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Old 2012-05-24, 05:48   Link #31241
ZeroXSEED
I am no one
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Inside your head
Demi want cheap armor, PIC magic is out of question, so large momentum is large.

Demi want a cheap armor, so powered armor still out of question, heavy armor is heavy.

And here, Demi subscribe that I.S. weapon are roughly 4.5 times (2 x 1.5^2) as powerful as human weapon of similar size. And it has 3 times (2 x 1.5) the momentum.

So far, the smallest SMG depicted? it's loaded with 10mm equivalent of a pistol round, and since it's a pistol-type projectile, it transfer the impact more efficiently on hard surfaces.

Going by your design, it's going to be able to take some shot from smallest I.S. weapon, which said a lot. The armor will be useful then.

P.S. IS verse has no laser weapon so far, all the energy weapon are particle type.
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Old 2012-05-24, 05:49   Link #31242
agetreme
One_Turn_Kill(Myself)
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Delusion world
One more day till end of exam....yay?

Didn't do so well....but there is no point being depressed about something too late to be change.....

My current list of plan after exam:

Movie:
M.I.B. 3
Immediately after the Exam....

=====

Game:

Dragon Nest (One word: Academic. Nothing more funny that a Loli beating down a giant monster with BFC (Big Freaking Cannon).....and yea....I find her combo count build up insanely faster than my swordman....and she(Loli) is a "anyhow" build....)

MapleStory (want to get that Legend ring which stack with other rings... and Plus 15 to all stats is good for my Battle Mage..... probably going to train Mercedes for extra Exp and Demon Slayer(for awesomeness? May be less annoying Boss Fight who can debuff and Battlemage really need that insane HP buff...to survive a few hit)

Diablo 3 (May be..... Although it look awesome but I hate the DRM.....)

===

Fanfic:

IS fanfic (Work IN progress):
Dream Catcher (pilot):
I did promise to finish this

Erinyes:
Don't assume that women do nothing while guys are plotting to humiliate or kill them.... They are not stupid or dumb.

Dream Catcher/Eater (More gundam-y feel?) Well... more like SD gundam.... because the machine is a Mascot Costume.....
-
Hidan No Aria Fanfic (detective stuff felt kind of interesting at the moment... And Detective stuff in the series is severely lacking).....
-
To Aru Fanfic (Limbo-mode.... wanted to type out one but really lack the energy to think of a good concept to work with....preoccupied by Hidan No Aria)

==

Original Fantasy story: On hold due to technically Difficulty.....(Still trying to decide how the lead character is like)
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Old 2012-05-24, 05:54   Link #31243
ZeroXSEED
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^ The more I think about it, it sound like revenge/ anti male OC fic.

Please don't take offense on it. Just a random guess.
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Old 2012-05-24, 05:56   Link #31244
greedyspectator
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Join Date: May 2012
@Demi:
The blooming effect for charged particle streams are even worse. The charged particles need to be of the same charge in order to allow acceleration via rails or coils. However, these charged particles repel each other, so the farther the beam goes the more distributed the area of the beam, thus limiting the density of the beam. Even worse, the charged particles will strip electrons out of the air, heating the air and turning them into plasma, creating even more blooming.

I'm willing to handwave this, though, since particle accelerators will have better penetration and less impact blooming (blooming when the projectile hits) when fired.
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Old 2012-05-24, 06:01   Link #31245
ZeroXSEED
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Well, it's not canon, but it was the most consistent collective opinion so far (this theory is almost as old as this thread)

Because otherwise, "Flexible" is the single, biggest bullshit I ever heard from the canon.

FYI, that was a technique used to 'bend' the beam midair, attacking enemy from odd angle, usually to bypass heavy frontal defense.

EDIT: there IS a possibility of stealth field being utilized in a way to bend laser, but still...
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Old 2012-05-24, 06:09   Link #31246
demino_hellsin
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My beacon and stealth doohickey do a well enough job disrupting magnetic fields. They both disrupt the cohesive energy construct of shielding and any form of beam weaponry, light or particle. Doesn't make them immune though, just less effective but enough to terminate a human in most cases.

The original idea for I had for an armor is based off basic physics and gun engineering. Since we have anti-recoil system by redirecting the force from firing a bullet to elsewhere other than back to the shooter's arms, why not do the same for the one hit? An armor that doesn't only catch the bullet but effectively disperses the kinetic force by running it through established channels. The biggest problems to this design are bulk, material and just how ludicrous such an armor would be.
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Old 2012-05-24, 06:13   Link #31247
ZeroXSEED
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Join Date: Apr 2010
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And... let's be specific, you better make it a power armor because even without servo, it was extremely complex the begin with

EDIT: OH GOD LASER REFLECTION SYSTEM! NOW IT STRUCK IN MY HEAD!
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Old 2012-05-24, 06:13   Link #31248
agetreme
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Location: Delusion world
more like "take that" fic....

Like I say, the story take place in the world where all the anti-IS faction existed....

and combine them with my Dream Catcher's Half-empty universe (which has the theme of "At the end of Dream, Despair/Emptiness awaits those who dare to dream.")

(Dream Catcher/Eater will be Half-Full story... because the machine is a Dream Catcher/Eater....)

Do not expect a happy ending... For Erinyes....

Do expect Anti-IS weapon being deployed to kill IS Pilot.

The reason why the story sounds anti-male because it is from female POV and how they feel about the guys creating anti-IS weapon because of their Superior/inferiority complex...

Edit:
Spoiler for spoiler:


Both stories have Half-Full answer to the Half-Empty universe.

Dream Catcher/Eater:
"Keep Dreaming anyway. The Journey Matter more than the End"

Erinyes:
"With friends by your side, at least you won't be alone."
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Old 2012-05-24, 06:18   Link #31249
demino_hellsin
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Well the original greatest weakness of the armor, if it ever went past theory, was that it could only take 1 IS grade shot at a time. The impact redirection mechanism uses the impact force to reset itself. But since resetting itself takes even a second or two, continuous hits make the system moot and the defense will become totally dependent on the armor material.
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Old 2012-05-24, 06:51   Link #31250
greedyspectator
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@Zero
I ran some numbers. Here's what I came up with.
Whipple shield (reinforced glass)- Material density: 11700 kg/m^3 (roughly twice of bulletproof glass density). Ultimate Tensile Strength: Approx. 4000 MPa. Ductility: Approx. 2cm
Inert layer (rubber)- Material density: 5000 kg/m^3. UTS: 200 MPA. Ductility: Approx. 30cm
Defensive layer (Kevlar or Vectran)- Material density: 3400 kg/m^3. UTS: Approx. 3,620 MPa for Kevlar, five times the number for Vectran. Ductility: Approx. 4cm.

Against 400gram projectile (IRL, 30mm cannon of Thunderbolt II, in IS verse, Vent Assault Rifle .61 assuming double mass) going at 1500 m/s (GAU Avenger of TII shoots at 1000m/s):

First layer: Momentum of projectile: 0.4kg*1500m= 600N. Momentum of layer: 0.117 kg*4000 MPA= 468N. 600-468= 132N of leftover force. More than 3/4 of original momentum lost, assumes projectile is broken into shrapnel (assuming projectile is made of tungsten, which has a UTS of 1510, which is about 0.4 of the UTS of the layer, hence the projectile is broken if momentum is reduced to less than 0.6 (1-0.4=0.6).
Second layer: Expansion to maximum: 30 cm. Momentum of layer: 0.005kg*200 MPA= 1N. 132N-1N= 131N of leftover force.
Distance between first and second layer: 30cm. Spherical explosion: r^2/4, which roughly equals to 225cm^2 of dispersal.
Third Layer: Shrapnel force after dispersal: 131N/225cm^2= 0.59N/cm ^2. Penetration impossible.

EDIT: Note- Mpa is mega pascals. Pascals are roughly equivalent to Newton/m^2. If using MPA is confusing, just replace it with Newtons, and the equations are still correct. Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultimate_tensile_strength

So, against a single .61 caliber bullet used by the vent assault rifle, as long as the bullet does not hit the same location twice, the wearer will probably survive. After three shots, however, the brittle Whipple shield will have exceeded its UTS (1510*3=4530), thus breaking the Whipple Shield and making it unusable until replaced. Each shot which hits the armor will impart correspondingly more force and energy to the wearer.
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Last edited by greedyspectator; 2012-05-24 at 07:18.
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Old 2012-05-24, 07:32   Link #31251
demino_hellsin
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@greedy: that armor won't work. If only for one reason. Too heavy.
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Old 2012-05-24, 07:35   Link #31252
Eratas123
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Need idea's for Soldier and Bride:/

Side note - Apparently I semi-inspired a fanfic. Yay?
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Old 2012-05-24, 07:44   Link #31253
greedyspectator
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@demi:
Weight:
1st Layer: Assuming 1cm thickness covering the the body with 2m surface area, 0.0001*2*2= 0.0004m^3 total volume, which is around 4.6Kg when multiplied by density.
2nd Layer: Assuming 3cm thickness covering the body with 2m surface area, 0.0003*2*2= 0.0012m^3 total volume, which is around 6Kg when multiplied by density.
3rd Layer: Assuming 1cm thickness covering the body with 2m surface area, 0.0004m^3 total volume, which is around 1.3Kg.
4.6+6+1.3= 11.9 Kg. Round it up to 12 Kg total weight. Assuming that the soldiers are carrying only weapons and no rations, its quite reasonable.
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Old 2012-05-24, 07:50   Link #31254
ZeroXSEED
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Inside your head
12 kg is reasonable in terms of mass.

BUUUT

Good luck wearing 5 cm plates allover your body

In case you wonder, I already tried similar concept in a W40K fic, and putting it into a sketch. The result is... hilarious. To say at the least. (though mine is about 3 cm thick w/ average density of 1.3 g/cc)

This might be the reason of why Space Marines armor is so darned light (130-170 kg), because it's mostly artificial muscle, various implements and chambers, and low-density ceramic and metal matrix. Only Adamantine is canonically heavier than steel, but it was used for skeletal structure, not layering material.
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Old 2012-05-24, 07:54   Link #31255
greedyspectator
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@Zero
Damn, forgot the size restrictions. It's possible to cut down the size to about 1-2cm, but it will correspondingly reduce the defensive capabilities to around only one .61 caliber round.

Also, 12kg is the vest. Full body armor would probably double that to around 24Kg. Still usable, but really heavy.
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Old 2012-05-24, 07:55   Link #31256
greedyspectator
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Oh well, you can't have everything when designing military equipment. Drawbacks are as essential as advantages are.
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Old 2012-05-24, 07:56   Link #31257
Masuzu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eratas123 View Post
Need idea's for Soldier and Bride:/

Side note - Apparently I semi-inspired a fanfic. Yay?
Which one?
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Old 2012-05-24, 08:42   Link #31258
demino_hellsin
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Is there really no way for the armor to be lighter?
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Old 2012-05-24, 08:45   Link #31259
Eratas123
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@ Box - A Harem's thoughts and feelings.

Side note - Watching Adventure Time. Damn, never thought it'd be post apocalyptic show.
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Old 2012-05-24, 08:54   Link #31260
Masuzu
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^ Oh right, that one.
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