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Old 2011-03-04, 01:15   Link #1001
MeoTwister5
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Well to be blunt, being truthful and honest doesn't require you to be complete. It's like the difference between saying "You have cancer" with saying "You have cancer of the pancreas." Both statements are true but the second one has loads more implications and connotations (Cancer in a broad term is not necessarily a death sentence, however a specific cancer like pancreatic cancer is practically unsurvivable).

Inkyubeytor's "sin" is not in lying, but in omission, so calling him a liar is false.
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Old 2011-03-04, 05:15   Link #1002
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I feel like we're missing something about Homura. For someone who is supposed to have control of time, she has been failing at keeping Madoka away from QB's grubby paws. At this rate, Madoka is going to have to become a Mahou Shoujo to save everyone from walpurgis night...

Unless Homura still has an ace up her sleeve...?

Lol just watch, right when QB is about to make a contract with Madoka, Homura is going to turn into a cat and say: No Madoka, make a contract with me and become a true mahou shoujo!
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Old 2011-03-04, 06:16   Link #1003
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Dictionary defination of lie: "something that misleads or deceives"

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/lie

Many people have the same problems as Sayaka, so i will leave this at that
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Old 2011-03-04, 12:16   Link #1004
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I am not sur eif I liek the fact that QB is an alien trying to "save" the universe and just seems evil because it's race is unable to have emotion. I dislike how murky animes get when they involve magic AND aliens in one story. Hopefully this won't fall victim to that.

QB is definitely misleading the girls, it just admitted in this episode it doesn't understand why these girls ar enot willing to sacrifice themselves. Meaning he is admitting that he doesn't tell them the full truth becaus ehe knows how they will react. QB isn't evil in my eyes but his lack of morals does make him evil by humanity's stand point, the stand point that no life is worth sacrificing for another.

So speculation, obviously the "dream" or "Flashback" or "other timeline glimpse" we saw in the first episode is happening in the next episode. Which mean Madoka is going to become a Puella next episode or when she makes the wish soemthing really bad happens. Homura knows something happens with her meaning she will survive this fight.

What I find itneresting is, it could jsut be the art style, but does anyone see how Homura's "house" is very similar to a Witch's "area"(whateve ryou want to call it). Maybe possibly once Madoka gains power she has the ability to turn Witches back to Puella's or stop the process/change it somehow to make it so the witch's power is accessable but Homura stays homura, she doesn't lose her humanity.

What I want to know is what makes Walpur-whatever-night so special? Is this a Puella who had the power Madoka supposedly has within her? Is it related to Madoka? Why is it so powerful compared to other Witches? If it is in the scene in episode one it obviously means Madoka will contract the minute Homura is about to be defeated.

I don't know what Homura is regarding the cat, possibly once Madoka becomes a Puella Homura might start to turn into a witch and, possibly, Madoka stops the process and turns her into a cat (since in stories black cats are familiars for witches).
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Old 2011-03-04, 12:56   Link #1005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlavorOfLife View Post
Dictionary defination of lie: "something that misleads or deceives"

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/lie

Many people have the same problems as Sayaka, so i will leave this at that
Please, if you must cite from a reference, do it verbatim. Your paraphrase in this case may as well be your own opinionated definition.

Quote:
lied | ly·ing \ˈlī-iŋ\
Definition of LIE
intransitive verb
1: to make an untrue statement with intent to deceive
2: to create a false or misleading impression
According to number 1, Kyubey has not lied. All of his statements have been true so far.
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Old 2011-03-04, 13:26   Link #1006
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I wonder where those Grief Seeds are actually being utilized, because I doubt about QB's claim that they're using those GS to fuel the device to stabilize the universe.

Why? What if... What if these Grief Seeds are being stockpiled for a colossal superweapon comparable to, say, the Covenant's Halo rings?
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Old 2011-03-04, 13:34   Link #1007
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That is incorrect. He has made untrue statements.

When he first pitched contracting to the girls, he said MG's purpose is to kill witches.

Now, he states their purpose is simply to become witches so he can harvest the energy released during the transition. Therefore, his initial words about MG's purpose is not true.

He also said to Sayaka and Madoka after Mami's death that he will leave them alone. That again was not true since we see him appear in front of Sayaka/Kamijou right after.

Even the example you just mentioned about possibility of turning back from witch. His first statement to Kyoko was untrue because he clearly knows it is impossible yet says he doesn't know if it is possible. The way you deem his words being factual would make any sentence factual. I can say the sky is red. It is factual under certain circumstances. Bill Clinton said initially he did not have a sexual relationship with Monica Lewinsky. According to what he considered as a sexual relationship, he said the truth. But most people watching that speech on TV believe it otherwise. So, from Kyoko's perspective, she just think QB said he does not know if it is possible despite the exact word play. She even commented that QB does not know everything. In this context, his words are not true, since he did know.

In all cases, his intent was clearly to deceive.
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Old 2011-03-04, 13:40   Link #1008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sa547 View Post
I wonder where those Grief Seeds are actually being utilized, because I doubt about QB's claim that they're using those GS to fuel the device to stabilize the universe.

Why? What if... What if these Grief Seeds are being stockpiled for a colossal superweapon comparable to, say, the Covenant's Halo rings?
QB hasn't said what the Grif Seed is used for, he didn't give that bit of info to Madoka yet. All he has said is that they use the energy expelled when a Puella transforms into a Witch to basically fuel the Universe or whatever his long speech says it does. He didn't tell her that is "eats" the seeds after aMagic Girl uses it to de-cloud her crystal.

I have no clue what they ar eused for. As i sai dI do not really like anime that puts magic and aliens together, there better be a good explanation for it because right now he eats them "becuase", lol.
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Old 2011-03-04, 13:45   Link #1009
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In that case, we may have to wait for a backstory to support QB's claims.
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Old 2011-03-04, 14:53   Link #1010
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Originally Posted by Shadow5YA View Post
According to number 1, Kyubey has not lied. All of his statements have been true so far.
So tell me this

"Kyubei is a liar". Statement true or false?

Answer me that and you will know why i posted only definition 2
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Old 2011-03-04, 14:56   Link #1011
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I hope QB was just BS'ing Madoka about entropy and aliens, anyway...

Now the starting scene makes a whole lot more sense as the climax of the show. Homura either fighting or becoming Walpurgis. Madoka finally doing something useful for once, i.e. become a MS to save her, and rebalance the world.

As for meta, I really hope they do something in the lines of EVA TV ending.

Still, Homura being Madoka's cat from the past is viable, but more and more unlikely. Last episode she kind of implied that she not human, only to immediately add that all MS are not.
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Old 2011-03-04, 14:56   Link #1012
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Yup, Kyubey has lied in the past and will lie again in the future. Like most Manipulative Bastards, he uses lies as the last resort, though--he depends far more on elegant, semi-verifiable half-truths and omission of important details, but he has lied, as an above poster mentioned.

Kyubey said that the purpose of a magical girl is to kill witches. This is actually completely false. Kyubey would gather far more energy if every magical girl killed no witches, obtained no Grief Seeds--they would turn into witches themselves far faster. Thus giving Kyubey the energy he seeks.

Edit: I'm pretty sure Kyubey has lied about gathering energy for a "good"/utilitarian means. He has never told the unadorned truth ever to any of the girls, so why should he start now?
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Old 2011-03-04, 15:23   Link #1013
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Originally Posted by Malkuth View Post
Now the starting scene makes a whole lot more sense as the climax of the show. Homura either fighting or becoming Walpurgis. Madoka finally doing something useful for once, i.e. become a MS to save her, and rebalance the world.
This doesn't make sense. If Madoka becomes MG, she will eventually become the strongest witch in history (as QB admitted in this episode) and destroy the whole world.

Unless there's a whole new season about witch Madoka bridging the world to shit, I don't see how the series could end as you think.
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Old 2011-03-04, 15:48   Link #1014
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Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
This doesn't make sense. If Madoka becomes MG, she will eventually become the strongest witch in history (as QB admitted in this episode) and destroy the whole world.
Nope, that's just one possibility, Mami and Kyouko never became witches, though for Madoka it's more likely since she is even more naive than Sayaka.
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Old 2011-03-04, 16:03   Link #1015
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Nope, that's just one possibility, Mami and Kyouko never became witches, though for Madoka it's more likely since she is even more naive than Sayaka.
QB takes the energy from the moment the soul burns out and the SG becomes GS (stated by him in this episode). So QB needs Madoka to become a witch to take the energy he's looking for, and you bet he would do anything to achieve this.

Of course, Madoka could become MG, defeat Walpurgis and commit suicide by shuttering her SG (like Kyoko). But then QB would just continue making baby witches out of little girls like he has always been doing, so not real solution.

EDIT: in fact, he's going to keep making new MGs even if he succeeds with Madoka, since preventing entropy is a never ending process anyway.
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Old 2011-03-04, 16:08   Link #1016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
QB takes the energy from the moment the soul burns out and the SG becomes GS (stated by him in this episode). So QB needs Madoka to become a witch to take the energy he's looking for, and you bet he would do anything to achieve this.

Of course, Madoka could become MG, defeat Walpurgis and commit suicide by shuttering her SG (like Kyoko). But then QB would just continue making baby witches out of little girls like he has always been doing, so not real solution.
Not a solution, that you would like... but what we wish to happen does not affect the actual outcome... unless you go by the anthropic principle
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Old 2011-03-04, 16:12   Link #1017
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Not a solution, that you would like... but what we wish to happen does not affect the actual outcome... unless you go by the anthropic principle
I'm just talking about an ending that would make sense from a storytelling perspective.

But hey, if you really think the story is going that way, let's just a agree to disagree, ok?
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Old 2011-03-04, 16:21   Link #1018
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Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
I'm just talking about an ending that would make sense from a storytelling perspective.
Still depends to what kind of stories you're refering to, EVA, Gilgamesh, Elfenlied, &c made perfecr sense with bleak and somewhat open to interpretation endings.

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Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
But hey, if you really think the story is going that way, let's just a agree to disagree, ok?
Well, sharing an opinion does not imply the ulterior motive to persuade the audience, that's more like what QB does
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Old 2011-03-04, 16:25   Link #1019
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Personally, I think we've gotten to the point where it's quite possible that Homura is trying to stop Madoka from becoming an MG because she's tired of having to kill her best friend ala Kyoko. As for why she doesn't explain anything to Madoka, well , how much faith would you put in the words of someone who admits they plan to kill you even if you agree it would be the right thing under the circumstances?
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Old 2011-03-04, 16:35   Link #1020
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Still depends to what kind of stories you're refering to, EVA, Gilgamesh, Elfenlied, &c made perfecr sense with bleak and somewhat open to interpretation endings.
I don't know about the others, but even Eva has a neat plot device (Rei) that allowed Shinji to ultimately decide over something that seemed unavoidable (instrumentality) in EoE.

I'm actually expecting something like that in this series. Some plot device that would let Madoka choose a different path instead of making a contract. Those locked memories about Homura might be the key to that.
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