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Old 2011-12-26, 12:09   Link #1201
justsomeguy
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Wow, so many long replies while I was asleep, so I'll just try clarify my thoughts rather than respond to every single point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Clannad
Yup, that's exactly what I thought about while being irked by Mashiroiro so much. I don't have the time to rewatch that series, but I remember that while TomoyaXNagisa was decided on very early, other characters' arcs still occurred, and they were developed even when it wasn't their arc. That's different than here, where the other girls basically faded into the background, except for Sana whose story is intertwined with Miu's.

@relentlessflame
Airi was instrumental to the school merger subplot, but the writers did not want her to be the main girl. In that case, she should not have been treated as main girl during the first half. I would have been more accepting if Shingo had continuously won her over during the whole series, rather than just the first half. The way they ended that, with Airi getting in the bath with him, and then suddenly joining the Kitty Club, it was presented as a cliffhanger that was never picked up again. So, I'm actually arguing that there should either be lessAiri, or equal amounts of Airi spread throughout the story.

@hyl
Flower is correct, I did not want an incest route, but rather get to know Sakuno better. As it is, she is just there, and we don't know much about her other than her slow and understanding nature.
As for Ange, yeah it was rather obvious she was a joke character. However, she still got her two episodes, while Sakuno who is definitely not there for comedy did not. That's too much focus on somebody who is not important to the plot.
About Sana, at the point where her personality switched Shingo was not that close to Miu yet. The anime was still on the Airi route at that point.
If the kittens are in the VN, that's a knock on VN's story, and a knock on the anime for including it. The whole thing was way too blunt in an otherwise smooth story.
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Old 2011-12-26, 15:28   Link #1202
relentlessflame
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
Airi was instrumental to the school merger subplot, but the writers did not want her to be the main girl. In that case, she should not have been treated as main girl during the first half. I would have been more accepting if Shingo had continuously won her over during the whole series, rather than just the first half. The way they ended that, with Airi getting in the bath with him, and then suddenly joining the Kitty Club, it was presented as a cliffhanger that was never picked up again. So, I'm actually arguing that there should either be lessAiri, or equal amounts of Airi spread throughout the story.
Who said that Airi is not the "main girl"? I think I can make a pretty good argument that, even with the way the show ended, Airi is at least as important to the overall story as Miu is, if not more so. Being the "main girl" and being "Shingo's chosen romantic partner" are not automatically the same thing.

And no, the bath scene and subsequent club-joining were not a cliffhanger. It was the conclusion of that plot thread (with a small further denouement in the beginning of the next episode). The conclusion for Airi was embedded in the line you felt was over-used, and Airi joining the club was the aftermath. The next episode showed that, as a result, the club was saved. There is nothing left to say.

What Airi went through during the first part of the story (getting closer to Shingo but realizing that he didn't love her) gave her perspective that helped her understand what Sana was going through, allowed her to appreciate what Shingo saw in Miu, and ultimately inspired her to take the stand she took in the last episode which resolved that sub-plot from earlier on. So I'm not sure how the plot could have accomplished the same objectives without largely resolving her issues first, and can scarcely imagine how the Miu/Sana romantic triangle would be portrayed if Airi's issues had to remain front and center. I don't think your proposed changes would make this a better show.


Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
About Sana, at the point where her personality switched Shingo was not that close to Miu yet. The anime was still on the Airi route at that point.
FWIW, the anime was on the Common Route at this point, not Airi's route. The personality change happens in the original story no matter what, and is not tied to any given heroine. As was said, there is very little of "Airi's route" in this anime. It's a game that always starts with resolving the situation in the class with Airi no matter what, since she is a friend of the group in all the routes that follow. Sana's personality switch also becomes part of the dynamic of the class and group no matter which route follows. So perhaps this is why I can't easily imagine the story being told any other way; to do otherwise too much would be unfaithful to the original work. (You might say you don't care and they should have made whatever changes necessary to deliver the sort of story you think would be "better" for whatever reason... but I think that's a rather myopic point of view.)
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Old 2011-12-26, 16:55   Link #1203
justsomeguy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by relentlessflame View Post
Who said that Airi is not the "main girl"? I think I can make a pretty good argument that, even with the way the show ended, Airi is at least as important to the overall story as Miu is, if not more so. Being the "main girl" and being "Shingo's chosen romantic partner" are not automatically the same thing.
I'm using "main girl" in the typical harem sense.

Quote:
And no, the bath scene and subsequent club-joining were not a cliffhanger. It was the conclusion of that plot thread (with a small further denouement in the beginning of the next episode). The conclusion for Airi was embedded in the line you felt was over-used, and Airi joining the club was the aftermath. The next episode showed that, as a result, the club was saved. There is nothing left to say.
So you think that it's okay to have a girl hop in the bath with a guy, and then the very next episode it's as if nothing has changed? No matter how much you explain that, that's poor writing. I think you already pointed out that the writers squeezed in the bath scene from Airi's route, I say that they should not have done that if they had no intent on following her story.

Quote:
What Airi went through during the first part of the story (getting closer to Shingo but realizing that he didn't love her) gave her perspective that helped her understand what Sana was going through, allowed her to appreciate what Shingo saw in Miu, and ultimately inspired her to take the stand she took in the last episode which resolved that sub-plot from earlier on. So I'm not sure how the plot could have accomplished the same objectives without largely resolving her issues first, and can scarcely imagine how the Miu/Sana romantic triangle would be portrayed if Airi's issues had to remain front and center. I don't think your proposed changes would make this a better show.
I very much disagree with that. Airi's initial opposition to the school merger had all but dissipated by the time what you call the common route was done, or at least there was no indication it remained at all. There was no need for her to get perspective as was shown here (how did the VN do it on non-Miu routes?).

Quote:
FWIW, the anime was on the Common Route at this point, not Airi's route. The personality change happens in the original story no matter what, and is not tied to any given heroine. As was said, there is very little of "Airi's route" in this anime. It's a game that always starts with resolving the situation in the class with Airi no matter what, since she is a friend of the group in all the routes that follow. Sana's personality switch also becomes part of the dynamic of the class and group no matter which route follows. So perhaps this is why I can't easily imagine the story being told any other way; to do otherwise too much would be unfaithful to the original work. (You might say you don't care and they should have made whatever changes necessary to deliver the sort of story you think would be "better" for whatever reason... but I think that's a rather myopic point of view.)
If that's the case, then the common route focused far too much on Airi, and not enough on the other girls to show that Airi is not the main girl. We've already had people argue in the P4A thread that being too faithful is a bad thing, and I think it applies here. I know that I'm not the only person who felt that this show made it seem as if Airi was abandoned to get into the Miu route (even if the storylines were tied together at the end, that doesn't erase how there was a poor transition), and that sort of thing could have easily been smoothed out during adaptation.
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Old 2011-12-26, 18:43   Link #1204
novalysis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post


So you think that it's okay to have a girl hop in the bath with a guy, and then the very next episode it's as if nothing has changed? No matter how much you explain that, that's poor writing. I think you already pointed out that the writers squeezed in the bath scene from Airi's route, I say that they should not have done that if they had no intent on following her story.

.
So , what was Shingo going to do? Automatically accept her advances even if he was not interested? In my opinion , the "nothing has changed" that you have so disparaged is actually a masterful way of illustrating , without words that Shingo rejected Airi as a romantic possibility.

Basically , the way I see it , the Bath scene could easily have developed into the Gate-way for the Airi route - had Shingo reciprocate. By simply going on as if nothing had happened , Shingo was basically politely hinting of his rejection of her advances. Basically , the route was aborted there when Shingo did not reciprocate. Of course , if a textual VN choice appeared on screen when they both next met , it might have been even more clearer.

What would you have considered good writing? Outright , in your face rejection?

How would you have warped up the ship-tease? In the end , given how many signals Airi was sending over to Shingo , there had to be some way for Shingo to "friendzone" Airi for the plot to make sense, and yet , you must still consider that Shingo is someone too polite to be that blunt....

To me , the poorest transition was the way they handled Sena's 360 Degree U turn to Tsun.... completely inexplicable.

Anytime the anime tries to make me pity Sena , I remember her 360 Degree u-turn of characterization insanity that basically guaranteed her loss by default.
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Old 2011-12-26, 19:13   Link #1205
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The bath scene is probably a fan service.....
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Old 2011-12-26, 19:31   Link #1206
hyl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
I'm using "main girl" in the typical harem sense.
So you think that it's okay to have a girl hop in the bath with a guy, and then the very next episode it's as if nothing has changed? No matter how much you explain that, that's poor writing. I think you already pointed out that the writers squeezed in the bath scene from Airi's route, I say that they should not have done that if they had no intent on following her story.
It was squeezed in without the same intentions and context as the VN, in which it was in the VN a semi awkward situation for both due their stubborness. I still think people think too much of that scene without looking at what was talked about during the whole bathscene in the anime.

Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
I very much disagree with that. Airi's initial opposition to the school merger had all but dissipated by the time what you call the common route was done, or at least there was no indication it remained at all. There was no need for her to get perspective as was shown here (how did the VN do it on non-Miu routes?).
Dissipated, yes. But she never openly said to anyone that she was no longer against the merger, not untill the merger was going to fail (even in the VN). Of course she was not inspired by Miu in the VN, seeing that it was some kind of anime original take to add the school merger problem and make it into a happy end.
Spoiler for merger:

Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
If that's the case, then the common route focused far too much on Airi, and not enough on the other girls to show that Airi is not the main girl. We've already had people argue in the P4A thread that being too faithful is a bad thing, and I think it applies here. I know that I'm not the only person who felt that this show made it seem as if Airi was abandoned to get into the Miu route (even if the storylines were tied together at the end, that doesn't erase how there was a poor transition), and that sort of thing could have easily been smoothed out during adaptation.
You can't disregard Airi at the beginning, because that was the whole basic premise for Mashiphony.
The stories were all stand alone in the VN, because they were all written by different people (the sole exception are Miu's and Sana's story). That's why all of them are written in a different style. The anime uses almost nothing from other stories besides the common route and Miu's story. There were minor elements from other stories added to make it smoother (or not), like the school merger that was never mentioned in Miu's story on the VN.
The only thing that i initially didn't agree on that the anime did use was Ange's 2 half episodes of fame, but i already used Ange's transition for my own theory in the Mashiro-iro Symphony games topic.
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Old 2011-12-26, 19:32   Link #1207
justsomeguy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by novalysis View Post
So , what was Shingo going to do? Automatically accept her advances even if he was not interested?
The situation should not have occurred in the first place.

Quote:
In my opinion , the "nothing has changed" that you have so disparaged is actually a masterful way of illustrating , without words that Shingo rejected Airi as a romantic possibility.
Oh really? Where's the awkwardness that would have arisen had Shingo rejected Airi during the bath scene? Something would have changed regardless of whether Shingo accepted or rejected Airi.

Quote:
What would you have considered good writing? Outright , in your face rejection?

How would you have warped up the ship-tease? In the end , given how many signals Airi was sending over to Shingo , there had to be some way for Shingo to "friendzone" Airi for the plot to make sense, and yet , you must still consider that Shingo is someone too polite to be that blunt....
Once again, the situation should not have occurred at all, or if it did there should be huge amounts of embarrassment and awkwardness afterwards. You think it's good writing for absolutely no reaction, no change in relationship afterwards?

Quote:
To me , the poorest transition was the way they handled Sena's 360 Degree U turn to Tsun.... completely inexplicable.

Anytime the anime tries to make me pity Sena , I remember her 360 Degree u-turn of characterization insanity that basically guaranteed her loss by default.
That's funny, that's the least poor transition; there was no 360 degree turn at all. Airi was already opposed to the merger before she met Sakuno and Shingo, and I don't think she actually expected to see them again at her school. Her behavior towards Shingo after having him join the school was an good demonstration of stubbornness and confusion. I don't think there's any examples of the show trying to make her an object of pity either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hyl View Post
It was squeezed in without the same intentions and context as the VN, in which it was a semi awkward situation for both due their stubborness. I still think people think too much of that scene without looking at what was talked about during the whole bathscene.
Then it should not have been in the show at all, if it was taken without the intention and context of the VN.

Quote:
Dissipated, yes. But she never openly said to anyone that she was no longer against the merger, not untill the merger was going to fail (even in the VN). Of course she was not inspired by Miu in the VN, seeing that it was some kind of anime original take to add the school merger problem and make it into a happy end.
And yet we have relentlessflame arguing about faithfulness, when that was no issue for the writers at all. As for having to to say that she's no longer against the merger, that would be unnecessary. After all, by then she was good friends with Shingo and Sakuno, and most people would not kick their friends out of school.

Quote:
You can't disregard Airi at the beginning, because that was the whole premise for Mashiphony.

The stories were all stand alone in the VN, because they were all written by different people (the sole exception are Miu's and Sana's story). That's why all of them are written in a different style. The anime uses almost nothing from other stories besides the common route and Miu's story. There were minor elements from other stories added to make it smoother, like the school merger that was never mentioned in Miu's story on the VN.
And what you mention is the big problem I have with the show. If Airi is so important to the story, then the show should have gone on her route instead of going Miu's story. If she is not important to Miu's story, then Airi should have been relegated to side character from the very beginning (get rid of all the sexual tension!, have the merger work quickly), making room to include whatever parts of Sakuno's story that can still fit. Or simply speed through the common route more quickly so that it doesn't look like Airi was dropped.
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Last edited by justsomeguy; 2011-12-26 at 19:49.
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Old 2011-12-26, 20:11   Link #1208
hyl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
Then it should not have been in the show at all, if it was taken without the intention and context of the VN.
You seem to forget for fanservice reasons. Besides that, the main point of that scene was the reason for Airi to know why she was not invited to the club by Shingo and also supporting my theories for why she realized that Shingo had no interest in her.
my theory (shortened)>
At he beginning of episode 5, it's clearly shown that Airi has fallen for Shingo due to her being so flustered after able to call Shingo just "Uryuu". For the entire episode she was hoping and observing Shingo that he is different (from the other men). You can rewatch the episode yourself if you missed that.
At the end of episode 6 at the bathscene, she realized that those feelings are not reciprocated because Shingo was nice and helped Airi the whole time not because he likes her, but that it's just his nature /personality. Airi even said: that's he is that kind of person
<end of my theory

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Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
And yet we have relentlessflame arguing about faithfulness, when that was no issue for the writers at all. As for having to to say that she's no longer against the merger, that would be unnecessary. After all, by then she was good friends with Shingo and Sakuno, and most people would not kick their friends out of school.
Miu was going to graduate anyway. So it actually made no difference if the merger failed or not for the VN. The merger was added in the anime in my opinion for multiple reasons:
-more development for Airi,because Shingo and Miu have changed her.
-developing Miu because to other people she look strong, while she is not that strong as others believe that she is
-tying loose ends from the basic premise about the school merger
-giving an happier ending, knowing that the merger succeeded and that the friends stay together.

Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
And what you mention is the big problem I have with the show. If Airi is so important to the story, then the show should have gone on her route instead of going Miu's story. If she is not important to Miu's story, then Airi should have been relegated to side character from the very beginning (get rid of all the sexual tension!, have the merger work quickly), making room to include whatever parts of Sakuno's story that can still fit. Or simply speed through the common route more quickly so that it doesn't look like Airi was dropped.
Airi had importance in Miu's story, but not for Miu but for Sana as a huge emotional support. Because in a way they are similar, but Airi has realized sooner that Shingo does not have feelings for her, while Sana is still somewhat in denial. If you ignore the common route , it would have effected one of the more important characters in the anime: Airi. Even if she was not the love interest, she was not less important overall.

edit: in the VN the merger was also one of the last issues in Airi's story. It makes sense to me that something as a big as 2 schools merging needs some time (a few months) before a decision is made. Saving that issue for the last is not unreasonable for me.

Last edited by hyl; 2011-12-26 at 20:29.
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Old 2011-12-26, 21:03   Link #1209
justsomeguy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hyl View Post
You seem to forget for fanservice reasons.
That is never a good reason in terms of story.

Quote:
Besides that, the main point of that scene was the reason for Airi to know why she was not invited to the club by Shingo and also supporting my theories for why she realized that Shingo had no interest in her.
my theory (shortened)>
At he beginning of episode 5, it's clearly shown that Airi has fallen for Shingo due to her being so flustered after able to call Shingo just "Uryuu". For the entire episode she was hoping and observing Shingo that he is different (from the other men). You can rewatch the episode yourself if you missed that.
And your point? I have not forgotten at all. All of that was character and relationship development, all of which led nowhere since the show did not go down the Airi route.

Quote:
At the end of episode 6 at the bathscene, she realized that those feelings are not reciprocated because Shingo was nice and helped Airi the whole time not because he likes her, but that it's just his nature /personality. Airi even said: that's he is that kind of person
<end of my theory
Or alternatively, Airi wanted to know why he didn't invite her because she feared he resented her or some such. I certainly did not see that as a sign of Airi resigning herself or anything.

Quote:
Miu was going to graduate anyway. So it actually made no difference if the merger failed or not for the VN. The merger was added in the anime in my opinion for multiple reasons:
-more development for Airi,because Shingo and Miu have changed her.
-developing Miu because to other people she look strong, while she is not that strong as others believe that she is
-tying loose ends from the basic premise about the school merger
-giving an happier ending, knowing that the merger succeeded and that the friends stay together.
I have no problem with the ending at all, it's how we got there that bothers me.

Quote:
Airi had importance in Miu's story, but not for Miu but for Sana as a huge emotional support. Because in a way they are similar, but Airi has realized sooner that Shingo does not have feelings for her, while Sana is still somewhat in denial. If you ignore the common route , it would have effected one of the more important characters in the anime: Airi. Even if she was not the love interest, she was not less important overall.
The thing is, if Airi is so important to the story it is very frustrating not to see any further development for her after episode 6 (and no, emotional support for Sana is not it), and just leaving things hanging after taking a bath with Shingo. That's why I would have preferred if writers had shifted the storyline so the "common route" had overlap with the Miu route. It's as if Airi and Shingo were suddenly no longer class reps and had no one-on-one contact with each other anymore.

Quote:
edit: in the VN the merger was also one of the last issues in Airi's story. It makes sense to me that something as a big as 2 schools merging needs some time (a few months) before a decision is made. Saving that issue for the last is not unreasonable for me.
Once again, I have no issues with the ending at all.
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Old 2011-12-26, 22:00   Link #1210
hyl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
That is never a good reason in terms of story.
As if the scenes of Airi in episode 2, the bath scene with Sakuno and Ange and the scene with Miu running around naked in her house were not fanservice scenes. I don't recall you complaining about those scenes, even if those were somewhat pointless for the story.

Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
And your point? I have not forgotten at all. All of that was character and relationship development, all of which led nowhere since the show did not go down the Airi route.
I think that you are simply seeing things that are not there. You seem to think that that scene was meant to romantic or for fueling the relationship of Airi and Shingo, while there were no signs of pointing out that during the scene. I still think that the topic of dicsussion had much more relevance in that scene instead of the bath itself. But you can't seen to look past that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
Or alternatively, Airi wanted to know why he didn't invite her because she feared he resented her or some such. I certainly did not see that as a sign of Airi resigning herself or anything.
For me that bath scene was instead of developing the romantic relationship of Airi and shingo, rather the moment that ended further development.
I haven't seen Airi trying to persue Shingo after she joined the club. Instead she seems to warn Sana for not trying to Shingo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
The thing is, if Airi is so important to the story it is very frustrating not to see any further development for her after episode 6 (and no, emotional support for Sana is not it), and just leaving things hanging after taking a bath with Shingo. That's why I would have preferred if writers had shifted the storyline so the "common route" had overlap with the Miu route. It's as if Airi and Shingo were suddenly no longer class reps and had no one-on-one contact with each other anymore.
I have no idea what you meant by further developing Airi. There is no point into romantically developing Airi if the anime was going for Miu at the end. The anime already added more development for Airi than in the VN by showing us more Airi in the scenes with Sana in it and the petition scene that was only in Airi's story.
Also episode 11 had some anime original development of the other heroines.
Who says that you can't join a club and still be a class rep? When i was in highschool i joined clubs, while being my class rep for 3 years.
Also the moment that they are doing things for their own classes were no longer that important, because the tension between them were gone after that supermarket scene.

Last edited by hyl; 2011-12-26 at 22:16.
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Old 2011-12-26, 22:17   Link #1211
novalysis
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Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post


That's funny, that's the least poor transition; there was no 360 degree turn at all. Airi was already opposed to the merger before she met Sakuno and Shingo, and I don't think she actually expected to see them again at her school. Her behavior towards Shingo after having him join the school was an good demonstration of stubbornness and confusion. I don't think there's any examples of the show trying to make her an object of pity either.


T
I meant Sana , not Sena. My bad. Sana went from the rather confident girl with a fairly impressive presence and air of maturity into a flanderized Tsun.

And we never ever found out the origins of her man hating ways....

If there's one thing that made this show quite memorable , besides the fact that the protagonist is not a generic wimpy moronic pesudo-cassanova , it's the fact that the Tsundere scenario got played out in a rather realistic fashion.
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Old 2011-12-26, 22:21   Link #1212
hyl
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Originally Posted by novalysis View Post
I meant Sana , not Sena.
And we never ever found out the origins of her man hating ways....
That was never mentioned in any of the original 4 stories, untill Sana got her own story on the psp
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Old 2011-12-26, 22:25   Link #1213
justsomeguy
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Originally Posted by novalysis View Post
I meant Sana , not Sena. My bad. Sana went from the rather confident girl with a fairly impressive presence and air of maturity into a flanderized Tsun.

And we never ever found out the origins of her man hating ways....

If there's one thing that made this show quite memorable , besides the fact that the protagonist is not a generic wimpy moronic pesudo-cassanova , it's the fact that the Tsundere scenario got played out in a rather realistic fashion.
Oh yeah, in that case I agree entirely. I don't know why she's supposedly such a popular character, with how she physically abuses Shingo and calls him a dirty insect.

@hyl
If you don't mind, can you explain her story?
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Old 2011-12-26, 22:30   Link #1214
hyl
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Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
@hyl
If you don't mind, can you explain her story?
Who's story? Airi's or Sana?
If you want to read Sana's story, then relentlessflame has already made a nice summary of her story in the games section up to christmas (not including the very fluffy parts after that and the conclusion) in the games section.
I kinda forgot when he posted it though
edit: it's somewhere on the 2nd page

http://forums.animesuki.com/showthre...=107398&page=2
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Old 2011-12-26, 23:20   Link #1215
justsomeguy
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Originally Posted by hyl View Post
Who's story? Airi's or Sana?
If you want to read Sana's story, then relentlessflame has already made a nice summary of her story in the games section up to christmas (not including the very fluffy parts after that and the conclusion) in the games section.
I kinda forgot when he posted it though
edit: it's somewhere on the 2nd page

http://forums.animesuki.com/showthre...=107398&page=2
So Sana actually has a compelling backstory? I would say that anime viewers and the non-PSP players have been done a disservice if all we see is of her being a manhater.
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Old 2011-12-26, 23:47   Link #1216
Marina2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
So Sana actually has a compelling backstory? I would say that anime viewers and the non-PSP players have been done a disservice if all we see is of her being a manhater.
Sana's back story (reason why she dislikes men) was revealed in her route on PSP version that
came out this year. In PC version, she doesn't have any back story on why she dislikes men.

This anime is the adaption of Miu's route from PC version ,so you can't really blame director for this
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Old 2011-12-26, 23:53   Link #1217
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If there is something unclear about the story there are 50 pages of posts and detailed explanations to help you through. Really unfortunate that you didn't enjoy one of the best romance stories this year.
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Old 2011-12-26, 23:54   Link #1218
justsomeguy
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Originally Posted by Marina2 View Post
This anime is the adaption of Miu's route from PC version ,so you can't really blame director for this
Of course not. But certainly Sana would have been a more sympathetic character had I known her family trouble. She was one of the problems I had with the show, and an explanation would have made much of a difference.

@Candyshark
A show should stand on its own, without an additional 50 pages of explanations about things not shown.
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Old 2011-12-26, 23:57   Link #1219
Flower
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Wow ... having read the backstory of Sana in the game thread I am impressed - she really was a much more interesting character in the game. What a pity that was not able to come across!

But oh well ... Manglobe made a choice and stuck with it.
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Old 2011-12-27, 00:24   Link #1220
relentlessflame
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
A show should stand on its own, without an additional 50 pages of explanations about things not shown.
I think the show stands just fine on its own, but you have to dig beneath the surface and try to piece things together in ways that aren't necessarily immediately apparent. If you read my FAQ, with very very few exceptions, it's all about things shown, but not always blatant/in-your-face. They take a less obvious route because they're delivering a less obvious message. You understand Airi's feelings in Episode 6 more fully after you've understood Sana's feelings in Episode 10/11 and the show ties the two together resulting in Episode 12. It's woven in an untraditional, but not "bad" way. I would suggest that if you were to re-watch the show knowing what you know now, you'll see things you probably didn't see on the first pass.

I'm not saying that you should like it, but I'll disagree rather strongly with your claims about "bad writing". You may not like what they did with the show, but I think it was written in a very clever and skilful way. So I suppose we will have to agree to disagree, overall.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Flower View Post
Wow ... having read the backstory of Sana in the game thread I am impressed - she really was a much more interesting character in the game. What a pity that was not able to come across!
Well, yeah, basically none of the PSP content was adapted. Yutsuki had two small cameos and that's it. Sana was essentially as portrayed in the PC game. It's too bad, but they were already pressed for time as it was, so I understand why they made that decision.
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