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by TheHaruhiIncarnate

What I really like about Kyon is that he's honest with her (partailly) and calls her out on her bull. It annoys her, but thats what she really needs. And since he's so honest with her (as far as she knows) she trusts him immensly.

It's not really the "won't lie" kind of trust. It's the "will never hurt me" trust. The idea that Kyon trust Haruhi to do the right thing, and Haruhi trusts Kyon to have her best interests at heart.

And technically Kyon was honest with her. He told her everything, she merely refused to believe him. So once she know the truth one day, Kyon can give her a "I told you so" and she can't get mad at him.

[TheHaruhiIncarnate]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

It's not really the "won't lie" kind of trust. It's the "will never hurt me" trust. The idea that Kyon trust Haruhi to do the right thing, and Haruhi trusts Kyon to have her best interests at heart.

And technically Kyon was honest with her. He told her everything, she merely refused to believe him. So once she know the truth one day, Kyon can give her a "I told you so" and she can't get mad at him.

That's true. Even if her best interests is something she doesnt like (quitting baseball game) she'll listen to Kyon.

[Ypocaramel]

I think trust is more than just prescriptive or prospective actions - i.e. will or will not. I mean, what's trust between best friends? Trust between lovers? I think, drawing on inspiration from (commwealth common law legal) trusts, I think one thing is that the trustee will have the other's interest in mind (as said above). You know what side they're ultimate on, and you know that they'll deliever as best as they can.

That said, the missing piece of course as far as I can remember, isn't just that 'SOS-dan is alien time travelling espers' but that 'you are have powers to rival God.'

Spoiler for Last chapter:

Speaking of God, it's an interesting parallel. In the early SOS Dan days, people recognized her powers but would never trust her per se, hence all the monitoring. Haruhi had 4 followers, but no believers. Now, we have Kyon, who puts his trust in Haruhi before all logic - is that not faith? For all the talk about Haruhi as God, is Kyon not the first to pit faith not in her powers, but in Haruhi herself?

[AbZeroNow]

I just read the epilogue translation. Thanks to the translator and the editor.

I can see that two future events being set up in the Epilogue: Tsuruya's flower viewing party and Kyon's middle school class reunion(with Sasaki).

It can be slightly annoying when Koizumi is your main source of information because you feel that you're not getting the whole picture from him. His infodump had some interesting tidbits.

Now, a few interesting things I noticed...

Spoiler for epilogue spoilers and speculation.:

Haruhi asking the what if you could met your future self question was very interesting. Given that we know from Editor in Chief that she laid the foundation for the time plane theory, I strongly suspect that Haruhi is more involved with how the Time Travellers operate. It seems that she at least knows that time travel exists when we see her College self. For all we know, she could have said with that gentle smile...see you later, John.

Koizumi is our only source of Fujiwara and Asahina being from different timelines. I will wait untl Asahina(Big) confirms this for herself before I take that as fact. It is also interesting that Koizumi got Kyouko's contact information and that she sent him an e-mail says that she's "retiring" and will just try to be a friend to Sasaki. Maybe Kyouko has actually seen the light, and will help the SOS-dan from now on in her own way. Kyon's comment about Mori got an interesting reaction from Koizumi, and it is interesting that Mori would use Koizumi's name without an honorific.

I am not sure, but did Tsuruya just call Kyon by his given name? Her telling him that she wants him to pick up the toy she found is very interesting. It sounds like that Chekhov's Gun is going to be featured soon.

This is the most character development I have seen from Kunikida. He seems like he has been interested in Tsuruya for quite a while, even before the SOS-dan was founded.

I am hoping that we see more of Sasaki soon. I wonder which middle school classmate of theirs had confessed to her. We have met two of the already, but it could be one that we have yet to meet. Her line about Kyon being the only one to treat her normally did sound something from a confession.

I am psyched for whenever we see more of Surprise translated.

[AmyElizzabeth]

Spoiler for Tsuruya and Kyon's name:

When I was reading, I was like "who the hell is Kyorosuke?" Could that be Kyon's real name? I was thinking that it was just another weird nickname she gave him

[ultimatemegax]

Originally Posted by AmyElizzabeth

Spoiler for Tsuruya and Kyon's name:

When I was reading, I was like "who the hell is Kyorosuke?" Could that be Kyon's real name? I was thinking that it was just another weird nickname she gave him

It is indeed a nickname. It was in katakana. Tsuruya usually gives nicknames to the Brigade. Strange how Koizumi hasn't gotten one yet.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by ultimatemegax

It is indeed a nickname. It was in katakana. Tsuruya usually gives nicknames to the Brigade. Strange how Koizumi hasn't gotten one yet.

Does Koizumi even talk to her, in an actual direct conversation?

I just got a feeling he was told to hold his distance because she is nearly as important to the Espers as Haruhi is. You know, your boss's daughter and all.

[ijuinkun]

Originally Posted by AmyElizzabeth

Spoiler for Tsuruya and Kyon's name:

When I was reading, I was like "who the hell is Kyorosuke?" Could that be Kyon's real name? I was thinking that it was just another weird nickname she gave him

Spoiler:

Well, "Kyosuke" is a reasonable enough name, but the addition of "ro" to it definitely sounds like one of Tsuruya's speech quirks (nyoro), so it probably is something she made up. I would not be surprised however if Kyon's real given name does begin with "Kyo".

[Jonbob0008]

Originally Posted by ijuinkun

Spoiler:

Well, "Kyosuke" is a reasonable enough name, but the addition of "ro" to it definitely sounds like one of Tsuruya's speech quirks (nyoro), so it probably is something she made up. I would not be surprised however if Kyon's real given name does begin with "Kyo".

Spoiler for Possible name:

Hmm...Kyosuke. For some reason, I like the sound of that name. It kinda fits him, too. Of course we don't know if that's his real name yet, but I hope it is.

[TheHaruhiIncarnate]

These drawings are amazing.






source

[Yumeka]

Originally Posted by TheHaruhiIncarnate

These drawings are amazing.

Spoiler for for big images:

source

Nice pics! I've been trying to find good Surprise art on pixiv but haven't had that much luck.

[Jenx]

I've been sort of skimming spoilers because I still want some surprises, so this post is actually rather old, but I just noticed something last night that I hadn't caught the first time I looked at it since I was skimming. Post is here on LJ.


So what I'm wondering is, can someone confirm/deny that

Spoiler:

Koizumi is the leader/founder of the Organization? Because really, wow, what. I know he's a dirty filthy liar, but even so, I'm kind of floored. Anyone got information on this?

[AbZeroNow]

Originally Posted by Jenx

I've been sort of skimming spoilers because I still want some surprises, so this post is actually rather old, but I just noticed something last night that I hadn't caught the first time I looked at it since I was skimming. Post is here on LJ.


So what I'm wondering is, can someone confirm/deny that

Spoiler:

Koizumi is the leader/founder of the Organization? Because really, wow, what. I know he's a dirty filthy liar, but even so, I'm kind of floored. Anyone got information on this?

Since I have only read the translations of Chapter 9 through to the epilogue, I'll just comment on that.

Spoiler for Koizumi and other LJ spoilers.:

Kyon did ask Koizumi if Mori was his superior. The question threw Koizumi off guard, and then Kyon explains that she says his name without an honorific(meaning that she is close or familiar to him) and that he calls her Mori-san. Koizumi then tells Kyon that his organization doesn't really have what most people would call a hierachy. It's my own speculation that Mori is the founder of the esper faction and that Koizumi is related to her.

The LJ post assumes that Koizumi is telling the truth about Yasumi being Haruh's subconscous and is wrong about Haruhi and Kyon being a couple. They aren't one yet but I would definitely think that one of them is going to confess very soon to the other.

Of course, I'd like to hear from those who can read the original Japanese for their take on that too.

[Yumeka]

Originally Posted by Jenx

I've been sort of skimming spoilers because I still want some surprises, so this post is actually rather old, but I just noticed something last night that I hadn't caught the first time I looked at it since I was skimming. Post is here on LJ.

Thanks for linking that LJ post. I had never seen it before =) It was great reading detailed observations/thoughts on the novels from someone who's read both in their entirety.

[ijuinkun]

Originally Posted by Jenx

So what I'm wondering is, can someone confirm/deny that

Spoiler:

Koizumi is the leader/founder of the Organization? Because really, wow, what. I know he's a dirty filthy liar, but even so, I'm kind of floored. Anyone got information on this?

Well,

Spoiler:

In "Melancholy", Koizumi did say that the Organization "found" him when his powers awakened, so I am inclined to think that a number of them had already gotten together before he found out about there being others besides himself.

[UNDER_LINE]

Just finished reading Surprise today.

Throughout the confrontation in the closed space, I totally expected Kyon to SOGEBU Fujiwara and literally grow wings to save Haruhi.

I can't be the only one who expected this.

[virox]

Originally Posted by UNDER_LINE

Just finished reading Surprise today.

Throughout the confrontation in the closed space, I totally expected Kyon to SOGEBU Fujiwara and literally grow wings to save Haruhi.

I can't be the only one who expected this.

No, not really. First of all, it's not that kind of story, with sparkles and bubbles and rainbows everywhere. Secondly, I'm not exactly a supporter of the "Kyon is the actual god" theory. Well, if Haruhi wanted him to have wings and believed it was possible, it might would have happened, but she was unconscious, so...

[DurararaFTW]

Spoiler:

What has Koizumi done to make you think he's a dirthy filthy liar?

[virox]

Originally Posted by DurararaFTW

Spoiler:

What has Koizumi done to make you think he's a dirthy filthy liar?

Nothing, we just don't know whether he tells the truth or not. But reading that LJ blog posted above would probably give a lot of people this impression, since the blogger seems to make a lot of misassumptions