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Old 2012-06-02, 09:58   Link #31841
demino_hellsin
That one guy
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
@eras: Well, as was once said "I shot an arrow into the air. Where it falls? I do not care.". Also, bluntness is all I offer in an argument. I don't like to sugarcoat things as it becomes more confusing.

Is this situation volatile enough?

dining room:

Ichika: nervous

Chifuyu: very annoyed

Natasha: Happy for the free meal

Clarissa: practically banging the table for food. Despite having a bandaged head.

Maya: still in mourning over her "eligibility as a bride".

Tabane: half-busy with her hologram screens. Probably miraculous considering the extensive bandages that wrapped around her.
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:01   Link #31842
Eratas123
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Being blunt is different from being an ass, but fine. I'll be blunt as well from now on since you prefer it. God knows I've been holding back for a while now.

And no, that's not volatile really. 4/6 people aren't really twitchy.
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:10   Link #31843
demino_hellsin
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@eras: explains why I only understand the tail ends of our debates for the most part.

dining room:

Ichika: nervous

Chifuyu: very annoyed, particularly murderous with Tabane while scowling at Natasha's carefree mooching.

Natasha: Happy for the free meal

Clarissa: practically banging the table for food. Despite having a bandaged head. Saying that food is good after some rigorous activities and a bath.

Maya: still in mourning over her "eligibility as a bride".

Tabane: half-busy with her hologram screens. Probably miraculous considering the extensive bandages that wrapped around her. Though these screens contain some rather "sensitive" information that she can't help but giggle at.
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:13   Link #31844
greedyspectator
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Join Date: May 2012
@Demi:
Sorry, but I have to back up Eratas on this. As much as I disagree with him, his arguments do not attack the person he's arguing with (wait, Eratas is a guy, right? Sorry, I can't approximate gender in the internet). Your arguments, however, do not attack his morality or his arguments, but attack him directly. There is a big difference in calling with his moral calculus unworkable and calling him naive. The former is a perfectly fine argument, provided you can back that up, the latter is called Character Assassination, a type of logical fallacy.

Besides, Eratas isn't naive. He simply has different utility preferences. He assigns high utility in not killing someone, perfectly reasonable. I assign high utility in obeying 'thou shall not kill' to the greatest extent I can (again, if more victims will die if I don't kill someone, I'll take the shot and kill, simply because if I don't, the blood of those victims are on me). You assign high utility in... whatever you believe in (sorry, I did not see a lot of arguments coming from you, aside from a poorly executed Character Assassination, no offense). We all have different utility preferences.

Anyway, no, that's not volatile enough. You can NEVER have enough volatility in comedy.
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:18   Link #31845
StratoSpear
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: The Elysium
Say... is it possible to have an IS transform into a flight unit for its standby mode? Super robot shenanigans just hit me so I had to ask.
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:19   Link #31846
Eratas123
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Add Maya shaking Chifuyu's shoulder's while crying to add more physical entertainment Oh, and add Ichika trying to play peacekeeper.

@ Stratos - Aren't the standby forms just accessories?
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:24   Link #31847
demino_hellsin
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@eras: It would be funny seeing Maya troubling Chifuyu with her "maiden" issues.

@greedy: I'm not really trying to make one see things my way. So I don't make much argument. However I just give my version of what would happen if it were me.

However if you wish to hear my reasoning for my version of things then here.

The basic premise of the issue before hand was killing the person and taking his organs would be morally acceptable. I answered in a way which states that there is no morality in such cases. It is more for a case of practicality than anything. If you find necessity in that moment, a sense of danger, dread, endangerment, feel free to kill him. Should he pose no threat or merely make you feel uneasy about killing him, then let him go. Organ collection on the other hand is actually feasible only if there really is a person who needs it on hand. It would be a move that is both macabre and pointless should you decide to pull his innards for storage. At best, the technologies can only keep it fresh for a week, and even then its already at the limit of spoilage.

EDIT: as for "character assassination". I'm not forcefully degrading anyone. I call'em like I see'em. I'm a jack-ass who probably has no worth in the world with probably no one caring if I dropped dead somewhere in a ditch. I'm a coward, who will try to fight but am too weak to do so. My priorities are wierd as they stray from normal people at times then reconverge somewhere. Still, doesn't change what I see.
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:32   Link #31848
Eratas123
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@ Demi - The problem isn't that we didn't get it, it's the way you say it. There's a difference between "Your argument's stupid" between "You're stupid for believing that.". Me and my friend were discussing Saw one with me as Anti-Jigsaw and her as Pro-Jigsaw. We argued for over an hour, but not once did we take it to the point where we attacked each other directly just because we believed differently. What's you're doing is calling the person naive for believing something rather than picking apart his argument.

Anyway, to make this clear: I'm all for killing when I have to and inself-defense, but not when a person is no longer a threat or danger to anyone. Here's an example: In fallout, you had to decide between running away to preserve a tribe's innocence but leave them vulnerable since they'll never learn self defense or kill your attackers to teach them but make them more warlike. I chose the second option since running away will never work forever. Killing is regrettable, but it doesn't mean you can't show mercy and only do it when necessary.
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:34   Link #31849
StratoSpear
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eratas123 View Post
@ Stratos - Aren't the standby forms just accessories?
No, not really. Those are Closed forms from what I understand.

Standby is more like the IS is... I dunno, "folded" I guess? I just thought it would be cool to have an IS be a subflight unit in Standby mode while the pilot rides it.

When it comes to using the IS, the pilot jumps off while the subflight unit transforms into an IS where the pilot just slips into the unit.
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:41   Link #31850
greedyspectator
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@Demi
I'm pretty sure the conditions are not self defensive. We're assuming the organ collector could not attack back at this moment. I also added the clause/ premise of sufficiently advanced technology to preserve his organs. There are three choices at hand here. I will offer my analyses for all three.

> Kill the guy because he's evil and society becomes better off without him.
> Kill the guy and harvest his organs to save someone else.
> Spare the guy.

The problem with 1 is that if you kill the guy but don't harvest his organs to save someone else, you have murdered that someone else. It's the same way that you have two buttons in front of you, one saves the life of a terminally ill person while the other does nothing. If you choose the button that does nothing, you have murdered the terminally ill person because you could have saved him by choosing the other option. Again, batman-joker reference.

The problem with 3 is that by sparing the person, you will allow him to continue murdering others. It would be the same as if you were murdering those people, since you could have saved them by just killing the person.

With 2, you directly saved a life by killing the organ-harvester's. You also saved a lot of lives by making him unable to harm his future victims. Therefore, in my opinion, choice 2 obeys 'thou shall not kill' in the greatest extent possible.

Going to sleep now. Good night.
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:42   Link #31851
demino_hellsin
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IS in standby are IS that are realized but inactive. So if it starts acting on its own... that's not standby anymore.

1. I don't really care if he's evil. If I just can't forgive him, then I will kill him.

2. Save another life? a one in a million chance and you expect me to see that far ahead to save that person's life. Unless I know someone in immediate need, I won't do such a thing. Doing things like that isn't trying to be hero, it's just trying to be god.

3. If I don't feel like killing him, then fine. Should he cross me, then I will judge him again.
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:43   Link #31852
ZeroXSEED
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Inside your head
Len: "Yet another fangirl? Give me a break!"

Oookay, I'm on fire and ready for another draft.

Spoiler for Onsen:


In case you wonder, yes, entire male dorm and it's accompanying facility are underground. To prevent trespasser
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:46   Link #31853
Eratas123
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Okay, when did "Spare" immediately translate to "Let him get away with it"? Sending him to jail is sparing him, but that's not letting him get away with it. Where did the idea that sparing someone ultimately means letting him off scott free come from? If there's a way to stop him without killing him, then I'll take it. If there's none, then I'll kill him just to stop him. Spare doesn't equate to release.

@ Stratos - I don't think so. I think it'd be cool if it turned into a skateboard, but it's woo wishy washy.
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:51   Link #31854
Eratas123
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@ Senpai - Wait, wait, who did Charlotte bump into?
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:51   Link #31855
ZeroXSEED
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Inside your head
^ greedy has impression that every jail is made of cardboard, and every villain is Joker.

That was Rito
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Old 2012-06-02, 10:58   Link #31856
demino_hellsin
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Join Date: Nov 2011
Let me breakdown the morality code thus far.

Greedy: completes the mission and goes beyond the call of duty.(lawful good)

me: impartial, just follow your gut/judgement(chaotic neutral)

Eras: do what must be done, but emphasis on non-lethality(lawful neutral/chaotic good?)


Older Harem:

Would it be weird if Ichika is more worried about dinner turning cold than the volatile bomb that is composed of the 5 women inside the dining room?
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Old 2012-06-02, 11:03   Link #31857
Eratas123
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Welll.....it was certainly an interesting first meeting

Anyway, need advice: Should I make Irish not care about changing clothes in the same room as anyone or be paranoid about it? I can give reasons for both.

@ Demi - Well said

Anyway, no not really. Look at his monologues and you'll see he's very food minded.
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Old 2012-06-02, 11:04   Link #31858
demino_hellsin
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old irish or new irish? cause this really depends. Paranoid fits the old Irish.
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Old 2012-06-02, 11:10   Link #31859
Eratas123
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What do you mean Old and New? He's still mostly the same.
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Old 2012-06-02, 11:14   Link #31860
ZeroXSEED
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Inside your head
I chalk it that Irish don't care if the person he's with is well trusted, and paranoid if that person isn't.

Len and Lingyin always try to 'kill' each other because of the slightest misunderstanding (and because both has DAMN HUGE ego). of course, that also led to inevitable UST....
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