AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series > Madoka Magica

Notices

View Poll Results: Madoka Magica - Episode 10 Rating
Perfect 10 293 82.07%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 39 10.92%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 13 3.64%
7 out of 10 : Good 7 1.96%
6 out of 10 : Average 2 0.56%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 2 0.56%
4 out of 10 : Poor 1 0.28%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 357. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2011-03-16, 16:09   Link #881
Dextro
He Without a Title
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Lisbon, Portugal
Age: 27
Send a message via Skype™ to Dextro
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crontica View Post
I'm gunning for the "Morning Lescue" ending myself.

disclaimer: Just kidding
__________________

Dextro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-16, 17:55   Link #882
Moridin
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Sweden
Age: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Child_of_Sierra View Post
True, but knowing how someone moves means being able to make counter-measures/ exploit their movement.

Kyuuby has an end goal in sight and he wouldn't just grant/help a person obtain a power he thought might jeopardize his plan. He likely has Homura's entire time loop figured out and believes that anything she does on her own is futile.

Humans can't imitate nature, but by knowing it's properties and characteristics we can direct the elements to produce energy for us. This is what I think Kyubey has in store for Homura and her time travel power.

All goes back to what I said about Homura being in a hamster wheel :P
You are basing your agrument on the assumption that QB can figure out in what ways homura can change the timeloop.
Sorry, i do not remember when, but i know that QB has stated that he can not understand people's actions since he does not understand feelings. Also, it was only QB in T1 that was making the decision to grant her her wish, and he was doing it using assumptions he based on homura's personality from T1.
The only way left would be for him to analyze every single action that is possible during the timeloops and see how they would affect the outcome of the loop, and then repeat that for the infinit amount of starting conditions (i. e. different homuras). Irrelevant of how much processing power QB has, this is impossible.

This means that the opposite must be true; That QB can not calculate the outcome of granting this wish to homura. Therefore it is possible for homuras skill to directly, or inderictly, create timelines that does not favor QB's goal.
Moridin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-16, 19:49   Link #883
Triple_R
Center Attraction
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Age: 33
Send a message via AIM to Triple_R
People hoping for a Morning Rescue End might get a chuckle out of this.

__________________
Triple_R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-16, 20:18   Link #884
ThereminVox
Guess what time it is?
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
Age: 29
With all the Eva comparisons, I'm never going to be able to see the LCL sea and not think of a world flooded with MORNING RESCUE again.
ThereminVox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-16, 21:41   Link #885
Grey
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
This episode was pretty cool. It's the only one I watched too.

Maybe I'll watch some of the earlier episodes. I think I'm getting used to the art style.
Grey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-16, 22:36   Link #886
Jimmy C
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Kyubei's mistake with Homura is actually twofold. The first one, everyone has already pointed out, he didn't expect Homura to be able to rewind time repeatedly. The second was something even less expected, that no one has pointed out yet. Homura saw Madoka turning into a witch after defeating WN. Without that, Homura might have never added opposing Kyubei to her list of actions to protect Madoka.
Jimmy C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-16, 22:40   Link #887
Shadow5YA
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moridin View Post
You are basing your agrument on the assumption that QB can figure out in what ways homura can change the timeloop.
Sorry, i do not remember when, but i know that QB has stated that he can not understand people's actions since he does not understand feelings. Also, it was only QB in T1 that was making the decision to grant her her wish, and he was doing it using assumptions he based on homura's personality from T1.
The only way left would be for him to analyze every single action that is possible during the timeloops and see how they would affect the outcome of the loop, and then repeat that for the infinit amount of starting conditions (i. e. different homuras). Irrelevant of how much processing power QB has, this is impossible.

This means that the opposite must be true; That QB can not calculate the outcome of granting this wish to homura. Therefore it is possible for homuras skill to directly, or inderictly, create timelines that does not favor QB's goal.
Being unable to understand feelings does not mean he is unable to understand actions. Kyubey planned for Kyoko to try turning Oktavia back to Sayaka and fail so that Homura will be left alone on Walpurgis Night with Madoka. Regardless of emotion, Kyubey does have a notion of what is possible and impossible to accomplish.
Shadow5YA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-16, 22:58   Link #888
Jimmy C
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
I just found out from elsewhere, there's a small but significant addition to the Nicovideo stream version of ep10. The name of Madoka's witch form. It's Kriemhild Gretchen
Jimmy C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-16, 23:37   Link #889
Deconstructor
Crossdressing Menmatic
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Where you live... the question is, do you see me?
Age: 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy C View Post
The second was something even less expected, that no one has pointed out yet. Homura saw Madoka turning into a witch after defeating WN. Without that, Homura might have never added opposing Kyubei to her list of actions to protect Madoka.
No. The idea is Homura will eventually find out Kyubey is responsible. Should Homura have not seen Madoka transform into a witch, Homura would have still reset time. Given as many tries as required, Homura would have eventually suspected and deduced Kyubey's secret, if Kyubey did not explicitly admit to his intentions himself.
Deconstructor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-17, 00:02   Link #890
Triple_R
Center Attraction
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Age: 33
Send a message via AIM to Triple_R
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy C View Post
I just found out from elsewhere, there's a small but significant addition to the Nicovideo stream version of ep10. The name of Madoka's witch form. It's Kriemhild Gretchen
What an intriguing name. It goes right back to Faust.

Beyond that, Kriemhild is the name of a central character in the old epic poem Nibelungenlied. Her first love in that poem is a warrior named Siegfried, who had special powers of defense, but who eventually died anyway. And he was killed by a thrown spear, no less...

Some images connected to that poem and Kriemhild that I think might raise some eyebrows here...

Spoiler for Kriemhild/Madoka comparison:



I think I see part of what inspired Sayaka's puella magi character design (Siegfried's cloak is a bit more pronounced on a different image with him).


Gen has really done his homework here. I'm quite impressed.
__________________

Last edited by Triple_R; 2011-03-17 at 00:36.
Triple_R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-17, 00:20   Link #891
Shadow5YA
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
So does that make Homura the Faust to Madoka as Gretchen?
Shadow5YA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-17, 00:24   Link #892
Triple_R
Center Attraction
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Age: 33
Send a message via AIM to Triple_R
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow5YA View Post
So does that make Homura the Faust to Madoka as Gretchen?
That would be my guess...
__________________
Triple_R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-17, 00:35   Link #893
Shadow5YA
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
That would be my guess...
Then Homura is a complex issue. While Faust did make a deal with the devil, he did ascend to heaven at the very end instead of being forced to serve Mephistopheles in hell. If this is true to Faust's story, then Homura should be saved in the end. However, only Faust's deal with the devil is well-known, so some may assume that Faust loses his soul to the devil.
Shadow5YA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-17, 01:00   Link #894
taofd
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow5YA View Post
Then Homura is a complex issue. While Faust did make a deal with the devil, he did ascend to heaven at the very end instead of being forced to serve Mephistopheles in hell. If this is true to Faust's story, then Homura should be saved in the end. However, only Faust's deal with the devil is well-known, so some may assume that Faust loses his soul to the devil.
Gretchen is also saved by her innocence!!!

*excited*

So is Madoka's illegitimate child with Homura a symbolic representation of her innocence / ideals? She "kills" her child to become a mahou shoujo, but in the end redeems herself by deciding to live by her ideals going forward and "ascends" to "heaven".

So. Excited.
taofd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-17, 01:01   Link #895
Dawnbringerz
性転換団長
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Dango Planet
Age: 28
In Nico Stream, not only Witch:Madoka's name was added, but her form was changed too.

Spoiler for TV:


Spoiler for Nico:


What's with that tree!?


edit: Ah, I got it. It was Shaft's mistake in the TV. Witch:Madoka was supposed to be on the opposite side. lol
Dawnbringerz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-17, 01:05   Link #896
Triple_R
Center Attraction
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Age: 33
Send a message via AIM to Triple_R
Quote:
Originally Posted by taofd View Post
Gretchen is also saved by her innocence!!!

*excited*

So is Madoka's illegitimate child with Homura a symbolic representation of her innocence / ideals? She "kills" her child to become a mahou shoujo, but in the end redeems herself by deciding to live by her ideals going forward and "ascends" to "heaven".

So. Excited.
Your interpretation of it sounds pretty good to me.
__________________
Triple_R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-17, 01:11   Link #897
sa547
Senior Member
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Philippines
Age: 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy C View Post
I just found out from elsewhere, there's a small but significant addition to the Nicovideo stream version of ep10. The name of Madoka's witch form. It's Kriemhild Gretchen
Finally, they posted up that grand episode.
__________________
sa547 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-17, 01:13   Link #898
Jimmy C
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
It looks like they're trying to fix a few drawing errors there. There was a giant treee during the Walpurgis attack. So they decided to put it back in. Second, Homura and Kyubei are on a slanted platform. Yet, the platform is view from both sides several times, and you can see Gretchen in the background almost all the time, as if there was one on either side. I don't think they were entirely successful yet.
Jimmy C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-17, 01:23   Link #899
Child_of_Sierra
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Philippines
@ Moridin: Shadow5YA pretty much answered for me here. I would also add that while Kyubey may not know the exact way an MG may use their powers he can still detect their magical potential before the contract.

He should be aware that Homura can never match Walpurgis Night by herself. The difference in strength is shown by the various timeline replays.

The times Walpurgis got defeated involved a mahou shoujo Madoka.

In Kyubey's eyes the cold logic of Homura (valued at say 10 in power) losing to a Walpurgis (100 power) will never change. As far as I could tell her power does not increase with each repetition so she will always be an underdog here.

She may have unlimited time but the resources she can gather in each repeat are limited. She can't forage for higher end weapons from far away because she always has to stalk Madoka. There is only a limited number of witches she can kill to recharge her soul gem as well. Recruiting the other 3 MG's seem impossible due to their own conflicting beliefs and personalities.
__________________
Child_of_Sierra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-17, 01:37   Link #900
BaKaBaKaOtaKu
Stupidity is Bliss.
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: In Hancock's Heart
with all these faust, gretchen stuff, it's possible that we'd get a happy/satisfying end. XDD it would also mean a madohomu end..XDDDD
__________________
www.gifreducer.com/upld/gen/IXzHGD/32-nodither.gif
Faberry
Quinn and Rachel
BaKaBaKaOtaKu is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
madoka magica, time travel

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 20:10.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.