AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series > Madoka Magica

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2011-03-12, 15:01   Link #1221
FlavorOfLife
Uncaring
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Guessing Madoka is the only survivor at the end
As Sayaka sas, when you save one, you kill one. Everything is always balanced.

Each time iteration shows 3 fixed things
i) Mami always dies
ii) Madoka always dies
iii) Homura always lives

For Madoka to live, Homura must take her place. We may end up with the first time loop but with Homura without her soulgem, lying on the floor and a crying Madoka.

At this point Kyubei's offer might be refused but i'm thinking Madoka will accept it. This time her mission is to save everyone and she loops back into time. Cue the title and its true significance (that is, it is Madoka's story from then on)
FlavorOfLife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 16:16   Link #1222
Lord of Fire
The Voice of Reason
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: The Netherlands
Age: 38
I agree with FlavorOfLife: Homura will be our next, and final fatality, though my reasoning is different.

We know that Homura needs to defeat both Walpurgis Night and prevent Madoka from becoming a Magical Girl, and she has to do it alone. If she fails in any may, it's mission fail and rewind.

I think Homura will find a way to achieve her goal, possibly by analyzing what she did wrong in previous timelines and adjusting her strategies accordingly. However, assuming her powers aren't nullified because of her reaching her goal, this means that Madoka will most likely be forced to kill her, as Homura could still become a Witch in the long run, since she's still a Magical Girl.

The only variable left in the equation is the chess master, Kyuubey. Homura may have won his twisted little game if she succeeds, but I wonder if he's willing to accept defeat once he realizes that his plan has failed. If not, Madoka needs to find a way to dispose of him forever without contracting with him.
__________________
Lord of Fire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 16:38   Link #1223
Key Board
Donut
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
I posted 3 predictions on my visitor's message profile last month. One of of my predictions might come true it seems

1)Madoka will become a magical girl the same way Hei from Darker Than Black became a contractor. She will SPOILER it from SPOILER and thus remove her from the burdens of the contract.

2) Madoka has so much potential because she has been through several time loops with herself as the focal point of the time space anomaly. Each loops dumps the residue power of the previous Madoka into the new timeline Madoka. For another parallel of this also see Yuuji from Shakugan no Shana and his Midnight Stray relic <-- this one

3) The black cat we see in the opening is Homura who has lost her human body. She has turned this way because she has forfeited most of her power to Madoka. See point 1)
__________________
Key Board is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 18:26   Link #1224
Xellos-_^
Valentine's Day with Wife
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: R'lyeh
Age: 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord of Fire View Post

The only variable left in the equation is the chess master, Kyuubey. Homura may have won his twisted little game if she succeeds, but I wonder if he's willing to accept defeat once he realizes that his plan has failed. If not, Madoka needs to find a way to dispose of him forever without contracting with him.
remember for QB just because he lost the current battle doesn't mean he lost the war. As long as he can get Homura out of the way and isolate Madoka at the same time. He will always have future chance to tempt Madoka with a miracle.
__________________
Xellos-_^ is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 19:28   Link #1225
Solace
(ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡┻━┻
*Moderator
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Something has been bothering me since episode 8, and unfortunately episode 10 does not help clear this up. I'm wondering about this image on the wall of Homura's house:



These are clearly humanoid and appear to be girls. However they do not look like any of the girls we've seen before. In addition, they're listed with the other information Homura has on Walpurgisnacht.

1. Are they pictures of what the MG's looked like as humans instead of Witches? There is another image that supports this idea:



This is displayed on the computer screen in the Witch's Lair of episode 4, Elly. However, the question becomes "How did Homura get/find this information for each of these girls/witches?" Also, if they are Witches, why are they pictured as MG's, and not their Witch form? What is the relevance?

We do have some other interesting observations about Witches:

At least some Witches can talk, at least to their victims (Elly and Isadel).
Some Witches have memories of their human life (Sayaka), and we've seen another (Elly) display memories of human life on her computer screens (we saw Mami in one of them).
Magical Girl power/appearance is based on their wish. Witches appear to share this reflection, but it is twisted. For example Sayaka's appearance is a mixture of a Knight/Mermaid (see Little Mermaid or Melusine for reference), and her lair is a reflection of her love turned curse (Kamijou and by extension, music...in particular, her memory of seeing Kamijou perform as a child).

There's also a few things we don't know about the MG/Witch system. For example, in episode 9, Kyubey states that he "discovered" the MG system. He appears to play no part in it except for (possibly) creating the Soul Gem and harvesting the energy released from the Gem as it turns into a Grief Seed. It is implied the wish is created from the girls power and not his own. He also admits in different episodes that the power of MG's is capable of doing impossible things.

So leading back to the image in Homura's house, I'm still perplexed. It is possible that the image is a red herring, but I find it odd that such a detail, in a show that is very meticulous about detail, would put such a thing there for no reason. Of course this could be like the cat in the OP, which we still haven't seen yet and maybe never will.
__________________
Solace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 19:41   Link #1226
BaKaBaKaOtaKu
Stupidity is Bliss.
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: In Hancock's Heart
what if madoka's doing a timeloop herself? LOL. and her wish has something to do with saving homura since the latter died in a madoka-centered timeline? this might say that their wishes will never meet and homura-centered timelines will never end..homura will always fail no matter what.
__________________
www.gifreducer.com/upld/gen/IXzHGD/32-nodither.gif
Faberry
Quinn and Rachel
BaKaBaKaOtaKu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 19:48   Link #1227
applejuice
I kill you
*Graphic Designer
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: In your brain
This is small possibility, but there is possibility that Homura isn't time-travelling at all... It might be just entire world changing, which is one of few ways to explain why Madoka had feeling of meeting Homura before.
__________________
If anyone attacks Shaft
I will be there to defend it to death.
applejuice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 19:52   Link #1228
Seihai
オンリーマイ曙v( ̄Д ̄)v
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Iwakawa Base
Age: 22
Send a message via Skype™ to Seihai
Kyubei confirmed her to have time manipulation and we know she uses time freeze. But yeah, I guess there's a small possibility that it's not entirely related to time because time is also connected to space. Then again, it might be Madoka herself that is the oddity here.
__________________
Seihai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 20:21   Link #1229
Zippicus
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Detroit, MI
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solace View Post
At least some Witches can talk, at least to their victims (Elly and Isadel).
Some Witches have memories of their human life (Sayaka), and we've seen another (Elly) display memories of human life on her computer screens (we saw Mami in one of them).
Magical Girl power/appearance is based on their wish. Witches appear to share this reflection, but it is twisted. For example Sayaka's appearance is a mixture of a Knight/Mermaid (see Little Mermaid or Melusine for reference), and her lair is a reflection of her love turned curse (Kamijou and by extension, music...in particular, her memory of seeing Kamijou perform as a child).
I could be wrong about this, but the witch that displayed Mami on her screen seemed to be doing that to torment Madoka. Madoka even said something to the extent of "this must be my punishment for being so weak". It's highly unlikely that the witch would have any memories of a private scene between Madoka and Mami, so I assumed it was pulled from Madoka's memory/subconscious.
Zippicus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 20:26   Link #1230
Hagoshod
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Send a message via AIM to Hagoshod
I just realized something.

Regular girls become Magical Girls, and Magical Girls "grow up" into Witches, right?

And Madoka's dying wish to Homura is to never have to become a Witch, right?


Holy crap. The entire story is a feminist deconstruction of Peter Pan. The characters are the Lost Girls by multiple definitions. It's a coming-of-age story about a group of little girls who are afraid of growing up, losing their idealism, and becoming something bad (compare Madoka's witches to Peter Pan's pirates plz). They're lost causes because, once you're a Magical Girl, the only way out is death.

Why the hell didn't I notice this before?
Hagoshod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 21:00   Link #1231
Solace
(ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡┻━┻
*Moderator
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippicus View Post
I could be wrong about this, but the witch that displayed Mami on her screen seemed to be doing that to torment Madoka. Madoka even said something to the extent of "this must be my punishment for being so weak". It's highly unlikely that the witch would have any memories of a private scene between Madoka and Mami, so I assumed it was pulled from Madoka's memory/subconscious.
You're likely right. I was pointing it out as an example of Witches showing memories visibly.

I was talking to someone about the nature of Witches a few days ago and likened them to a kind of poltergeist, but now I'm wondering if that's really true. It seems more like Witches are just twisted versions of MG's, their humanity warped by their grief. They're basically trapped in a loop where they seek a solution to a problem that can't be solved (in their mind), in that Magical Girls (their former life) sought out Soul Gems (souls) to cleanse their own grief but Grief Seeds themselves can't work in the opposite direction. So they're stuck seeking out "grief" like they were as a Magical Girl but because their Seeds only absorb "grief", they can't remove their own, and end up trapped and unable to return to what they used to be.

This might also explain how Witches can revive, since we never see the Seed destroyed like we have seen Soul Gems become destroyed (by shattering them). We know that Soul Gems must be near the body to keep it alive, but there is no implication that the Soul Gem itself would "die" if there was no body to operate. Since we know that Witches can materialize wherever their Seed is, perhaps the Seed can move from place to place. This could be supported by episode 10 where Homura returned to the past in her old body but her Soul Gem was transported from the future to the past. This suggests that Gems/Seeds can operate independent of the human body but that the Seed contains more than what the Gem can handle, so it "shatters" the Gem, abandons the human form, and re-materializes into a form that can contain/hold all the accumulated grief. In theory, if this grief could be "cured", the Seed could reform back into a Gem and the human body could be restored.

This is all completely hypothesis of course. I'm still wondering about the nature of the system and how it relates to the image in Homura's house.
__________________
Solace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 21:32   Link #1232
Malkuth
Banned
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: London
Age: 34
Send a message via MSN to Malkuth Send a message via Skype™ to Malkuth
Going a little meta, the only way to have a conclusive ending ending is for Homura to die, since in any other case, there will be the possibility to have another reset.
Malkuth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 22:00   Link #1233
Jimmy C
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
No matter what Homura does, eventually Madoka will die of natural causes.
Jimmy C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 22:27   Link #1234
kaigan
Segmentation fault
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malkuth View Post
Going a little meta, the only way to have a conclusive ending ending is for Homura to die, since in any other case, there will be the possibility to have another reset.
i'm beginning to wonder if it's even possible of purging (viz. "killing" even though she's dead already) homura-chan out. if in the course of any given timeline homu "died" fighting WN or any other means then that means she did not fulfill her mission to protect madoka. that should in turn trigger an "auto-reset" because her wish is to redo her meeting with madoka in order to protect her instead of the other way around.

killed in action does not satisfy the clauses agreed by both QB and homura (qb fulfills the girl's wish, girl becomes PM). killing homura without her wish being fulfilled is a breach in contract which is so unfair while the other girls had theirs.
kaigan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 22:47   Link #1235
Malkuth
Banned
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: London
Age: 34
Send a message via MSN to Malkuth Send a message via Skype™ to Malkuth
Am I missing something here? Homura never died in the 4 iterations shown

Also wishes are fullfilled instantly, and do not have any lasting effects, from what I gather from Mami's case, since she did die in the end. So it is unlikely that it is Homura's wish that restarts events, but instead her power to manipulate time and space... but this raises the question why does not she use it more practically, i.e. not getting trapped by Mami...

Then again what we have seen up until now is not clear if it shown from a certain perspectives (which would be ultra-cool, but will throw off the majority of casual viewer), or it is an objectional presentation

In any case, the show already justified both the pre-air hype and the all-star staff already, I just hope they do not do something utterly ridiculous with the last two episode; well a minor fault was QB's exposition last episode with no-sense sci-fi crap
Malkuth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 22:55   Link #1236
kaigan
Segmentation fault
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malkuth View Post
Am I missing something here? Homura never died in the 4 iterations shown
maybe i'm not using the correct term, but is it not that once a girl turns into a PM they are considered "literally dead" since their souls are ripped out from their bodies?
kaigan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 22:55   Link #1237
Zippicus
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Detroit, MI
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malkuth View Post
Going a little meta, the only way to have a conclusive ending ending is for Homura to die, since in any other case, there will be the possibility to have another reset.
Considering that we don't really know the mechanics of Homura's wish, saying "the only" is a bit premature. There's still a few unexplained things going on as well that could affect the outcome of this whole mess.

My current prediction involves Madoka remembering (fairly heavily foreshadowed) previous loops and how to access her (super heavily foreshadowed, supposedly unimaginable) power to fix whatever QB's people did to corrupt the current MG system. But hey only time will tell.
Zippicus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-12, 23:19   Link #1238
Crontica
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: My Desk
What happens when a angel loses their halo? Cause Kyubei got two of them.
__________________
Crontica is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-13, 00:07   Link #1239
Xellos-_^
Valentine's Day with Wife
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: R'lyeh
Age: 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippicus View Post
Considering that we don't really know the mechanics of Homura's wish, saying "the only" is a bit premature. There's still a few unexplained things going on as well that could affect the outcome of this whole mess.

My current prediction involves Madoka remembering (fairly heavily foreshadowed) previous loops and how to access her (super heavily foreshadowed, supposedly unimaginable) power to fix whatever QB's people did to corrupt the current MG system. But hey only time will tell.
what if the furballs didn't corrupt the system but just taking advantage of the result of the system already in place.

I read the previous eps and none of it actually gave any hints or evidence that the evolution of MG to Witches are anything other then just a natural progression.
__________________
Xellos-_^ is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-13, 00:15   Link #1240
Triple_R
Senior Member
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Age: 33
Send a message via AIM to Triple_R
I don't think that Kyubey's people corrupted the magical girl/witch system. Rather, I think that they created it.

What is likely independent from them, though, is that humans have magical potential inherit in them (or at least some of these girls do). A key, then, may come in finding a way to tap into that magical potential without contracting with Kyubey.
__________________
Triple_R is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
madoka magica

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 19:46.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.