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Old 2013-07-26, 18:09   Link #501
Benoit
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westlo View Post
But the PSX was more powerful than the Saturn
No, it wasn't. The Sega Saturn was a dual CPU machine.
Quote:
CD allowed the PSX to have the impression/illusion of being more powerful through pre rendered backgrounds and fmv clips, case in point Final Fantasy 7.
The PSX wasn't the first console with CD technology, nor was it the only one in that generation.
Quote:
The Dreamcast got overwhelmed by a superior PS2
The PS2 was inferior to the Dreamcast in every aspect except for the CPU. In fact, the PS2 was the weakest console overall of its generation.
Quote:
It's not like Sony or MS lost as bad as Nintendo did with the N64 and Gamecube.
The N64 and Gamecube were only relative failures. They still made Nintendo some good money. Sony's PlayStation 3 and Microsoft's Xbox 360 were money sinks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sides View Post
However you can probably say that the snes was designed to act more efficiently.
What are you talking about? The SNES's CPU didn't even have a MOV command, which added extra overhead to what was, for the time, a slow CPU. An extra chip provided by select cartridges was needed just to be able use Mode 7 on something else than backgrounds.
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Old 2013-07-27, 04:37   Link #502
Sides
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Originally Posted by Benoit View Post
What are you talking about? The SNES's CPU didn't even have a MOV command, which added extra overhead to what was, for the time, a slow CPU. An extra chip provided by select cartridges was needed just to be able use Mode 7 on something else than backgrounds.
That is what i was talking about.
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Old 2013-07-27, 10:11   Link #503
4Tran
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Originally Posted by Benoit View Post
Which is nothing game developers have to worry about. That's the entire point of an API. What you're describing is the manufacturer's job.
This is probably why so many early ports looked and performed worse than the PS360 versions. Is that really what anyone wants or is it better to tailor the software to the hardware?

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Originally Posted by Benoit View Post
Don't change the argument. You were asking what people would buy a Wii U for, not what they bought for it in the end.
If they didn't buy the system for the games, then aren't they exactly examples that prove my point that nobody is buying the Wii U for non-Nintendo games?

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Originally Posted by Benoit View Post
Yes, it is a big deal. It shows that making your console the most powerful one on the market doesn't pay off, which is the point I'm making.
It doesn't prove anything of the kind. All it means is that there are many factors that affect the sales of a console. Price, feature set, timing and public perception being the other main factors. Performance may not be the most important factor, but it's right up there. That's why every major console other than the Wii and Wii U have always tried to tout power as a selling point. The lack thereof on the Wii U is precisely why it's failed to garner any audience.

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Originally Posted by Benoit View Post
That's not possible, as Smash Bros. Melee is not a Wii game.
Whoops. Still, the new one should sell okay, but it's poorly positioned to help Wii U numbers that much. I suspect that Mario Kart will do a better job of that, but it might be too little too late.
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Old 2013-07-27, 11:39   Link #504
Benoit
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sides View Post
That is what i was talking about.
Nintendo cutting costs equals being designed for efficiency?
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Tran View Post
This is probably why so many early ports looked and performed worse than the PS360 versions. Is that really what anyone wants or is it better to tailor the software to the hardware?
What are you talking about?
Quote:
If they didn't buy the system for the games, then aren't they exactly examples that prove my point that nobody is buying the Wii U for non-Nintendo games?
Looks like you've forgot the point I was trying to make.
Quote:
Performance may not be the most important factor, but it's right up there. That's why every major console other than the Wii and Wii U have always tried to tout power as a selling point. The lack thereof on the Wii U is precisely why it's failed to garner any audience.
You're contradicting yourself here. First you say it's not the most important factor, then you present is as the reason the Wii U isn't doing well. This doesn't even make sense in the fact of the fact that no console has won because of its power.
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Old 2013-07-27, 12:32   Link #505
4Tran
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benoit View Post
Looks like you've forgot the point I was trying to make.
I'm really not sure what point you're trying to make. Perhaps you'd like to try restating it.

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Originally Posted by Benoit View Post
You're contradicting yourself here. First you say it's not the most important factor, then you present is as the reason the Wii U isn't doing well. This doesn't even make sense in the fact of the fact that no console has won because of its power.
That's not quite right. The reason why the Wii U has failed is because it couldn't capture a decent-sized audience. It's not very attractive to the PS360 owners who were the largest potential portion of that audience because it can't do much more than what they already have. You neatly snipped out the part of my reply which explains the rest.

It's priced higher than the closest competition, the Wii U's new features aren't very compelling. It came out at the wrong time to take advantage of generation fatigue, and it has no public traction. Of all of these factors, the only two that Nintendo had much say in are price and power. And that's the crux of my argument: either the Wii U should have been price at casual consumer prices ($100-200) or have double the graphical performance of the PS360.

Also, bear in mind that the Wii U isn't competing directly with the PS4/Xbone. It's actually competing against the PS360 (and the Wii), and the market has been found to be greatly lacking.
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Old 2013-07-28, 05:34   Link #506
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I bought my wii U at launch and I think the Off TV features its a compelling feature its just that I feel that Nintendo hasn't really advertise that feature.
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Old 2013-07-28, 05:39   Link #507
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sagi View Post
I bought my wii U at launch and I think the Off TV features its a compelling feature its just that I feel that Nintendo hasn't really advertise that feature.
It does seem like a fantastic feature yes. It's what the Remote Play funcionality of the PSP and PS3 should have been.
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Old 2013-07-29, 04:37   Link #508
Chaos2Frozen
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The Next Super Smash Bros. Won't Have a Story Mode or Cutscenes


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Old 2013-07-29, 08:35   Link #509
Shadow5YA
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I really wish kotaku would give the actual link to the interview instead of just linking to the famitsu homepage.

I've already stated this in the Smash Bros thread, but good riddance to Subspace Emissary, because this:

Quote:
"Unfortunately, the movie scenes we worked hard to create were uploaded onto the internet." Sakurai lamented. "You can only truly wow a player the first time he sees [a cutscene]. I felt if players saw the cutscenes outside of the game, they would no longer serve as rewards for playing the game, so I've decided against having them."
Indirectly acknowledges that Subspace Emissary is only a fun experience the first time around and has little replay value.
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Old 2013-07-29, 12:25   Link #510
4Tran
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sagi View Post
I bought my wii U at launch and I think the Off TV features its a compelling feature its just that I feel that Nintendo hasn't really advertise that feature.
It's still not very compelling as a selling point though. Potential buyers won't have any real idea what Off-TV play is going to be like until they've got the system in their living rooms. Besides, a console can have all sorts of great features without any of them being very good from a sales perspective. For instance, I think that the Vita is one of the best designed pieces of gaming hardware ever, but it's still dead because very few people care about what it can do.
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Old 2013-07-31, 03:52   Link #511
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Nintendo records quarterly profit despite abysmal Wii U sales

The Wii U sold 10k units in Europe this last quarter. 10k! That's insanely low.
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Old 2013-07-31, 06:08   Link #512
Nightengale
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160k units of Wii U shipped in a quarter.

Even at its very worst, I don't think PS3 ever dipped below 500k units per quarter.

This is bad.
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Old 2013-07-31, 11:48   Link #513
Solace
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Very bad. The system is dead, hate to say it. Nintendo won't pack it in though, pulling the console would actually be worse. But you can damn well be sure that they're accelerating the development of the Wii U's successor. It's a tainted brand now, and they've mishandled it to an incredible degree.

That said I still like the system and I wish it had been given more of a chance, but it's painfully clear that the industry, and by extension the consumers, really do just want faster horses. I'm not sure Nintendo can tap into the casual market through hardware innovation as reliably as they used to. Touch screen gaming has been taken over by smart phones and tablets, and motion controls have proven to be a fad as much as 3D screens are.

Nintendo should be tapping the best strength remaining to them, which is their software. It's the only reason the 3DS has been able to find traction, because the hardware isn't compelling enough to draw in buyers. For the Wii U, I don't believe the upcoming software will have the same effect, because they've let the system drift for almost a year. It probably explains the lack of urgency from the company to change direction rapidly like they did with the 3DS (especially since handhelds have propped up the company for well over a decade).

The Wii U will help them grasp HD development, which they seem to be doing with remarkable speed, and I believe they'll coast on the system for as long as possible until they can switch both platforms over to something new in a few years. I wouldn't be surprised if they debuted a "third pillar" hardware device and leaked some info on a new console, like they did with the DS and "Revolution" when the Gamecube turned out to be a market failure.

Either way, I suspect they'll continue to find ways to profit, but the Wii U is a lost cause.
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Old 2013-07-31, 18:18   Link #514
Shadow5YA
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I really hope this doesn't mean they'll be delaying Smash Bros even further for a simultaneous release with the next generation console like they did with Twilight Princess...
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Old 2013-07-31, 19:07   Link #515
Urzu 7
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Solace, I don't think it is just about people wanting faster horses. The Wii U could have decent sales by now if it actually had some very good games to play on it. That is the thing, the only good games it has had from November of last year to end of July have been NSMB U and MH3U. Neither of those are big system sellers. Throw in a $350 price tag and games that look no better than XBox 360 games, and it is no wonder the system isn't selling.

Here is what I wrote in regards to Wii U on another forum:

Quote:
If Nintendo wants to avoid this system becoming a failure, here is what they do: When Mario Kart 8 launches and is sold individually on disc, they sell a Mario Kart 8 bundle with the 32 GB Wii U at the same price a 32 GB model was already going for. When SSB hits Wii U and sells on disc individually, they sell a SSB bundle with a 32 GB Wii U for the same price as the Mario Kart 8 bundle. Possibly sell both bundles in holiday season 2014 so people can choose from one or the other. For holiday 2013, they sell a NSMB U bundle with a 32 GB Wii U for $300.

If they do things aggressively like that, they will save the Wii U from a crash and burn.

Here is the thing, though, Nintendo is stubborn, they don't think they need to do such things out of desperation (when they need to), and they just tend to not act aggressively with strategies when things call for it.
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Old 2013-07-31, 19:16   Link #516
GDB
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They really need to drop the price. It's far too close in price to the other upcoming systems without really having much to offer.
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Old 2013-08-01, 00:27   Link #517
Shadow5YA
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I'd be more than willing to pay for it if games like Smash Bros, Zelda, and a 3D Mario adventure had earlier release dates.
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Old 2013-08-01, 01:12   Link #518
Chaos2Frozen
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Batman Arkham Origins would come with a multiplayer mode to EVERY PLATFORM... Except for the Wii U.

http://gematsu.com/2013/07/batman-ar...ayer-announced

They don't even bother coming-up with an excuse for it this time.
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Old 2013-08-01, 02:23   Link #519
Witch of Uncertainty
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Originally Posted by Shadow5YA View Post
I'd be more than willing to pay for it if games like Smash Bros, Zelda, and a 3D Mario adventure had earlier release dates.
Yeah. It was a huge mistake for Nintendo to release the console when they did. The only real problem with it is the extremely, extremely small library. They should have launched it together with Zelda or the new Super Mario game, if not both, along with Pikmin and Supersmash etc around the corner. (I'd personally love a Metroid announcement.. Any time).

In other words, I think they would have benefitted by releasing it at the same time as Xbox One/PS4 (or developed the games earlier).
Either way, the Wii U is in a shabby position, and I truly think it's a shame.

I'm also not sure it can really recover once Zelda etc releases. People will probably have rather purchased the PS4/Xbox One, and the price difference is nowhere near what it was with the Wii vs. Ps3/360, so less people will purchase both consoles.
(I'm not claiming to know a whole great about this, but that is my personal take on it).
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Old 2013-08-01, 05:16   Link #520
Sides
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Nintendo cutting costs equals being designed for efficiency?
Yeah. But they didn't cut the cost, without enable further processing boost through those enhancement chips. So in that sense I do think it was designed more efficient than the other consoles at that time. If developers wanted to use more power they had the option, but they have to be certain that it would actually benefit the game, and not waste the extra resource.
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