2012-08-11, 09:52 | Link #1141 | |
あやせたんの剣
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: bakanki.blogspot.com
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It's not I'm doubting you and your teacher, but is it possibly that your teacher thought お兄ちゃんっ子 meant tomboy because she didn't know Kirino character? Up until now, from various media (LN, PSP game, anime commentary from DVD/Blu-Ray), Kirino character as well as the theme of this series, it's more likely that it means "girl who likes her big brother" than "tomboy." And just like relentlessflame said, most (or maybe every) time I saw the slang, お兄ちゃんっ子 means the person is so/too attached/dependent to, or like/admire his/her big brother, just like "momma's boy" slang perhaps But now you mention it, I can see it works too. Maybe Kirino back then was a tomboy and when Kyousuke spent more time with Manami, little Kirino thought because Manami is more girly than her thus she grew her hair and started to use make up and be more fashionable, even become a teen model ^^
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2012-08-11, 10:20 | Link #1142 |
さっく♥ゆうきゃん♥ほそやん
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: in the land down under...
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I'm inclined to agree with relentlessflame's interpretation too. Given that there is another term for tomboy (お転婆娘), the impression I get from the お兄ちゃんっ子 term as a way of saying "tomboy" contains the nuance of the girl in question acting as a 'big brother' to someone...which doesn't seem possible for Kirino at the time.
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2012-08-11, 21:09 | Link #1144 | |
夜空派
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Hong Kong
Age: 37
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Nah, it's alright if you guys don't agree. I was just giving my own interpretation, just like everyone else ^^
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For me, from the novel itself. I've already placed an order for it.
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2012-08-11, 21:17 | Link #1145 | |
Administrator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Age: 41
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Since you do "know the darn language so well" (and I won't claim to), let's go with tomboy. But I think we are still to assume that the relationship between Kirino and Kyousuke was better in the past, and something happened to change that relationship, which seems to be the topic of the story. So even if she didn't "love" her brother in the past and all she's saying is that she used to be a tomboy, the overall meaning of the story doesn't really change either way, it just means they were using the line as a tease, and it's a throwaway.
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2012-08-11, 23:35 | Link #1146 |
夜空派
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Hong Kong
Age: 37
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Oh no no no. I didn't mean it like that. What I meant by "Now I wish I didn't know the darn language so well..." was then I would see "お兄ちゃんっ子" the same way as you guys do, that it does indeed mean she was attached to Kyousuke back then - something I would really want Kirino to say.
I apologize if that part sounded rude...>< I meant no offense. The only reason why I'm sticking to the tomboy explanation is because that's how I interpret it, from the years I've learned the language. I'm not challenging anyone's view or anything, nor do I consider my own to be 100% correct, much less "superior" than everyone else's.
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Last edited by VVolf; 2012-08-11 at 23:51. |
2012-08-12, 00:46 | Link #1147 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
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That being said, I'm inclined to agree with relentlessflame's interpretation. What I've seen around the net pretty much uses お兄ちゃん子 (a short for お兄ちゃん大好きっ子) to describe little sisters who are brocon or tending towards that. It's not that it's evil to use slangs (perhaps, it is evil in mainstream literature though). It's Fushimi trying to portray the characters, especially Kirino, as belonging to the group of Gen Y people who uses such slangs. Quote:
From the summary, I'm guessing that this is going to end at volume 12 or 13. |
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2012-08-12, 00:57 | Link #1148 | |
Administrator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Age: 41
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Incidentally, a Google search for the term also seems to support that the other use is more common vernacular on the Net. Again, not that it matter if he's being tricky and just using slang to mislead (which I totally think is possible; I just think it's also possible that he isn't). Well, the teaser did what it was supposed to do and get us talking about the volume, so mission accomplished on that front.
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2012-08-12, 01:27 | Link #1149 |
夜空派
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Hong Kong
Age: 37
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Haha, I gotta admit you guys do make a good point about it being a net slang. I'll admit I didn't learn my Japanese (my fourth language in fact) through the net or anything anime-related. I gotta say the more I see it, the more I think your translation is more likely now. I got stubborn when I saw it only as a single word, not as a short form for something else.
So, I believe a formal apology is in order. Sorry if I sounded cocky or misled anyone.
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2012-08-18, 21:48 | Link #1150 |
Lab. member 009
Scanlator
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: 1.048596
Age: 35
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That is a pretty tricky slang told be true. In Internet has a meaning, and in RL has another.
I think here it means both, "tomboy-ish" and "being too attached to the elder brother". Reasons: 1) We know Kousaka sibiling got along in the past. 2) Kirino was practicing sports since grade school IIRC 3) She changed her looks and became a model. 4) The way she speaks to Kyousuke... Then, Fusimi sensei is just using a "word" that makes us wonder what's the real thing, and discuss like the earlier posts |
2012-08-18, 22:58 | Link #1151 |
Administrator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Age: 41
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Actually, now that I rethink this whole thing again, there is another angle to all this.
If you take "Onii-chan-kko" literally, you might read that it's "an older-brother-like girl". In all of the eroge she plays, she does play the older brother character. In an odd sort of way, it's the very definition of being an "onii-chan-kko" (in the other meaning). Even though on the outside she's become fashionable and "girl-like" (in the stereotypical sense), her inner self is still an "onii-chan-kko" in that meaning. Her specific tastes with her hobby are more traditionally male. So perhaps even "tomboy" isn't a very good translation of the term, but a more literal meaning is more to the point -- her "inner self" is a siscon Onii-chan. But, I still don't think that explanation alone is sufficient to explain whatever went on in the past, so there's surely more to the story.
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2012-08-27, 21:42 | Link #1158 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
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Regarding the previous issue: first forget about it meaning "tomboy" because that isn't even remotely close.
The use of っ子 is when something has characteristics of or actually is that, in other words in this case お兄ちゃん and お兄ちゃんっ子 is the same thing it's just that the っ子 is used more when refering to a child. And no this is not slang |
2012-08-27, 22:57 | Link #1159 | |
Obey the Darkly Cute ...
Author
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ...
Age: 66
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comedy, harem, romance, shounen, siblings |
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