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Old 2012-03-12, 07:00   Link #2721
MrTerrorist
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ANN reviews the 1st 12 episodes of Last Exile: Fam, the Silver Wing

And what do you know. The reviewer like this show and gave it a "B" saying "Perhaps Fam isn't the second coming of Gonzo (yet), but it is a well-made, well-balanced, and, well, enjoyable action series—and they could've done far worse than that."
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Old 2012-03-12, 08:00   Link #2722
hiroshi5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ami-chan View Post

Putting your socioeconomic views aside, I think you're misinterpreting their point. The whole idea wasn't to tell us that killing people to create room for the future population is okay. They weren't trying to put those two characters into an "Oh, I see. They're actually trying to save the world!" position. I think they wanted to reinforce that Luscinia and Liliana are indeed wrong, and are blindly pushing towards an end without considering the means. I guess you can consider that a gray area. But in no way was their volition justified. It's actually quite the contrary. The entire series, they've been painted as the villains, but we were always given some kind of hope that they may have goals that make all the deaths and suffering worth it. Luscinia and Liliana are the villains who, in their minds, think they're doing the world a greater good. But they're alone and the protagonists in the this show will show them how wrong they are.
I get what you're saying, but the actual script didn't give me a clear sense of how many people agree with Luscinia, how many have moderate solutions, and how many don't think there's a problem at all.


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Originally Posted by Ami-chan View Post
If you were in a war for your country and watched friends and family die all around you. And then, even if it's just for a day, a truce was reached. You seriously think you'd keep your guns loaded and cocked and shoot anyone that looked at you wrong? These guy are happy because they don't have to kill their friends anymore and their life expectancies went higher than a week. Give them a break.
Ok, but it's overstated and too simplistic. One day, fighting, next day, all lovey-dovey.

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Originally Posted by Ami-chan View Post
And they have done this before. The problem being, it requires other countries to renounce her as the ruler for her kingdom. This isn't a republic or a democracy, it is a monarchy. Leadership over these countries is passed down by lineage. You can't just say "She's not our Queen anymore", you're pretty much at her mercy unless you're willing to start a civil war. This is a monarchy.
You're ill-informed. It's actually fairly common for monarchs to be deposed and replaced by another monarch - sometimes even someone from the same family.
And, regardless of the eloquence of your argument, I think the script in #18 handles the topic very poorly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ami-chan View Post
They are not saying killing entire countries and instilling population control with your military is the right thing to do. But they did decide to have it as a main point in the plot to instill thought and emotion within their viewers. They were successful. This by no means makes the script rubbish.
Your arguments are not without merit, but the actual script handles these topics clumsily.
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Old 2012-03-12, 10:04   Link #2723
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Originally Posted by Panzerklein View Post
Like ram her Vespa to Exile and die in vain, right? .
I hope she at least was packing a nuke. Like in Independence Day.
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Old 2012-03-12, 12:24   Link #2724
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Lot of main characters continue to die, but Fam still the useless spectator and everything happen in front of her eyes. Apart the grand race there is something that she will able to do? Just wondering.
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Old 2012-03-12, 12:52   Link #2725
hai_san
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So Luscinia is just a plain old bad guy, no hidden agenda no secret plot he just want to wipe out most of the population so that the surviving ades + Sara can rule the earth. So next thing is grand final battle versus rest of the world, where he will dies while taking out most of the world too. Afterward we get a happy end! Fam can race her grand Race as peace party with Sara watching and then Sara will get assassinated by whoever is left. And the neverending circle of war and peace continue till the next Last Exile - "insert possible Name here" serie.

God the serie began so good so much promising but by ep 12-14 it went down and down and down. Please at least let the last grand battle be good...

Last edited by hai_san; 2012-03-12 at 13:02.
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Old 2012-03-12, 12:58   Link #2726
Myssa Rei
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeisterBabylon View Post
I hope she at least was packing a nuke. Like in Independence Day.
There aren't any tactical-grade weaponry on Earth anymore aside from the Exiles though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fnights View Post
Lot of main characters continue to die, but Fam still the useless spectator and everything happen in front of her eyes. Apart the grand race there is something that she will able to do? Just wondering.
Directly? Hard to say. But I do think she'll play a part in getting Sara back from Luscinia, as a previous poster has mentioned that, for all its intimidation factor the Grand Exile likely has the same sort of weaknesses as every other Guild-designed ship: that is, small craft like Fam's vespa can likely infiltrate it from the inside.

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Originally Posted by hiroshi5 View Post
The setup positively invites comparison with Western Europe in our world about a hundred years ago. So if comparisons are made, you shouldn't complain.
And I'm not. The thing is it's not reasonable to expect an exact one is to one correlation between our real-world history and the world presented by Last Exile.
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Old 2012-03-12, 13:30   Link #2727
Julio C
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Funi's subs at up at least. It is still unclear if Sadri knew Luscinia's true intentions on bringing that new weapon, but he did mentioned that he will proceed to the plan. We'll find out how loyal Sadri is on the next episode.

Fam finally realizes her fault and that the grand race is nothing but a dream. It sucks that her realization was poorly executed and felt unrealistic, but at least she realize how much hate there is in this world.

As for the Grand Exile, a small vanship might be able to get inside and do some damage. Also there might be a weakspot on the rear where the Silvius can do critical damage to it.
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Old 2012-03-12, 14:01   Link #2728
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTerrorist View Post
ANN reviews the 1st 12 episodes of Last Exile: Fam, the Silver Wing

And what do you know. The reviewer like this show and gave it a "B" saying "Perhaps Fam isn't the second coming of Gonzo (yet), but it is a well-made, well-balanced, and, well, enjoyable action seriesóand they could've done far worse than that."
Great read and nice to see he's enjoying it too.
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Old 2012-03-12, 15:37   Link #2729
stormwaltzing
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Unlike Orang, Sadri didn't seem to have a crazy freak out re: that ending. But then again, Sadri didn't just lose his entire fleet of comrades.

Spoiler for Anyway about that jedi battle.:
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Old 2012-03-12, 16:59   Link #2730
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Oh man its not called the Grand Exile for nothing, that was some ridiculous firepower. Dio taking out Alauda was nice. So Vasant finally died, though i was expecting worse. How is Sara the maestro?
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Old 2012-03-12, 17:20   Link #2731
Trajan
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Well, after watching the subs, this episode just comes across as a hot mess to me. In fact, in the last two episodes, we have seen a) Liliana tell Millia to do what she has to, b)Luscinia tell Fam to do what she has to, c) Luscinia tell Liliana to do what she has to, and d) Luscinia tell Fam he is only doing what he has to. Amazing writing, really.

Liliana and Millia: The viewer sees that Liliana was “forced” into serving Luscinia and becoming a witch after the destruction of Turan. Then it cuts to Millia bemoaning Liliana’s death and saying that she (Millia) was oblivious to everything and didn’t realize the burden Liliana had to bear. But how does Millia come to understand this? It wasn’t just the Exile knowledge Liliana may or may not be aware she possesses. It was the choice Luscinia gave her in the ruins of Iglasia. That’s when Liliana decided to “bear her burden.” Did Millia download all of Liliana’s memories as well? That’s the only way Millia could appreciate Liliana’s situation. If so, that would be an interesting development, but I don’t think the show really intends to go there. I just think the writers are belatedly trying to make Liliana a complex character by shoehorning details into the plot.

Fam Fan Fan: Well, Fam finally realizes that other people have feelings too, which is a positive bit of “growth” for her character. But as another poster noted, it rings entirely false. Let’s just recount what Fam has personally witnessed prior to this episode: terrorist attack on first Grand Race; death of Kaiser in front of her six-year-old self; assassination of Augusta Farahnaz in front of her six-year-old self; annihilation of Iglasia; ambush of the sky pirates by Orang; Liliana’s betrayal of Millia when the Sylvius meets the Ades fleet; destruction of the provincial fleet; destruction of most of Glacies’ rocket fighters; the aftermath of the destruction of Kartoffel; losing an entire squadron of Sky Pirates in the first battle of Boreas; almost being shot down by Dian in the second battle of Boreas.

After Fam has seen and experienced all these things, she still, as she admits to Millia, doesn’t think of anyone else’s feelings and only wants peace so that there can be another Grand Race. But somehow Liliana’s death forces Fam to grow up, when Fam’s first-hand experiences up to that point haven’t moved her character one bit? Seems forced and unbelievable to me.
Spoiler for Fam at the end:

Sadri: I love the old guy. I don't think there's any way to reconcile what a character in his position should know with a view of him as anything other than a crafty, psychopathic old man. After all, Luscinia has been using the equivalent of an atomic bomb (the Exile) to bring world peace and now he tells Sadri that he is going off with Sara to get an even bigger "peace-bringer." How can Sadri think it's anything aside from an even bigger bomb?


Below just some general thoughts and questions I have going forward:
Spoiler for Guild theories:

Questions:
Spoiler:
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Old 2012-03-12, 19:18   Link #2732
Myssa Rei
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The following are assumptions based on what we know, both via in-series implications as well as what little supplementary information we can get from various print media on the franchise.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajan View Post
1. In Episode 1 we see the Last Exile arrive on Earth very shortly before (maybe even the night before) Adesí battle with Turan over the Grand Lake. If the Last Exile was on Earth at the start of Adesí campaign, why did it leave again? Is there something important still on Prester, and if so, why was it not brought to Earth sooner?
We've been given hints that the Last Exile was shuttling people and war material (remember, Alex comments that most of the Anatoray forces were in transit) to Earth, likely the former more than the latter. As we have no idea just how FAR Prester is from Earth, I assume that the Exile only stays as long as necessary to unload its cargo, then goes back on its 'route' to pick up the next batch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajan View Post
2. For what purpose is Alvis on Earth? We know from the manga that
Spoiler:
and now Luscinia. As noted above, the Last Exile came to Earth at the start of the series and left again. Why didnít they put Alvis on it for her own safety?
This one takes some guesswork, but I assume it's because Alvis herself doesn't want to be cooped up in the starship in transit between worlds, and just wants to stay close to her ad-hoc family (well, relatively anyway). It might be more risky, given how many factions want to grab her for what she can do, but at least she's not alone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajan View Post
3. Are Alvis and Sara interchangeable? In Episode 19, Luscinia moves to get Sara and Alauda moves for Alvis. As Luscinia and Alauda part from one another, they make a pact that if one fails, the other will continue on to finish the plan. This implies that either Alvis or Sara can activate the Grand Exile.
I don't Alvis or Sara are necessarily interchangable, but more of a Plan A/Plan B situation: if Luscinia doesn't get Sara, Alvis is the second choice because of her connection to the Last Exile.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajan View Post
4. Alvis can either sense the other Exiles or the other Keys (or both). Can Sara? Could Liliana (and now Milia)? If not, why not?
We've only seen Alvis display this level of empathy for other Exiles. One would EXPECT all the other Keys to be able to do the same, but we've not seen any evidence of this. Then again, Alvis is pretty much a pureblood, or at least just a single generation away from being a pureblood, where everyone else (Liliana, Sara, etc) are descendants of descendants.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajan View Post
5. When did Luscinia discover that Sara was the Maestro and Key to the Grand Exile?
He probably had an idea as early as his time as a bodyguard for Farahnaz. Remember, Dio actually called (the former Augusta) as a Maestro.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajan View Post

6. Did Sadri ever tell Fam who she really is? He was about to, and then she stepped on his foot, and then . . . we cut away to a different scene at the party. Did he get pissed off that she stepped on his foot and decide not to tell her? Because it's not like he couldn't have done so immediately after she stepped on his foot.
I assume he never got around to, as it was incredibly awkward (and Sadri was fumbling for words as well).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajan View Post
7. Along with #6, will we ever find out why Fam was in that vanship?
Your guess is as good as ours. If we go by the rule of drama though, I'd say that Raha was fleeing because the relationship that produced Fam wasn't something that Sadri approved of. It might also coincide with the assumed tumultuous period that preceded the peace celebrated by the Grand Race.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajan View Post
8. Why is the source of the Grand Lake a perfectly circular hole in the lake? (beginning of episode 10)
Someone dug a deep well for ceremonial purposes? Again your guess is as good as hours, but in this cases I just blame the Guild and the Exile project and leave it at that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajan View Post
9. Where does the Turan Exile go when it isnít being dropped on cities? It doesnít fly back up into formation with the other Exiles.
I assume that it just returns to wherever its Key sends it to, which is offscreen in the wilderness somewhere.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajan View Post
10. Where is Earthís natural moon? (My theory, it was carved up to make the Exiles)[/spoiler]
We actually see the moon at one point -- it's the largest crescent behind the Exiles parked in orbit.
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Old 2012-03-12, 20:00   Link #2733
Graveyard Duck
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Originally Posted by Myssa Rei View Post
We've only seen Alvis display this level of empathy for other Exiles. One would EXPECT all the other Keys to be able to do the same, but we've not seen any evidence of this.
Actually, we see Liliana reacting when the Glacies Exile is activated. Some use this reaction to speculate that Fam is a Key: When more of the Glacies Mysteria are recited, and the Turan Exile is reactivated, we cut to a scene of Fam dropping a bundle of supplies. Some suggest that her sudden clumsiness is because she was reacting to the Exile activation.

Quote:
I assume that it just returns to wherever its Key sends it to, which is offscreen in the wilderness somewhere.
It remained above its last battle site after the battle of Glacies.
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Old 2012-03-12, 20:32   Link #2734
MeggieMay
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Well I just finished watching the show at NicoNicoŖ and I'm going to have to back off on some of my earlier comments. First, Kayhvan's not dead - those who reported that seem to have missed the fact he seemed to be fine when we last see him (he see's the light but it is going past him). Second, the opening part of the show wasn't mentioned. Someone just posted that Lilliana was forced, after all, to do what Luscinia wanted her to do. What?! What Lilliana seemed to have done is been given the a chance to kill Luscinia but was talked out of it by a wacky speech about if how she didn't let him start a war and take over, then she'd have to do it herself. NO one had to start a war, let alone continue it! The series started on a note where things had actually looked to be calming down. Luscinia and Aluada went out of their way to stir it all up again JUST to start this war. Had Lilliana pulled the trigger, and Luscinia actually let her kill him (not to sure he'd have done that), Lilliana didn't have to do squat about keeping peace for everyone in the world. The fact she didn't realize that shows that she had some real issues. I guess what they show was going for was that she agreed with Luscinia because as a Key she knew the cycle of violence was never ending but why Luscinia would be the end to that violence shows her to be quite short sighted. Just because he has a big bad weapon it isn't going to stop a thing. At some point (probably before the end of the series even) he's going to lose the ship through his own death or maybe even Sara's and then what? If that didn't happen now it would in a few hundred years. He isn't stopping anything here. He's on a huge ego trip and killing thousands of people who are in the way. Anyway, this opening scene seems to be his memory, not Millia's, though it could be trying to convey it's a shared memory between the two, due to Millia seeming to gain her sisters memories. Still, I'm not sure exactly what Millia understands when it comes to Lilliana's "burden." I still can't make heads or tails of why Lilliana did what she did. She went from angry over her fathers death to just doing what the person who killed him wanted to, to the point of wanting to always be with him. Part of this is most likely Stockhom Syndrome but I still think Lilliana's swayed way to easy for someone next in line for a throne.

Luscinia's talk with Fam: I think that's the only time in the series he ever spoke directly to her. Interesting to me is that he told Fam Lilliana wanted her to look after Millia. That isn't what Lilliana asked for. She asked Luscinia to do it and it shows yet again how worthless a person he is and how foolish she was to be swayed by him. I have to say that over all I didn't like this episode because it I just feel the story isn't doing a good job conveying what it wants us, the viewers to take away from it. Case in point, it keeps harping on how poor Lilliana situation was when it never did one thing to let us know who she was, let alone understand her. The only positive thing on the long term plot was that Fam finally realized she's been a total dork about the Grand Race, which was nice but not exactly a high point either. There are other things that are rubbing me the wrong way but that's a big one at the moment.

Now the one thing that did make me happy was Dio finally dispatching Aluada. What I'm not sure about is what does the side of the Vanship read? I know it's important but the NNŖ didn't subtitle it. It was also nice to see Dyan have regrets but if thing hadn't really gone all crazy at this point, I think it would have been to late for her. Now I think the show is setting it up so they can let her out of of jail to at least fight without making Millia to upset (they're going to need everyone that's left).

Last thought - I keep thinking that the Mysteria poems are telling a story, the back story that is, of what happened in the past. If so, then whatever that Exile was created for sounds like it had more to do with sending people off in the beginning. So did Ades simply decided not to use their Exile? Even if they did use it and come back or whatever happened, the ship doesn't seem to be like the other Exiles or truly have the same purpose. The design isn't really big enough to be a long distance carrier for a Prester sized group of people so what was it really for? I asked this before but what was that Exile really meant to do? I do hope we find out though I'm not counting on it .
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Old 2012-03-12, 20:57   Link #2735
Trajan
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Originally Posted by Myssa Rei View Post
The following are assumptions based on what we know, both via in-series implications as well as what little supplementary information we can get from various print media on the franchise.
I think most of your guesses are pretty good, but I'm hoping we get some "official" answers before the end of the anime and the manga. Some thoughts on your guesses below:

Quote:
We've been given hints that the Last Exile was shuttling people and war material (remember, Alex comments that most of the Anatoray forces were in transit) to Earth, likely the former more than the latter. As we have no idea just how FAR Prester is from Earth, I assume that the Exile only stays as long as necessary to unload its cargo, then goes back on its 'route' to pick up the next batch.
I understand that, but my point was that it's a bit odd that Anatory's superweapon is on-scene at the beginning of the fighting and then disappears to make another supply run, missing almost the entire war. Whatever they are going back to get must be more important than remaining to fight.

Quote:
This one takes some guesswork, but I assume it's because Alvis herself doesn't want to be cooped up in the starship in transit between worlds, and just wants to stay close to her ad-hoc family (well, relatively anyway). It might be more risky, given how many factions want to grab her for what she can do, but at least she's not alone.
I can't really see that, because many people have died protecting Alvis from these attacks. That would make Alvis incredibly self-centered if she's insisting on people dying to protect her all so that she doesn't have to stay on a starship. If the writers do give us a reason, I hope Alvis and Dio have been doing more than just running and have rather been looking for/collecting something that will help them in the final battle.


Quote:
He probably had an idea as early as his time as a bodyguard for Farahnaz. Remember, Dio actually called (the former Augusta) as a Maestro.
If so, that makes his decision not to retrieve Sara from Vasant seem even more foolish.


Quote:
We actually see the moon at one point -- it's the largest crescent behind the Exiles parked in orbit.
Actually, if you look closely, in Ep. 1 the largest crescent has stars shining where the darkened portion of the moon should be. I'm not sure we've seen the moon yet, unless there was another shot of it that I've forgotten.

PS:
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeggieMay
What I'm not sure about is what does the side of the Vanship read
I went back to this b/c I figured if they focused on it, it might be important. It says "Dont seat front, please". So take that as you will. The other writing on Dio's vanship reads "...exchanges / keep out" right below his seat and "Forever Sky Pirates! / Forever Kaltafare!" (not Kartoffel) on the rear of the fuselage. What's perhaps most interesting is the Sky Pirates' crest. It shares the double six-pointed star design with that seen on the screens of the Grand Exile, and it has what looks to be a pattern of roots underlying its hourglass, similar to those seen on the Grand Exile's control room floor.

Additionally, the writing under Augusta Sara's flag reads: "someday, we reache the stars" (extra 'e' is on the flag)
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Old 2012-03-12, 21:30   Link #2736
encia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajan View Post
10. Where is Earth’s natural moon? (My theory, it was carved up to make the Exiles)[/spoiler]
In terms of mass, 1000 Exiles are nowhere near the Luna Moon.

The Luna Moon has a diameter about the size of Australia. Turian's Exile is more or less about same size as a small city e.g. Macross Frontier.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ars89 View Post
Oh man its not called the Grand Exile for nothing, that was some ridiculous firepower. Dio taking out Alauda was nice. So Vasant finally died, though i was expecting worse. How is Sara the maestro?
It looks like Vasant died a slow death.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hai_san View Post
So Luscinia is just a plain old bad guy, no hidden agenda no secret plot he just want to wipe out most of the population so that the surviving ades + Sara can rule the earth. So next thing is grand final battle versus rest of the world, where he will dies while taking out most of the world too. Afterward we get a happy end! Fam can race her grand Race as peace party with Sara watching and then Sara will get assassinated by whoever is left. And the neverending circle of war and peace continue till the next Last Exile - "insert possible Name here" serie.

God the serie began so good so much promising but by ep 12-14 it went down and down and down. Please at least let the last grand battle be good...
Perhaps Luscinia plans to play "Adam and Eve" start with the known Guild DNA females (e.g. Liliana/Sara/Alvis) after "nuking" the current civilizations....

Last edited by encia; 2012-03-12 at 21:52.
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Old 2012-03-12, 21:34   Link #2737
stormwaltzing
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Originally Posted by MeggieMay View Post
Now the one thing that did make me happy was Dio finally dispatching Aluada. What I'm not sure about is what does the side of the Vanship read? I know it's important but the NNŖ didn't subtitle it.
Spoiler for \o/:


Spoiler for HERE I'LL EDIT TO ADD THE RAW CAP OF IT hurr.:
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Old 2012-03-12, 22:08   Link #2738
thundrakkon
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So Luciana's goal is to save mother earth's natural resources? Then why the heck did he unleash an earth destroyer known as the Grand Exile? The Grand Exile lays barren land and natural resources. It destroys ecosystems in a blink of an eye.

The concern is overpopulation depleting our natural resouces. Yet he has been on a mindless compaign destroying all land and scorching the earth. I am surprised no one in his army has noticed the hypocrisy of it all. Well, at least he is telling them it is for world peace. When everyone else is dead, your pure race will achieve peace (where did I hear that before, and where do I keep hearing it practiced today? )
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Old 2012-03-12, 22:53   Link #2739
Stevie_Nix
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A few quick thoughts:

I'm kind of pissed that Vasant was killed. I kind of expected most of the Generals to be killed, and I expected Luscina would be responsible for killing her. Still I didn't really like it.

I still love how even animist everything, we still got a nice sweet Fam/Gisey/Millia Moment.

I want to see if Millia forgives Dyan.

I really can't wait until next week, if for nothing else to see Tatiana and Alister fly together again, and to see Millia take command of the Silvius.
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Old 2012-03-12, 22:56   Link #2740
Graveyard Duck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajan View Post
I understand that, but my point was that it's a bit odd that Anatory's superweapon is on-scene at the beginning of the fighting and then disappears to make another supply run, missing almost the entire war. Whatever they are going back to get must be more important than remaining to fight.
Anatoray has many warships. It has only one Exile. The Exile is more valuable as a transport between the prester and Earth than it is as a weapon. Their first priority should be to keep the Exile safe, and the best way to do so is to send it away to carry more troops as soon as possible. This is assuming they even knew that Ades began hostilities before it left.

Quote:
2. For what purpose is Alvis on Earth? We know from the manga that
Spoiler:
and now Luscinia. As noted above, the Last Exile came to Earth at the start of the series and left again. Why didn’t they put Alvis on it for her own safety?
We know from the manga
Spoiler for Hourglass:


Quote:
If so, that makes his decision not to retrieve Sara from Vasant seem even more foolish.
He thinks he or Alauda can simply return and retrieve Sara. He did, in fact, walk into Sara's room and grab her this episode. That he preferred Alauda to be there for the moment of discovering the Grand Exile is perfectly legitimate.

Quote:
Actually, if you look closely, in Ep. 1 the largest crescent has stars shining where the darkened portion of the moon should be. I'm not sure we've seen the moon yet, unless there was another shot of it that I've forgotten.
Timestamp? I do not see these stars
http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/e...2_01_moons.jpg
http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/e..._01_moons2.jpg
http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/e..._01_moons3.jpg
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