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[risingstar3110]

Even if you take the sympathise toward Palestine out of the equation. Israeli is currently are blind themselves on not recognizing that they are digging their own hole.

I means with technology advancement and constant change in geopolitics, there will be a point where Israel and her ally, naming U S and Western countries could no longer hold the current mighty and assured position.


And when that happens, think just for a second what if instead of Vasili Arkhipov, you have an extremist version of Ivan Maslennikov holding a button , or pill, or data that can eliminate millions of life including the entire existence of Israeli ? And we only need 20-30 years or so for such massive geopolitical to happen. It can be any of the AS poster sitting right here, or more likely, one of those related to current Gaza shelling to decide the fate of Israel and the rest of Middle East. And when the only thing that can save your life is the mercy or compassion of your enemy, which you are eradicating right now, then you are screwed big time.


For one who suffered so much during WW2, Israel ended up the only one who failed to understand the most important lesson from it .And if you think your or my government with their super intelligence and defense system will never allow that to happen, think again. I means just watch this, and see how likely simple negligence could go to a wrong hand:

[maplehurry]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

hungry but not at the point of starving to death.

According to WFP, the food consumption score of the 2 regions are as followed:

Gaza: 22.6% poor consumption, 26.8% borderline, 50.6% good.

NK: 33.8% poor consumption, 50.6% borderline, 15.6% good.

With poor being the worst state of the three (with borderline means borderline acceptable).

So on average, Gaza's significantly better fed in comparison, though if we look at the "worst case", there's still 22.6% starving there.

Oh, and don't make a joke about Stalin and stats.

[kyp275]

Originally Posted by risingstar3110

stuff

If your point is that Israel should concede defeat lest they be annihilated in the future by some mad man with super WMD that will apparently be easily obtainable, then I think you’re missing the bigger problem – the easily obtainable super WMD.

If something like that will be easily obtained and deployed, Israel won’t even matter. There are no shortage of political / religious conflicts now or in the future that’ll breed extremists. Just randomly throw a dart at a map of Africa, and more likely than not you’ll hit one with ongoing unrest/civil war, and that’s just one continent.

Mercy/compassion of your enemies? Try pleading your case to the likes of Boko Haram or ISIS. Forget about killing you because you did something to them, they’d kill you just because you’re not them, or for lulz, or both.

In your scenario, worrying over Israel’s current conduct is pointless, it’d be like worrying about if you should have dinner when a 1,000km asteroid is 5 min. away from hitting Earth, you’re done either way.

[risingstar3110]

Originally Posted by kyp275

If your point is that Israel should concede defeat lest they be annihilated in the future by some mad man with super WMD that will apparently be easily obtainable, then I think you’re missing the bigger problem – the easily obtainable super WMD.

If something like that will be easily obtained and deployed, Israel won’t even matter. There are no shortage of political / religious conflicts now or in the future that’ll breed extremists. Just randomly throw a dart at a map of Africa, and more likely than not you’ll hit one with ongoing unrest/civil war, and that’s just one continent.

Mercy/compassion of your enemies? Try pleading your case to the likes of Boko Haram or ISIS. Forget about killing you because you did something to them, they’d kill you just because you’re not them, or for lulz, or both.

In your scenario, worrying over Israel’s current conduct is pointless, it’d be like worrying about if you should have dinner when a 1,000km asteroid is 5 min. away from hitting Earth, you’re done either way.

Admit defeat? Please. You know the main reason why Hamas still shooting rocket toward Israel while Egypt and Lebanon don't, is because Israel right wing politician benefited from the ongoing conflict rather than back down for a more peaceful and constructive solutions. That's why Yitzhak Rabin was strongly opposed and assassinated and while none others were.

And no I'm not talking about WMD, not yet anyway. Originally, I means the change in geopolitics. The same way Hitler took just 15 years from believing his nation was back-stabbed by "Jews, Marxists, and 'cultural Bolsheviks' " to revive the German economy and its restricted army to invade Europe and murders millions of Jews, Marxists, and Russians. Or Pol Pot took just 22 years, starting with him from failing exam in France and forced to go back, to become a ruthless dictators and massacred the civilians by the millions. No one could have foreseen those happening. The Jews, US, Britain didn't then, what to say they are now?

Oh, with your darts analogy. Do you drink something that say "can potentially give you brain cancer, but don't worry we sold a millions products so plenty could die before your family turn"?

Even without the change in geopolitics, simply the advance of technology will leave the "almighty Israel" clueless of what hitting them. For example, I means do you know 80-90% of treated waste water in US still contaminated by up to 50 of different chemical and hormones due to commercial products that still unsure on its long term affect to human productions genes or hormones growth? And no one gave a damn, and they were not even busy with flying rockets, just their Obamacare political games.

And that's only negligence. Wait for something malice to happen.


Yeah your last line sounds like a drunk homeless telling civil worker about how they should mind their own business. Maybe the Israeli just like you, having that victim complex cooked up by their government, thinking whoever criticise you is secretly justify Hamas actions and are out there to harm the Jews. Hence it's so easy to turns blind eyes and do a "f*ck the world opinions, we do things our way". But public opinion aside, i haven't talked to or read researches of any scholars studying in the school of international politic. Who believe escalating conflicts will benefit Israel in long term. None. Or at least not the way Israeli governments are defending their actions

[kyp275]

Originally Posted by risingstar3110

Admit defeat? Please. You know the main reason why Hamas still shooting rocket toward Israel while Egypt and Lebanon don't, is because Israel right wing politician benefited from the ongoing conflict rather than back down for a more peaceful and constructive solutions. That's why Yitzhak Rabin was strongly opposed and assassinated and while none others were.

...great, and have nothing to do with what I was responding to, which was your rather explicit claim that Israel will be wiped off the map in the future if they don't stop now.

And no I'm not talking about WMD, not yet anyway. Originally, I means the change in geopolitics.

If you want to talk geopolitics, then actually do it, instead of using it as a catchphrase. The rise of Nazi Germany had little to do with geopolitical reasons (No, seriously, Hitler didn't come to power because of where Germany was located). If you actually do study geopolitics, then you would know that things happen for a reason, and the last thing you'd say would be "well, who knows what will happen in the future - except this! I don't know how or why it'll happen, but it will!"

Also, "a button , or pill, or data that can eliminate millions of life" is something that the rest of the world considers WMD.

Oh, with your darts analogy. Do you drink something that say "can potentially give you brain cancer, but don't worry we sold a millions products so plenty could die before your family turn"?

Really, at this point I'm going to have to assume that English is not your primary language, because half of the stuff you're saying simply doesn't make any sense.

Even without the change in geopolitics, simply the advance of technology will leave the "almighty Israel" clueless of what hitting them.

Israel is far from almighty, but who do you think are on the forefront of research in technology with military use? Here's a hint, ISIS isn't the one that's testing railguns. What are you gonna do, Instagram Israel to ruins?

For example, I means do you know 80-90% of treated waste water in US still contaminated by up to 50 of different chemical and hormones due to commercial products that still unsure on its long term affect to human productions genes or hormones growth? And no one gave a damn, and they were not even busy with flying rockets, just their Obamacare political games.

Yea, I'm sure you'd prefer the drink the water in China instead. Alternatively, you can also provide us with your water purification technology, or are you suggesting we go back to the stone age and cut the world population accordingly? BTW, want to bet which public water system is cleaner? the "contaminated" ones today, or the ones from a couple hundred years ago, before all these commercial products?

Yeah your last line sounds like a drunk homeless telling civil worker about how they should mind their own business. Maybe the Israeli just like you, having that victim complex cooked up by their government, thinking whoever criticise you is secretly justify Hamas actions and are out there to harm the Jews. Hence it's so easy to turns blind eyes and do a "f*ck the world opinions, we do things our way".

Read above about the English bit. In any case, I did laugh at your suggestion that I'm somehow a supporter of Israel.

But public opinion aside, i haven't talked to or read researches of any scholars studying in the school of international politic. Who believe escalating conflicts will benefit Israel in long term. None. Or at least not the way Israeli governments are defending their actions

Because it doesn't. But they have little choice atm, quite literally stuck between a rock and a hard place. It's the internal politics and the power wielded by hardliners on both sides that makes any sort of resolution in the foreseeable future extremely unlikely.

In all honesty, I would rather the US pressure Israel to rein in their tactics or withdraw their support, certainly not sending more money their way:

http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/01/politi...html?hpt=hp_t2

We took IDF from insurgents all the time in Iraq, the difference is that we didn't just start shelling in their general direction afterwards, especially if they were in a populated area.

[SaintessHeart]

Guys,if you both have a beef with each other over this issue, please take it to PM.

This topic had been argued ad nauseam since 1948 and the only thin worth discussing is which defence stock to buy, and which rocket is cheap and efficient for Hamas to use.

The loss of human life is just another statistic.

[JokerD]

Anyone posted this yet?
Taiwan petrochemical firm blamed for deadly blast

Images

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[LKK]

I realize that the Israel / Hamas conflict is a hot topic with strong opinions on both sides. However, that does not mean you can indulge in personal attacks against fellow board members. Leave the personal attacks out of your posts and keep the overall conversation civil. Otherwise, we'll be forced to step in and take more drastic action.

[MrTerrorist]

Ebola crisis: Virus spreading too fast, says WHO

This is worrying since many have died since the outbreak was reported.

[SaintessHeart]

Originally Posted by MrTerrorist

Ebola crisis: Virus spreading too fast, says WHO

This is worrying since many have died since the outbreak was reported.

And there is alot of irrationality about this one. A relative of mine said he is cancelling his trip to US because they brought two Americans back there.

This has become more of a panic than a pandemic.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by SaintessHeart

And there is alot of irrationality about this one. A relative of mine said he is cancelling his trip to US because they brought two Americans back there.

This has become more of a panic than a pandemic.

SaintessHeart, think of this as opportunity

dig a bunker in your backyard
load it up with food and water
survival supplies.

anybody ask, say you are preparing for upcoming Ebola plague.

secretly you can also it up with restraint, chloroform and loli.

[risingstar3110]

Originally Posted by kyp275

...snip

Sorry man, but i don't think i can seriously discuss with you until you just stops answering for the shake of answer. At the end of the day I still prefer to have a more constructive and thought-provoking discussion. And I expected that you do too


Just to point out that it's very obvious when you talked about something that you don't know, while pretended you do. For examples:

1. Definition of geopolitic. I think that you just heard about the word, probably skimmed through the wikipedia page and assumed it 's something to do with land or location. Try at least going back to wikipedia and at least read the whole basic description first. They provided the best summary out there
2. The whole thing about railguns, and whether contaminated water today cleaner than the ones from a couple hundred years ago. Same thing. One is about nutrient and and heavy metal contamination. The other? Biological and biochemical on genetic level. Asking that is like asking "what is more delicious, a hard driver or Kennedy's soul".

[Solace]

Originally Posted by kyp275

In all honesty, I would rather the US pressure Israel to rein in their tactics or withdraw their support, certainly not sending more money their way

The problem is that there is a tremendous amount of money flowing into politics from people loyal to Israel, people who benefit from the fighting in the Middle East, as well as a disturbing underlying aspect of some US culture that genuinely believes in the old war between Christianity and Islam.

Combine those and you have a backing of elites, particularly in politics, who are more invested in Israel and economic/religious goals than in promoting peace in the region.

Don't believe me? Here's the 2012 Democratic Convention:

YouTube

https://youtu.be/cncbOEoQbOg

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

The divide between the general population of the country and the people running it becomes wider every year.

[Dextro]

Originally Posted by Solace

The problem is that there is a tremendous amount of money flowing into politics from people loyal to Israel, people who benefit from the fighting in the Middle East, as well as a disturbing underlying aspect of some US culture that genuinely believes in the old war between Christianity and Islam.

Combine those and you have a backing of elites, particularly in politics, who are more invested in Israel and economic/religious goals than in promoting peace in the region.

Don't believe me? Here's the 2012 Democratic Convention:

YouTube

https://youtu.be/cncbOEoQbOg

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

The divide between the general population of the country and the people running it becomes wider every year.

HOLY...! That's what passes for democracy? People shouting in a stadium until the one "counting" the votes feels like he's had enough and considers a clear tie (at least) to be a 2/3rds majority in favour of what he wants to be? Damn!

[Xellos-_^]

Ultimatum – One warning from the Prime Minister of Israel to the enemy population, in which he announces that Israel is about to attack military targets in their area and urges those who are not involved and do not wish to be harmed to leave immediately. Sinai is not far from Gaza and they can leave. This will be the limit of Israel’s humanitarian efforts. Hamas may unconditionally surrender and prevent the attack.
Attack – Attack the entire ‘target bank’ throughout Gaza with the IDF’s maximum force (and not a tiny fraction of it) with all the conventional means at its disposal. All the military and infrastructural targets will be attacked with no consideration for ‘human shields’ or ‘environmental damage’. It is enough that we are hitting exact targets and that we gave them advance warning.
Siege – Parallel to the above, a total siege on Gaza. Nothing will enter the area. Israel, however, will allow exit from Gaza. (Civilians may go to Sinai, fighters may surrender to IDF forces).
Defense – Any place from which Israel or Israel’s forces were attacked will be immediately attacked with full force and no consideration for ‘human shields’ or ‘environmental damage’.
Conquer – After the IDF completes the "softening" of the targets with its fire-power, the IDF will conquer the entire Gaza, using all the means necessary to minimize any harm to our soldiers, with no other considerations.
Elimination- The GSS and IDF will thoroughly eliminate all armed enemies from Gaza. The enemy population that is innocent of wrong-doing and separated itself from the armed terrorists will be treated in accordance with international law and will be allowed to leave. Israel will generously aid those who wish to leave.
Sovereignty – Gaza is part of our Land and we will remain there forever. Liberation of parts of our land forever is the only thing that justifies endangering our soldiers in battle to capture land. Subsequent to the elimination of terror from Gaza, it will become part of sovereign Israel and will be populated by Jews. This will also serve to ease the housing crisis in Israel. The coastal train line will be extended, as soon as possible, to reach the entire length of Gaza.
According to polls, most of the Arabs in Gaza wish to leave. Those who were not involved in anti-Israel activity will be offered a generous international emigration package. Those who choose to remain will receive permanent resident status. After a number of years of living in Israel and becoming accustomed to it, contingent on appropriate legislation in the Knesset and the authorization of the Minister of Interior, those who personally accept upon themselves Israel’s rule, substance and way of life of the Jewish State in its Land, will be offered Israeli citizenship.
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/Ar...cle.aspx/15326

Moshe Zalman Feiglin (Hebrew: משה פייגלין‎, born 31 July 1962) is an Israeli politician and columnist. He is Deputy Speaker of the Knesset, Knesset Member, and head of the Manhigut Yehudit ("Jewish Leadership") faction of Israel's governing Likud party
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moshe_Feiglin

Israeli Rights final solution for Gaza/Palestine.

[Ithekro]

Well, that is one way to end this thing. Several of us did say that leaving Gaza would be a bad idea. The West Bank is more viable.

[GuZidi]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-0...s-tension.html

China Raids Microsoft Offices in Anti-Monopoly Investigation
China regulators opened an anti-monopoly investigation into Microsoft Corp. (MSFT), seizing computers and documents from offices in four cities amid escalating tensions with U.S. technology companies.

The government also is investigating Microsoft executives in China, including a vice president, according to a statement posted today on the State Administration for Industry & Commerce website. The regulator urged the company to cooperate after almost 100 SAIC staff inspected the offices yesterday, copying contracts and financial statements.

China stepped up the pressure on U.S. companies after American prosecutors indicted five Chinese military officers in May for allegedly stealing corporate secrets. Microsoft, Google Inc. and Apple Inc. (AAPL) have since been criticized by state media for allegedly cooperating with a U.S. spying program, and Qualcomm (QCOM) Inc. in November disclosed an investigation related to anti-monopoly law.

“They’re playing a long game,” said Duncan Clark, the Beijing-based chairman of BDA China Ltd., which advises technology companies. China wants to discourage U.S. security agencies from using American technology companies, while also promoting domestic competitors, he said.

Microsoft, the world’s largest software maker, said in May it’s working with the... Read More
Microsoft acknowledged the probe yesterday in an e-mail and said in a statement today that it “complies with the laws and regulations of every market in which we operate around the world and we have industry leading monitoring and enforcement mechanisms in place to ensure this. Our business practices in China are designed to be compliant with Chinese law.”

http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2014-0...ovince/5644728

Strong earthquake hits China's Yunnan province, at least 398 killed
At least 398 people have died and more are missing after a strong earthquake struck south-west China's Yunnan province.

State news agency Xinhua says more than 1,800 people have also been injured.

The quake in Qiaojia county of Zhaotong prefecture has left residents searching for survivors beneath the rubble of toppled buildings and communications and power lines, as images shared on social media show.

The United States Geological Survey (USGS) measured the quake at a magnitude of 6.1, striking 11 kilometres north-west of the town of Wenping at a relatively shallow depth of 10 kilometres.

It struck at 4:30pm Sunday local time.

State media reported the earthquake at magnitude 6.5, citing the China Earthquake Networks Centre.

"Too many buildings were damaged and we are collecting data on deaths and injuries," Xinhua quoted a local official as saying.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

I just had a conversation online with a supporter of Israel. He literally claim that if Israelis just kill every civilian hostage and human shield, that Hamas would stop taking hostages.

If that's the logic process of the supporters of Israel, we are going to a very dark place. It seems he didn't understand how terrorism works.

[maplehurry]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

I just had a conversation online with a supporter of Israel. He literally claim that if Israelis just kill every civilian hostage and human shield, that Hamas would stop taking hostages.

If that's the logic process of the supporters of Israel, we are going to a very dark place. It seems he didn't understand how terrorism works.

Well... I am pretty sure Netayahu is much more smarter than this guy.

[SaintessHeart]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

I just had a conversation online with a supporter of Israel. He literally claim that if Israelis just kill every civilian hostage and human shield, that Hamas would stop taking hostages.

If that's the logic process of the supporters of Israel, we are going to a very dark place. It seems he didn't understand how terrorism works.

Got a better idea?

If the Muslims don't want to kill off the Jews, then the Jews will kill off the Muslims. After all, "it is in the holy edict", what they said. [/troll]

Death solves all problems. No man, no problem. Anyone taking a side in the conflict should be given a suicide vest and a free plane ticket to sacrifice him or herself to the name of whatever entity he/she believes in. Among Gush Katif and the Hamas tunnels, combined with Merkava tanks and Special Operations deep within Gaza, it seems that the problem is fixed when one side is completely wiped off the face of the earth.