(L+CR) Space Battleship Yamato 2199 (movie & TV)

[TZoli]

So the usual 1970's, 1980's space station designs by various artist (something like what you seen in the old Superman or Sci-Fi movies)

Yeah I've noticed it is similar to Andromeda which could help me with the drawing as I don't have to draw and entire new ship, could use the old Andromeda for parts.

For the gamilas ship, not necessary Gatlantis turrets, but probably based on them, they seems to be capable of rapid fire excellent firing arcs, though at a lower firepower as a compromise

[Ithekro]

The Gamilas ships are similar to the later Galman style ships shich use Gatlantis style turrets as well as their own turret designs. I think the idea was that Dessler would use any tech idea he could find and incorporated it from learning his lessons from each of his defeats of the last few years. This leading to the Galman-Gamilas Empire having huge ships compared to the old style Gamilas ships, and some even larger than the Yamato 2199 Gamilas ships.

On the image I provided of older style Yamato ships, the bottom middle area is mostly Galman ships, with Dessler's newest flagship the large blue ship on the bottom. It is really big.

As the episode commentary mentions, Space Battleship Arizona was designed by Yutaka Izubuchi, who is presently the Supervising Director for Yamato 2199.

[TZoli]

What are your guys opinion on the Galaxy Express and Harlock series? Were they inhabit thesame universe as Yamato just in the future (few hundred or thousand years) or a parallel universe with many similarities?

[Ithekro]

Both. All Harlock based materials follow an ecentric multiverse timeline that loops like a 3D donut. Yamato is there some how and always was. It has always been more a matter of how rather than when.

There was to be a unified universe under Matsumoto around the turn of the Century, but legal issues and all that. Even then, there are a half dozen or so Harlock related projects withYamato making a cameo appearance, as one of the ships of legend.

There was an effort to make a unified timeline of the Leijiverse with same success. It is convoluted but functional. I tend to want to keep elements of it for my own reasons. With Yamato 2199 it technically shouldn't be part of it at all, but whatever.

With the way the Earth military acted againt the Gamilas in the new version, my take is that the events of Interstella 5555 happened in this universe and that Earth had had contact with a blue skinned alien race for.a time before the gate they were using collapsed (or was just closed). But the blue people, before closing the gate, warned Earth about aggressive species, there cousins the Gamillas (who might have just come to "reintroduce" them back into the Empire). This warning being the basis for the Earth command to order the fleet to open fire without warning. (Those blue meanies cut us off from our blue pop culture sensation, they must be evil.)

Something like that.

[TZoli]

I see, I would not count Interstella 5555 as it was a movie (clip series) for the French Daft Punk band. Indeed Matsumoto created it but it's more of a musical with like 3-4 spaceships in it.

I'm asking because the Wave Motion Technology seem to reduced only to engines, as I did not see Wave Motion Cannon style weaponry in the Galaxy Express and Harlock series.
Neither the Arcadia nor the Death Shadow seems to have this kind of weaponry.
To say the truth I only watched a handful of Harlock episodes as the series did not aired in Hungary and damn hard to find the original japansese dubbed english subbed version on the net!

On the other hand...
The Karyu from Cosmo Warrior Zero have a Wave Motion Cannon style weapon the "Fire of St. Elmo"
Any thoughts about this?

Yamato 2520 too seems to lack such weaponry but the Great Yamato or Great Galaxy (Dai Ginga) have 3, two on the wings and one large on the nose.

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Correction, Yamato 2520 do have some kind of Wave Motion Weapon, just hidden in the nose behind armour plates:

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[TZoli]

And some other Yamato 2520 related art: (I know the ships in it isn't created by Matsumoto, none the less, they look more futuristic more post Harlock time)

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[Ithekro]

Yamato 2520 has mixed technology weaponry. It could be that the mixed weaponry causes other advancements that make the now centuries old wave motion technology obsolete.

The Arcadia has what looks like two enhanced wave motion engines for long distance warping (similar to what Yamato was refitted with in "Be Forever, Yamato".) In some versions, Arcadia's main batteries can put out massive amounts of damage in a fashion of a wave motion gun (Harlock Saga). Just on a smaller scale that doesn't need the massive power buildup.

Arcadia was a ship built by Tochiro, so it wasn't strictly built at an Earth yard with access to the best in terms of wave motion gun technology. Some of the other military ships seem to have the opening in the front for such a weapon, but it would be restricted use, most of the time.

In Harlock: Endless Odyssey, the Earth's "police" forces have wave motion gun type weapons that they use to blow up a corrupted science ship...through Pluto.

Deathshadow doesn't have a wave motion gun, unless it if hidden, though the ship is styled somewhat like the Earth ships in Final Yamato. (when it isn't styled like the original version of the Arcadia). I was thinking the horns might have been some type of special weapon system, rather than the Arcadia's ramming knife.

The Karyu's double twin polarized wave motion guns seem to be the only thing on that ship that makes it decent in combat. The main guns are lacking in power, and they don't have the crew to make the fighter bays work (post-war). It seems like a tricky weapon to use, since the ships design seems flawed with its cooling systems not able to handle its own wave motion guns at full power. But the weapon system seems to be controllable by the ship's captain. He can maneuver the blast once fired to targets anywhere around the ship, which could be quite handy verse Yamato's single beam, or even the Andromeda's spread effect.

[TZoli]

I'm not sure the Arcadia or Death Shadow could be built in EDF (Does it still exist at that time?) shipyards, because the Earth was defeated or had to do a loser's side compromise in the war, or what I able to deduct from Cosmo Warrior Zero. The Mechanized men seems to be very potent adversary!

Yes in 2520 they use a different energy source, Monopole but it's quite rare though probably much more potent than Tachyon based technology.

[Ithekro]

The old Deathshadow was suppose to have been an Earth Solar Fleet battleship of some sort before the war ended and Harlock crashed it to prevent its use (for a time) by the enemy.

The newer ones (old style Arcadia "Deathshadow" and the later Arcadia) were built wherever and modified over the years/generations of use.

Depends on which timeline, time around the timeline it is for Harlock. None of his series seem to follow 100% into any other series. Some are 90% in line with a previous version, but still not in line. Others are almost entirely in a different timeline...then something happens that makes it seem like part of one of the other series. Matsumoto is fast and loose with continuity.

https://animekritik.wordpress.com/in...-leiji-verses/

The link to the third edition of the Leijiverse Integrated Timeline is here. https://animekritik.wordpress.com/20...ersal-variety/ (warning, it is something like 275 pages long). There are a lot of events in Matsumoto's works over the last 40+ years.

[TZoli]

If you are referring to the links in the pdf, they are now dead

[Ithekro]

Found a version of it online still.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/101816886/...-Timeline-V305

[TZoli]

Yes that works! But all these "Star Blazers" version makes me both sad and sick. I don't consider that "cartoon" as part of the Leijiverse. Rewritten story, different character names and such...
It's like renaming the USS Enterprise in Star Trek to USS Bismarck or anything non USN related and Picard or Kirk to say.... Captain Bald and Captain Gigolo...

[Ithekro]

Names mostly. The story is not all that changed really.

Especially when it comes to the present day and Yamato 2199. A few plot elements in the remade story reflect more the translated Star Blazers version of events rather than the original events. Though usually these changes are for when the character reasoning in the English version makes more sense in modern context to the 1974 Japanese writer's reasoning for the characters. Particularly when it comes to the two Kodai's.

Mamoru's reasoning for staying behind in Star Blazers, the live action Yamato film, and Yamato 2199 make logical military sense, where the original version was very old style bushido code or something that calls for death before dishonor, and that one cannot leave the battlefield alive in defeat.

Sasumu's reasoning for attacking Balan in Star Blazers was actually tactically sound. Take out the enemy bases along your route to Iscandar, because you will have to fight them again on the way home if you don't. His reasoning in the original version was to avenge the native animals the Gamilas had butchered. Animals that Dommel specifically had butchered because Yamato would stop at Balan to avenge them. Meaning they had showed a pattern of doing this behavior enough to allow Dommel to set this up as a trap. In Yamato 2199 they in turn are not given a choice when it comes to Balun. They can't let 10,000 enemy ships be able to just follow them through the gate to Iscandar, so the gate system core needs to be shut down and they need to do it quickly and with the ability to escape. Queue the wave motion gun.

There are probably other things as well (like the whole robot tanks business the Americans tacked on due to violence issues on TV at the time) that made it to Yamato 2199 for whatever reason. Those are just the ones I can think of at the moment.

[TZoli]

Found a drawing of the Gamilas Cruiser:

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[Ithekro]

It is a good looking battlecruiser. A nice update to the older designs. Though when we first saw it we thought it was an older design, it turned out it was a newer design, bridging what would be the gap between old Gamilas tech and Yamato III era's Galman tech.

I also like that the underside turret actually has a good field of fire while the other designs have the wing in the way.

[TZoli]

It is also interesting how they use both barrelled and barrel-less turrets

[Ithekro]

I do wonder why that was decided? Both this ship and the improved battleship have two triple long barreled turrets on the upper deck while the remaining batteries are of the older barrel-less style.

They are even listed differently as positron beams and positron cannons. While Yamato has positron impact "shock" cannons. This is all antimatter beam weaponry (positrons are the antimatter equivalent of electrons).


Dommel's ship has quad barrel-less batteries (49 cm and triple 33 cm) while Dessler's battleship has triple barreled main cannons (48 cm and 33 cm) as well as some barrel-less batteries (33 cm).

[Ithekro]

I recently bought the big Gamilas book that came out a year or so ago. While it is mostly pictures of ships and characters with interviews and the likes I found one very helpful image on the Gamilas battlecarrier. There is a cross-section image that shows the ship's hanger decks. Multiple decks as well as where the rotating gun decks, landing gear, and turrets rest under the hull. The ship has the enclosed hanger space along the main deck, then two hanger below deck. A longer one below the upper one that gives a little extra space below the gun decks. I was messing around with another set of images in an effort to scale the carrier with the DW262 fighters seen operating from those carriers in Ark of the Stars. I wanted to get a guess at to how many the ships could carry. packing them in like American and Japanese style carriers of World War II give an interesting result. Even keeping the elevators clear, not using the upper most armored hanger space, and leaving room on the lowest deck for support craft, I get a possible 36 fighters per hanger...that's 72 fighters per carrier. Mind you the DW262 is smaller than the rest of the Gamilas fighters and bombers, but it fits nicely on the ship.

Assuming I'm scaling the ship and fighter correctly.

The battlecarrier is suppose to be 390 meters long while the DW262 is 15.58 meters long.

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[TZoli]

The barrelled ones probably give more firepower and/or accuracy and range (like a real world longer barrel of a gun is more accurate and the shell could fly further due to more stable flying path) or it could provide more firepower because more guns can be mounted of less energy consumption.

[TZoli]

Some other ship designs I've found:

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