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View Poll Results: Madoka Magica - Episode 07 Rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 58 | 41.13% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 47 | 33.33% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 23 | 16.31% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 9 | 6.38% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 3 | 2.13% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 0 | 0% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 0 | 0% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 0 | 0% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 1 | 0.71% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 0 | 0% | |
Voters: 141. You may not vote on this poll |
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2011-02-19, 22:38 | Link #421 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
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2011-02-19, 22:39 | Link #422 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
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What can I tell you? At least about Anja they do mention what she does to humans.
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2011-02-19, 22:45 | Link #423 | ||||||||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Kyrgyzstan, Bishkek
Age: 40
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It is not a death blow - just incapacitation. Easily achieved by use of teargas - on non zombie girl of course. Quote:
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I already asked. Basically as long as her soul is clean she’ll be alright. And it cannot be dimmed by external means. There is no way our confession reject her. She is human being in need of help, so there is no way he reject her or label her as dead or such because it is exactly things that can harm her soul. Still it is not good thing, and I was kind of chastised because I find her position enviable. And of course there is no such scripture but it is exactly why priests exists. Now, will you accept this truth? And if not why bother asking? I do not speak about this because I assumed that my confession is irrelevant to you. We are small and unorthodox confession. Quote:
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Spoiler for Momentum:
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2011-02-19, 22:46 | Link #424 | |
Banned
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Ah, but to use your words: "WE DON'T KNOW" that she can't kill if she so chooses. |
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2011-02-19, 22:55 | Link #425 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
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Ok, that's a valid point. I suppose I just find the concept of "one bounce per lie" too good to spoil with senseless killing. But yeah, I don't know.
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2011-02-19, 22:56 | Link #426 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
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But I don't think that should base on humanities POV. It has been established that being a MG in Madoka universe is not a fun thing to do and you should only become one if you are wishing for a miracle. Madoka do not have such a wish so I understand she didn't become one in the mean time. Besides as of this episode Sayaka/ Kyoko/ Homura had been doing fine against the witches. Madoka will surely add plenty of firepower to them, but they don't need this firepower immediately.
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2011-02-19, 23:04 | Link #427 |
Art Block Specialist
Join Date: Jun 2007
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ok, so here's what we know:
witches can make people committing suicide familiars can grow to become witches, but what do they feed on? the sense of despair so that "witches grows out of despair"? speaking of threats Madoka throwing items down the bridge onto the incoming traffic, and Homura running on the highway. Both are acts that warrants a fine if not jail term, as both can cause serious traffic accidents.
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2011-02-20, 01:16 | Link #429 | |
Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
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Take Anja for example. Maybe being turned into a ball and bounced around and reminded of every lie they've ever made in their life is humiliating enough for them to go kill themselves, or even perhaps it's just an aftereffect of the magic. Witches aren't necessarily malicious creatures, just dangerous ones.\ (Note:I'm not saying they AREN'T evil, just that I think we're jumping to conclusions about how evil they are just based on hearsay from Kyubey who is of sketchy reliability and a bunch of Puella Magi who have been clearly duped by Kyubey already and as such aren't really reliable sources of information either). At this point the only character who we can even consider trusting the answers from is Homura, and that's just because we don't know if she dodges the truth or not whereas we know for a fact everyone else except Kyubey is ignorant and Kyubey glosses over and covers up stuff constantly. |
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2011-02-20, 01:28 | Link #430 | |||
Banned
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Given that criteria, any court would rule the witches are dangerous threat to humanity. You don't have to succeed at murder, in order to be guilty. It's called attempted murder. Quote:
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2011-02-20, 02:50 | Link #431 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
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We didn't see witch directly kill anyone except in self defense. The witch driving people to death is based on QB's words and may not be necessarily true. I also find it interesting that you distrust Homura and trust QB implicitly.
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2011-02-20, 03:55 | Link #432 | |
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Join Date: Dec 2009
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2011-02-20, 06:41 | Link #433 |
Banned
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Hamburg
Age: 54
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QB has shown an interest in exactly 2 things:
1) Getting girls to contract with him 2) Getting contracted girls to collect Grief Seeds Anything else is irrelevant for him. He doesn't care if there's infighting between MGs. He doesn't care if normal people are killed. He's content as long as he can keep his little racket going. Which absolutely doesn't fit with making him the savior of mankind for being the recruiter of the "only weapon against witches". His actions have led to loss and suffering for all girls dealing with him (even Mami made clear that her life which seemed to be saved by QB was terrible). He knowingly withheld critical information from them, because having them know the truth would reduce his chance for a contract. Not a single time has he helped a girl in trouble. Compare that to Homura, whose warnings have proven to be correct every single time, and who has repeatedly saved the girls in trouble. So, if you seriously insist on trusting QB and distrusting Homura, please be my guest. It feels completely unreasonable to me. Inexplicable. At the moment, there's around one skeleton dropping out of QB's locker each episode. But hey, the girls didn't ask, right? |
2011-02-20, 08:27 | Link #435 |
Speculation is wrong.
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Paris
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Can't we just drop the all "Kuybey/Homura is evil" on each thread ?
Seriously guys... Choose one place, go speculate, because it's running in circle and it's getting nowhere. Finally catch up. Spoiler for Episode 7:
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2011-02-20, 11:47 | Link #436 | |
Banned
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In short, I know if I wanted to know what Kyube was up to, I could just ask. Homura is a different question. I don't trust Kyube "implicitly" but I do have him figured out enough to know what to expect from him. Homura is more of an enigma, so I can't fully know what she'll do, and thus I can't full trust her. And trust/distrust is a different question altogether as opposed to evil/not evil, which I won't go into, except to say, I believe neither one is evil. |
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2011-02-20, 12:08 | Link #438 | |||
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Age: 35
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These posts are by now kinda old. Been having computer troubles.
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On the other hand--say Sayaka does learn to accept her own human weaknesses. Then what? There is no guarantee her love or feelings will be answered; or, in the long term, that that is even possible. If Sayaka does abandon the righteousness and altruism she became a Puella Magi for to make her feelings her first priority, then she is forced to confront the fact that the sacrifice she made would have been completely meaningless. This is why this development is a tragedy. Between her love and her sense of righteousness, neither are things which Sayaka would be truly okay with giving up on. Quote:
First, Homura. She accepts it. She previously knew about it, and states that it is the payment for having received a miracle. I agree with Kaijou that Homura's stated reason for silence is somewhat spurious. In fact, I consider the real reason to be that, like Kyubey, she doesn't really thinks it matters. Having acknowledged herself that on some level her thinking is no longer human, I think she has accepted it as something of an ancillary part of the simple reality of Puella Magi. From Homura and Kyubey's perspective, the mere fact that your soul has been moved somewhere shouldn't be enough to dissuade anyone from being a Puella Magi. Next, Kyouko. She was shocked, but after a day, has come to terms with it. In terms of her own world view, where she will hold only her own self accountable for what she gains and what she sacrifices, it doesn’t really change anything. I think this reaction/conclusion is probably the most natural. Next, Sayaka. Well…she’s currently kind of despairingly making use of it. A troubled positive? As for before that though…I feel her initial bitterness was over Kyubey’s betrayal of her. Sayaka was inadvertently exposed to a danger that she had been completely unaware about; this was of greater importance than the direct causes of it. Although Kyubey’s explanation was rational, she could no longer put her complete trust in him. During her conversation with Kyouko, she had no further objections. As for her later breakdown, Sayaka’s “Because I’m already dead!” was emotionally powerful. I think that was spoken somewhat metaphorically though for the mahou shoujo reality that was finally hitting her; because as Mami told her—of a Puella Magi’s life fighting witches in constant struggle and in loneliness—she should have known that as a mahou shoujo she had been essentially dead already. In physical terms, I think Sayaka does know that hugging and kissing is still perfectly possible. Next, Madoka. I think a significant degree of her impression of ‘horribleness’ can be associated with the shock and grief of having nearly killed Sayaka. Moreso than the actual effects of it, it is this traumatizing experience which colours Madoka’s reaction. As it is, while she feels it is horrible, I do not think this knowledge will present any particular further obstacle in her eventual decision to become a Puella Magi. Next, Kyubey. He considers it practical. From a utilitarian perspective there don’t exist any negatives. He is distressed and confused by human girls’ visceral/emotional reaction. Finally, Mami. Well, she's dead. lol. Well, so as you can see, the Soul Gem's effects themselves have not particularly influenced the perspectives of the characters. It is rather the circumstances which surround the reveal which bother them: the fact that they can't trust Kyubey, the fact that Sayaka was nearly killed inadvertantly. But as for the discussion of possible negative effects themselves, let me also offer some arguments. First: sorry, but it is absolutely right to say that the Soul Gem inherently decreases a Puella Magi’s weaknesses and vulnerability. If we're talking about combat survivability, it is impossible to argue that it is easier to cut off a body part and lob it 100 meters, while fending off a regenerating opponent who is still capable of fighting you, than it is to incapacitate a normal human enemy, I think this is obvious. If one is able to cut off a Puella Magi’s arm (if she wears her Soul Gem on her arm!!) in the first place, then the pain and possibly lethal bloodloss would be infinitely more valuable than the absurd notion of being able to somehow pick it up and get it 100 meters away from her. Similarly, the idea of ‘controlling’ a magical girl by taking hold of her soul gem is frankly ridiculous. First of all, you would have to constantly be (a stalker) within 100 meters of her to have any functionality. Disregarding the obvious limitations this alone would place on her use to you, the controller himself has to sleep sometime! Losing consciousness against an opponent with magical powers and within a 100 meter vicinity, something you have to do eventually, can anyone honestly believe it’s even possible you won’t get your ass pwnt and the gem returned to her? Unless, that is, you are suggesting a one time use of her which is absurd considering the impossibe improbability of obtaining a soul gem and knowing how to use it in the first place. Finally, to comment on the religious argument which has been brought up here. Metaphysical insecurity is certainly the only argument against Soul Gems carrying any degree of merit objectively, but then objectively the default religious understanding of ‘death’ would be 'oblivion' over ‘heaven’ or ‘reincarnation’ fundamentally. While the thought of your soul physically exposed does indeed bring up vulnerability over possible metaphysical outcomes, religious associations seem out of place here, particularly for girls so far whose motivations thus far seem very much grounded in more immediate aspects of reality. I think a general default assumption that, Soul Gem or not, in this universe death will lead you into oblivion, is by far the most reasonable expectation. The more terrifying possibility, in a complete non-religious aspect, is the thought that if magical girls can indeed turn into witches, they will get to spend the rest of eternity in the dark abysses of Kyuubey's body. This idea, however, also remains complete speculation currently. I personally doubt it. Quote:
At 14 years old, having lived life painlessly in a peaceful metropolitan city, Sayaka got the impression that having desires was ‘bad’ of her. Acting on that self-judgement, trying to shoulder the true burdens of reality, Sayaka committed herself to a path of self-sacrifice irreversibly. As an idealistic girl exposed to the inequality of the world’s suffering, I don’t think you can truly blame her for believing in altruism. However, she is paying for that naiveté and good-heartedness now as she realizes both what she's lost, and what she sacrificed, with increasing clarity. |
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2011-02-20, 13:20 | Link #439 | |||||
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He's said he's powerless to stop magical girls fighting, and he can't even defend himself! Quote:
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You hit the nail on the head here. This is one of Sayaka's biggest flaws; she expects too much of herself and castrates herself for even thinking the smallest selfish thought. She has to learn that selfish thoughts are okay, and it's okay to want something for yourself, as long as you aren't inflicting your will onto someone who doesn't want it. |
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2011-02-20, 14:07 | Link #440 | |
Me at work
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I can't really follow your extrapolation,yes he said there's nothing he can do about it but nowhere has he said that he actually cares or that he'd do something if he could. He avoided the question when Kyoko brought it up and in his conversation with Madoka he said the only thing that he could tell Sayaka was that she was being reckless,not that it was wrong or something he disaprooves of.
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