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Old 2011-01-12, 12:46   Link #1
Zalis
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Did people use to rage about widescreen anime?

These days, I've noticed that whenever a new series shows any hints of possibly being 4:3, there's this massive outpouring of hate and disgust. The most recent example would be Freezing and its odd mix of 16:9 OP/ED and 4:3 main episode in some raws.And when older native-4:3 anime come up for discussion or download, there's always at least some disappointment about "square video" or the like. I don't really see why people get upset over literally nothing, which is what black bars are, but that's just me. There hasn't even been a native-4:3 otaku-market TV anime in 4 years (since Manabi Straight and Saint October of the Winter 2007 season), so you'd think people could withstand one out of dozens of shows being fullscreen once in awhile.

But at some point in the past, most people or everyone had 4:3 displays, right? Was there the same amount of raging whenever a 16:9 series came out back then? Like when Noir was being fansubbed in the spring of 2001, was there indignation in the channels of dalnet and efnet about "rectangular video" and annoying letterboxing? Did the first season of Vandread (the second 16:9 TV anime ever made) send people scrambling to #Elite-Fansubs demanding fullscreen versions? I wasn't into anime, much less DLing fansubs back in those days, which is why I'm asking here.

I guess I'm just trying to get some perspective on the contemporary hate for 4:3. I still use 4:3 screens, and I don't get annoyed by watching 16:9 with letterboxing. To me, the "it sucks cause it doesn't completely fill my screen" attitude is a relic of the early days of DVD when the Hollywood-movie-watching masses demanded fullscreen/pan&scan releases because they thought they were missing some of the movie. I'd always thought the anime fandom was more sophisticated than that. But if people did use to rage about 16:9 anime, I must've been mistaken.
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Old 2011-01-12, 13:09   Link #2
SeijiSensei
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As I recall, the rage about H.264/Matroska fansubs far exceeded anything I heard about aspect ratios.

There's a solid contingent of people who think "If it doesn't fill my screen, I'm not getting what I paid for." In the US there are channels that consistently stretch older 4:3 shows to 16:9 at the origination. Turner is especially infamous for this practice.
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Old 2011-01-12, 14:24   Link #3
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The only reason for such complains would be the hardware used at that current time. To put it simply, when there were first talks about widescreen anything, of course everyone who had a 4:3 aspect ratio screen complained. They don't want to watch something not native to what their CRT/LCD had/have. So now that pretty much everyone has widescreen LCDs, who in their right mind would prefer 4:3 over 16:9/16:10? And why?
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Old 2011-01-12, 14:31   Link #4
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Yes, the only "rage" I remember is when the average size of a fansub file doubled (120-150MB -> 250-400mb) with the h.264/matroska advent. Many people live on crippled internet connections (whether they think so or not) in terms of monthly transfer caps, so this really affected their choices in what to download.

I don't remember any whining about 16:9 versus 4:3 ... but then it was already common for people to watch wide-screen DVD movies on 4:3 televisions. Do many people actually watch anime on fullscreen very often anyway (rather than a window)? I only use full screen when I'm playing an episode on our television.
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Old 2011-01-12, 14:45   Link #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Do many people actually watch anime on fullscreen very often anyway (rather than a window)? I only use full screen when I'm playing an episode on our television.
Actually, I started doing that after I got a bigger LCD (22"), so I can dive in my armchair 0,5m away from it.

A little extra for Zalis, showing why one rage might be a bigger problem than the other, not only due to letterboxing (please don't mind the horrible visualisation, made it in a hurry):



In the first case, the video was always distorted, never showing itself as it should, with pixels having to merge together to show everything, hence the rage against widescreen media at first. In the second case, you can have the whole original on your screen without any of those defects, if you don't want to stretch it all over.

Whether the complains were valid or not depends on the individuals and their needs. One may not care while the other starts an uproar about the tiniest details.
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Old 2011-01-12, 16:47   Link #6
kitten320
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I don't care about screen raio, didn't know there was rage about it...

Isn't the old style better? You actually get bigger pictire.

Sometimes screen are made so thin that it is hard to see =/
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Old 2011-01-12, 16:59   Link #7
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Dunno whats there to rage about the difference between screen ratios on i guess "subbed animes" rather then complain or rage about better think about those that "take their timing doing it" and even if the op/ed ratio probably different. There are tons of varies issues that ppl go through (in other words the fansubbers)

Solutions:

~better off just buying a bigger comp screen that can handle your screen resolution and/or a laptop with better resolution what so ever fits your choice
~Deal with it
~Complain but that doesnt get you anywhere but flaming
~find another video that'll stop your raging
~Or None of the above and pretend this never happen

Probably the only thing i rather rage is the increase in MBs as someone as said. Thats about it
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Old 2011-01-12, 17:25   Link #8
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If the show was made using a widescreen ratio and airs with 4/3 ratio,I'll rage.
If the show was made using a 4/3 ratio and airs with a widescreen ratio,I'll rage.

Basicly I want the tv station to show me the show the way it was meant to be seen,be it 4/3 or 16/9
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Old 2011-01-12, 19:51   Link #9
Vexx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by totoum View Post
If the show was made using a widescreen ratio and airs with 4/3 ratio,I'll rage.
If the show was made using a 4/3 ratio and airs with a widescreen ratio,I'll rage.

Basicly I want the tv station to show me the show the way it was meant to be seen,be it 4/3 or 16/9
I remember the old Cinemascope movies being shown on "Saturday Afternoon Movies" on the television in the 1960s .... they didn't even pretend to fix it so you got this huge horizontal compression when they'd execute the "cinemascope" moments.
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Old 2011-01-12, 20:14   Link #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by totoum View Post
If the show was made using a widescreen ratio and airs with 4/3 ratio,I'll rage.
If the show was made using a 4/3 ratio and airs with a widescreen ratio,I'll rage.

Basicly I want the tv station to show me the show the way it was meant to be seen,be it 4/3 or 16/9
Totoum here pretty much summarized how I feel about different ratios. I absolutely despise pan and scam.

"This film has been modified from its original version. It has been formatted to fit your screen." More like not fit my screen.

I also dislike forced letterboxing in 16:9 films. Nothing like watching a film with the same aspect ratio as your screen but filling 1/3 of the available space and surrounded by black.

Also, what's the story with Freezing? It really stands out as the only anime recently released to be in 4:3.
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Old 2011-01-12, 22:48   Link #11
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Am I the only person who doesn't even notice the aspect ratio?

Unless it does something funky to the animation I could care less.

I don't think I even thought about the issue until now.

Me, I worry about plot and character development. Animation quality is a close third. Aspect Ratio isn't even on the list of things I look for.
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Old 2011-01-12, 23:17   Link #12
triskelion
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I have a 16:10 monitor and I don't mind the black bars when I watch anime to be honest..
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Old 2011-01-12, 23:18   Link #13
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I've never really bothered or noticed with Aspect Ratio's either, black bars don't bother me at all. The only time it really popped up as an issue for me would've been back during the time when Clannad was still airing. Episodes were being aired chopped up in 4:3 pan and scan, with the airing of the proper 16:9 version trailing behind a few weeks.
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Old 2011-01-12, 23:21   Link #14
0utf0xZer0
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I fall in the "no cropping or stretching, please" camp. I'm totally fine with 4:3 in old anime (although I often wish old computer games had widescreen support).

New anime in 4:3? That just makes me go "huh?". When anime moved to 16:9, you could at least justify it on the grounds it was the way the market was headed, and as Vexx said many people were used to watching their movies with black bars anyway. But why would you make anime in an obsolete format today? What's the point of reintroducing black bars?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Yes, the only "rage" I remember is when the average size of a fansub file doubled (120-150MB -> 250-400mb) with the h.264/matroska advent. Many people live on crippled internet connections (whether they think so or not) in terms of monthly transfer caps, so this really affected their choices in what to download.
Technically, that's the result of HD subbing rather than H.264/MKV. I have some early H.264 subs that are basically the same size as everything else from the time because they were standard def.
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Old 2011-01-12, 23:57   Link #15
Ichihara Asako
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Originally Posted by 0utf0xZer0 View Post
New anime in 4:3? That just makes me go "huh?". When anime moved to 16:9, you could at least justify it on the grounds it was the way the market was headed, and as Vexx said many people were used to watching their movies with black bars anyway. But why would you make anime in an obsolete format today? What's the point of reintroducing black bars?
That's my main gripe the past few years. Stuff still broadcast in 4:3 makes no sense, especially when it's clearly produced in 16:9 (as shown by certain networks or DVD/BD release) but some networks cropping to 4:3 is just absurd. I don't think anything in the past two or three years has actually been made in it, yet we've had a few things broadcast cropped.

I do get annoyed about it, but only when it's the broadcasting, not for older series that were actually made in 4:3. I still happily rewatch old series without noticing in most cases.
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Old 2011-01-13, 02:11   Link #16
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Though to be fair, people who rage about 4:3 nowadays are also simultaneously raging at the LQ that usually comes with the 4:3. That was what happened with Clannad, and also the more recent K-On! (the second season's HD was a far-cry from the first season's quality).

And for the record, I have a 15" 4:3 monitor, so most aspect ratio problems don't really affect me. ...orz
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Old 2011-01-13, 02:34   Link #17
InitialGT
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i don't care too much for aspect ratio as long as it's got a high resolution
somewhere along the lines of 720p
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Old 2011-01-13, 15:00   Link #18
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Yes... ppl did rage of widescreen. I did too.

What did we rage a few years ago:

1- Widescreen > in a 4:3 monitor we raged coz the image main image would be smaller. Most ppl had 14'' and 15''.
2- H264 > Eats too much cpu. Rage coz most ppl CPU sucked.
3- H264 + 720px > Can't play without lag.
4- Mkv > Since codec packs were still in the beginning is was a pain in the ass for average Joe to play it even use to convert into another format and such
5- Codecs > since there was this and that codec and it this plus and minus here and there it was a pain in the ass to have the system fit to play whatever file you would download.
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Old 2011-01-13, 18:12   Link #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brocko View Post
I've never really bothered or noticed with Aspect Ratio's either, black bars don't bother me at all. The only time it really popped up as an issue for me would've been back during the time when Clannad was still airing. Episodes were being aired chopped up in 4:3 pan and scan, with the airing of the proper 16:9 version trailing behind a few weeks.
I remember that, I was in despairing for the episodes for a bit since the show could get quite emotional at times (and had some strong cliffhangers actually).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiberium Wolf View Post
1- Widescreen > in a 4:3 monitor we raged coz the image main image would
I seriously could NEVER understand this. Ok so you had to downsize the image because you had a small monitor (I did too, in fact I still have my old 15" flatscreen hooked up as an alternate display and I still use it to watch even recent anime) but widescreen was created to allow for a more cinema-like viewing experience and to allow people to see more. We actually see closer to a widescreen ratio than a a square one so widescreen is helping us see more at the same time.

So while I could understand people raging about HD because their computers couldn't handle it (since not everyone can afford a new pc every 2/3 years and for a long time that meant a giant leap that has sort of slowed down today) I couldn't quite understand people raging about widescreen back when it first showed up.
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Old 2011-01-14, 07:37   Link #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zalis View Post
These days, I've noticed that whenever a new series shows any hints of possibly being 4:3, there's this massive outpouring of hate and disgust. The most recent example would be Freezing and its odd mix of 16:9 OP/ED and 4:3 main episode in some raws.And when older native-4:3 anime come up for discussion or download, there's always at least some disappointment about "square video" or the like. I don't really see why people get upset over literally nothing, which is what black bars are, but that's just me. There hasn't even been a native-4:3 otaku-market TV anime in 4 years (since Manabi Straight and Saint October of the Winter 2007 season), so you'd think people could withstand one out of dozens of shows being fullscreen once in awhile.
either you're pretty dumb or the people who were raging were even dumber

people rage (legitimately) because the shows are actually 16:9 but get pan&scanned down to 4:3 (which means you are actually missing a significant part of the picture), not because of the aspect ratio in itself
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