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Old 2006-04-12, 03:55   Link #141
musouka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrProphet
Actually, that scene was necessary
What was necessary was that Tamaki have a reason to put two and two together, not a scene with gorgeous, romantic visuals and gentle piano music. They could have had him look down from one of the windows. They could have had him stand on the sideline. They could have followed the manga version of that scene.

It's not just the fact that there was a scene between the two of them, either. You also have to keep in mind as to how the scene was done. If they didn't want the scene to come off as romantic, they could have followed the manga and kept the joke that shattered the romantic mood, but they specifically left it out.

For reference, here's the scene in the manga:
Page 01
Page 02
Page 03
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Old 2006-04-12, 04:02   Link #142
wao
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Personally the vibe I got from the show was that they intended to pair Tamaki and Haruhi up together - not necessarily romantically, but as good friends. And I think the little hints - while they may have been for some other purpose, also did do something for the way they look at each other. Obviously they're not head over heels in each other, that's way too fast!

But, I believe that the show intended not to hide it from the beginning. I don't know if this is because guys look at things differently from girls, but I was kind of drenched in all the "interest" vibes between Haruhi and Tamaki from the OP onwards. There is absolutely no denying it for me. And the fact that Haruhi's generally oblivious to it - she sees him as a nice person but she's rational and cool enough not to go all fangirly over him, which is kind of the point of it all - makes it a helluva lot better for me. Pardon me if I derive great enjoyment in seeing whimsical guys go a little gaga over girls, whether in jest or not.

I don't think the show was ever trying to break out of the cliche, but it's done it in a really convincing, funny, and most importantly, subtly self-jabbing way that it's really quite hilarious. I don't think I would have enjoyed it so much if it took itself really seriously!

Anyway, call me boring too.... but honestly, I just gotta like Haruhi. So cool!! I like her way better than anyone else in the show. After her I think it would be Kyouya because I find his manipulative bystanderishness (oh my English standards...) .... really hilarious.
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Old 2006-04-12, 04:27   Link #143
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wow that scene gives a completely different feeling in the manga. sure i like it, but i prefer the way the anime is currently. now i guess ill go check out the rest of the manga.
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Old 2006-04-12, 04:29   Link #144
MrProphet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by musouka
What was necessary was that Tamaki have a reason to put two and two together, not a scene with gorgeous, romantic visuals and gentle piano music. They could have had him look down from one of the windows. They could have had him stand on the sideline. They could have followed the manga version of that scene.
So, basically, they had a pretty scene that conveyed a point that could have been conveyed by a non-pretty scene? Is that it?

Well, I guess they better kill all those swirling rose petals and funny arrows and framing shots. Because they aren't really all that necessary and it's possible to convey the point using simpler means.

Only, it wouldn't be Ouran... 8)

Quote:
It's not just the fact that there was a scene between the two of them, either. You also have to keep in mind as to how the scene was done. If they didn't want the scene to come off as romantic, they could have followed the manga and kept the joke that shattered the romantic mood, but they specifically left it out.
Oh, I swear you want that scene to have romantic tension. Because you are clearly reading way too much into it. 8)

Just because it was presented like that, and not simpler and plainer, does not mean they wanted "the scene to come off romantic". Maybe they wanted to make it pretty, maybe it's Igarashi's style, maybe he wants to keep everything very fluffy and cute.

Just because something is pretty, doesn't mean there is some deep conspiracy out there to bring the two together. 8)
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Old 2006-04-12, 04:44   Link #145
musouka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrProphet
So, basically, they had a pretty scene that conveyed a point that could have been conveyed by a non-pretty scene? Is that it?
None of the other versions I mentioned had to be "ugly", they would have just given off a different feel.

Or do you think the scene is beautiful merely for the sake of being beautiful? You don't think they could possibly be trying to express something with it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrProphet
Well, I guess they better kill all those swirling rose petals and funny arrows and framing shots. Because they aren't really all that necessary and it's possible to convey the point using simpler means.
It's not a matter of expressing something in a simple way, it's being aware of how a certain scene reads. Those are all important to the mood of the series. I find it hard to believe that a series so attuned to that DIDN'T mean for the wallet scene to come across in a romantic fashion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrProphet
Oh, I swear you want that scene to have romantic tension. Because you are clearly reading way too much into it.
It's not me reading too much into a scene so much as remembering how the scene was in the manga and comparing it to the scene in the anime. There is a marked difference.
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Old 2006-04-12, 05:05   Link #146
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Quote:
Originally Posted by musouka
There is a marked difference.
But that difference doesn't necessarily imply what you want it to imply.

OK, that's it, I am done. This is going nowhere and I've got an episode of Glass Fleet to watch...
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Old 2006-04-12, 13:18   Link #147
musouka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrProphet
But that difference doesn't necessarily imply what you want it to imply.
If it doesn't imply anything then there is no point in making such an obvious change. I don't have a vested interest in that scene being romantic, despite what you might think. But I can't turn off my eyes either.

Maybe the problem is that too many people are watching this and expecting a sharp, insightful parody of shoujo, when really it's just a high budget shoujo comedy that doesn't take itself too seriously. If you're assuming that it's the former, I think you might be setting yourself up for disappointment.
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Old 2006-04-12, 19:07   Link #148
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What an incredible series! In 20 or so years of anime watching (before I even knew what anime actually was), I've rarely, if ever, watched a single episode repeatedly. I must've seen the first ep two dozen times already

The art, the music, the characters, simply fabulous! I guess I have to get Utena, once it's out on high-def, to check the reference works.


I agree with musouka: there was definitely a hint of romance in that fountain scene. The atmosphere, the music, not to mention the way Haruhi's hair got "lifted" by the non-existent wind after she (he at the time) sees Tamaki's very uncharacteristic serious side.


I took a peek at the manga (shouldn't have read the second chapter/ep ) and definitely prefer the anime. I only wish that the anime ends where the manga ends, even though that it's unlikely since the manga's not done, and doesn't let me hanging in a very open ending (ai-baby, kare kano for example), or any open ending for that matter. A resolution of a pairing, or a definite conclusion that no pairing will be happening would also be appreciated.

I want closure. Unfortunately, that is seldom found in anime.
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Old 2006-04-12, 19:56   Link #149
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i just watched the first ep of this...and boyyy it was a ride! it was so funnyyy. it gives a furuba vibe which havent been found any in anime lately ><

just lookign for info on the anime.... like how many eps and who else will be subbing it.. is the manga as good?? how far off is the manga as well....

cheers
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Old 2006-04-12, 20:17   Link #150
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Haven't read the manga. Haven't seen the second episode yet. Still sort of got some attraction on Tamaki's part. Notice how the blood drained from Tamaki's face after hearing Haruhi say it was kind of nice listening to girls chit-chat in episode 1.
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Old 2006-04-12, 21:02   Link #151
Secca
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This show is really fun. ^-^ I have no idea what this show about, until I saw it today. Woah, I just cannot stop laughing. >_< !!!!!

Spoiler:

My new favorite this season with School Rumble. ~_~♪♪
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Old 2006-04-12, 23:34   Link #152
Ori
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Decel
I only wish that the anime ends where the manga ends, even though that it's unlikely since the manga's not done, and doesn't let me hanging in a very open ending (ai-baby, kare kano for example), or any open ending for that matter. A resolution of a pairing, or a definite conclusion that no pairing will be happening would also be appreciated.

I want closure. Unfortunately, that is seldom found in anime.
Bones is known to make up decent endings for series that has yet to end. Ie) Fruit Basket, FMA.

So... if we can extrapulate anything from this trend it is that this anime will probably be given a decent satisfying ending that does not follow the manga too.

In other words... I am not too worried.
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Old 2006-04-12, 23:46   Link #153
Decel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ori
Bones is known to make up decent endings for series that has yet to end. Ie) Fruit Basket, FMA.

So... if we can extrapulate anything from this trend it is that this anime will probably be given a decent satisfying ending that does not follow the manga too.

In other words... I am not too worried.
FMA had a decent ending... until the movie ruined it.
I didn't like how Furuba ended though.

Overall however I'd rather have them wait for the manga to finish and release it completely, or in seasons.
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Old 2006-04-13, 00:41   Link #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Decel
FMA had a decent ending... until the movie ruined it.
I didn't like how Furuba ended though.

Overall however I'd rather have them wait for the manga to finish and release it completely, or in seasons.
Normally I would agree with you but from what I saw of the manga, it doesn't look like the ending... when ever it comes, will provide full closure.
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Old 2006-04-13, 01:03   Link #155
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I gotta ask who is this Bones guy
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Old 2006-04-13, 01:51   Link #156
domino
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Originally Posted by EricMontreal22
I gotta ask who is this Bones guy
BONES is a studio that animated/produced lots of awesome shows. Famous for smooth and pretty high-quality animation. Here's a list of shows they've worked on.
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Old 2006-04-13, 05:15   Link #157
MrProphet
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BONES didn't do Furuba at all...

And by the way, Furuba didn't end all that good. It had a silly angsty ending with Kyo and that's pretty much it. No resolution, the end was open.

To end a popular manga, one has to take significant risks, like making up your own story on the go. Full Metal Alchemist took quite a turn from the manga mid-way through, and boy were the fanboys bitchin', but it turned out quite epic and interstingly so.

Of course, for every Alchemist there is Kenshin (made-up ending done stupid), but that's certainly a gamble.

On the other hand, Furuba (and partly KareKano) just followed the manga's storyline until the end, when there was nothing else to animate and they just stopped.

Although, to be fair, KareKano was not Hideaki Anno's fault. He actually wanted to do his own stuff and he was doing it in an excellent manner, but Hakusensha (manga publisher) started bitching that this isn't what he is supposed to do and that he should stick to the original closely, so Anno just said: "Oh, screw you!" and left after finishing about 18 episodes. Anno's student and assistant, Kazuya Tsurumaki, although being quite talented, was still very young and inexperienced at the time, so the ending was rather weak.
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Old 2006-04-13, 09:55   Link #158
Ori
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Oh sorry. I got confused about Fruit Basket. You are right, they didn't do it.

Eureka 7 and Wolfrain are what they did.

Any time any anime goes away from original ending fanboys/girls start bitching. It's a natural reaction that cannot be stopped. But in the end, some time it's not too bad... well in my opinion anyway. I don't have very high expectations for anime, I know.
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Old 2006-04-13, 09:56   Link #159
Decel
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Originally Posted by Ori
Normally I would agree with you but from what I saw of the manga, it doesn't look like the ending... when ever it comes, will provide full closure.
That's my point though: mangas should be done/near done to have an anime release.

A good example of that is Ai Baby. I've read the end and by the looks of it, they could've made a 50-ep show with a proper ending, instead of "one day you'll see your mom again".

FMA's series ending was somewhat decent, though I don't like the "real world vs Shambala" stuff. The movie however sent the characters in every direction and left them hanging without conclusion (Mustang/Hawkeye, Winry).

Furuba and karekano just stopped dead in its tracks. Karekano really pissed me off because they ended it at the very start of a sub-arc.


I think the most famous example is Marmalade boy, where they did a whole "Marmalade boy US" arc because the manga wasn't done. However the show did end where the manga ended, and I'm grateful for that.
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Old 2006-04-13, 11:08   Link #160
Xellos-_^
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Decel
and karekano just stopped dead in its tracks. Karekano really pissed me off because they ended it at the very start of a sub-arc.
There was some sort of spat between the manga creator and gainax on how the show was going. karekano ended up stopping at that point because because gainax didn't have permission to go any further.
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